Gravity Mod / Brawl+ Competitive Code Suggestions and Analysis

[K1T3]

Guys. I've been playing high gravity with my friend for months now (seriously, we are addicted to it).
The trick to making it better is changing the damage ratio to 1.1. It returns the vertical power back to normal
makes many of the wimpy horizontal strikes decent (Samus Charge Shot, Missiles, the Knee, etc).

Falco's d-throw stops chaining but instead allows combos into aerials often times.
Luigi's d-throw also chains into aerials.
C. Falcon can combo n-air into d-throw into u-air into knee (this may be because of opponent's bad DI but I've done it before)
MK's mach tornado is unable to rise.
Sonic and Fox are speedy beasts.
And of course, much much more.

If you have the directional air dodging, then recovery shouldn't be a problem. Link can cancel a vertical air dodge into his hookshot, giving him another jump worth in recovery. Sonic can airdodge after up-b allowing him to negate is falling frames and give him even a greater rise. As for Yoshi, air dodging basically substitutes his up-b which wasn't great anyways.

Good info thx. I'll give 1.1 dmg a try too =)
Does it stop the floor laser/jab lock infinites or DDDs standing infinte by chance, if it does I think this will be a great addition.

Hmm interesting. I will try out high-gravity sometime, I didn't even consider playing that mode with my friends when they came over lol. It should be fun and feel like melee more. But ya, if i remember right, high gravity may have been a little too high, may be a little higher than melee. So I think it's just better if you increase the gravity just by a little.

Im not sure yet as to if we should make a dif version of brawl like melee was, or if it would be right to keep the normal version, but i guess we could have two versions. But when u do mod Brawl into a different version, don't make it exactly like Melee. What I'd like to see is something in the middle... so instead of increasing gravity by 50%, increase it like 25%, and such. Cus if you make it feel like melee... well then it's more just like playing melee, and there should be at least a small difference in the gameplay that you can notice.

Well anyways thx for working on this, (@ the people making a new version of brawl) and gj so far

Yeah I don't want to make it just like melee I want it to still be a new game so a combination of both to make it better than both. My current settings include a 25% increase to gravity, directional air dodge, l cancel, and no tripping. Leaveing things lilke the new hit stun and shield mechanics seperate it vastly from melee and give the game many new interesting options when combined with the settings I mentioned. I'm also go to try this 1.1 dmg thing.

I think having 2 different versions of brawl will be fine. One standard and one for those people that like a more fast paced game with technical aspects and more options.

 

[Problem2]

Just use the Gravity modifier codes to find the best gravity you want that doesn't carry the cons of destroying Up Bs. Here, I'll post them.

Gravity modifier (P1)
4A000000 90180F20
140000E0 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Gravity modifier (P2)
4A000000 90180F7C
140000E0 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Gravity modifier (P3)
4A000000 90180FD8
140000E0 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Gravity modifier (P4)
4A000000 90181034
140000E0 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

What you put in XXX for

0.05 = 3D4CCCCD
0.25 = 3E800000
0.5 = 3F000000
1.0 = 3F800000
1.5 = 3FC00000
2.0 = 40000000
2.5 = 40200000
3.0 = 40400000
3.5 = 40600000
4.0 = 40800000
5.0 = 40A00000
6.0 = 40C00000
8.0 = 41000000
10.0 = 41200000
16.0 = 41800000
20.0 = 41A00000
32.0 = 42000000
64.0 = 42800000
100.0 = 42C80000

Of course, this only affects vertical gravity, not horizontal (as far as I know, testing it would be nice).

The gravity's effect of reducing jump height and Up-b runs a little deeper into the coding then people think. I just tested this code, and it did nothing but replicate heavy brawl (with all's it's jump nerfness in tact).

Imo, it would be better if you can mess with the values of the metal form. Remove the faux-super armor frames, the increased heaviness, and reduce the falling speed so that it is not quite the speed that the metal box gives you.

an alternative is to use high gravity, but code an invisible nerfed bunny hat lol.

EDIT: K1T3, what value do you use to replicate x1.25 gravity? Is it 3FA0000?

