Ike Social Thread

[WhinoTheRhino]

Ally can literally only use Fsmash and beat any Fox, buff Fox pls.

 

[grandpappy]

Nerf Ally.

 

[Solharath]

Hope you all are watching Lordy at Shots Fired.

 

[Starfall11]

Hello all,

I placed 7th out of 17 at a local tournament yesterday. Not terrible, but definitely not great either. Went 2 and 2, and lost against a Captain Falcon and Dr. Mario.

I realized at this point that my Ike is solid, but I need to work on my MUs a lot. So what advice do you have for these two matchups? I barely won my first round against Captain Falcon, and I feel like the MU is very momentum heavy. I had to gimp him early on, or he'd combo me to death pretty quickly. The player I faced was pretty good a snuffing quickdraw with Falcon's aerials too.

As for Dr. Mario. The guy won the tournament, so props to him, he was a really good player. But I felt it was tough playing around his pills and short hop. The range he throws the pills at makes it really difficult to get in on him. And the guy's survival DI was so good that I couldn't take stocks until 130%. I messed up and should have KOed him much earlier though.

That was my experience on the MUs. Now what do you guys think?

 

[Starfall11]

Obligatory double post guys. Metroid has 666 subscribers to his youtube channel. This was too important not to share. I'm a little afraid now.

 

[lordhelmet]

Hope you all are watching Lordy at Shots Fired.

Randomly look in Ike social for the first time -> see's Super's post about me.

Did you mean Rolltier? Didn't go to Shots Fired.

 

[Solharath]

Randomly look in Ike social for the first time -> see's Super's post about me.

Did you mean Rolltier? Didn't go to Shots Fired.

....My brain did a dumb. Yeah, the one where you opened the can on MW:W and took some games off nationally ranked players.

 

[Nekkid Yeti]

What are good stages for Ike, and which stages is ike better off avoiding?

 

[Starfall11]

Smashville is good. Avoid Lylat like the plague.

Question for fellow Ike mains. Who should I main in melee that will compliment Ike's gameplay style most?

I'm thinking Ganondorf or Marth. Mainly because of the power/disjointed hitboxes, and the way they play in neutral. Let me know what would compliment my game more, and I'll probably pick them up for tourneys.

 

[Commander]

Lylat is a better stage than most people give it credit for. "But muh walls!" Aether and QD are really good recovery options on their own and wall jumping isn't reall that helpful.

I think Ganondorf is closer to Ike than Marth. Ganon has very long limbs, is a similar weight(same crouch cancel percentages), and has tech based movement(wave landing). Marth feels so different. The only thing Ikeand Marth have in common is a good grab game and spacing, but the spacing is done differently with Marth since his dashdance and wavedash are his main movement tools.

 

[Starfall11]

Hmm, I was thinking the same thing. Ganondorf relies on waveland like Ike. And they both hit very hard and have tech chase.

But I really like Marth's dashdance and grab game. I do better with Ganon when I pick him up, but Marth seems pretty cool. It's a tough call. Any other opinions?

 

[Frakture]

Pick Marth because he's better.

 

[Commander]

Picking characters based on how good they are as opposed to who you have more fun with is literally ********. You really shouldn't have that strong of a desire to be good at a children's game. The opportunity cost of playing smash is astronomically high.

 

[Frakture]

If you are already going to play a competitive game, then why not be good at it? It makes no sense to put time into being good at something but intentionally making it harder than it needs to be. And in regards to how fun the characters are, he said he enjoys both of them about the same, to the point where he can't decide which one he wants to play, so why not play the better one. I don't know about you, but I have way more fun playing smash when I'm winning, and you will definitely win more with Marth than with Ganon.

 

[Player -0]

Play Roy obv.

...

You'll learn to outplay the opponent in neutral at least?

 

[Starfall11]

Well, Ganondorf feels close to Ike, so I like his gameplay. Mainly SH Fairs and Bairs. But Marth's grab game is amazing. I was really just looking for who will compliment Ike better, and help me in PM.

I don't take melee as seriously, but with Nintendo's issues with PM, it hasn't been at the tournaments I've been attending (EX: Winter Brawl, Summer Jam, ECT, etc). So I wanted a melee main who will help me get better with Ike, but I can still perform well.

Playing who you like most is way more important that just winning. That said, I like to win with my favorite character. Which is why I love PM, you can win with anyone.

