How do I short hop reliably?

[Keeshu]

In normal matches how much I short hop depends on how fast the character is. I almost never short hop with Lucario because he's so slow, whereas with Meta Knight I short hop much more often (so much so that occasionally it's by accident). Practicing in training mode I tend to either short hop or not jump at all, but rarely a full hop sneaks in sometimes, until I start trying to add in attacks/whatever, then it becomes full hops all the time (unless I accidentally trigger the short hop attack).

I'm not sure if I'm pressing the button wrong. Also, sometimes I wonder how much mentality plays a part since I usually don't have as much problem with doing short hops when I play Ridley and while he maybe fast for a heavy, he's not the fastest character around. I still mess up on short hops with him too though. It's a bit harder to not panic with Lucario since his slow speed and short range makes it hard for me to play neutral with him since I've always been used to either having long range, projectiles and/or fast speed to do anything in neutral. So I end up panicing a bit more when the enemy hits me because I have no idea what I could have done differently aside from having strong reads, and strong reads will only get you so far if you can't control your character perfectly (Though I do love that about Lucario because I often lose 1 or 2 stocks and then take 2-3 stocks of the opponent extremely quick when I stay alive at high percents for a while and it throws them off so much that they start getting nervous and play poorly. Lucario matches so tense!)

I do not want to rely on attacking soon after a jump to short hop. I found out about that when trying to learn how to do Meta Knight's ladder combo now that we have trajectory lines so I know whether or not it was the CPU moving or if it was something I was doing wrong. The timing is so incredibly precise on that combo, too early and you do a short hop, too late and it's not a true combo. So I ended up accidentally short hopping up air trying to do that combo. The problem with short hop attacks is that there are times where I do not want to throw out an attack randomly and short hopping is so essential to playing better and speeding up your gameplay. I should probably mention I set my jump to R specifically because of Meta Knight's ladder combo, but having jump on there has been so much nicer for all my characters as well since it makes certain aerials easier to connect.

I just want to make sure I learn how to short hop properly, and not accidentally condition myself into learning the wrong input timing or whatever for short hops, forever keeping me from doing short hops in the future since short hops are so crucial to speeding up gameplay.

TL:DR - How do I reliably short hop without doing the short hop aerial method so I can improve many parts of my gameplay because of how essential short hops are?

 

[CruS]

I do short hop drills:

1. ) Training mode
1.1 ) Short hop side to side until I get at least 5 laps without any full jumps.
1.2 ) Short hop fair side to side until I get at least 5 laps without any full jumps.
1.3 ) Short hop nair - ** -
1.4 ) Short hop nair fast fall - ** -

2. ) Game vs CPU
2.1 ) Focus on SHFFL for the duration of the game

 

[1FC0]

I practice SHs a lot in the online waiting room. I often practice running in a direction and then doing a reverse SH followed by a Bair there. You just need to press the jump button really fast. another way to SH is to press attack and jump at the same time. If you do that then you will perform a SH Aerial even if you keep the jump button pressed.

 

[Lord_Ghirahim]

You just need to release the jump button before your character leaves the ground. Practice a bit and it'll be easy. Good luck

 

[Keeshu]

You just need to release the jump button before your character leaves the ground. Practice a bit and it'll be easy. Good luck

I practiced throughout the lifespan of Smash 4. Every now and then I'd spend 2-3 hours at a time just short hopping. Probably have over 50 hours of practicing. I'm not really sure if more practice is going to do anything. I feel like I'm doing something wrong.

I do short hop drills:

1. ) Training mode
1.1 ) Short hop side to side until I get at least 5 laps without any full jumps.
1.2 ) Short hop fair side to side until I get at least 5 laps without any full jumps.
1.3 ) Short hop nair - ** -
1.4 ) Short hop nair fast fall - ** -

2. ) Game vs CPU
2.1 ) Focus on SHFFL for the duration of the game

I'll be lucky if I get just one lap of short hops at the rate I'm going. Less than 50% of the jumps I make are short hops.

