Fire and Lightning 2: DC Comics vs Pokemon Conquest Game over DC Comics Wins!

[Kantrip]

It's not a cluster****. What we need to do is very clear, which is, first of all, calm the **** down.

We basically have a fallback that most people are generally on board with all lined up, and now's the time to move our votes to him.

 

[Gargaglione]

Garg, listen to me for a moment.

If dabuz is scum, and we let him live, and he is alive toMorrow and untouched, we don't lose out on anything. We can still lynch him no problem, and he'll probably be incapped by the other scumteam so we'll even be able to just choose not to uncap him and not even waste a lynch on him.

And we don't lose out on anything by leaving him alive that extra phase.

However, on the chance that he may actually be legit (the claim would explain why he started the game trying to play safe and was generally trying to appease people since he wanted to stay under the radar), leaving him alive guarantees that if he is still alive toMorrow because the scumteams didn't go for him, we get the use of his night action for the Night and learn valuable information

First of all, the fact that you're stating what scum will probably do means that whoever is scum will read this and write it down on their "what not to do list", meaning that neither scumteam will probably go for him any time soon regardless of whether he is scum or not.

Second, keeping dabuz alive doesn't assure he is a cop that can learn **** at night. Saying you're the cop =/= being the cop.

Anyone could say they're the cop. If we were about to lynch someone like Hollownote, he'd probably claim to be cop before his death too just to save his chances, just like what's happening now. it's a common thing people do and it does not increase the likelihood of them being cop, so you cannot count on that

 

[Fandangox]

ARMANDO ESTOY EMBARAZADA

 

[Gargaglione]

This is a cluster****. I feel like we are in a Hispanic telenovela and we just hit the ****ty cliffhanger twist before the end of the season.

Isn't that what mafia is?

 

[Gargaglione]

ARMANDO ESTOY EMBARAZADA

PERO MI AMOR DE VERDAD ES GORF, PARA SIEMPRE.

 

[Fandangox]

ARMANDO ESTOY EMBARAZADA

Isn't that what mafia is?

Yeah, but this one is specially ****ty.

Also since you two are active right now can you answer the question I made last page.

 

[Kantrip]

First of all, the fact that you're stating what scum will probably do means that whoever is scum will read this and write it down on their "what not to do list", meaning that neither scumteam will probably go for him any time soon regardless of whether he is scum or not.

Second, keeping dabuz alive doesn't assure he is a cop that can learn **** at night. Saying you're the cop =/= being the cop.

Anyone could say they're the cop. If we were about to lynch someone like Hollownote, he'd probably claim to be cop before his death too just to save his chances, just like what's happening now. it's a common thing people do and it does not increase the likelihood of them being cop, so you cannot count on that

The scumteam should definitely use their Night Kill. They should totally not No Kill for the WIFOM, that would be dumb.

Oh also scum should vote for townies. They shouldn't vote each other to help us out, that doesn't make any sense.

Oh hey scum, you guys should ask if the MOD will let you incap yourselves. Actually no don't do that that's dumb.

Geez dude, I don't think you understand the idea I'm trying to get across here. dabuz is condemned to death with that cop claim. His days are numbered now, with or without town's help. Even if he's scum he ain't lasting long on a cop claim. We don't have any reason to waste our lynch on someone who claims cop because it's actually ****ing ********

 

[Fandangox]

ebwop: why did that sentence get posted again

 

[Kantrip]

guys speaking in not english is against the rules

say sorry for bad englando and pls no more rebelerino

 

[Fandangox]

Oh didn't know that. Well gonna stop it then.

But again, I think the key is intent, I want your thoughts on the question I made last page.

 

[Kantrip]

If dabuz is still alive toMorrow we lynch him then. Deal?

The fact that he may get at least one night action off is what makes leaving him alive just one Day worth it

 

[Fandangox]

I don't know man, I am still iffy about this. Also please, I want your thoughts on my question last page, you too garg.

When everyone else reads this please also your thoughts on that.

 

[Kantrip]

I already listed that out as a possibility above.

I am gonna wait to see what everyone else says about this, I could go with a Hando lynch, but I still don't see why a town cop who is about to get killed would claim before getting any results. Like if this were day 2 and 3 and he actually had some results for us to look into after we realized we myslynched I could see why a townie would do that.

Why the hell would a town player claim COP in before the first day is even over, even if you are about to die, and you are cop, and you have had not results because no night has passed, you should probably realize the big commotion this would cause to the other town players, and you would get killed either way next night unless scum want to take that gambit so we mislynch the cop next day. This just keeps going in circles on my head, I am gonna wait on everyone tomorrow, but my vote is still on Dabuz.

The town player would claim cop if, and only if, they are the cop. In which case they're telling us so that they will not be the lynch. We will lynch someone else and they will most likely die, meaning we lock down scum's options for the Night phase and they don't get to kill who they want to. If we still lynch the cop claim, we're just doing scum's job for them and giving them more freedom, and we're denying ourselves information in the form of another lynch we could have gotten.

