Ganons prioritys

[CORY]

It seems the pm community is fatter and nerdier than I thought

get out of here with this crap.

 

[shwickid222]

we're not the ones rolling in saying we're better than top players with no proof.

then showing "proof" that's not better than top playing.

Umm ok? But if your trying to tell me what im doing wrong... I need a videos to know whether or not yoyr right or what u say is full of crap. Soo again until u SHOW ME what u say is true then u dont have anything to say. I need prove before I can take what u have to say in acount.

 

[shwickid222]

Man if you want to improve your game, take the criticism and improve it. If you want to tout your skill, come in and blow our socks off. I'm trying to comment as neutrally as possible now that you have vids up, but it's hard when you act so bad. Just work on your game. Don't ask for help or advice if you don't want it.

And gez ar first u said I was full of ****....... thats not being neutral brother.

 

[deadjames]

I also consider myself better than kage.

Snake has sooooo many specisl attacks, and I barely win.

Pick one you can't have both.

 

[CORY]

Umm ok? But if your trying to tell me what im doing wrong... I need a videos to know whether or not yoyr right or what u say is full of crap. Soo again until u SHOW ME what u say is true then u dont have anything to say. I need prove before I can take what u have to say in acount.

no, you need to not walk in and say you're better than top players, then show spacing that's on par with the crap my friends and i put out while drinking.

 

[GeZ]

And gez ar first u said I was full of ****....... thats not being neutral brother.

I was skeptical. The first post was really a bit much and I wasn't sure if you were ever going to post any matches, but after seeing you play, I'd like to help out. I think this WHOLE THREAD (that means you other guys) need to get into the same mindset. He posted something, so we should help however we can. That's how the community grows.

 

[shwickid222]

no, you need to not walk in and say you're better than top players, then show spacing that's on par with the crap my friends and i put out while drinking.

Prove it

 

[CORY]

prove that i'm bad? ok, hold on.

 

[shwickid222]

prove that i'm bad? ok, hold on.

No prove that your better than me as u claimed in your other pist. Cant wait to see this. Say your cory in the video. I dont want to bs.

 

[GeZ]

I'll start getting down the tricks I know and have seen Ganon's use as I recall them, so I'll probably end up updating this post a few times.
To start, if you expect the opponent to get up from the ledge with an attack, you can full jump and come down on it with a Dair. It cleanly beats most attacks up from the ledge and sets up for the usual combo options off of Dair. It can also catch players off guard enough to beat out waveland onto stage if they're not expecting it.
Edit: Guys, you don't need to be better than a player to help them. I get that the thread started out rocky, but lets patch it up and just be helpful now. I know I've helped players improve their game who would easily flatten me if I played against them. The value of the information is in the information, not the player employing it. So lets post friendly critiques, and tech that we think could help, and in return, shwickid222 can ask us how it's supposed to help, without demanding we post videos to back it up. This thread will be a lot more helpful to ALL Ganon players if we just get along.

 

[CORY]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsfD85m__rY&list=PLQPB6oRGudipr341P7DHn9i08qd-gMtHF&index=1 so, now this is me sober at a local tourney. notice how bad my spacing is, i eat gnw ccing my dash attack into his dtilt the entire set (most especially game3), pretty much. i pick bad approach options at bad moments. i don't follow up on the hits that i get effectively (too much mashing force palm, because i was not good at using other follow ups), especially off of the few solid aerial hits i get.

defensively, my di is not that good, i fall into dash attack-dash attack comboes from the gnw when i shouldn't, misuse survival di in combos, then think that i'm in combo di mode when he does a finisher, so die to dat mario kart di i have going on.

i have some shining moments where i read a tech he's going for and get solid followups or a kill, but i have more moments where i concede too much stage control to evade an attack, rather than going for a quick dash dance back in for a punish; or i evade properly, then punish poorly.

so, i've proven that i'm not that good. i'm still waiting for you to prove that you're ken/pc chris/kage level of player.

 

[GeZ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsfD85m__rY&list=PLQPB6oRGudipr341P7DHn9i08qd-gMtHF&index=1 so, now this is me sober at a local tourney. notice how bad my spacing is, i eat gnw ccing my dash attack into his dtilt the entire set (most especially game3), pretty much. i pick bad approach options at bad moments. i don't follow up on the hits that i get effectively (too much mashing force palm, because i was not good at using other follow ups), especially off of the few solid aerial hits i get.

defensively, my di is not that good, i fall into dash attack-dash attack comboes from the gnw when i shouldn't, misuse survival di in combos, then think that i'm in combo di mode when he does a finisher, so die to dat mario kart di i have going on.

i have some shining moments where i read a tech he's going for and get solid followups or a kill, but i have more moments where i concede too much stage control to evade an attack, rather than going for a quick dash dance back in for a punish; or i evade properly, then punish poorly.

so, i've proven that i'm not that good. i'm still waiting for you to prove that you're ken/pc chris/kage level of player.