 

[CruS]

Well it's basically just muscle memory, keep at it and eventually it will be easy for you

 

[Keeshu]

Well it's basically just muscle memory, keep at it and eventually it will be easy for you

I'm not so sure about that. I practiced it a lot throughout Smash 4's life, but I don't think I ever got better at it. I just worried I'm getting muscle memory for doing it wrong, making it even harder to short hop in the future as well.

 

[ddonaldo]

Pretend the jump button is at finger melting temperatures each time you go for it, told this to a friend a while back and he said it did help

 

[CruS]

I'm not so sure about that. I practiced it a lot throughout Smash 4's life, but I don't think I ever got better at it. I just worried I'm getting muscle memory for doing it wrong, making it even harder to short hop in the future as well.

This is why you should do drills.

You will tell your brain when you ****ed up and when you succeed because getting angry and restarting the set you will know that was bad. And when you finish a set, you will be rewarding your brain with happy feelings.

This way you will force your muscle memory to be correct.

If you just keep playing normally it would take a lot longer and you might enforce the wrong thing because you might reward your brain with happy thoughts because accidentily doing full hop fair actually landed a killing blow.

 

[Lord_Ghirahim]

I practiced throughout the lifespan of Smash 4. Every now and then I'd spend 2-3 hours at a time just short hopping. Probably have over 50 hours of practicing. I'm not really sure if more practice is going to do anything. I feel like I'm doing something wrong.

Ah sorry I can't really speak for Smash 4 as I play Melee instead, maybe it's a lot harder in Smash 4.
Even with practice it can be hard to hit 100 out of 100 short hops so don't be hard on yourself when you do fail one.
It's not something I've ever tried personally but I know some people use their nail and not their actual thumb for short hops.

 

[Keeshu]

This is why you should do drills.

You will tell your brain when you ****ed up and when you succeed because getting angry and restarting the set you will know that was bad. And when you finish a set, you will be rewarding your brain with happy feelings.

This way you will force your muscle memory to be correct.

If you just keep playing normally it would take a lot longer and you might enforce the wrong thing because you might reward your brain with happy thoughts because accidentily doing full hop fair actually landed a killing blow.

In the 19 minutes since I saw your post I mainly was just restarting after 1-3 jumps for the majority of the time. Though there was one time I jumped 5 times in a row, and another time where I jumped around 7 times in a row and those felt pretty good. Feels more like a fluke more than anything though considering I was constantly jumping the entire time.

Usually rewards type strategies never work for me whenever I try to change habbits in life, but hopefully this will be different. Gotta say though, doing the drills certainly does make things more fun. Also your reasoning for doing drills makes sense as well, I've seen a lot of people talking about short hop stuff but I haven't heard of doing drills, at least not like this where you restart everytime. I will be doing that from now on.

Ah sorry I can't really speak for Smash 4 as I play Melee instead, maybe it's a lot harder in Smash 4.
Even with practice it can be hard to hit 100 out of 100 short hops so don't be hard on yourself when you do fail one.
It's not something I've ever tried personally but I know some people use their nail and not their actual thumb for short hops.

Strangely enough I have an easier time short hopping in Melee than in Smash 4 or Ultimate. Though that might just be because I'm pressing Y when trying to short hop in Melee and not the Z button since I use the button in that area for jumps ever since Smash 4 because it helps characters out a lot with aerials.

Too late for not being hard on myself. Perfection doesn't exist, so I'll always find something to figuratively beat myself up about. Just getting better will make me less disappointed with myself.

I've heard the thumbnail strategy quite a few times. I can understand why it'd work for some people, but I just can't do it.

 

[CruS]

In the 19 minutes since I saw your post I mainly was just restarting after 1-3 jumps for the majority of the time. Though there was one time I jumped 5 times in a row, and another time where I jumped around 7 times in a row and those felt pretty good. Feels more like a fluke more than anything though considering I was constantly jumping the entire time.

