Ice Climber Stage Counterpick/Ban Discussion (Donkey Kong)

[Barge]

Ice Climbers Stage Counterpick/Ban Discussion and Review

Basically we'll be discussing and summarizing the good and bad stages for a certain character. I'll probably update this thread once every 2 days depending on how fast we get through a character.


= Counterpick
= Ban it for your life


Character 1:
Bowser: Awesome Dragon

Final Destination, Smashville
Battlefield, Norfair

Summary: Bowser is a real beast, with his powerful attacks and great camping abilities, he's scary in the right hands. He'll use battlefields platforms and edges to totally throw off your game, AND he can infinite jump between the platforms and the stage, keeping him in the air longer. His fire breath can get hard to get through, and it out prioritizes all of Ice climbers B specials, norfair is also a great stage for him, many platforms for him to camp on, a lot of ledges for easy recovery, hard to chain grab on, and not to mention the small bounderies for easy KO's. You'll want to counterpick FD or SV for obvious reasons, flat stages are ice climbers territory. You can easily chain grab him on those stages, and it takes away his platform campiness.


Character 2:
Captain Falcon: Falcon PAWNCH!

Final Destination, Pictochat, Smashville
Norfair

Summary: Again, you'll want to ban Norfair for many reasons. Falcon is a really fast character, and can travel around the map and off stage easily. Norfair gives him a lot of approaching and manueverablitiy options, while it takes away ice climbers. Norfair also limits the ice climbers chain grabs to a certain extent. Counterpick Final Destination(If it already isn't banned) Pictochat, and Smashville. All these stages are flat and small, perfect for ice climbers chain grabs and approachs, pictochat allows a lot of other options when it comes to chain grabs. But it can also ruin them, this should be an easy matchup, just ban Norfair and you'll be fine.


Character 3:
Diddy Kong: Monkey with no pants

Battlefield, Yoshis Island Brawl
Final Destination, Norfair, Rainbow Cruise

Summary: This is a tough matchup because Diddy pretty much makes ice climbers ground game null and void due to his Bananas. So you'll want to ban stages where his ground game is amplified. Even though Final Destination is one of ice climbers best stages, diddy does better on it. No platforms, flat, small, perfect for nanners. You'll also want to ban moving stages and hazardous stages that Diddy does well on. RC and NF are pretty neutral for Diddy, and bad for IC's. Counterpick stages that take away some of his bananas priority. Such as stages like Battlefield, or Yoshis island, the platforms take away some of his banana game.


Character 4:
Donkey Kong: Monkey with a tie




Summary:


Character 5:
Falco: Has a bread fetish




Summary:

Commence discussion!​

​

 

[smaci92]

Final Destination
Battlefield

I'm probably wrong, but let's see what others have to say. Good idea btw

 

[Barge]

Could you give any reason as to why?
I'm going to explain why a stage is good/bad for ice climbers.

 

[Bnzaaa]

Bowser loves platforms, so stay from stages like Battlefield.

Choose a flat stage like Final Destination. Just be careful when you are SoPo.

 

[smaci92]

Could you give any reason as to why?
I'm going to explain why a stage is good/bad for ice climbers.

sure i will. FD, because it is flat, and it doesn't have platforms...and bnzaaa stated that bowser likes platforms...btw, i edited my post to battlefield instead of smashville. battlefield, on the other hand allows bowser to space properly and move around a lot...

I'm exhausted right now...I'll try to think of more reasons tomorrow

 

[Barge]

sure i will. FD, because it is flat, and it doesn't have platforms...and bnzaaa stated that bowser likes platforms...btw, i edited my post to battlefield instead of smashville. battlefield, on the other hand allows bowser to space properly and move around a lot...

I'm exhausted right now...I'll try to think of more reasons tomorrow

What puts ice climbers at a disadvantage here?

 

[momochuu]

ICs on platform happy stages usually isn't a good idea because most other characters can platform camp you.

 

[smaci92]

What puts ice climbers at a disadvantage here?

this vvv lol

ICs on platform happy stages usually isn't a good idea because most other characters can platform camp you.

 

[Liquid Gen]

MY personal Bowser experience:

Ban Norfair. Nuff said. No cg's for you PLUS its one of Bowser's best stages.

For counterpicks, there's a lot to choose from, Final Destination, Smashville (I suppose, not as big though), Yoshi's Island, etc.

Battlefield is iffy though, whilst Bowser can get CG'd here, he can stay on the playforms and come down for an attack, and go up again. But thats highly unlikely plus not very useful, so i doubt it'll happen.

But most importantly, ban Norfair. #1 priority.

