Gainesville, FL Power Rankings

[Sandtru27]

Of course Hbox doesn't. People like Lio or Hbox (or me) will only play now if it benefits monetarily (or as a "fun" waste of time every now and then). Unfortunately, Brawl is a relatively awful game (which is why you see people move to traditional fighters or other games). Hopefully Smash 4 is better and revives interest among many communities (even if it is bad it'll have big tourneys at first).

If I don't continue my education after graduation this semester, I won't be able to aide/teach the community. So that sucks.

Yeah.

 

[DewDaDash]

well sax was decent awhile back I remember, ved seems to be improving and russel expressed a desire to improve as well. I do not live in that region so I cant help them out much except at tourneys.

Oh yeah, when I first came to UF, the talent pool was little to none. Since then though, I trained with ryo taught him things, he trained me and taught me things. Those results have shown for their self. Not many people here desire to improve either you know. Only ryo for the past 2 years was willing to train with me and get better and the results have shown. Now after Ive met dolo and ereth in February, Ive got two other people to train with. Unfortunately I haven't been able to train ereth much just because when he calls me when its inconvenient, and when I call him hes in NC or something >_>". Met dolo even more recently but hes probally the one ive been able to train most. There really isnt any excuses of having no talent, just improve your current players. Although I do understand if none of them desire to get better. Personally, I'll help anyone who goes out of their way to ask me for help. If you really want you could come down to gainesville sometime just for a smashfest.

 

[Sandtru27]

Sax is just busy w/ music/working and is disinterested in continuing travel.

 

[Ereth]

He said he would travel for P:M last time I was in jax

 

[Sandtru27]

Yep, but it's so rare that we play proj. m now (and we were talkin Brawl). We used to play very often but the main guy we were training w/ decided he couldn't deal w/ the competitive environment. So smash in jax is essentially only Brawl atm

edit: but yea. Jax/Gville should train/bootcamp more

 

[SxK]

lol this thread

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

im having a similar problem with the flippers casuals

they play no items and all that so i know they like playing seriously

but at the same time they don't come when the "pros" come, even jsut to play them cuz they are more interested in winning than getting better competitively, if that makes sense. i only had one player come out of the casual players (blade) and he did have a really good time. but the main issue i see is alot of the players do put us on pedestals that they feel is unreachable cause they see it as a form of talent, not a means of getting better through time.

thats the main reason i wana start classes so the time it takes to get better at the game doesn't seem so daunting, since it won't take them the same 6 years i spent getting as good as i am, since i can pass down my experience if that makes sense...


i think we as a community need to find better ways of introducing the competetive side of brawl without making it seem so impossible to get good, like finding ways to show them they can do it too

idk

there are some players i've found at FIU north campus that play pretty consistantly but they are borderline casual players as well, so any suggestions on what to do from here on to hook their interest in competetive play would be greatly appreciated

 

[DewDaDash]

Umm, vincent wanted to get better but said some miami players look down on him due to his character choice and don't really care to improve him due to it so finding practice is difficult for him. Being humble would be a start.

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

ask vincent if i've EVER turned him down for friendlies




i'll save u some time, the answer is no


and when we played in pools he asked me to play seriously, and i told him that I always do

so i duno where he's getting that idea from cuz its not from me

 

[Sandtru27]

man, that's the ****in problem. people view "talent" as being "natural" talent

i ****in hate that so much

literally NONE of us were naturally predestined to be as "good" as we are right now

blood, sweat and (in some cases) tears [j/k seibrik ;P]

edit: who vincent?

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

vincent is ex-justice, he's an amazing samus player


anyway, the only thing i believe talent determines (cuz i do believe it exists) is a person's BASE skill lvl in a given skill set


it is by no means a measure of somebody's POTENTIAL

 

[SxK]

most gamers have natural skill as such, seeing as how theyve been playing games for quite awhile
imo its just about how they hone their skills to cater specifically to smash

 

[yos]

DewDaDash said:
Umm, vincent wanted to get better but said some miami players look down on him due to his character choice and don't really care to improve him due to it so finding practice is difficult for him. Being humble would be a start.

seibrik so nice doe
and also ive been doing srs friendlies with chozox n he gets bettter at da MU everytime , he took lad to game 3 ithink to last stock


also doodootrash i wanna mm again :]

 

[Sandtru27]

most gamers have natural skill as such, seeing as how theyve been playing games for quite awhile

This is NOT an example of natural talent AT ALL. That is an example of picking a hobby that requires a specific/similiar skillset that is only improved upon as an adult.