Usually rewards type strategies never work for me whenever I try to change habbits in life, but hopefully this will be different. Gotta say though, doing the drills certainly does make things more fun. Also your reasoning for doing drills makes sense as well, I've seen a lot of people talking about short hop stuff but I haven't heard of doing drills, at least not like this where you restart everytime. I will be doing that from now on.

Good luck and report back

 

[rat.jpg]

People who can short hop perfectly every time prove that robots can blend in to human society

By the way what's the benefit of shorthopping without doing an aerial because you can just shorthop aerials by pressing jump and the attack at the same time

 

[Super_Hylian]

People who can short hop perfectly every time prove that robots can blend in to human society

By the way what's the benefit of shorthopping without doing an aerial because you can just shorthop aerials by pressing jump and the attack at the same time

I do it sometimes to fake people out. Make them throw up a shield, and then I grab them instead. Depends on the situation as always

 

[rat.jpg]

Oh I see that's very smart.

 

[CruS]

Also you want to learm to mixup you attack timings. Some attacks open up different combos if hit on a later frame. Such as Marth who can do some of his better combos from a late nair. If you always use the shortcut you always get an early (rising) nair

 

[Keeshu]

Good luck and report back

Day 1 practicing Short Hopping

Reporting back! Going to be making a series of videos of myself trying to improve with short hops to show my improvement overtime since I'm sure many people have troubles with short hops and would feel better about seeing someone else have troubles with it too. Sometime today I'm planning on getting a camera so I can show my hand movements for day 2 tomorrow hopefully.

I felt like I was making progress for a while. However later on I started having problems not pressing the button hard enough and it became very hard to break that habit. I forgot how discouraging it can be to just short hop well for a while and then out of no where it feels like it was all for nothing and feel like you weren't actually progressing.

 

[T3RT1S]

Day 1 practicing Short Hopping

Reporting back! Going to be making a series of videos of myself trying to improve with short hops to show my improvement overtime since I'm sure many people have troubles with short hops and would feel better about seeing someone else have troubles with it too. Sometime today I'm planning on getting a camera so I can show my hand movements for day 2 tomorrow hopefully.

I felt like I was making progress for a while. However later on I started having problems not pressing the button hard enough and it became very hard to break that habit. I forgot how discouraging it can be to just short hop well for a while and then out of no where it feels like it was all for nothing and feel like you weren't actually progressing.

I usually just hit the edges of the Y button and that makes short hopping easier.

 

[Keeshu]

I usually just hit the edges of the Y button and that makes short hopping easier.

The Y or X button might make things easier in some situations, but thinking about doing a short hop into up air while trying to maintain your momentum just sounds like a nightmare when trying to use the Y or X buttons.

Edit: Though next time I practice I'll be trying to use the ZR button. I assumed it was like fight pad/gamecube L+R buttons where you control how far the button is pressed, but no. ZR buttons are just regular buttons, and they kinda force the button to be pressed unlike the R button where you can press the button all the way down but the input won't register. So next time I practice I'll be trying the ZR button.

 

[MalanoMan]

I think I read somewhere that all SH's in this game have a 3 frame window. Same for every character.

I actually have the opposite problem. I have a problem with not jumping at all when I hit Y. (I use Y to jump.) I find that if I'm too quick, the controller doesnt even read my input (an OG gamecube controller), and then I stay grounded and get punished cuz if I use c-stick for an aerial, ill just smash attack instead of jumping and aerial attacking. I find that I have to make a conscious effort to press the button just enough to trigger my input, but be fast enough for the SH window... Anyone else experience this? I dont think im trying to jump too early either.

 

[kirby3021]

Lots and lots of practice is the only advice I can give here, and not just practice in training mode - after you have it down in training, practice in a higher-pressure situation like against a low-level CPU, then a higher-level CPU, all the while trying to remember to practice against human opponents as well.