 

[K1T3]

The gravity's effect of reducing jump height and Up-b runs a little deeper into the coding then people think. I just tested this code, and it did nothing but replicate heavy brawl (with all's it's jump nerfness in tact).

Imo, it would be better if you can mess with the values of the metal form. Remove the faux-super armor frames, the increased heaviness, and reduce the falling speed so that it is not quite the speed that the metal box gives you.

an alternative is to use high gravity, but code an invisible nerfed bunny hat lol.

EDIT: K1T3, what value do you use to replicate x1.25 gravity? Is it 3FA0000?

Yeah that's the value I use. It still nerfs jumps and up B's some but not as much as heavy mode does so it gives the bonuses we wanted without quite as much of a cost.

I tested 1.1 dmg. I like it so far. It brings killing percents down a little bit and it does stop Flaco's chain throw. Unfortunately D3's chain and infinite are still intact as are the lock infinites =(

With all the changes it seems to work rather well. I've been able to move the stock back up to 4 and it's still faster than a normal 3 stock brawl match.

I am having one problem but I don't know if maybe it's just my controller... When I spam shuffled aerials across the stage a decent amount of the time right after I land my character will roll right, never left just right (this stops any chance of a follow up and is very annoying) Anyone else have this problem or know what it could be?

 

[Problem2]

I haven't had anything like that happen to me once. Try replugging your computer.

...but omg, this is sooooo close to Melee, I can't even believe my eyes and fingers! This is what I dreamed of nights after watching the Dojo. Pretty amazing.

 

[K1T3]

I haven't had anything like that happen to me once. Try replugging your computer.

...but omg, this is sooooo close to Melee, I can't even believe my eyes and fingers! This is what I dreamed of nights after watching the Dojo. Pretty amazing.

I know exactly what you mean =)
I've been spamming my regional thread all day about how ecstatic I've been about this and how amazing it feels and how fun and fast it is. I just love this.

Yeah it's probably just the controller. I've been using my old controller for brawl as it no longer worked well for melee. Since brawl didn't really have any technical aspect any control worked fine, but I guess adding all this great stuff shows that it's still not a good controller =(

Exactly what do you have on and are playing in?

I changed the dmg to 1.1, Lcancel, Wavedash, No trip, and gravity of 1.25.

I hear you can play hacked brawl if you both have the same hacks on wifi as well.

 

[Problem2]

That's what I've been playing on, and to be more specific, I use wavedash v2.1. I'm glad I found someone who actually likes the same settings.

 

[MuBa]

Since I understand the conversion between hexadecimals and decimals (also thanks to the good old calculator) I'm gonna try out 1.20, 1.15, and 1.10x gravity and tell you guys what I think about it.

 

[Revven]

Since I understand the conversion between hexadecimals and decimals (also thanks to the good old calculator) I'm gonna try out 1.20, 1.15, and 1.10x gravity and tell you guys what I think about it.

Tell us the results!

 

[MBlaze]

Any luck on better results such as not screwing up b moves and U attacks?

 

[Delta_BP26]

WHAT?!!! I can't download the HBC?!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[:034:]

So are these codes available for the EU/PAL version of Brawl?

 

[MBlaze]

So are these codes available for the EU/PAL version of Brawl?

I heard only US as of now.

@Delta: Don't worry, hopefully a patch for the new update will come up soon.

 

[MuBa]

So far I've been trying out 1.1125x Gravity and it looks like it works out pretty darn well. I've compared both Captain Falcons: One with 1.0 Gravity, and the other with 1.1125.

1.1125x Falcon jumps lower and falls faster than 1.0 Falcon by a small amount BUT their Up Bs hardly changed.

Sonic on the other hand, 1.1125x Sonic's recovery is lower than 1.0x Sonic BUT the recovery is STILL manageable to get back to the stage without much problem, plus he's also got the Melee airdodge to help him out.

So I say 1.1125x Gravity is the best in terms of being able to recover and fastfall. But one main issue still resides. WE NEED ADDED HITSTUN TO BE ABLE TO COMBO!!!