Natural talent would be having tall-ass parents (thus being tall) and playing basketball or somehow your brain and the chemicals/electrical impulses in it are quicker at certain cognitive aspects.

(sidenote: MANY people say that having perfect pitch is an example. I would disagree because there is evidence to show that children who group up learning a tonal language [ex: Vietnamese is a good example] have a better chance of developing that ability an adolescence)

Natural talent can shift your focus towards or away from particular hobbies as a child, but it will not make you a top performer in anything by itself.

DELIBERATE PRACTICE is what aides us (and not necessarily time spent). This is to say, people that will sit down and break down their entire process of action (slowly; piece by piece) and build it back up. This is NOT what a lot of newer players (or ****.. older players too) do and is one reason why they get ****ing ****-****ed in tournaments and lose to "washed up" players like me.

I HATE the idea of natural talent because it plants the seed in people's mind that they can't accomplish their goals by saying **** like "Oh, well... he was just born to be good. I would never be able to achieve that." SUCH HORSE ****

Everyone should do individual research on the 10,000 hour theory and if they wanna be good, they need to put the blood/sweat/tears/time in and be DELIBERATE about it. Otherwise, they are meant to be totally irrelevant.

edit: damn i like doo-wop

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

i had this conversation with someone recently talking about him wanting to become a basketball player in his late 20's and he asked me if i thought it was possible at this point


i said maybe not NBA but a lesser league yea


hee said ur right, the people in the nba have way more talent

i said no


they had initial interest but that would have done nothing without two things:


Access/a means to practice, hereby known as Opportunity

and

Reinforcement

if u take away any of these three elements (interest, Opportunity, reinforcement) you are likely to have one of three possible scenarios occur


Take away interest:
The person will stop performing the minute an obstacle gets in the way. This person most likely will do something they feel they are the best at, but the minute someone better comes around that challanges them, they quit cause they "never really liked doing ____ anyway." The person may look at the "good" players skill in relevance to his current skill and give up, seeing the task of getting better to be too daunting and not "for him"

Take away Opportunity:
The person will never reach his full potential. This is usually where you see young kids who were amazing at say swimming, but they're parents move to some new area where they no longer have a pool or something.

Take away Reinforcement:
The person doesn't get rewarded by his role models/parents for whatever hard work he puts in. Quickly loses interest in the given activity and moves on to something more pleasing to the role models, seeking that reinforcement. This is one of most common missing elements in a competitive gamers life as many parents of our generation didn't/doesn't support their child sitting in a room for 8 hours playing a video game.


If all of these three elements are present and remain present throughout childhood and adolescence, then you start seeing this phenomenon called "Talent" being born. When in actuality, it's a combination of determination, support, and a chance.

 

[NickRiddle]

Hey, popped in because there's a statement that I can relate to.
Vincent was talking about how people look down on him for his character...
Most times people say anything negative about somebody's character choice is because we're looking at it from a competitive angle.
If you play Samus you cannot reasonably expect to place high at ANY event except for a small local or a mid-/low-tier tournament.
Any time I say something negative about a character is because picking a bad character will be a hindrance to your performance.
I don't care how amazing you are, once people learn your mediocre or bad character you will do worse compared to when somebody learns a better character... (Learning the Samus Mu as opposed to learning the MK MU.)
If your goal is to become an amazing Samus/Link/Zelda player then go for it, but don't expect to place that well.
If your goal is to become a top contender for tournament placements, pick somebody good and put forth the same effort, but don't expect to be nearly the best with your overused character.
If you only feel comfortable playing bad characters and you want to place high in tournaments, I don't know what to tell you. I have the same problem whenever I try to play secondaries. I can play ZSS, Bowser, and Zelda. I've put time into learning multiple high-/top-tiers, but other than ZSS I can only use two craptacular characters... Hence why I only use ZSS in tournament.

