Falcon is terrible now just accept it

[suzuki brawl]

there a lot of post trying to cheer him up but it's useless,that combo in a video doesn't work,knee is not easy to land,he has lot of problems against small enemys,so please stop with this post,try to make a combo vid with a conscistent combo and show it for us

 

[Y34HDUD3!!!]

**** off.

Seriously.

 

[goodoldganon]

sigh tis sad

 

[zeionut]

y dont u just let people use who they want to use
u dont need to blow em off like that
people should just use who they want to

 

[Mann]

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=154152&page=4

Learn to read.

 

[PhillipthaGoober]

STFU please

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

Heh, my only reply to you is what I say to all my friends who think this character or that character sucks. I just tell'em, 'They only suck cuz you suck at usin' em! A true expert can utilize anything to his advantage and come out victorious!'

You tellin' me you can't do the same with Falcon, Mr. Topic Creator?

 

[Mann]

You tellin' me you can't do the same with Falcon, Mr. Topic Creator?

You can't read either. Almost each other character out there out prioritizes Falcon's moves. He barely has any range. No duh that a player with better skill will most likely win over someone who has less skill.

 

[Ayato]

Stop it with the god**** bashing. We know he's harder to play, whoopdee doo.

Get more people to play him and we'll see new techniques to help him improve. It's that simple. Sure, his moveset is bogged down with some of the worst priority in the game (save uair, which is even better as a juggle combo now). We get it.

Nobody will spend time figuring out why Falcon's good if this cynicism keeps up. Seriously. Let's get more Falcon mains or at least people who mess around with him so we can see some development here. Falcon's style won't develop in 3 weeks you know. He's got potential, despite the priority issues.

This Falcon bashing is really getting ridiculous.

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

Ayato, I totally agree with what you say. Nice name btw, RahXephon? Anyway, I agree with a lot of people here that Falcon seems to be having a hard time against a lot of characters. Hell, I'm considered the best in my little group of friends but now with Brawl out, it's getting harder and harder to hold that title. Still, I play Falcon because I believe he's a great character. I have a fun time pulling off Falcon Punches when my friends least expect it, and I love the expression on their faces when I spotdodge and punish a lot of their moves.

I wouldn't go as far as to say he's as terrible as most of you make him out to be. Like some people say here, maybe it's because you guys just play as him thinking he'd be the same ol' Captain Falcon from Melee. As for priority, Mann, are you sure you've tried EVERY single move against EVERY attack in EVERY situation? If you find an attack that can't seem to go through another enemy's attack, why don't you try a different one, something you haven't used before? Or why not just figure out a way to avoid it all together and take a different approach?

They say that the one who is most successful is the one that knows change. You know what I'm saying? I might be a newbie to this board and I might not know a thing I'm saying, but frankly, I'm tired of all this 'Falcon sucks' crap. Why couldn't you guys spend more time being positive than being negative? Does it hurt that much to try and look at the brighter side of things? Don't get me wrong, I'm not pointing fingers or anything, but please, can we be a little more grateful that we even have Falcon, and make the most of what we've got? =)

If not, then let me be the newbie I am with my blind optimism who constantly believes that 'When there's a will, there's a way.' I have no intention of giving up my passion playing as the Falcon and I'll do whatever I can to bring honor to his name.

 

[VEC]

Good, Flacon should have been nerfed, he was good in both the original and in melee UNLIKE MY MAN LUIGI

 

[Rampage]

**** off

please

 

[Mike87]

Dont feed the troll guys.

 

[vills]

well this guys a b***h who agrees with me=D

 

[Mann]

As for priority, Mann, are you sure you've tried EVERY single move against EVERY attack in EVERY situation? If you find an attack that can't seem to go through another enemy's attack, why don't you try a different one, something you haven't used before? Or why not just figure out a way to avoid it all together and take a different approach? .

No. Because I'm a complete Falcon noob. I just bought Brawl and think Falcon is the worst character. And he isn't my main. Why don't people read? You're trying to compare statistics to situation. People already know a way to figure out how to avoid one move, but again, that's situational. I already know what moves work, what doesn't with Falcon. However, applying it is completely different.

 

[Anth0ny]

Nerfed? Yes. Terrible? Hardly.

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

Well I'm sorry you think I don't know how to read Mann. I guess I'm not as uber as you are, but I'm doing my best not to get in anyone's way or upset anyone. I'll admit I'm bad at arguing too, so cut me some slack here and tell me what exactly is your purpose here?

Are you here simply to bash on Captain Falcon too? On a board dedicated to him? Or are you here to prove to the world that people can't read? lol
You haven't played Captain Falcon that much and you already think Falcon is the worst? If that's true, then what is that supposed to make us people that think he's a great character that has lots of potential?

