how do i handle a fox when i can't even grab him?

[JBM falcon08]

yesterday i had a tournament i held and i tied for fifth due to some poor playing against fox and falco, but mostly fox. his playing style was like lunin's, although nowhere near as technical. all he seemed to do to me was run away laser somewhat then come in with an approach, hit my with a nair or dair and and shine, if he got the combo going he wouldn't run away, but if he didn't he'd just run away and wait for an opening i'm guessing. i couldn't seem to get a grab in on him at all nor could i really land any hits.

so anyone plz tell me, how in the world do you handle a fox who is extremely hard to grab? the way this guy played was with isai's advice"don't get hit".

 

[balladechina212]

You've already figured out his strategy (running away, etc.), this is a good first step. Now all you have to do is predict where he is going and get your grabs that way. In other words, you know he'll run away, so attempt to grab at a spot that overshoots where you usually grab.

 

[Smash G 0 D]

Camp! Don't approach him. When he comes at you with a Nair or Dair, roll or WD back. You could even use a jab to keep him away. From a backwards WD you could Dtilt or Fsmash or dash into a JC grab. But you'll have to do it fast.. Mix up your wavedashes and dashes and crouchcancles with some Dtilts, Jabs, and Fsmash to space. He cant shine you if you keep him a sword's length away. Then when he has to recover from lag, you dash and JC grab him. Best thing to do against a very aggressive Fox is to camp and wait for him to come to you, or atleast keep him outside of your swords range. While you are camping, observe how he approaches you. Then, when he is coming near, you will know which attack to use. Or maybe you'll dodge it. Spacing with your sword will usually be the downfall of Fox. Whenever you have the sure opportunity, go for the grab!

 

[JBM falcon08]

yeah smashGOD, i thought about that after i was done playing him, i wish i would've considered that b4 i played his fox

ok, so as far as his falco goes, it was the same way, he kept himself spaced well and approached with lasers that could normally lead into grabs. it seemed that if i would of seen my match would have been me just shielding practically alot bcuz of his lasers. i know i should've used the counter against his laser approach but once again, i wasn't thinking about it.

god i hate knowing what to do but not being able to practice it and put it into my game( i wish i had better fox and falco players around me.

 

[Smash G 0 D]

Ah... Falco. Yeah you can ignore Fox's lasers but not Falco's. If he sucks at SHL then you could crouch them.. or not.I would switch to Luigi if I was in your situation.. but I don't think that's a rational solution for you. If he laser spams, then try to get as close as you can to him. It's okay if you take a few hits. If he just approaches you with lasers, then you might want to try some spot dodges. And, once again, try some backward WDs into spacing or JC grabs.I know it's difficult to do this when he's lasering, but you might as well take a few hits. You should be able to make up for the damage if you grab him. If you try to jump over the lasers, Falco will take you out with pillaring and his quick aerials. Remember, Fsmash is your friend!

EDIT: I just saw this, and since I suck vs Falco, you'll probably get more help from here than you will from me . http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=102497

 

[DuskMarthWater]

Try spacing. Marth's a freakin' god if you space right. Also, try luring them toward you. Don't move around too much, but do things like double fairs and shuffled or, if you're quick enough, the no-lag non-shuffled nair, and tempt him into attacking you. Once he tries something, space right and grab or use an aerial. There are many, many other options, but that's just one of them. Use your imagination, that's how you usually win anyways, unexpected stuff. From there, it's your job to own his face.

Against Falco, try to stay aggressive and not let him use so many lasers. Stay in the air, although not very high up in the air...if you know what I mean. Use dash attacks and dtilts to JC grab combos, that usually gets their lasers screwed up. If you have a platform, please abuse it, either by avoiding the lasers or an evil utilt combo. Again, there are other options, but I won't name them, most of them more advanced anyways. And again, just use your imagination, you'll figure something out that works.

 

[Pye]

Hey guys, just a quick question, and probably a very nooby one. I just want to be clear though. In Emblem Lord's "Getting Past Falco's Lasers" guide, he mentions "Marth's shield trap game" a few times.

What exactly is Marth's shield trap game?

 

[ArcNatural]

Marth's shield trap game is just the many options you have when you have an opponent shielding against you. You can shffl a spaced or nonspaced fair and dash away from, or behind them before the can do anything. You can shffl a spaced fair to dtilt or downsmash trying to shield stab them. You can basically force them to do something as they can't reach you from the shield. It's one of the main ways to create mindgames for Marth. Such as space the fair perfectly enough at first they may try to shield grab you, miss and you get a free hit. Later they may try rolling behind you after the fair, then you just turn around and grab or w/e. It's one of the main reason's Marth's spacing is so important.

 

[Retroking2000]

yesterday i had a tournament i held and i tied for fifth due to some poor playing against fox and falco, but mostly fox. his playing style was like lunin's, although nowhere near as technical. all he seemed to do to me was run away laser somewhat then come in with an approach, hit my with a nair or dair and and shine, if he got the combo going he wouldn't run away, but if he didn't he'd just run away and wait for an opening i'm guessing. i couldn't seem to get a grab in on him at all nor could i really land any hits.

so anyone plz tell me, how in the world do you handle a fox who is extremely hard to grab? the way this guy played was with isai's advice"don't get hit".

the space animal game is based on high pressure play .......they need to keep the pressure on to beat a marth . so just relax don't let him intimidate you because of the lasers . try wave shielding and the counter
is good for defending yourself and remember marths metagame is based on the edge ..... through him off and edge guard him

Btw ken edgeguards space animals by pressing down B as soon as their firefox comes in range then the fox will get hit and do another Up B while charging you come down and hit him with a fair then edge hog it is really effective

I am sorry if my advice did not help lol

 

[Dv02]

Counter dude.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Dude, DD grab camp. dd away from his dair or nair and just come back in with a grab. But, make sure your grabs **** him. Like, if he's hard for you to grab you better make sure you can 0-death, but thats not practical so at least be sure you can get him of the edge or do damage.

 

[Micheloxx]

he can run away because of lasers so what i think you should do, is to mind game a lil, man, u r marth and got a lor of range more thatn what fox has, use ftilt when he comes and shieldgrab, do diferent things i dont know moonwalk, but try to be fast 2