The possibility of NEITHER scumteam incapping a claimed cop is so small it is non-existant so we don't need to worry about that possibility, which means dabuz will literally be 100% dead by the end of toMorrow without us having to use a lynch on him.

 

[Gargaglione]

If dabuz is still alive toMorrow we lynch him then. Deal?

The fact that he may get at least one night action off is what makes leaving him alive just one Day worth it

Alright, fine.
Hando IS scummy, and what you're saying is very sensible.

...


Vote: Handorin

 

[Gargaglione]

Gonna go to bed. I have faith in this lynch, so yee.

peasoup guys

 

[Fandangox]

The town player would claim cop if, and only if, they are the cop. In which case they're telling us so that they will not be the lynch. We will lynch someone else and they will most likely die, meaning we lock down scum's options for the Night phase and they don't get to kill who they want to. If we still lynch the cop claim, we're just doing scum's job for them and giving them more freedom, and we're denying ourselves information in the form of another lynch we could have gotten.

The possibility of NEITHER scumteam incapping a claimed cop is so small it is non-existant so we don't need to worry about that possibility, which means dabuz will literally be 100% dead by the end of toMorrow without us having to use a lynch on him.

Alright that's very solid. I still think scum would think of letting him leave so we kill him next phase, it would be a repeat of D1, except we might have a result to work it, but I don't know if scum would also rather leave that up in the air..

 

[Kantrip]

Alright that's very solid. I still think scum would think of letting him leave so we kill him next phase, it would be a repeat of D1, except we might have a result to work it, but I don't know if scum would also rather leave that up in the air..

See that's my point.

Scum could leave him alive to try to make it look like he's scum, but town only benefits from that in the form of his night result that he can share with us. Even if we choose to lynch him then, a townflip would mean the result he just gave us is confirmed true which means we get some valuable information.

Which is why scum likely won't leave him alive if he's town, so we really don't have to worry.

You feel me? Can you join us on Hando?

 

[Fandangox]

I totally feel you on this, but I want to see what everyone else says about this.

 

[Kantrip]

Hopefully something along the lines of "Vote Handorin"

 

[Kantrip]

He only has 3 votes right now I think you should throw your vote down so we're not scrambling more than we already are.

@ #HBC | Scary I see you reading now too, please vote Hando when you finish

 

[#HBC | Scary]

HOLY ****

Sorry I haven't been around, was with family today. I just read up on everything and I generally have the same feeling that Garg does but Kanty laid things out really well. I have the sinking feeling that Dabuz could really be the cop just cause I've never really seen frustration in Dabuz's gameplay before and I believe this is real frustration oozing out of these last few posts. I'm just super torn on this now.

Like Kanty said though, worst comes to worst, scum bops him in the night.

@Make it Rain!
As I was reading through, I saw that you said that my vote on Dabuz was the worst. Just gotta ask why? Pretty sure I voted after reading Kanty's case and agreeing with him.

 

[Fandangox]

He only has 3 votes right now I think you should throw your vote down so we're not scrambling more than we already are.

@ #HBC | Scary I see you reading now too, please vote Hando when you finish

I will wait for tomorrow. I am still not very sold on this, but I definitively see the point you are making.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

So lemme pose the "What do we get out of lynching Hando?" question.

 

[Fandangox]

Potassium is arguing that we were going to lynch him anyway (most likely true) and not lynching dabuz right would make scum target him and avoid their original target. Assuming Dabuz is telling the true of course.

In terms of information we wouldn't get much, there;s that Hando/Gorf thing Gova and Potassium mentioned, but I am honestly not seeing it.

 

[Kantrip]

So lemme pose the "What do we get out of lynching Hando?" question.

Best case? A scum flip.

Worst case? A vanilla townie flip. At least it wouldn't be town cop.

There may not be much in the way of connections but there is some stuff, and he is almost universally agreed upon to be grimy this game. It's essentially a fall-back lynch, and I'm open to other suggestions (but I think Hando is a better lynch than Hollow), but we do need to come together to lynch someone

 

[Fandangox]

Best case? A scum flip.

Worst case? A vanilla townie flip. At least it wouldn't be town cop.

How would you know that? ANYONE could be the cop.

 

[Kantrip]

How would you know that? ANYONE could be the cop.

Because I am actually, believe it or not, operating under the assumption that dabuz is legit.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I will give you that with Hando vs Hollow for backup lynch supremacy.

Pretty bad day for a deadline to fall on with the Super Bowl happening.

 

[Kantrip]

@ #HBC | Red Ryu request deadline extension because super bowl

 

[Fandangox]

That's probably a blessing cause I am operating on the assumption of COULD GO EITHER WAY.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I mean, the Super Bowl could create more drunk musings for me.....but I'd probably be to busy watching it and eating all the food involved in it.

Any who.......Vote Handorin

I'm going to drink heavily tomorrow, and I will decide if this vote will stay here in the process.

 

[Fandangox]

@ Top Deck BLS
@Make it Rain!
@Gova
@ Gargaglione
@ Handorin
@Raziek
@ #HBC | Scary
@HollowNote
@ #HBC | Gorf

Not tagging Potassium cause he already answered.