 

[Commander]

If you are already going to play a competitive game, then why not be good at it? It makes no sense to put time into being good at something but intentionally making it harder than it needs to be. And in regards to how fun the characters are, he said he enjoys both of them about the same, to the point where he can't decide which one he wants to play, so why not play the better one. I don't know about you, but I have way more fun playing smash when I'm winning, and you will definitely win more with Marth than with Ganon.

Because the cost of playing smash bros is stupidly high. Have you ever looked at the winnings of the top 5? They make less than minimum wage in smash(tourney winnings only since sponsors don't disclose their benefits). All the time they spend playing smash could have been spent on something more productive. They can value smash and play it a lot, but focusing on smash to the point of being anything more than a local threat is dumb because of everything else you could be doing instead. Smash can be an important part of your life, but having it as a high priority part of your life is a foolish decision.

Also winning in a play style you don't like that much isn't fun. If he can't decide playing both is then the best option regardless of tourney results, because no matter the results, spending time on smash to be amazing isn't really worth it.

 

[Starfall11]

I'm not sure I agree with that commander. It sounds like you're almost bashing some of the top Smash players, and saying they wasted their life potential. Mainly when you said "Focusing on smash to the point of being anything more than a local threat is dumb".

Personally, I want to be more than a local threat. I go to some big tourneys. Mainly the ones hosted by Big E Gaming. And I would love to travel to Apex someday. Besides, one of the best Ganondorf mains out there, BIzzarro Flame, just finished Law School, and is on his path to becoming a lawyer. You can be extremely skilled in a game, put enough time into said hobby, and still have a life outside of it.

I just received my Master's Degree and finished a resume/cover letter for a mental health counselor position at a local university. Point is, I believe you can be "more than a local threat", and still have a life outside of Smash.

 

[Frakture]

Because the cost of playing smash bros is stupidly high. Have you ever looked at the winnings of the top 5? They make less than minimum wage in smash(tourney winnings only since sponsors don't disclose their benefits). All the time they spend playing smash could have been spent on something more productive. They can value smash and play it a lot, but focusing on smash to the point of being anything more than a local threat is dumb because of everything else you could be doing instead. Smash can be an important part of your life, but having it as a high priority part of your life is a foolish decision.

Also winning in a play style you don't like that much isn't fun. If he can't decide playing both is then the best option regardless of tourney results, because no matter the results, spending time on smash to be amazing isn't really worth it.

Please don't preach to me about not taking video games seriously on a video game forum. I never said he should drop everything in his life to play smash, all I said was if you're stuck between two characters, you might as well pick the one that's clearly superior. If he enjoys Ganon more, then sure, play Ganon. But the fact that he was torn between the two implies that he likes them both and enjoyment wasn't a deciding factor.

Well, Ganondorf feels close to Ike, so I like his gameplay. Mainly SH Fairs and Bairs. But Marth's grab game is amazing. I was really just looking for who will compliment Ike better, and help me in PM.

I don't take melee as seriously, but with Nintendo's issues with PM, it hasn't been at the tournaments I've been attending (EX: Winter Brawl, Summer Jam, ECT, etc). So I wanted a melee main who will help me get better with Ike, but I can still perform well.

Playing who you like most is way more important that just winning. That said, I like to win with my favorite character. Which is why I love PM, you can win with anyone.

I do agree that Ganon's playstyle is closer to Ike's, but they are only so similar. I wouldn't recommend playing Melee to get better at Ike specifically, although it could certainly help improve your general smash skills. I honestly think that playing Marth in Melee will help you improve much more, and with less effort, than playing Ganon.

 

[Player -0]

Improving more with less effort is placebo of playing a better character. In actuality you just got better at using the tools of an amazing character.

You might get better at playing neutral as Marth or getting in a different mindset that will transfer to Ike but "improving much more with less effort" is definitely not true.

 

[Frakture]

Improving more with less effort is placebo of playing a better character. In actuality you just got better at using the tools of an amazing character.

You might get better at playing neutral as Marth or getting in a different mindset that will transfer to Ike but "improving much more with less effort" is definitely not true.

Playing a better character allows you to exert more control over the game. This allows you to learn faster than if you played a weaker character because it becomes more obvious when you make a mistake as opposed to just being a bad matchup. As for less effort, playing a character like Ganon requires a large amount of character specific knowledge and very tight tech skill just to function in competitive play. Marth on the other hand, is far more forgiving and requires much less experience to begin playing. Another important thing to keep in mind is you get better the more you play, but you tend to play more the more you win. In tournaments or in friendlies, the losing players stop playing, and the winners continue. Picking a better character helps you win, which helps you improve.