Cory, I get this thread didn't start well, but this is too much. Check my above post, and get off this pissing contest. It's not helping anything and everyone will improve once we get away from it.

 

[shwickid222]

Ibjust thinkbits funny that hes sooooo much better than me. I agree though this whole thing is dumb.

 

[Mr.Pickle]

You're better than I thought you were going to be, but having said that, your claims of being better than old school top tier players like pc chris and ken, are wildly inaccurate. This is my short analysis so forgive me if its somewhat abrasive. Your DI was pretty bad, your punishes were very sloppy, your movement is alright but it needs work, and you have no patience at all. I know this is a competitive environment and you want to prove something, but you should've tried to be a little more humble about it, people would've definitely been more polite to you then.

 

[shwickid222]

ralking about my ganon? Or his lucario?

 

[CORY]

Ibjust thinkbits funny that hes sooooo much better than me. I agree though this whole thing is dumb.

this. you're probably better than me, but i'm a terrible player and can at least admit that.

"you're probably better than me"

no, you need to not walk in and say you're better than top players, then show spacing that's on par with the crap my friends and i put out while drinking.

we don't play much better when we're not drinking, as a qualifier.

 

[Mr.Pickle]

I'm talking about your ganon, sorry if I didn't specify. Though I've played cory before at low tier city. Not to be rude but is english your first language? You're making a lot of spelling mistakes.

 

[shwickid222]

Lol. I text fast and dont care to fix my errors.

 

[GeZ]

Yeah, the claims at the beginning were a bit much, and being humble is the key to getting honest feedback, but we've got everything fixed now. I was going to say about the writing, but I can understand it, so I've been refraining from commenting. To continue with **** to help, Ganon's Dthrow was nerfed last patch, but it's still sick. At early percents on heavy characters you can get a lot of reps on it, but on the standard weight chars you can get about 2 or 3 from 0% and then jab them away and rush down. On falco you can Uthrow from about 15% to 70% which is AWESOME! Make that damn bird CRY!

 

[Mr.Pickle]

Oh I get ya, lol who needs to spell things right anyway.

To continue with **** to help, Ganon's Dthrow was nerfed last patch, but it's still sick.

I didn't know this, but then again I gave up ganon a long time ago. How was it changed?

 

[CORY]

the change log(2.6b) doesn't mention it, maybe he misread another character's stuff or he's been playing on a dev build with pmbr a bit?

 

[GeZ]

I think I meant from 2.5 to 2.6 probably? It got nerfed at some point because you used to be able to chaingrab for too long on almost every character. And the dev builds with pmbr do confuse me sometimes lol. Ganons changes in it so far have been interesting... They've been alternating between making his Flame Choke actually throw them upwards or leaving it doing what it usually does. The upwards launch would be so that he doesn't get guaranteed followups but currently it's his normal one I think because they think he probably doesn't need that particular tool nerfed. The thing that I've seen a lot of that I'm super stoked about is a change to his jab. It combos better, and that's it. Sends not just forward but pops them up a teeny bit so that it combos easier, and that's just a great overall buff.

 

[CORY]

i hope they don't make the grounded flame choke launch : / unless it turns into some uber combo enabler or a kill move, it almost seems like a straight nerf, since he still needs a read on your tech to get a followup out of it. i remember watching a stream with the launching one, then asked hylian to play dorf on a stream of his, where it was normal, but hylian said he wasn't using a true dev build at the time, just the roy/m2 build from big house, so that might be a reason why it looks like it's been swapping back and forth?

that jab change is interesting sounding. is there a recording of the stream where they showed it? that's the first i've heard of it!

and i don't know the changelog from 2.5-2.6 : p maybe they adjust his grab there, it was pretty dumb (still is : p).

 

[shwickid222]

I think ganon being able to easily chain throw is good. Why? Cause its very hard to get close enough to grab in the first place. So if u get a grab off with him it should be rewarded. He has like what... 3rd shortest reach for grabing in the game?

 

[CORY]

yeah, his chain grab is definitely offset by his low grab range and poor mobility. it's just, he could chain throw super well in melee, but brawl's grab mechanics made it suuuuuuuuper better (iirc, you can grab the flailing limbs in brawl, whereas you couldn't in melee), so they're looking for ways to either remelee-ify grabs in general, or adjust ganon's grab so that it's not so centralizing.