Lol at the numbers I've given them. Makes them sound like some robots.

Edit: The code for 1.1125x Gravity is -> 3F900000

 

[MBlaze]

So far I've been trying out 1.1125x Gravity and it looks like it works out pretty darn well. I've compared both Captain Falcons: One with 1.0 Gravity, and the other with 1.1125.

1.1125x Falcon jumps lower and falls faster than 1.0 Falcon by a small amount BUT their Up Bs hardly changed.

Sonic on the other hand, 1.1125x Sonic's recovery is lower than 1.0x Sonic BUT the recovery is STILL manageable to get back to the stage without much problem, plus he's also got the Melee airdodge to help him out.

So I say 1.1125x Gravity is the best in terms of being able to recover and fastfall. But one main issue still resides. WE NEED ADDED HITSTUN TO BE ABLE TO COMBO!!!


Lol at the numbers I've given them. Makes them sound like some robots.

Edit: The code for 1.1125x Gravity is -> 3F900000

Everyone agree for 1.1125x to be the gravity for regulations?

 

[MuBa]

First try it out and see for yourselves. If you feel like it makes the game a lot balanced in terms of being able to combo yet still retain a manageable recovery then this could become a norm.

Besides, it makes broken recoveries like DDD, MK, Jigglypuff a bit easier to edgeguard.

And if you want to compare b/w 2 gravities all you have to do is give Player 1 and 2 the modified gravity and leave Player 3 and 4 alone and compare player 1 and 3's jumps in Final Destination.


Also for those of you who is very worried about this game being like Melee, trust me it won't be. The game will still feel like Brawl except a LOT smoother and combo-able.

 

[5ive]

This changes Brawl Physics. We aren't trying to accomplish anything like that.
Again, we want to accomplish a Deeper Brawl. Brawl is not Brawl without it's unique physics.

 

[MuBa]

This changes Brawl Physics. We aren't trying to accomplish anything like that.
Again, we want to accomplish a Deeper Brawl. Brawl is not Brawl without it's unique physics.

Adding a little bit of gravity will STILL not make Brawl like Melee in any way, shape, or form.

Try out 1.1125x Gravity and you'll see what I mean.


And in terms of hitstun, I think we need a good 120 frames (2 seconds) worth of it ONLY from aerials, throws, and tilts.


Something worth noting with modified gravity: MetaKnight can HARDLY go up with his Mach tornado OMGZ MK has been NERFED!!! Well not really since he can now do other stuff....it's more like everyone got buffed but not much in MK dept.

 

[Delta_BP26]

SHOOOOOOOT!!!! I can't even play on hacked stages!!! You can't undo the update?!

 

[5ive]

Adding a little bit of gravity will STILL not make Brawl like Melee in any way, shape, or form.

Try out 1.1125x Gravity and you'll see what I mean.


And in terms of hitstun, I think we need a good 120 frames (2 seconds) worth of it ONLY from aerials, throws, and tilts.


Something worth noting with modified gravity: MetaKnight can HARDLY go up with his Mach tornado OMGZ MK has been NERFED!!! Well not really since he can now do other stuff....it's more like everyone got buffed but not much in MK dept.

That's still changing Brawl physics. That is something we do NOT want to achieve.

 

[Revven]

SHOOOOOOOT!!!! I can't even play on hacked stages!!! You can't undo the update?!

Hmm? You should still be able to use Gecko OS 1.07b. You can't undo it though if you already updated.

 

[Delta_BP26]

This sucks. Really bad.

 

[Revven]

This sucks. Really bad.

Don't worry, Bushing (the guy behind the HBC and Twilight Hack) says that he can get a work around no problem.

 

[K1T3]

This changes Brawl Physics. We aren't trying to accomplish anything like that.
Again, we want to accomplish a Deeper Brawl. Brawl is not Brawl without it's unique physics.

Then we can simply use the in game options like heavy mode. That would be no different than using other in game options like Stock intead of Time, and no items instead of all items, and turning off stages of great gay. But there is no decent reason to limiting ourselves to doing that when we can use the same concept but fix it and still allow decent recoveries with all the benifits I listed on the first post. I'll also point out that all those benifits will lead to a much deeper/ more fun brawl, which is what we are trying to accomplish.

