HDTV.. hear me out.

[Lingy]

I've searched 'HDTV' and looked through every single topic, but I still have one last question. (I'd post it there but those topics are all pretty old.)

Some people replied to use wii 480p component cables to fix the lag, but other people have reported that component cables don't improve lag at all. I'm pretty confused about the whole topic, seeing how everything is extremely complicated.

I tried playing Melee yesterday on my HDTV, but had some input lag and had no idea how to fix it (I had no idea about all of this 480p crap until today) so I had to use an old crappy TV. The gamecube and the wii are both 480p if I recall correctly, so I'm assuming they would both show the same input lag if the same component cables were used.


So.. to sum up my question: Will Wii 480p component cables reduce lag?


EDIT: To keep this in the Brawl Discussion thread, I'll direct the question above to those who have a bit 'outdated' HDTV (around 2005-2006ish), have experienced delay lag, and have Brawl right now. People who do not fit in ths category can still respond.

 

[Nuvia]

What a minute... this isn't about Brawl at all!

 

[Nowfist]

I dont think it reduces lag at all, as much as it just ups the resolution output of the game.
Correct me if im wrong.

 

[-sonny-]

Yeah, I'm kind of wondering that too.

I can play Melee on my HDTV without any lag whatsoever, so should it be okay with Brawl as well? I would appreciate a reply.

 

[Lingy]

...Hm, I was pretty sure I posted this in the Melee section. Move this please D:

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Wow...4 posts in about -2 minutes...lol...

This isn't related to Brawl...

 

[DarthBrittinias]

It's not so much 480i versus 480p that causes the lag. All LCD high definition televisions have a slight lag on what they display. You won't see that lag on a CRTHDTV or a Plasma as much either. It's most noticeable on the LCD televisions. That's why games like Rock Band and Guitar Hero actually have an option to configure your televisions lag.

 

[iharfor]

Look at your video settings in brawl. I needed to get component cables to fix the lag on my DLP. Not only did I need the cables, but when I started the game it asked me if I wanted to turn progressive can on. Thats what you need to do I imagine.

 

[Dogenzaka]

First of all. Melee doesn't support 480p.
Second of all, if you're having input lag, it's probably your TV. Not the cables. Not the console.

What kind of TV do you have?

Not only did I need the cables, but when I started the game it asked me if I wanted to turn progressive can on.

If he has a Wii.
And he has component cables.
And an HD TV,
the setting on his Wii SHOULD be set to widescreen 480p TV.
However, Melee won't look much better. It doesn't natively play in widescreen 480p.

 

[Egaseci]

Certain TVs use special filtering that results in all forms of input lagging. Check with other games to confirm that the problem isn't with Brawl. There may be a way to disable whatever kinds of filters your TV uses but I've heard of some hdtvs that have filtering that can't be disabled. It's sad because it can truly ruin any sort of gameplay.

edit-
Someone above said this happens more with LCD screens, not true. I've seen it happen on all types of screens (plasma screens are probably the most common). It's not related to the type of screen, it's related to whether or not the manufacturers decided to enable special filters to make the picture better. Sadly, this same filter makes input lag quite a bit.

 

[Lingy]

I have a DLP Samsung TV (supposedly the two types that show the most delay lag).

First of all. Melee doesn't support 480p.
Second of all, if you're having input lag, it's probably your TV. Not the cables. Not the console.

What kind of TV do you have?

I may have a completely wrong idea of what causes input lag, but from what I've read, the differences between HDTVs and consoles (reguarding 480p and all that crap, not sure what it's really called) are what causes the lag, due to the fluctuations that have to be processed, and certain component cables make this process easier.

 

[Dogenzaka]

I have a DLP Samsung TV (supposedly the two types that show the most delay lag).

Eh then that might be your problem right there. lol.

 

[Lingy]

Well, I don't really want to resort to buying a new HDTV, so I was wondering if anyone else had a DLP Samsung TV, and has no delay lag on their wii because they are using the 480p wii cables.

 

[usea]

Wii component cables will not fix the lag, they will just make the picture sharper.

You need to turn off all processing stuff on your tv to reduce the lag; usually there is a "game mode" which does this for you. On some sets you just won't be able to reduce the lag to a tolerable amount.

 

[Barrakketh]

I have a DLP Samsung TV (supposedly the two types that show the most delay lag).

The 2006 and later models should have had the input lag problem fixed (it is on my 2006 Samsung), and there is a "Game Mode" that you can enable to turn off any extra processing that the TV will do to the picture.

That said, component cables/480p input can fix lag. One of the main causes of lag that your TV has to scale your picture to the TV's native resolution (no, it isn't restricted to LCDs). If you're using composite/S-video, the another issue is that your TV also has to deinterlace the image. 480p input isn't interlaced, so there is no lag caused by your TV having to do extra work by deinterlacing the image.

It might not fix all of your problems, but you're almost guaranteed to see an improvement.

 

[KitsuneXXX]

Actually, Melee DOES have 480p... 'p' stands for progressive scan, which most gamecube games have an option for, and 480 is the standard deffinition. In most cases, componant cables (RGB) will fix the lag. At least on my TV, the lag dropped from 8 frames to 1.

 

[Lingy]

..Never mind, I'm getting confused with component / composite..

 

[hotgarbage]

First of all. Melee doesn't support 480p.

Actually it does. It doesn't support widescreen though.


And component cables will reduce lag in most cases. How much of a reduction, or if it is reduced at all, depends on the tv. But in a general sense they will help.