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

^^^ all good points, and really the only way to place well with a bad character is by abusing a good secondary.

The lower tiered your character, generally the more 2ndaries you will need to have to cover your increasing in number bad matchups.

by that i mean as ur character is further down the tier list, you tend to have a higher number of unfavorable matchups.

as such, you will need to pick up more than just one 2ndary to cover those bad matchups

but it will get to a point where u need so many 2ndaries, at that point it's probably not a bad idea to just secondary mk

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

and by "get to a point" i really mean, like the bottom 10 characters in the game or something

 

[SxK]

o

and by "get to a point" i really mean, like the bottom 10 characters in the game or something

or rob

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

who does rob have a hard time with?

 

[Sandtru27]

lol rob players are so funny

rob can actually do really well.. it's just that most don't play "gay" enough or are just plain awful/new (OR rob's just choose "easier/less frustrating" char's to play)

he's not fantastic, but rob can do well (4-6 at worst) against everyone but MK

in contrast, i have to hit at least 50% of my farts on a 58 to 1:35 (preferably less) timer to win nowadays (unless the opposing player is just straight garbage)

and wario is guaranteed to lose the % war in MANY matchups (not bad but somewhat demoralizing)

tl;dr STEP YA **** UP JELLY

 

[SxK]

who does rob have a hard time with?

mk, d3, falco, zss, diddy, fox, lucario, olimar, toon link, pikachu
marth/snake are close to even imo
rob really only beats ic's and wario for the upper tiers imo

 

[Sandtru27]

none of those matchups are worse than 4-6 (besides mk obvi)

wario CRUSHES rob; are you high?

 

[GodMeowMix]

Everytime I read about match up discussions/arguements it looks like a political debate in the sense that everyone discusses their opinion on how things work instead of getting straight to the facts.

Anyway is there anything to look forward to for Brawl in May? I'm trying to schedule some hometime to where I can compete and I won't be available for this month's GT.

 

[Sandtru27]

MEOWMIX

i miss you, bro

-gmoney

my **** is straight to the facts

rob vs anyone but MK is 4-6 at worst

and i just **** rob so fk it

 

[Ereth]

Brawl in May is looking like 2 tournaments in winter haven and a tournament in jax

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

dylan, what about fox/diddy/lucario/tl are even bad?

i dont understand, most of those characters lose to shield so ur probably too busy trying to play rob how u think rob should play generally instead of playing to counter ur opponents character/play style

to me it just looks like u listed characters u feel out camp rob, which doesnt necessarily mean they beat him in any way

 

[GodMeowMix]

Hey G$, I'm looking forward to facing you in bracket again, for real.. and chillin with you too of course. ha

 

[Sandtru27]

you're gonna have to convince the **** out of me to go, bro

sorry

but it MAY happen

i'm graduating next week

just a lot on my plate (and smash is not one of them atm)

 

[SxK]

dylan, what about fox/diddy/lucario/tl are even bad?

i dont understand, most of those characters lose to shield so ur probably too busy trying to play rob how u think rob should play generally instead of playing to counter ur opponents character/play style

to me it just looks like u listed characters u feel out camp rob, which doesnt necessarily mean they beat him in any way

fox: speed prevents rob from chasing, dair abuses bad shield, can out camp us, has a reflector, can juggle realllly well cause rob has AWFUL air speed
lucario: fair shield pokes hard and low percent juggles rack up % quick, again ez juggling, rob has no kill power so lucario lives forever --> he does more damage
diddy: while rob can abuse bananas well with his decent item game but diddy just does it better (obv), bananas trip due to more shield johns and he can camp well
toon link: he outcamps us really hard, all his projectiles and z-air shieldpoke really hard, kills us pretty quick

but I still think rob beats wario 55-45

 

[DewDaDash]

Can ya take me off the panelist if your not going to ask me about it :D

 

[Ereth]

already did, calm your panties

 

[True Blue]

Da fudge am I reading? Lol.
But was fun reading all of it. Especially the things G$ said. Or Sandtru. Whatever you want to be called.

