I am far worse than everyone in my Melee group

[toadee]

So, I have about 5+ friends who play Melee with me in a competitive style. I have only been playing Melee in a competitive style for about 2 months now, whereas most of my friends have been playing it for around a year now. The problem is, that everyone is better than me.

The closest guy to my skill level I can play usually 2 stocks me. However, my best friend form the group is an amazing fox / falco / marth and pretty much 4 stocks me about 97% of all matches, and I have always said that there is no point in playing him. He even has JV5'ed me a couple of times. Well, the problem is that he (and one other guy who is his brother and is really good as well) are the only people I get to play with a lot. The other people I usually only see once every month / 2 months.

So, I came up with an idea.
I play him regular 4 stock matches and whenever I get a stock off him, he has to start off with that many stocks for every other match. So, if we were playing a match and I take a stock of him, the next match, he kills him self to he starts of with 3 stocks. This keeps going until he reaches no stocks. This takes about 1 or 2 hours to complete.

I have only done this twice, but I really do think I have improved from doing it. I do try to practice at home everyday, and I play as much Melee as I can when I'm at my friends house.

Do you think that there is any other training methods I could do?

Just to let you know, I'm a main.

Thanks for reading

 

[ShrieK1295]

Playing people who are much better than you can be helpful. It's going to be frustrating, and you definitely don't want all your practice to be against someone who stomps you super bad. But getting punished for doing stupid things will help you break bad habits.

 

[stabbedbyanipple]

This concept hits home for me, because when I first started I used to play people who would own me with like 8 of their character every match and I felt like it was impossible to catch up.

When you've been playing for like less than like 6-12 months, I'd recommend practicing tech skill a LOT. You have to be able to do what you WANT to do. As Falcon, a character who gets comboed pretty hard, and who doesn't have the best escape options, if you're slow and clunky then you'll just get bulldozed by anyone who has a grasp on shield pressure.

If your friend actually 4 stocks you literally every match, it will honestly take a long time to catch up to him if he stays practicing. However, the fact that your close friend is that much better than you isn't bad at all, because you can ask him for advice on what you're doing wrong. I'm sure he wouldn't mind helping you become a legit training partner.

Also, watch videos of good/solid falcons and try to learn from them. Read through the backlog of posts in the falcon boards. There are a lot of bad posts there, but there are also a lot of old ones that are really good.

Last thing: don't get frustrated no matter what. Easier said than done when getting 4 stocked continuously, but just know that it's a matter of experience. If you keep your head cool and stay diligent, you can become as good, if not better than your friend.

p.s. don't think you need that odd style of training, but if it works, it works I guess

 

[toadee]

This concept hits home for me, because when I first started I used to play people who would own me with like 8 of their character every match and I felt like it was impossible to catch up.

When you've been playing for like less than like 6-12 months, I'd recommend practicing tech skill a LOT. You have to be able to do what you WANT to do. As Falcon, a character who gets comboed pretty hard, and who doesn't have the best escape options, if you're slow and clunky then you'll just get bulldozed by anyone who has a grasp on shield pressure.

If your friend actually 4 stocks you literally every match, it will honestly take a long time to catch up to him if he stays practicing. However, the fact that your close friend is that much better than you isn't bad at all, because you can ask him for advice on what you're doing wrong. I'm sure he wouldn't mind helping you become a legit training partner.

Also, watch videos of good/solid falcons and try to learn from them. Read through the backlog of posts in the falcon boards. There are a lot of bad posts there, but there are also a lot of old ones that are really good.

Last thing: don't get frustrated no matter what. Easier said than done when getting 4 stocked continuously, but just know that it's a matter of experience. If you keep your head cool and stay diligent, you can become as good, if not better than your friend.

p.s. don't think you need that odd style of training, but if it works, it works I guess

Thanks for the advice!

 

[Zhea]

Honestly dude you have picked a hard character to win with this early in you melee career. You have to be a bit masochistic to get good with him(Trust me, I have gone through 2 years of this).

So first I want to ask you a question. What is more important to you, getting better or winning? Both are noble goals, there is no wrong answer.

If you want to get better, good news! You are in an excellent position to do just that. You are surrounded by players who are much better than you and you will improve much quicker than if you were with a group you could beat. And you will lose, oh will you lose, from dawn to dusk you will fly into the blast zones like a bird into a clean window. Your focus here should be to improve your spacing and your technical consistency. In a year or two of play you will be able to crush your old self in a similar fashion.

If you want to win, pick a different character. Go Shiek, Falco, Peach or Puff. You will do a lot better a lot faster. The trade off is the you who played to get better would crush the you who played to win in a year or 2's time. That's the trade off.