 

[Barge]

MY personal Bowser experience:

Ban Norfair. Nuff said. No cg's for you PLUS its one of Bowser's best stages.

For counterpicks, there's a lot to choose from, Final Destination, Smashville (I suppose, not as big though), Yoshi's Island, etc.

Battlefield is iffy though, whilst Bowser can get CG'd here, he can stay on the playforms and come down for an attack, and go up again. But thats highly unlikely plus not very useful, so i doubt it'll happen.

But most importantly, ban Norfair. #1 priority.

Thanks for your input, norfair is a bad Ice climber stage in the first place.

 

[ignore the fire]

MY personal Bowser experience:

Ban Norfair. Nuff said. No cg's for you PLUS its one of Bowser's best stages.

I was just going to say this ^^^

I think it's safe to say that you should either ban Norfair or Rainbow Cruise no matter what. Just choosing between the two can be tricky. Norfair for Bowser though.

Final Destination should be you number one choice for a counterpick, but everyone I played at my last tourney banned it, so you'll probably want Smashville. Pictochat isn't bad either and Bowser couldn't really platform camp because the platforms disappear...


Oh, and good idea for a thread... we needed one of these

 

[Barge]

Not getting as many replies as I hoped for, maybe its just the character we're on though....
I should change it soon, I'll wait for a few more replies.

 

[ignore the fire]

Not getting as many replies as I hoped for, maybe its just the character we're on though....
I should change it soon, I'll wait for a few more replies.

It's probably just the character. Bowser is just... Bowser. He doesn't really have many stages to his advantage, and the one he DOES have sucks for the ICs anyways and will get banned.

 

[JustNoOne]

Not all platforms are bad ya know! We can Uair them through the platforms as well as belay and squall up through. The only reason why I like to ban stages with outrageous platforms is if the ICs can't get anything out of it (Nofair) or if they're battling characters with a good platform game (Snake)

BF is not that bad, but yes, banning Nofair is the best thing to do. Nofair offers no advantage to the ICs, or little advantage to them. With Bowser, I would probabily choose FD since it's so easy to Fthrow CG him there.

 

[Barge]

Okay, thank you all for your input. Lets move on to captain falcon. Let me know if anything needs to be added to my summary on bowser.

 

[Teh Future]

lol if you encounter a c. falcon at a tourney just laugh and ask them if you really have to face them or if you can just move on to the next spot in the bracket.

 

[Barge]

Yeah, I figured I wasn't getting much replies due to the character again.

 

[*P*L*U*R*]

CF can be good on moving stages, simply because:
A) He's the second fastest character in the game
B) His approach(or lack thereof) is helped.
and
C) IC does terrible on moving stages.

OBviously, ban FD, I think. CF's pretty good on Battlefield, methinks.


And don't be so ignorant when it comes to CF, guys. He can still Uair/Nair combo Nana off the stage if you get seperated. Then it's SoPo vs CF, where I think CF has the advantage. My point is, stop being ******** if we're discussing the CF matcup.

 

[Ayaz18]

Alrighty boys, I main Falcon and use him in tournaments REGULARLY along with Sonic, my brother Nasir also main's IC, so I know this match-up inside out.

Falcon's best stage is Norfair, the platforms allow for more approach options and mobility, and in this specific match-up in allows the IC CG's to be limited in some sort.

Falcon mains in this match-up will ABUSE jab's, Bair, Uair, and Utilt, but don't worry because Billizard prioritizes all these moves! ******

but this isn't a hard match-up but if you fight an experienced Falcon, you may have your work cut out for you

 

[Barge]

I'll update this tommorow, I need a little more input on captain falcon. Then we're moving to the characters that probably need a little more discussion.

 

[Bnzaaa]

The reason I said Battlefield for Bowser was because not only can he camp the platforms, but he can infinite jump between the platforms and the stage, keeping him in the air longer. Also Side-B kills are eaiser here, and he can attack through the platforms when he's under them with powerful moves.

However, Norfair is a lot worse. He can do all that, and Side-B into the lava does massive damage (or might kill, not quite sure.) Plus this stage is already bad for the Ice Climbers

For Captain Falcon, I agree with what Ayaz said.

 

[ignore the fire]

Alrighty boys, I main Falcon and use him in tournaments REGULARLY along with Sonic, my brother Nasir also main's IC, so I know this match-up inside out.

Falcon's best stage is Norfair, the platforms allow for more approach options and mobility, and in this specific match-up in allows the IC CG's to be limited in some sort.

Falcon mains in this match-up will ABUSE jab's, Bair, Uair, and Utilt, but don't worry because Billizard prioritizes all these moves! ******

but this isn't a hard match-up but if you fight an experienced Falcon, you may have your work cut out for you

Ban Norfair lol.