 

[outlawpika]

Holy Balls this thread...

 

[#HBC | Scary]

There's a lot of stuff about the correlation of using a low tier and bad placements.

Meh.

 

[Publix]

Didn't read any what you guys said, but i wanna get in this

GO TEAM ME! MY NAME IS G.Love... PEOPLE STILL CALL ME PUBLIX. Combo video right here! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZW0IbbqxBo

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

fox: speed prevents rob from chasing, dair abuses bad shield, can out camp us, has a reflector, can juggle realllly well cause rob has AWFUL air speed
lucario: fair shield pokes hard and low percent juggles rack up % quick, again ez juggling, rob has no kill power so lucario lives forever --> he does more damage
diddy: while rob can abuse bananas well with his decent item game but diddy just does it better (obv), bananas trip due to more shield johns and he can camp well
toon link: he outcamps us really hard, all his projectiles and z-air shieldpoke really hard, kills us pretty quick

but I still think rob beats wario 55-45

i dont really see how those characters cover an unfair amount of options. imo bad matchups truely come from a character being able to cover many of your options while still having a window open to punish your other better options. not just because other characters are better at camping than you.

i get it, rob is an amazing camper, and when he's forced to approach, it takes away from the big good side of his playstyle, but that doesn't mean he strait loses the matchup because of it. alot of people judge matchups too much on whether or not their biggest plusses are abusable or not.

if i was judging matchups based on who out camped who, ddd would have rediculously bad matchups across the bored cause everyone with a decent projectile can out camp him. however his only real bad matchups are those like IC's MK or ZSS, all characters that can completely shut his approach game down, while still be able to run him over for free if they happen to have to approach.

aka their options can just beat his while still staying safe.

based on your reasons about ur "bad" matchups, i'm not really seeing that happen. the majority of the reasons came down to who out camps you, and shield pokes. the shield poke thing, imo, can get solved by having better footsies. yes this makes you change ur normal playstyle a bit, but rob's ftilt is godlike and imo is one of the best spacing moves in the game.

the other thing you said was he cant really land well and gets juggled. This will again bring me back to DDD or even snake for that matter. DDD suffers from this and DOESNT have any good means of b-reverses to change his momentum and trick up his opponent. Snake has gernades, but rob has his laser (i believe) gyro cancels a good up b for stalling in the air (except against mk cuz we can shuttle loop that for free) and a side b you can throw out to mess with someone that tries to wait under u in a shield

i duno, i just feel like just because your direct attacks (nair and stuff) don't beat outother people when they are below you, doesn't mean you lose in the air, you just need to abuse the other options rob does have to make up for that.

hope that's helped in some way, and i'm sorry if this is all info you already knew, i just don't think alot of people playing mid-ish tiers give their characters enough credit.

Just because your character isn't the best in a given situation, doesn't mean they are bad in it.

 

[Dolo]

It would be nice if we could at least see reasons why people were moved up and down on the rankings. Right now I don't see any reason why Goof is in 3rd (me and lio both have positive tournament records against him), why Hiroi and Hungrybox were removed considering they have significantly more experience than the bottom two introduced to the ranking (Hiroi and Hbox were both at GatorLAN, the very tournament it says these rankings are based off of), or even what caused Ereth to move ahead of Jeck. I'm not trying to start anything but the rankings would be much better/accurate/unbiased if we could base them on actual results instead of opinion of player skill...

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

the fact that there is no standard way of measuring players for a PR is why making one is so damn annoying, cause no matter how someone chooses to do it or how much thought or work goes into it, ur gona have people unhappy about something.


not pointing you out Dolo, just stating a fact about just about all pr's

 

[Dolo]

the fact that there is no standard way of measuring players for a PR is why making one is so damn annoying, cause no matter how someone chooses to do it or how much thought or work goes into it, ur gona have people unhappy about something.


not pointing you out Dolo, just stating a fact about just about all pr's

Yeah of course, it shouldn't be based purely on making people happy. Just from that statement, doesn't it make sense to base it on results instead of opinions which are often biased and unreliable?