G&W Help

[Exia 00]

I just noticed how mean G&W is T-T. I did ok againt him but does lucas have any tools that help in the match up ? Also, what are some strategies that tend to work against G&W ? Are there any stages or attacks that hinder G&Ws air based approaches ? Im a skilled lucas main but I find him being one of the HARDEST matcch ups. All help is appreciated. Thank you.

Edit: I main pit, lucas and sonic. Who is the smarter choice against G&W ? I dont want to swicth since figuring out ways to beat him is better for me and also better for advancing the meta game of lucas. Im sure I'm not the only one with this problem.

 

[Levitas]

Lucas and sonic are both countered by Game and Watch. They both have it really bad.

Do you have any specific questions/problems that you're having difficulty with?

ie. How do I get around G&W's bair?

Honestly, I'd go pit against G&W. Careful about the arrows, because that bucket will OHKO you for sure. If you want a solid game against G&W, I'd recommend marth. In fact, I'd recommend him anyway because he's fun to play.

 

[Exia 00]

I might try marth in the future but hes a bit overused lol. Its not a problem but in case I have to use lucas (when I feel like it) , How should I deal with his Dair ? I dont get Baired much since im usually out of range, forcing him to approach. Also, I assume PKT is not as effective on him off stage. I cant stage spike him for some reason and PKT gimping is especially difficult when he makes low recoveries. His low recoveries are to quick to stop and trying might get me stage spiked. Thanks for the help Levitas.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

ya you really might need to pick up a different char to deal with him. avoiding his dair is easy. predict it and shieldgrab or spotdodge and punish. it's pretty easy to see coming. how are you forcing G&W to approach exactly? you don't really have a way to force an approach against him. it's more like whoever decides to approach approaches. PKT gimping is a bad idea. he will bucket and proceed to recover. you can't gimp his recovery because it has invincibility frames. that's why it's so hard to hit him lol. his moves have IASA frames so watch out for that. really if you want to win this match with lucas. Bait and punish. bair has lag. fair has lag. dair has little lag. do something you know they would expect you to do as the bait, and when they take it, punish them. if you see a G&W approach you facing backwards expect bair drop your shield on purpose once or twice to get your opponent thinking you'll drop your shield each time and then when they expect you to drop your shield, don't and punish. little things like that can win a match, but seriously... pick up another char lol.

 

[Levitas]

Getting hit as a mindgame is strictly worse than not getting hit as a mindgame.

 

[Natch]

Shield Grab the Dair. Remeber that it has two hitboxes, and the second one comes out on the ground. There is enough lag to grab him afterwards.

Also, Up+B on GaW has invincibility frames. My reccomendation is to space yourself from the ledge so you can grab him(remember to pummel. Divide his current percentage by 25 to get the amount of pummels you can do) and throw him back out-if he doesn't jump or roll onto the stage.

If he rolls, Dsmash/Jab/Grab/Something. If he jumps...find something. Can't remember off the top of my head, since I'm inbreited(yay for Smirnoff!), but you put him into a trap that he won't realize until he's thrown off the ledge for the 5th time in a row or something.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

Getting hit as a mindgame is strictly worse than not getting hit as a mindgame.

lol i know i was just using it as an example of what i meant, though i may have put the idea in his head to try it. ehh... oops my apologies.

let's try something like approach with nair often they'll expect nair and either put up their shield or roll/spotdodge. if they put up their shield. grab them. if they roll it turns into those little chase thingies lol. if they spotdodge, just punish it.

is that better?

i'm new to my baiting and punishing (i picked up luigi not too long ago)

 

[A2ZOMG]

Learn to get inside G&W's range and Jab him srsly.

 

[Irsic]

....Is bucket reflectable?

I'd test this but I currently do not have access to a Wii for a day or two.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Nope. Sorry.

 

[Exia 00]

Seriously, all of you are awesome! Its amazing how helpful the lucas/ness mains are. I think I should post here more often. ^_^

Also, to force him to approach, I wave bounce a PK fire (no b-stick ) carefully so Im out of his range. When he notices my SH, he usually tries to go for a Fair/Bair or sometimes a bucket when he catches on. This also could have beeen because of my opponents decisions.

 

[Irsic]

Don't always short hop the PK Fire, the bucket is pretty ****ing scary.