I'm still in favor of leaving brawls unique physics that add to the games depth and fun. Meaning I want to leave the current hit stun and new shield system/settings. There is still hitstun in brawl, it is just not as much. With all the additions we've been mentioning I think it will work out fine and even better with those new systems from brawl. Also, it's not like we're planning on changing the other new stuff like tech timing, different ledge mechanics, different spike and canceling properties. Brawl will still be brawl simply better.

Some things I am interested in finding ways around though include lock infinites, standing infinites, and a way to reduce the great potency of chain grabs (or at least allow players to resist them like they could in melee). Preferably the changes made to fix these things would also add overall depth or other desired effects to the game. An example would be 1.1 dmg reduces the number of times Falco can chain grab but at the same time makes over all killing a little bit easier and speeds up the game. One of the main complaint of TOs is that brawl takes way to long, even at 3 stock characters normally live to 200%, and this will assist in fixing that problem. Currently with the settings I've mentioned I use I've moved the game back to 4 stock and a match still goes by faster than it would have at 3 stock in normal brawl.

Also, Muba thx for the info. I'll try out that setting. But frankly recoveries are just fine at 1.25 but I'll keep playing around with it like you are. What I can suggest is don't get stuck playing just one setting and get it in your mind that that is the best one. Keep trying different ones to find what really is the best. This is needed as we're still in the process of trying to find a standard. Also it might help make it universalizable if we use a more rounded figure... I'm sure what you mentioned works fine but maybe 1.1 or 1.15. People don't like complex things you see...

People please let me know if you can think of some fixes to those problems I mentioned above like infinites and the like.

Also does anyone know what code I can use to change the dmg setting that way I don't have to do it in game?

 

[Revven]

Also does anyone know what code I can use to change the dmg setting that way I don't have to do it in game?

There's codes just like the Gravity modifiers and use the same floating points (probably will need a calculator again to get anything smaller/bigger than what's given) but, I'll copypasta for you.

Damage/Stun Modifier P1 (Rohins)
4A000000 90180F20
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Damage/Stun Modifier P2 (Rohins)
4A000000 90180F7C
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Damage/Stun Modifier P3 (Rohins)
4A000000 90180FD8
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Damage/Stun Modifier P4 (Rohins)
4A000000 90181034
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

When I used 3.5 and did an Fsmash on Falcon with DK, it brought Falcon up to 77% so this has to be the right code. So, same floating point values as before.

 

[K1T3]

There's codes just like the Gravity modifiers and use the same floating points (probably will need a calculator again to get anything smaller/bigger than what's given) but, I'll copypasta for you.

Damage/Stun Modifier P1 (Rohins)
4A000000 90180F20
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Damage/Stun Modifier P2 (Rohins)
4A000000 90180F7C
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Damage/Stun Modifier P3 (Rohins)
4A000000 90180FD8
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

Damage/Stun Modifier P4 (Rohins)
4A000000 90181034
140000C8 XXXXXXXX
E0000000 80008000

When I used 3.5 and did an Fsmash on Falcon with DK, it brought Falcon up to 77% so this has to be the right code. So, same floating point values as before.

That sounds perfect, thanks alot Flaco400! =)

Also, to everyone, once I get a really great set of codes that work together and only serve to improve the game should I try to upload my code list so everyone can DL it and try out the same codes?

Though slightly unrelated I'm adding the codes for allowing replays over 3 minutes to my list. There's an OR listed though... so am I fine with just that first line? Do I need to include all 5 lines with the OR? Should I just used the last 3 lines?
Are there any other great codes that people added or think should be added?

Edit again: Did I mention this already, if I did it's epic enough to be mentioned again. Falcon's Dair -> Knee is a real consecutive hit combo!!!! ****'s amazing.

 

[5ive]

*sigh*

The original point of this project was to add depth to Brawl, not change it's physics.