 

[Starfall11]

I have to agree with Frakture on this a little more. But I see both sides. Playing Marth will help my fundamentals better since he's easier to play. As a result, I can perform better. This is mainly because some matches are so tough for Ganon that it's almost hopeless, like space animals.

But I disagree about the losing thing. When I lose, I play just as much as if I won. I don't quit anything, no matter how much I lose or how poorly I perform. I take winning/losing very seriously, and I never quit because I lose. I needed to express that, since not knowing when to quit can be bad too.

I tend to get really angry when I lose and keep going to the point of exhaustion. But everyone has a different style. Marth may help with fundamentals more, but Ganon seems like a lot of fun.

I didn't mean to cause a debate on the forums, just wondering who played more like Ike. Or at least, who would improve my playstyle more.

 

[Frakture]

I have to agree with Frakture on this a little more. But I see both sides. Playing Marth will help my fundamentals better since he's easier to play. As a result, I can perform better. This is mainly because some matches are so tough for Ganon that it's almost hopeless, like space animals.

But I disagree about the losing thing. When I lose, I play just as much as if I won. I don't quit anything, no matter how much I lose or how poorly I perform. I take winning/losing very seriously, and I never quit because I lose. I needed to express that, since not knowing when to quit can be bad too.

I tend to get really angry when I lose and keep going to the point of exhaustion. But everyone has a different style. Marth may help with fundamentals more, but Ganon seems like a lot of fun.

I didn't mean to cause a debate on the forums, just wondering who played more like Ike. Or at least, who would improve my playstyle more.

I didn't mean that losing would discourage you, I meant that losing prevents you from playing as many matches as possible. If you are on a friendly setup and you lose, you sit out. The time you spend sitting out is basically wasted. The same goes for tournaments. It's not about mentality, it's about the fact that the amount of time you are able to play is directly affected by how much you win.

In the end, just play who you want. We can give you advice based on what we think you should do, but it's your decision.

 

[Starfall11]

Thanks. That clears it up Frakture. And you're right, in round robin, you don't get a chance to play nearly as much. Valid point.

 

[Player -0]

It depends on the friendly set up but I see what you mean. If you make a friend with a good player and talk to them while they're playing (you don't have to be playing) you can understand interactions a lot better then apply it to your game play rather than just winning because leniency.

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

I think a small interesting thing to add to Ike in 3.6 would be an audio cue telling the player when QD is about to auto release.

 

[Player -0]

He already turns red..?

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Well when you're going for the OHKO you're generally looking at your opponent and how they're moving, not if you're turning red.

 

[Player -0]

You should still have map awareness everywhere. How do you play vs. Snake?

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

I'm assuming you're talking about Snake's mines? They don't move, so you don't need to keep track of them. You should be able to tell what your own character is doing at all times with only small glances at your own character, since you've played that character enough and know the character well. You should be spending most of your focus on the opponent, so you can find their habits and simply know what they're doing at all times.

 

[Player -0]

You should be able to tell what your own character is doing at all times with only small glances at your own character

Then why are you having trouble with the full charge?

 

[Starfall11]

The instant kill is extremely impractical anyways. We don't need an audio cue in my opinion. If you go to training and practice the timing for ~ 15 minutes, it's actually pretty easy to land consistently.

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Then why are you having trouble with the full charge?

You're right. But my point is not whether or not we need an audio cue. Obviously the OHKO is so impractical that we don't need anything for it since it's never gonna be used seriously anyways. I just thought that it would be a cool thing and nice to have. I also thought it would be reasonable to add since we already have an audio cue on QD.

 

[Commander]

The OHKO needs to be buffed since it does nothing to an opponent in shield.

 

[Player -0]

Maybe like the F-Smash taunt, you can say prepare yourself while charging QD. That would be funny

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Omg if the OHKO broke shields that would be glorious, and I'm down for "prepare yourself!" while charging QD lol.

 

[Commander]

Fully charged eruption instantly breaks shields and kills. If you try to counter it you will be killed before the counter attack comes out. It is weird that QD's OHKO doesn't do that too. I suppose with how much easier it is to land it would be absurd, but a OHKO in general is absurd.

 

[Player -0]

You can SDI -> DI down -> tech roll nB though.

 

[Commander]

Screw it. Fair should just be a OHKO.

 

[Starfall11]

Agreed. So should Bair. The hitbox is so small, it's basically impossible to land anyways.