Counterpick FD (probably already banned), Smashville, Pictochat.

 

[Kage Me]

Ban Norfair lol.

Counterpick FD (probably already banned), Smashville, Pictochat.

...Not too sure about this one. Falcon is fast, he could easily get to the moving platform.

It's good for neutral stages, but I'd recommend Pictochat and FD over it.

 

[Noodlehead]

counterpick fd
gives you longer chaingrabs and blcok locks

smashville will work better than picto

anyways you really dont need to cp,already at huge advantage

 

[Barge]

Character 3: Diddy Kong

This one is a tuffie, we're both at the advantage on flat stages, but his nanners totally screw up our game. List the stage counterpicks/bans you have for diddy kong.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

I would probably take an IC to something a little more out there like rainbow cruise or norfair. Diddy isnt the best on both of those, but he can play there and it seems like it would work especially well to stop ics cgs..

 

[ADHD]

I'd be smart about taking an ice climber player to certain stages. I'd take them to lylat, or yoshis story. They can't get that spike at the end of a cg that easily on the yoshi story ledges, and lylat's tilting screws up cgs. It's even on basically every neutral stage, little things don't exactly change the matchup. Rainbow cruise is the final backup if I want to win against an ice climber player.

So ban FD, lylat, yoshis story, or rainbow cruise.

 

[nasir123]

well i think that an alright stage to counter pick is jungle japes because IC dont't require too much skill in order to do a massive chaingrab and you are able to do a deadly spike at the end of each chaingrab with ease although if you are knocked out by the opponent then you get owned and end up loosing an easy stock so i think it's like a 75 to 25 chance for IC.

 

[nasir123]

counterpick fd
gives you longer chaingrabs and blcok locks

smashville will work better than picto

anyways you really dont need to cp,already at huge advantage

hey noodle i am ayaz's bro i diddn't know you play IC's we gotta VS online some time but i guess there is bad connection.

 

[Ayaz18]

hey noodle i am ayaz's bro i diddn't know you play IC's we gotta VS online some time but i guess there is bad connection.

he doesn't nub, he main's falcon is discussing Falcon's weaknesses.............


<3 Nasi

 

[ignore the fire]

I play Diddy sometimes and the one thing I've noticed that may give ICs a slight advantage are platforms. Diddy is very mobile, though I'd rather stay on the ground and combo with bananas and such. Plus, the platforms on Battlefield catch bananas that you slip on, possibly breaking a Diddy's combo. Platforms also serve as a hinderance to Diddy's superior stage control.

So, ban FD (*sigh*) and counterpick battlefield I guess?
Basically CP a stage that minimizes banana stage control.


Referring back to Smashville not being a good CP against Falcon...
Falcon cannot platform camp. Let him try. IC's uair will outprioritze anything Falcon could try to hit you with on the platform. The fact that the platform moves completely destroys any hopes he'd have of camping there in the first place.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

if i were ic i wouldnt waste my ban on FD seeing as how its a good cg stage, even if it is vs a diddy kong.

 

[Umpadumpalump]

I would, you can CG on plenty of other stages, but I think rainbow cruise may be worse.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

I avoid FD against Diddy because platforms give me some breathing room to deal with his bananas. I'm sure there are worse stages to fight against Diddy on, but I don't know the match-up well enough to say much.

 

[Barge]

Character 4, donkey kong.

 

[Bnzaaa]

I would take him to a flat stage like Final Destination to force him to approach since his lacks a projectile. I also believe that it could make him slightly easier to read. He's also good from under, so you want to avoid platforms as much as you can.

Ban Brinstar.

It's one of the Ice Climbers worst stages because the small KO zones finish you off earlier than normal, and the lava can disrupt chaingrabs.

This happens to be Donkey Kong's best stage by far. The link below explains why.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=190951

 

[Mr.Victory07]

Yes, absolutely ban Brinstar if you want to win. We KO you there almost always at -90%s, and the lava will screw with infinites. The next smartes ban would probably be rainbow cruise(a given for ICs i think), and probably Japes, because we like that stage

I'd say cp something like FD. Forces us to face you head on and gives you more grab chances

 

[highandmightyjoe]

Brinstar is insane for DK in this match. I would say FD would help IC's here, but thats just an assumption, seems kind of like the obvious one.

 

[lain]

This thread doesn't look very useful.

Ban norfair, pray for no rainbow cruise, and make sure you win the first game so you can cp a neutral 3rd game and ****.

 

[magikguy]

I would also cp brinstar due to the level not being flat . As dk i love my platforms they are helpful , i would ban Final d .