 

[toadee]

I always play to learn. For the record, I have used Falco and Puff for a considerable amount of time. I have only recently (last 2 weeks) picked up Falcon. I'm just experimenting with characters. BTW, my friend who 4 stocks me consistently suggested that I use a space animal or falcon to get better tech skill and puff to improve my spacing.

 

[AppleAppleAZ]

Practicing puff probably won't help your spacing imo, because there's not really any other character that has the same tools as her. Puff however, can help you a lot with reading your opponent and recognizing habits quickly. I say just practice spacing with Falcon instead.

Picking up a spacie will definitely speed up your hands though.

 

[Stratocaster]

You are blessed to have people who can destroy you around. That gives you something to strive for. My technical skill is good, and I have a good understanding of the game, but my play against good people is crap because I don't play people regularly enough who are better than me as my area is pretty weak. Point is, this is a good thing. If you're playing Falcon you're going to need to Shffl really well, as Falcon's top 5 moves are: Uair, Nair, Fair, Dair, Bair. Lol.

 

[Bones0]

The fact that everyone in your group is better than you is not a problem; it's an opportunity. I would be overjoyed to have a player nearby who could 4-stock me constantly.

 

[S7GF]

I understand what you mean. I'm getting back into smash after a 2-year break. I wasn't actually good then, and I'm not better now. But I guess I'm going to be going to smashfests and stuff soon. I know I'm going to get my ass handed to me, and it's going to be a really rough road considering I want to play Mr. Game and Watch.

 

[гυιη]

Knee Knee Knee. Well it isn't ALL you should do but the point is that if you want to get better you need to be offensive. Put on the Pressure. Read up on the forums for combo's for Captain Falcon. Learn matchups and how to counter-pick stages to give a little more advantage. Learn what other characters can do to you. Look into improving your tech skill. Videos can show you and teach you a lot, but the best way to learn is to just sit down with another Falcon main and have them teach you tips and tricks and then to constantly practice and perfect them. Most great Captain Falcon's learn how to "tech chase" so you should get good at that. A blessing with captain falcon is his speedy movement, so abuse it with dash-dancing. You can really throw someone off with approaching them and then dash-dancing a bit into a grab, down-throwing, running to a side and dash-dancing until you can tell which way they are getting up, and repeating. I used to fall for it all the time while playing with my friend. You have a long road ahead of you though. I have been playing competitively for about 9 months with a group of 4 friends and I'm still at the bottom in terms of skill level and tournament placings. I learned a lot about playing Falco and Luigi about my friend and last night after a big tournament, I was thrilled when the best member of our group noticed that I was catching up. You'll get better man, trust me. Don't expect to be amazing after 2 months. It takes time and you shouldn't give up.

Also I wouldn't suggest playing Game & Watch in Melee. If you want to play Game & Watch, play him in Project M 2.6, but not melee. I tried him out before in Melee and I would highly recommend that you pick another character that's within the top 10 on the tier list if you want to have a lot of options. Sheik, Marth, and Jigglypuff are all fairly easy to learn and abuse (Hardly anyone in my group even knows how to play patiently against a Puff main). Try to stick to only two characters for now. Once you're confident with those two, pick up one or two more. Becoming a good Falco or Fox player helped me so much to increase tech skill, knowledge of matchups, and fast repetitive button inputs.

 

[pokemongeof]

You Are lucky that you get to play with people! But since they've been playin longer than u, it makes sense that they beat u.

Keep practicing tech skill and keep playing them. Also watch some vids of some great falcons

 

[S7GF]

Also I wouldn't suggest playing Game & Watch in Melee. If you want to play Game & Watch, play him in Project M 2.6, but not melee. I tried him out before in Melee and I would highly recommend that you pick another character that's within the top 10 on the tier list if you want to have a lot of options. Sheik, Marth, and Jigglypuff are all fairly easy to learn and abuse (Hardly anyone in my group even knows how to play patiently against a Puff main). Try to stick to only two characters for now. Once you're confident with those two, pick up one or two more. Becoming a good Falco or Fox player helped me so much to increase tech skill, knowledge of matchups, and fast repetitive button inputs.

I know how hard it's going to be, but I don't want to be another cookie-cutter Fox, Falco, or Jiggs player. It's not fun, and the victories are not satisfying.

I want to set myself apart. I want to show everyone how good G&W can actually be. I have my tech skill down pretty well already. I'm not new to the game, just new to G&W.

 

[danieljosebatista]

Keep playing with them but also try to find some opponents close to your level to practice with. You need players of all levels to improve. And quite frankly, it will take much longer if you're playing these guys only because you aren't at a level where you can fully understand why you get punished or why things work sometimes but not all of the time.