I also find that some muscle and button pressing technique goes into performing reliable short hops. What I am referring to is where I start the movement (first joint of thumb vs base of thumb), hand position, and the pressure I use to tap the button. I can not give you much there, you will just have to find what works reliably for you in your situation and then repeat it a million times until it gets easier. In essence, just pay extremely close attention to EVERYTHING you are doing with your thumb, hand, and body when you are reliably performing short hops and find a way to repeat it.

I do find short hopping a bit harder to do in this game than in Smash 4.

 

[CruS]

Day 1 practicing Short Hopping

Reporting back! Going to be making a series of videos of myself trying to improve with short hops to show my improvement overtime since I'm sure many people have troubles with short hops and would feel better about seeing someone else have troubles with it too. Sometime today I'm planning on getting a camera so I can show my hand movements for day 2 tomorrow hopefully.

I felt like I was making progress for a while. However later on I started having problems not pressing the button hard enough and it became very hard to break that habit. I forgot how discouraging it can be to just short hop well for a while and then out of no where it feels like it was all for nothing and feel like you weren't actually progressing.

Wow, you really did take my advice

Ok - so after watching most of your video I can maybe give you another tip..

I asked my GF to try shorthopping and she has never played the game or any other smash game. Barely even a video game at all.
Now, try not to be discouraged by this, but she could do 5-6 consecutive short hops in a row after trying for a few minutes. SO unless your thumb is a piece of wood with glue on it - you are doing something wrong.

The first clue is that you started not jumping at all at some point in the session, that to me sounds like you are trying to push the button as light as you can, which in theory would work but the point is how fast you release the button. Normally when I shorthop I pretty much push the button all the way in, just release really quickly. I suggest trying without pressing so lightly, just try to do it quickly. If that doesn't work - I am sure your way of doing it would eventually work as well since I would say you did make some progress.

Keep at it!

 

[Keeshu]

Lots and lots of practice is the only advice I can give here, and not just practice in training mode - after you have it down in training, practice in a higher-pressure situation like against a low-level CPU, then a higher-level CPU, all the while trying to remember to practice against human opponents as well.

I also find that some muscle and button pressing technique goes into performing reliable short hops. What I am referring to is where I start the movement (first joint of thumb vs base of thumb), hand position, and the pressure I use to tap the button. I can not give you much there, you will just have to find what works reliably for you in your situation and then repeat it a million times until it gets easier. In essence, just pay extremely close attention to EVERYTHING you are doing with your thumb, hand, and body when you are reliably performing short hops and find a way to repeat it.

I do find short hopping a bit harder to do in this game than in Smash 4.

Definitely was planning on practicing against low level CPUs and then randoms at some point. Probably not high level CPUs since they can promote bad gameplay for fighting humans.

I try to pay attention to what my hands are doing, but sometimes my mind gets so distracted by the fact that I'm actually short hopping that I feel like it messes it up sometimes. Though a mental thing like that would probably go away once I do it enough times. The other problem is that a lot of the time when I do short hops correctly, I try to recreate it and it just stops working.

Wow, you really did take my advice

Ok - so after watching most of your video I can maybe give you another tip..

I asked my GF to try shorthopping and she has never played the game or any other smash game. Barely even a video game at all.
Now, try not to be discouraged by this, but she could do 5-6 consecutive short hops in a row after trying for a few minutes. SO unless your thumb is a piece of wood with glue on it - you are doing something wrong.

The first clue is that you started not jumping at all at some point in the session, that to me sounds like you are trying to push the button as light as you can, which in theory would work but the point is how fast you release the button. Normally when I shorthop I pretty much push the button all the way in, just release really quickly. I suggest trying without pressing so lightly, just try to do it quickly. If that doesn't work - I am sure your way of doing it would eventually work as well since I would say you did make some progress.

Keep at it!

I wonder if there's some tricks to speeding up the hands. Yes I am doing something wrong, otherwise short hopping wouldn't be a problem. Just I don't know what is the problem.