 

[foxygrandpa]

After watching the video, I can confidently say that Im better than you, no offense intended. You're pretty good though. I do think that snake vs ganon is a poor matchup though, but I can also say that although some of ganons attacks look awkward, he is definitely one of the more polished characters playstyle wise. He doesnt focus on insane combos or mobility yet can body a top tier character if he uses his powerful gimps and spacing. The problem vs snake is that snake does not need to approach, and ganon has an easy time attacking opponents when they approach. Thats my opinion, as a shiek main and ganon secondary, that is at a higher level of play than most of the players on this post.

 

[shwickid222]

After watching the video, I can confidently say that Im better than you, no offense intended. You're pretty good though. I do think that snake vs ganon is a poor matchup though, but I can also say that although some of ganons attacks look awkward, he is definitely one of the more polished characters playstyle wise. He doesnt focus on insane combos or mobility yet can body a top tier character if he uses his powerful gimps and spacing. The problem vs snake is that snake does not need to approach, and ganon has an easy time attacking opponents when they approach. Thats my opinion, as a shiek main and ganon secondary, that is at a higher level of play than most of the players on this post.

Got any videos? See the problem with sheik mains.... she has sooo much priority over most attacks and is very easy to set up and combo with. Kind of how its super easy to combo with falco. I dont really relay that as skill.. just easier to win I guess. If a low tier beats a high tier. I give more props ans skil to the low tier guy. Just my opinion.

 

[Papa+Stone]

Falco is way harder to play than ganon what are you saying. All ganon does is throw out huge attacks abd if they connect he gets to advance and try for another until they die. If he fails he retreats and starts over by throwing out more huge hitbox attacks. Falco has to pay attention more than that

 

[WizKid911]

There needs to be lower tiers that can take out the top guys. Thats what we are trying to do. I have never been one to choose top tier characters. Maybe i cant be as awesome as professor pro or other top snake players , but i am working on it

 

[WizKid911]

I agree that shiek is better than ganon tier wise. I am assuming that you dont see to many finalists in tourneys that play ganon. But how many shieks, falcos, foxs do you see. Its time to change the game. I will admit i have multiple mistakes in my gameplay. Im not a defensive person thats not how i wantmy playstyle to be. Should i switch that up everynow and then.. probably. But if i can learn ways to be aggressive while finding ways around my opponents attack then i will. There have neen times where i have whooped shwicks ganon and there have been times where he owns my snake but we are evolving into better players. His ganon has improved. He has found ways around my attacks and eventually i will become better from him. He is a better technical player than me and i know that but i am getting better. Ohhh btw that match was seriously the first match i had had in a week in a half so i had all kinds of fuff ups. We will post more vids of our evolution hopefully you guys can help us become better players

 

[foxygrandpa]

Got any videos? See the problem with sheik mains.... she has sooo much priority over most attacks and is very easy to set up and combo with. Kind of how its super easy to combo with falco. I dont really relay that as skill.. just easier to win I guess. If a low tier beats a high tier. I give more props ans skil to the low tier guy. Just my opinion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZM6_zuF2-I
This was my only tournament that I've been to, and I got second place. I lost to a 2.5 sonic in finals. Im the red sheik. Im one of 4 brothers, so I have a lot of matchup experience and play this game pretty often. I didnt stay for singles because I was fasting, but Im pretty confident I would have placed well. Im much better now than I was then too. Maybe I'll post a recent video some time of me in a 1v1 match with one of my brothers.
Anyway, the thing with playing a character like falco compared to ganon is that there is less of a punishment for a mistake. For example, as a ganon player, you probably know that you can punish an off edge slip up with a spike for an easy stock, or a missed l cancel with a ftilt. Although ganon does not combo as well as falco, falco has to try way harder to punish and gimp, leaving him at a point where he's forced to put himself into risky situations. He's the easiest character to gimp and combo, so shouldnt he make up for that with an advantageous offensive game? Keep in mind that ganon was A tier in melee, when he didnt have as many tools as pm ganon. I would place ganon somewhere near the top of the tier list. Again, I think the reason you're having trouble with snake is because his grab works well on a heavy weight like ganon and his traps limit ganons already poor mobility. And as a ganon secondary, I think ganon can put up to most of the top tiers, probably having the most trouble against sheik.