I don't know why people want to make this even MORE like melee. Melee Physics + Brawl =/= Brawl+

 

[MuBa]

5ive, if you've actually tried out the gravity modifier that I came up with, you'll still end up getting a Brawl-ish feel.

I'm trying to find the RIGHT gravity where it'll make the game still feel like Brawl but with much more depth to it.

If you want Brawl's physics to stay the same then please don't be in this thread. Rather look at the user blogs whom they are trying to "Balance" all of the characters.

Edit:

Also I've tried 1.18x Gravity and Sonic feels a bit nerfed in terms of recovery options.


So I like to conclude that 1.1125 Gravity is perfect for the balance between fastfalling, combo ability, recovery options, and still retaining that Brawl mechanics feel.

 

[5ive]

I am not a supporter of balancing the characters.

I just want people to know that the original intention was to make Brawl deeper, not change the physics.

I guess people like taking over <_<

 

[K1T3]

I am not a supporter of balancing the characters.

I just want people to know that the original intention was to make Brawl deeper, not change the physics.

I guess people like taking over <_<

I responded fully to this objection in a way that keeps with what you were saying.
The very biggest changes to physics that goes against brawl and the options it offers the the directional air dodge code. I can fully understand if you wish to object to that code in saying that it changes brawls physics too much now that there is only one air dodge. I would then argue the depth added by it of course. But as far as the gravity argument please read that long *** post I made just for you... it is an option in the game... we change other options in the game already, etc.etc.....

I am also against balancing the characters. The only balances I proposed are those against things like chain grabs and infinites that the other player has zero control over and no possible way of escape and require no skill. (even in melee you could at least DI the chain throw and get out most of the time unless your were playing someone near perfect)

I believe I am being very logical and providing good reasons to each and every change made and how it adds to brawl. If you can think up any semi decent logical arguments against even one of the changes I have proposed please list them and I will be happy to hear them out and if they're good I will retract my proposal for that change. At present though you are doing nothing more than say that you are a supporter of brawl depth (every change I have made adds depth) and you don't want brawls physics changed (the dodge is a much greater change, a gravity change is provided in game and changing it is no different than the normal rules we change not the mention the amazing amount of depth it adds that has been covered on the first post and throughout this whole topic)

 

[Revven]

Also 5ive, you have to realize, Brawl+ doesn't have a standardized code list yet it's one of the following at the moment.

1) No Tripping, SSBM Air Dodge, S-Canceling
2) No Tripping, SSBM Air Dodge, L-Canceling
3) No Tripping, L-Canceling/S-Canceling (either one)

Right now, it's pretty divergent, the most common one is the second though. If we're trying to find a standarized code list, we need to at least try some other things besides the three things we have already (that prove to work) and the one fourth code that we know we ALL want (hit stun). It doesn't hurt to experiment with gravity change, does it? JUST experimenting, and if it works and catches on that's another option. If it becomes the most used option, there's the standardization.

5ive, it doesn't hurt to try or experiment is all I'm saying.

 

[5ive]

I responded fully to this objection in a way that keeps with what you were saying.
The very biggest changes to physics that goes against brawl and the options it offers the the directional air dodge code. I can fully understand if you wish to object to that code in saying that it changes brawls physics too much now that there is only one air dodge. I would then argue the depth added by it of course. But as far as the gravity argument please read that long *** post I made just for you... it is an option in the game... we change other options in the game already, etc.etc.....

Air dodge CAN be considered as physics, but I am talking about the change of Brawl Hitstun, and Gravity.

What this thread talks about is adding Hitstun and/or Gravity to make Brawl faster, and to add combos.
This takes away from what we are trying to achieve: a deeper Brawl. Sure it makes it deeper, but the more changes we add to the unique Brawl physics, the less it becomes Brawl.

If we want to keep this project "Brawl+" we should be weary about the changes we add to it. We need to keep it as close to Brawl as possible, while adding minor depth changes.

If you still disagree, I respect your opinion, but I honestly do think you are ruining the Brawl+ project.

 

[K1T3]

Air dodge CAN be considered as physics, but I am talking about the change of Brawl Hitstun, and Gravity.