(I assume you have a LCD TV btw) This is because component cables allow the Wii/gamecube to output in 480p. Composite cables will only output in 480i. LCD tv's have a "native resolution", which means that they can only display images of a certain resolution. So lets say that your LCD tv does 720p (and since that is it's native rez that is all it can do), but the wii is outputting at 480i. Now we have a problem, because if the LCD TV were to display the signal as is it would look tiny on the screen (only using 480 out of 720 pixels) . Add to that the fact that LCD's can't display interlaced (i) video... and we've got a problem. To solve this, the tv will take the 480i signal and turn it into a 720p signal so that it can be displayed. But this is where the lagging issue crops up. To "upscale" the 480i signal to 720p the 480i signal it is sent through a processor and processed, but this process takes time, resulting in lag.

....okay now to finally answer your question >____> . Component cables will reduce lag by reducing the amount of image processing that has to be done. i.e: instead of 480i -> 720p (composite) it is now 480p -> 720p (component). Component cables eliminate the i -> p stage completely, which will reduce the total lag.


Well! Hope that helps!

(btw, if your tv has any "image enhancing" options you'll want to turn those off. Just fool around and see what works)

 

[Dogenzaka]

Actually it does. It doesn't support widescreen though.

Ah. My bad then.

 

[igloo9]

Hey guys I saw this topic and I have a question too.

I have a 32" widescreen Emerson tv. I have wii and component cables. Will Brawl lag for me at all if I play in 480p?

Edit: Also, the tv has 8 ms response time.

 

[SYC!]

First of all. Melee doesn't support 480p.

Wow. It's kinda hard to take anything you say seriously when the first thing you put out is a lie. Congratulations.

Everytime I start up Melee it asks if I would like enable progressive scan. Hmmmmmmm... guess Melee doesn't use 480p then. Those component cables I have don't do ****, huh?

 

[Goldkirby]

It's been said a couple times already, but component cable running the game in 480p will help reduce the lag a little bit, since the TV won't have to use processing power on de-interlacing. However, your TV still has to upscale from 480p to 720p or 1080p depending on what TV you have. This will still keep some of the lag there, but it is much less noticeable. Also I think some of the 2005-6 TV's have a "game" mode which will also help out with the perceived lag.

@igloo9 - yes, it will still lag, but not as much. Use the component cables.

 

[igloo9]

It's been said a couple times already, but component cable running the game in 480p will help reduce the lag a little bit, since the TV won't have to use processing power on de-interlacing. However, your TV still has to upscale from 480p to 720p or 1080p depending on what TV you have. This will still keep some of the lag there, but it is much less noticeable. Also I think some of the 2005-6 TV's have a "game" mode which will also help out with the perceived lag.

@igloo9 - yes, it will still lag, but not as much. Use the component cables.

It will still lag even WITH the component cables!?

 

[sffadsad]

I don't understand (sorry tech newb). The Wii has a resolution setting for HDTVs. I'm assuming with component cables and selecting the HDTV setting would allow you to play Brawl without any lag.

Also does anyone know what Screen Burn In reduction is?

 

[Lingy]

Are these what you are using?

 

[hotgarbage]

Ah. My bad then.

yea, I myself just found out that is was progressive last week O___o. This whole time I thought it wasn't


anyways @Lingy: Yea, this stuff is really confusing lol. In case you're confused about it:

composite = the cable with 3 connections. Can only output in 480i

component = the cable with 5 connections. Can output in pretty much every signal, but in the wii's case will be doing 480p

It will still lag even WITH the component cables!?

Technically yes, it will always lag a minimum of 16 milliseconds (1/60 of a second or 0.016 seconds). (....Though needless to say such a small period of time can't be detected by human senses).
The amount of lag present depends on the TV though. If you can't notice it and it doesn't effect your ability to win matches don't worry about it.

 

[brawl1994]

I play melee on a 32" LCD HDTV, I dont' notice any lag, I use component cables and when I switch my TV to the wii input it says in corner of the tv 480p SD....what does that mean? and will I have any lag with brawl?

 

[Ice Ninja]

Also does anyone know what Screen Burn In reduction is?

It just lowers the brightness of the screen so that it doesn't create as much heat and burn into the screen.

 

[igloo9]

Are these what you are using?

No. I'm using the official nintendo component cables.

 

[TK Wolf]

To keep my answer short and simple:

1) Component cables reduce lag in many cases. (Did wonders for me)
2) Turning off all filtering effects of your HDTV helps. Some have "game mode" settings, too. (Also made a difference for me)

 

[Lingy]

Okay.. so old HDTVs will still show a bit of lag even with wii component cables? Hopefully it isn't noticeable.

No. I'm using the official nintendo component cables.

Oh, those aren't the official ones?
...I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter which company it's from though, 3rd party included. They aren't like controllers, and pretty much the only thing you have to look for when buying them is to see if they're frayed by rats from the factory that produces them.

 

[Lingy]

...er, sorry, double post, delete this please.

 

[sffadsad]

Actually 3rd party stuff has a tendency to die off. I'm not sure about video cables, but it never hurts to be safe. Plus on Amazon you can get em for like 27 dollars wereas on gamestop.com they're like 30+ -_-;

 

[Lingy]

If you're worried about prices, go to Frys.

 

[Hitzel]

First of all. Melee doesn't support 480p.

Yes it does. Hold down B as you're starting the game up.

 

[Igneous42]

It's not so much 480i versus 480p that causes the lag. All LCD high definition televisions have a slight lag on what they display. You won't see that lag on a CRTHDTV or a Plasma as much either. It's most noticeable on the LCD televisions. That's why games like Rock Band and Guitar Hero actually have an option to configure your televisions lag.

I've been told that plasma is worse than LCD. And by personal expierience I'd have to agree. I have a LCD HDTV and have no lag problems. But my friends has played on a plasma screen and said it was pretty much unplayable.