Also a general tip on the bair, is even when G&W hits the ground, he has another hit box that comes out from the bair, and this for some reason still catches me off guard. >_<

If you can get all up in G&W jazz with combo'd nairs, grab + pummels, some dair combos you may be able to net yourself a kill, but G&W can also take you to hell and back with him. This is one of our toughest matchups, and it partly relies on the stage you guys play on.

 

[Exia 00]

Whats an ideal stage for lucas ? Also, Its not 100% but I found out that jab to grab is pretty cool lol. Sheild grab works better IMO. Its the first two hits of the jab>Sheild grab>pummel as much as possible>what ever throw floats your boat lol. It does more damage than a normal jab combo. My main combo against anyone at low percentage is usually nair>Utilt>Nair/Uair :/

 

[Levitas]

Lucas likes Norfair. A lot.

I hear brinstar, too.

As far as neutrals, I like smashville a lot.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

Whats an ideal stage for lucas ? Also, Its not 100% but I found out that jab to grab is pretty cool lol. Sheild grab works better IMO. Its the first two hits of the jab>Sheild grab>pummel as much as possible>what ever throw floats your boat lol. It does more damage than a normal jab combo. My main combo against anyone at low percentage is usually nair>Utilt>Nair/Uair :/

nair --> utilt is safe
nair --> uair is not safe

the time it takes for you to jump and uair, the opponent will already be able to react again and shield/spotdodge/any move that comes out in 5 frames or less. (not sure if it's exactly 5 frames that the opponent has)
norfair and brinstar are lucas' stages.
good neutrals are smashville and if you're good with ledgebending FD.
BF is ok... yoshi's island is the wackest island i've ever been to.

 

[ChaosTheoryX]

Lucas likes Norfair. A lot.

I hear brinstar, too.

As far as neutrals, I like smashville a lot.

G&W likes norfair quite a bit so I don’t really suggest it, but you definitely want a stage where you will need a minimal use of pk thunder as a recovery so i would definitely suggest brinstar. Also note that any stage with a high upper blast zone is a great thing against G&W

 

[Exia 00]

Lol. Brinstar worked for me so I thank you all for being so kind ^_^ Also, I ***** my friends G&W on Green Greens. A fresh Fsmash killed at a really low percentage and I abused the hell out of the bomb blocks lol

 

[lil cj]

To defeat G&W
pretty much jus do what everyone has said(im late...lol)
Summary:
Dair, nair, and jab alot
and not too much PK fire/PK thunder
Pick a good stage counter(Nofair and Brinstar)
Watch this vid of APC(one of our best Lucas mains)
he ***** this G&W
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJk1YFUnLw

 

[K 2]

Just don't spam your specials...That's the safest way. Any combination of PK whatever will guarantee and OHKO, which is -1 stock for you.

Honestly, all you characters have tough matchups against G&W. I would suggest using Marth or Snake in the matchup. They both have really good matchups that cover most of the characters in brawl.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

To defeat G&W
pretty much jus do what everyone has said(im late...lol)
Summary:
Dair, nair, and jab alot
and not too much PK fire/PK thunder
Pick a good stage counter(Nofair and Brinstar)
Watch this vid of APC(one of our best Lucas mains)
he ***** this G&W
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJk1YFUnLw

no norfair.
you forgot shieldgrab the dair.
punish his laggy moves.
OH and you can bait a bucket and punish it's lag.

 

[K 2]

Lucus's specials have quite a hit of endlag too, so you will be hard pressed to punish the bucket lag.

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

To defeat G&W
pretty much jus do what everyone has said(im late...lol)
Summary:
Dair, nair, and jab alot
and not too much PK fire/PK thunder
Pick a good stage counter(Nofair and Brinstar)
Watch this vid of APC(one of our best Lucas mains)
he ***** this G&W
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJk1YFUnLw

That video is pretty out of date....

Anyways, I would recommend approaching so that you aren't at the same horizontal level Game and Watch is on. This will prevent him from being able to do turtle or fair.

 

[prOAPC]

stay in the ground, his better than you in the air
learn to shield every hit of his turtle (6 hits)
don't be afraid to use PK Fire, but don't spam it, make him use the bucket and then punish
tech his dthrow

 

[Exia 00]

stay in the ground, his better than you in the air
learn to shield every hit of his turtle (6 hits)
don't be afraid to use PK Fire, but don't spam it, make him use the bucket and then punish
tech his dthrow

lol. I always let go of the shield to early >.< My SHs usually make my friend take out the bucket so maybe that's my opening. Seriously, i like the lucas mains on SWF. You are all so helpful. Thank you! ^_^*is an official lucas main*