 

[standardtoaster]

i hope they don't make the grounded flame choke launch : / unless it turns into some uber combo enabler or a kill move, it almost seems like a straight nerf, since he still needs a read on your tech to get a followup out of it. i remember watching a stream with the launching one, then asked hylian to play dorf on a stream of his, where it was normal, but hylian said he wasn't using a true dev build at the time, just the roy/m2 build from big house, so that might be a reason why it looks like it's been swapping back and forth?

that jab change is interesting sounding. is there a recording of the stream where they showed it? that's the first i've heard of it!

and i don't know the changelog from 2.5-2.6 : p maybe they adjust his grab there, it was pretty dumb (still is : p).

his jab is completely unchanged in the dev build. if he thinks it changed at all it's just a placebo

 

[cmart]

I think I meant from 2.5 to 2.6 probably? It got nerfed at some point because you used to be able to chaingrab for too long on almost every character. And the dev builds with pmbr do confuse me sometimes lol. Ganons changes in it so far have been interesting... They've been alternating between making his Flame Choke actually throw them upwards or leaving it doing what it usually does. The upwards launch would be so that he doesn't get guaranteed followups but currently it's his normal one I think because they think he probably doesn't need that particular tool nerfed. The thing that I've seen a lot of that I'm super stoked about is a change to his jab. It combos better, and that's it. Sends not just forward but pops them up a teeny bit so that it combos easier, and that's just a great overall buff.

There isn't really one TRUE dev build, but a LOT of dev builds with different files/codes. What you see in xyz dev build isn't necessarily a release candidate. Remember that everything is subject to change

 

[GeZ]

I understand that, but from the ones that i've seen and played, it seems that the flame choke changes are in a state of flux, though i've heard now that the jab isn't changed (which im surprised about because it really seemed like it). In any case while there isn't one true dev build, a lot of the changes or additions are interesting and neat to try out and hope that they make the final cut.

 

[shwickid222]

Me and wiz kid play like once a week. But we are the kids lol in a sense. His snake has improved since day 1 and so has my ganon. Another thing to consider is, weve had project m for maybe 2 months. Atleast ive really only played for 2. Another thing is I have always been a fox main through my years of play. Last but not least.. I picked up ganon a month ago. While others have had there mains and have been used to them for years. Im a month and a week or 2 in. If I main him longer. So will my skill. Wizkids in the same spot. Thanks guys.

 

[| Kailex |]

Play more people, gain experience, go to tourneys

 

[shwickid222]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZM6_zuF2-I
This was my only tournament that I've been to, and I got second place. I lost to a 2.5 sonic in finals. Im the red sheik. Im one of 4 brothers, so I have a lot of matchup experience and play this game pretty often. I didnt stay for singles because I was fasting, but Im pretty confident I would have placed well. Im much better now than I was then too. Maybe I'll post a recent video some time of me in a 1v1 match with one of my brothers.
Anyway, the thing with playing a character like falco compared to ganon is that there is less of a punishment for a mistake. For example, as a ganon player, you probably know that you can punish an off edge slip up with a spike for an easy stock, or a missed l cancel with a ftilt. Although ganon does not combo as well as falco, falco has to try way harder to punish and gimp, leaving him at a point where he's forced to put himself into risky situations. He's the easiest character to gimp and combo, so shouldnt he make up for that with an advantageous offensive game? Keep in mind that ganon was A tier in melee, when he didnt have as many tools as pm ganon. I would place ganon somewhere near the top of the tier list. Again, I think the reason you're having trouble with snake is because his grab works well on a heavy weight like ganon and his traps limit ganons already poor mobility. And as a ganon secondary, I think ganon can put up to most of the top tiers, probably having the most trouble against sheik.

Umm yeah the 1v1 is a must... cause if your going by those double matches.. idk how u are confidently better... there wasnt a whole lot of tech nor advanced moves. U were also very un agressive. I cant say that this video proced u were better. I felt corys lucario was better than the red sheik.. u kind of just didnt do anything acxeot some fairs... im not trying to be a jerk just stating what I saw. By watching that I would say my ganon would kill your very slow sheik.. but then again no one ever agrees with me on here.

 

[| Kailex |]

No one does, and just saying that being aggressive doesnt necessarily mean that youre better.
A patient and smart player can dominate another player which has 100% perfectness with techs and just rushes in mindlessly; not saying that youre that kind of player, just giving some examples

 

[Scarlet Bean]

No one does, and just saying that being aggressive doesnt necessarily mean that youre better.
A patient and smart player can dominate another player which has 100% perfectness with techs and just rushes in mindlessly; not saying that youre that kind of player, just giving some examples

WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO WIN WHEN YOU CAN JUST SHOW OFF HOW GOOD YOU ARE. YEAAAAAAAAAAAAA

 

[Crescent Monkey]

This thread is giving me cancer