What this thread talks about is adding Hitstun and/or Gravity to make Brawl faster, and to add combos.
This takes away from what we are trying to achieve: a deeper Brawl. Sure it makes it deeper, but the more changes we add to the unique Brawl physics, the less it becomes Brawl.

If we want to keep this project "Brawl+" we should be weary about the changes we add to it. We need to keep it as close to Brawl as possible, while adding minor depth changes.

If you still disagree, I respect your opinion, but I honestly do think you are ruining the Brawl+ project.

Now you're just making **** up.... *sigh* Please read my other posts. At no point have I said I think we should change the hitstun...

Here I'll quote from like 3 posts up
"Then we can simply use the in game options like heavy mode. That would be no different than using other in game options like Stock intead of Time, and no items instead of all items, and turning off stages of great gay. But there is no decent reason to limiting ourselves to doing that when we can use the same concept but fix it and still allow decent recoveries with all the benifits I listed on the first post. I'll also point out that all those benifits will lead to a much deeper/ more fun brawl, which is what we are trying to accomplish.

I'm still in favor of leaving brawls unique physics that add to the games depth and fun. Meaning I want to leave the current hit stun and new shield system/settings. There is still hitstun in brawl, it is just not as much. With all the additions we've been mentioning I think it will work out fine and even better with those new systems from brawl. Also, it's not like we're planning on changing the other new stuff like tech timing, different ledge mechanics, different spike and canceling properties. Brawl will still be brawl simply better."

I'm all for leaving all the physics of brawl that are benifical to it. Adding gravity on top of being provided by the game not only gives possibility for combos but all the other advantages listed on the first page and throughout this topic as well as giving those lower tiered characters more options and possibilities in the game which will allow them to be more playable.

Again please list at least some kind of logical argument against any of the changes I have proposed or at least some disadvantages the would come about from any of them.....

Or maybe list how this takes away from the deeper brawl we are trying to achieve. I have given countless reasons as to why this only supports the deeper brawl we are trying to achieve....

Flaco400 hitstun really IS fine. I mean dair -> Knee is a real combo.... with the settings I have given I'm sure we'll figure out countless other combos as well. We don't want to make combos to easy where every character can 0 -> death others. Combos so still be rather hard to pull off and skill/knowledge based. We don't want to water down the game more, the point is to make it deeper.

 

[5ive]

oops, I thought you were FOR melee hitstun, my mistake.
I still highly disagree on changing gravity though.
I guess we can beg to differ. We just have to find a consensus on Brawl+ Rules.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

i don't think any decision is going to be made until someone with a red or purple name steps in and tells you lemmings what to do

 

[Quail Man]

I'm talking about their air speed. Not their ground speed or their attack speed. The only way to solve a problem is to make sure your solution doesn't create problems, and higher gravity creates major problems.

Make a code that maintains momentum from ground movement when you jump. Like in Melee.

*goes to finish reading thread*

*finishes reading thread*

*thinks "5ive" should gtfo*

 

[K1T3]

i don't think any decision is going to be made until someone with a red or purple name steps in and tells you lemmings what to do

LOL No...

It doesn't matter who comes in here whatever they say must have logic and reason behind it. If they start spouting **** I will of course request them to provide explanation and good reason for their point of view.

 

[MuBa]

The only way Brawl+ will ever become a tournament standard is if it's popular enough and people demand it.

 

[5ive]

The purpose isn't even for Brawl+ to be a tourny standard.

We just want to build a metagame with these new additions.

 

[K1T3]

The purpose isn't even for Brawl+ to be a tourny standard.

We just want to build a metagame with these new additions.

These are my sentiments.

We just all need to agree on a standard code list so we can all play the same game, then create the metagame from there.
I think closing your eyes to different possibilites before even trying them out first is a bad idea. We need to try all the different ideas and if we find some bad reject them and if we find some good keep them. But both keeping or rejecting any idea should be done with logical reason behind it not simply because oh I FEEL or don't FEEL like doing that....

 

[5ive]

Alright. I agree with you.