 

[Ziodyne]

I know how hard it's going to be, but I don't want to be another cookie-cutter Fox, Falco, or Jiggs player. It's not fun, and the victories are not satisfying.

I want to set myself apart. I want to show everyone how good G&W can actually be. I have my tech skill down pretty well already. I'm not new to the game, just new to G&W.

I'm glad you have some conviction with regards to your main, but the idea that Fox, Falco, and/or Jiggs are cookie cutter characters is a misconception. Their general plethora of options for any situation means that that a player for these characters actually have many different personal choices for options and that results in countless different, individual styles for each character. If you played Fox, Falco, Jiggs for any length of time and developed them to a high level, I'm 99% sure you'd have a distinctive playstyle, not something "cookie-cutter."

 

[S7GF]

I'm glad you have some conviction with regards to your main, but the idea that Fox, Falco, and/or Jiggs are cookie cutter characters is a misconception. Their general plethora of options for any situation means that that a player for these characters actually have many different personal choices for options and that results in countless different, individual styles for each character. If you played Fox, Falco, Jiggs for any length of time and developed them to a high level, I'm 99% sure you'd have a distinctive playstyle, not something "cookie-cutter."

I'd probably develop something that was my own. As hipster as it may sound, I just don't want to play Fox or Falco if everyone is doing it. I want to have fun, but I do want to win, too. And I know it's going to be hard to win, especially with a low-tier character. But I'd rather have the respect of at least sticking with a character than just playing a higher tier character and doing better.

Obviously, characters are better than others. But I want to show to the world that you should be playing against the player instead of the character.

 

[Kadano]

Do you think that there is any other training methods I could do?

Don’t get hit.
That is all.

 

[Sedda]

Maybe this is more useful in 64 since every time you get hit you're pretty much done, but if you can somehow record your games every once in a while (With a crappy camera; doesn't matter) and watch them critically, you will learn. Watch the whole match, and then zoom in stock by stock. Figure out in what ways you got hit, and if you see any recurring habits in your playing, especially BAD habits. I say this because even if some of your habits don't get punished regularly, you'll eventually play someone who catches up to them and you'll suffer EVERY TIME, so it's better to have a handle on them (i.e. "That thing I do got me killed, so I won't do it against this guy anymore).

Other than that, just play a lot. You have to lose a lot to start seeing your mistakes. There is no better way to learn about spacing, approaching and DI than to suffer the consequences of not being good enough at them, so don't worry about it. If you're in it to get better, you'll be fine. You can only get frustrated if you're foolishly trying to WIN against people who are much better than you. You'll get there. Patience.

 

[TerryJ]

I know how it feels man. I used to play Melee for years with my friends and thought I was really good but when I first got into the tournament scene I used to get 4 stocked constantly. I couldn't help but laugh a lot knowing that there was still a LOT MORE work for me to do and that I had to catch up so I keep practicing.

Just keep at it, and play a lot. Bladewise told me that he too had to lose a LOT before he could realize what he was doing wrong and adjusted his game. It just takes practice, and a lot of it.

 

[Double Helix]

I wish I had people to play whether good or bad. Comes with the area I guess. I am a Ness player who has been at it for about a year. I know he is bad. I have been told to switch many times. But the character is too fun. If I can have fun getting bodied as Ness then I will lose a lot. Besides, it'd be cool to help advance a character's metagame.

Anyways...play the crap out of the game. Do not get discouraged, focus on improvement and not winning (which you seem to do), and most of all...have fun with the game. If you aren't having fun you lose. I don't care what the results say, you are doing it wrong XD

 

[Zodiac]

I know when you are getting bodied all you can think is "I am getting wrecked and I don't know how to stop it." But I would suggest trying anything you think might work, even if you screw it up the first time, or the second or third time eventually you will get it down. And you don't have to be paying attention to every little thing your opponent does all at once, that is a little overwhelming, the key to getting better and beating someone better than you is working on one thing at a time, even if you lose for the next two weeks you will start improving and start playing much closer matches and maybe even winning some.

 

[JKJ]

Focus on one thing per match. Realize a situation in which you are being punished, i.e. when you try to shield pressure, or when you try to approach, and focus on understanding why exactly you are being punished. If you are being constantly shield grabbed, focus on countering that with Falcon's knee-jab-knee or knee-gentleman pressure, or aerialing on the back of his shield. If you are being stuffed on approach, try to realize how he is predicting you and then mix it up. Never do the same thing and get punished for it more than twice. Play to learn, and realize why you are losing in specific situations, don't focus on results too much.