When I started not jumping it was because I was trying to recreate how I short hopped before, but for some reason my fingers just would refuse to press the button hard enough to do an input and manually pressing the button hard was way too slow leading to full hops. I was always trying to do it quickly, but I don't really know the most efficient way to press the button quickly, as silly as that sounds.

I was hoping to do short hop videos daily, but alas real life intervenes a bit too much, and I've gone a few too many days with 4 or less hours of sleep. Leading me to go a bit crazy at work. So won't be able to practice for a few days due to trying to catch up on sleep. Hopefully in that time I'll obtain a camera to show my finger movements. Also next time I practice I plan on trying to use the ZR button because the ZR button makes it kind of impossible to press the button too lightly if you press it at all unlike the R button. Seems easier in the few minutes I'm practicing now despite having skipped 2 days of sleep.

I will also try to play characters other than my main Meta Knight so I will attempt to short hop more.... Meta Knight is a very forgiving character when it comes to not being able to short hop due to his fast fall speed and multiple jumps and the way his aerials are. Pichu (because 30% slower fast fall speed) and Ridley are rather forgiving too but not as much as Meta Knight. Wolf and Lucario are 2 characters I really want to get good with that do get helped significantly more by short hopping by comparison. Of course, one thing at a time, since Lucario also needs to master turnaround B and wave bouncing stuff since it helps him more than most characters. So I'm definitely going to be using Wolf a lot for a while.

 

[Datfalsetto]

Well.... If you hit jump and A at the same time you auto short hop and attack. Idk that's been the best way... You can even use directional commands to change the attack... Thought this would be good to know.

 

[Switch313]

I think with the shorts hops, rather than trying to time letting go of the jump button before the jump animation just challenge yourself to let go faster in general.

I thought I wasn't pressing the button for very long either and turns out I was (compare how fast you can tap and let go with your index finger compared to your thumb and you will see you are just holding on for too long). Also, I noticed that some controllers are just better at this fast twitchy stuff than others. On my "pro-like" controller I can't short hop as reliably as on my old gamecube controller/cheap gamecube controller knock off I got years ago to play wii :D Also jump and attack helps me do bair and fair short hop attacks!

 

[One_C]

I actually have the same problem, except I play almost exclusively claw, so pushing the Y button with the side of your index finger is harder than pressing X with the bottom of your thumb in the traditional grip. Does anyone have any recommendations aside from drills and practice whenever you can like during waiting room or after a stock, cause I've already been doing those. What I mean are stuff like finger exercises.

 

[NintendoParty]

I actually have the same problem, except I play almost exclusively claw, so pushing the Y button with the side of your index finger is harder than pressing X with the bottom of your thumb in the traditional grip. Does anyone have any recommendations aside from drills and practice whenever you can like during waiting room or after a stock, cause I've already been doing those. What I mean are stuff like finger exercises.

With 2.0, you can just press two jump buttons at same time for sh. I use L and ZL together.

 

[Keeshu]

With 2.0, you can just press two jump buttons at same time for sh. I use L and ZL together.

I saw that and was going "please be good", and then I got around to trying it in the game and I was able to short hop consistently easily. I'm so glad they added this feature in the game. Short hopping shouldn't be a problem for me anymore now. Still gotta practice this because pressing 2 buttons at once to jump isn't exactly normal but should be much better than short hopping by tapping. I feel like my hands are just too slow to ever reliably short hop, even on good days. If I'm having a horrible day, there's no way I'd be able to short hop.

I'm curious what people have their buttons set to now. Right now I have ZR and R as my jump buttons since it's the same side of the controller, and ZL and L as shield so I can quickly shift the position of my shields, while I still have X as grab which is a leftover of trying to short hop. However, I'm thinking I might swap jump buttons to ZR and ZL or L and R in case that shifts the movements of the controller in my hands less.

 

[Sco7t]

I'm using ZL and L for shield, ZR, X, and Y for jump, and R for grab. ZR + Y I find makes for a nice easy shorthop, or you could could go ZR + X so your thumb is in a good spot to move to move to A.