Please your thoughts on the following:

I already listed that out as a possibility above.

I am gonna wait to see what everyone else says about this, I could go with a Hando lynch, but I still don't see why a town cop who is about to get killed would claim before getting any results. Like if this were day 2 and 3 and he actually had some results for us to look into after we realized we myslynched I could see why a townie would do that.

Why the hell would a town player claim COP in before the first day is even over, even if you are about to die, and you are cop, and you have had not results because no night has passed, you should probably realize the big commotion this would cause to the other town players, and you would get killed either way next night unless scum want to take that gambit so we mislynch the cop next day. This just keeps going in circles on my head, I am gonna wait on everyone tomorrow, but my vote is still on Dabuz.

Trying to tie the intent on why would Town/Scum Dabuz claim on this situation.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I really enjoy the logic you bring into this Fanny. I will definitely sleep on these ideas and drink with these in mind.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Wow but that was just him using my points

I think Gorf's thing on Hando being a potential scum partner dabuz is trying to distance from was a ridiculous assertion though, and part of why I think Gorf/Hando could be a scumteam. Another point is what someone mentioned earlier (I forget who, Gova maybe?) about Gorf diffusing early pressure on Hando by calling stuff he was doing anti-town rather than scummy and starting that whole debacle before a Hando wagon formed.

First of all how is it a ridiculous assertion. You look at the interaction they had at the end of that page and tell me it didn't COMPLETELY come from left field. Either Hando just happened to be there when Dabuz started trying to switch onto him (and no this isn't me sarcastically saying that, that is certainly a possibility) or they came up with a distancing plan. If you read the fine print I've NEVER said that was my conclusion, merely a theory. Jeez.

Oh, an DIFFUSING the pressure? You guys think I was DIFFUSING the pressure because he's anti town? All I said is the same thing I said to YOLO in Tranquility when he tried pressuring BSP early on, and when he tried pressuring JTB D2. There's a difference between anti town and scummy, and pushing anti town as scummy just honestly doesn't fly with me. Pressure for anti town all you want, but iirc Garg was talking about lynching on it and that he was scummy for it when at the time he was just being inactive. Ya know. Like JTB in Tranquility. Pressure the slot all you want, hell lynch the slot! Just don't try to call something scummy when it's not.

You think Hando and dabuz are mates right?

And you think they are both individually scummy?

Would you be down to go Hando first?

(To be clear I'm not suggesting that course of action but rather asking if you would do it)

Yea sure I'd be down if the support for dabuz diffused. I'd prefer dabuz though.

Dude these are literally the two most ******** options and I'm astounded that you suggested them.

Cop should not CC.
We should not lynch dabuz.

We go for a fall-back on Hando. If dabuz is legit he will most likely die during the Night. If he's not there is no harm in him living past Day 1 and then we'll know. We don't want to out our real cop if he is scum, and we don't want to risk lynching him if he's town.

FoS Gorf (even though I already was but got damn)

And then the wifom toMorrow comes when one team incaps him and the other team doesn't right? You're just asking for a wifom fest with this dude. If he's scum, the other team will incap him and then the wifom of "But what if one team wanted to throw off town and make him think he was the real comp cop hurr durr" and all this madness. I'll only agree to this if we can all agree that he doesn't live to see N2.

@Kantrip all pg 32 you're ******** and just BEGGING for wifom aren't you?

Yeah but there is no downside to putting the lynch off. We'll get free night results if scum leaves him alive, and if they don't we can stop worrying about this WIFOM.

Dude. Come on. WWMD. What Would Marshy Do. That's all you gotta ask yourself when you're presented with somebody try'na avoid the noose with a claim. In fact, I hope the only support you have for this hop off atm is Ruy just cuz of how much he loooooves claims.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

If dabuz is still alive toMorrow we lynch him then. Deal?

The fact that he may get at least one night action off is what makes leaving him alive just one Day worth it

Pinky promise?

Unvote

Vote: Hando

How would you know that? ANYONE could be the cop.

Because I am actually, believe it or not, operating under the assumption that dabuz is legit.

Really dude. You're willing to be so open and shiz about dabuz being cop, and just don't think of the possibility of Hando being cop. Truth be told I'd believe him over dabuz being cop but whatever. Let's hope he doesn't come in here and CC amirite.

Well, @ Fandangox the thing is if dabuz IS town cop, then from his pov AT LEAST we're not lynching the town cop on D1 you feel me?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'm pushing deadline to tomorrow for the Super Bowl.

1 day added, I will not do this again.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Tomorrow at 11:59 PM?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Cst at 11:59 PM

 

[Handorin]

Guys, 10-13 pages of stuff since I last looked at this.

Give me some cliff's notes, or anything you feel is important. It'll help me weed through the useless junk so I can concentrate on reads, and help me get reads on you since you pick and choose what to share.

 

[Top Deck BLS]

You have me for roughly 30 minutes. I am half of my slot. What is happening at the moment, please give me cliff notes.