 

[ReploidArmada]

1) Feeding trolls makes you liable to get your arm bitten off by stupidity.
2) Trolling makes you a target for admins and people who for some reason want their arms bitten off.

Now that those 2 points are out of the way: I love Falcon. Captain Falcon is still top-class in running speed, has good range with his DownB, both in air and otherwise, his SideB adds some much needed range and unpredictability to his attacks, and his calling card (NeutB) now has greater flexibility in being able to swing around to hit behind you for more damage. Plus, he's made of style.

However, I will admit Falcon is a harder character to play. I main Falcon, and my current tops for Kills, Damage Dealt, Falls, and Damage Taken are held by Falcon. Falcon is a hard character to play because, in part, he's really fast. Plus, his Side and DownB attacks will freefall you, so using them with reckless abandon on small stages *cough*FD*cough* will doom you to stock loss.

However, this "OMGFLACONISTEHWEAKSUACE" **** needs to stop. Now. Captain Falcon has his place and can do very well at it, when those who play him know how to put him there. However, this rampant bashing of a good character will lead to a lack of recognition in competition, as the uninformed huddle around the so-called "god" characters (see Ike). In the end, all we will have for this is less people playing a character they like and can actually do well with, and more reinforcement of whatever tier list we come up with in a year or two.

In short, quit your *****ing.

 

[Mann]

You haven't played Captain Falcon that much and you already think Falcon is the worst?

Assumptions are awesome.

People will still be using Falcon. I'll still be using Falcon. The fact remains that Falcon will be a challenge to use against most characters.

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

Assumptions are awesome.

People will still be using Falcon. I'll still be using Falcon. The fact remains that Falcon will be a challenge to use against most characters.

Didn't mean to make an assumption, but what you said made it seem to me like that you're not giving Falcon a chance. If I'm wrong, I sincerely apologize.
People will still be using Falcon, that, I agree with you wholeheartedly. Even if it's proven fact that he is a challenge, I won't let that stop me. I enjoy the challenge, I embrace it, and I'll see it to the end. Perhaps we can Brawl sometime, maybe I can learn a thing or two from you.

 

[Mann]

No worries. I'm egotistical on the boards.

to the original topic. I will not accept that Falcon is terrible, because I love his move set and his stylish clothing. One can not simply just rush out anymore and expect results with him. It's annoying and people just don't have the patience for thinking about the habits of the opponent. Not only that, Falcon players are going to have to anticipate their own moves more than ever. If you any move too early, or too late, even just a bit, most likely going to be punished by it.

Peach's forward B is an example. You may think that the start up movement may lead into your elbow, instead only to find yourself with Falcon's face full of... cloth. All goes under experience who you have been playing with. Applying it to each game after makes you a better player than before.

 

[KeyKid19]

Ayato, I totally agree with what you say. Nice name btw, RahXephon? Anyway, I agree with a lot of people here that Falcon seems to be having a hard time against a lot of characters. Hell, I'm considered the best in my little group of friends but now with Brawl out, it's getting harder and harder to hold that title. Still, I play Falcon because I believe he's a great character. I have a fun time pulling off Falcon Punches when my friends least expect it, and I love the expression on their faces when I spotdodge and punish a lot of their moves.

I wouldn't go as far as to say he's as terrible as most of you make him out to be. Like some people say here, maybe it's because you guys just play as him thinking he'd be the same ol' Captain Falcon from Melee. As for priority, Mann, are you sure you've tried EVERY single move against EVERY attack in EVERY situation? If you find an attack that can't seem to go through another enemy's attack, why don't you try a different one, something you haven't used before? Or why not just figure out a way to avoid it all together and take a different approach?

They say that the one who is most successful is the one that knows change. You know what I'm saying? I might be a newbie to this board and I might not know a thing I'm saying, but frankly, I'm tired of all this 'Falcon sucks' crap. Why couldn't you guys spend more time being positive than being negative? Does it hurt that much to try and look at the brighter side of things? Don't get me wrong, I'm not pointing fingers or anything, but please, can we be a little more grateful that we even have Falcon, and make the most of what we've got? =)

If not, then let me be the newbie I am with my blind optimism who constantly believes that 'When there's a will, there's a way.' I have no intention of giving up my passion playing as the Falcon and I'll do whatever I can to bring honor to his name.

You sound exactly like me. lol And you've gotten owned by Mann a couple times just like I have (although I think I've been owned by him more than a couple times especially on the tourney experience point he made in another thread). It's ok though because I think Mann is a hard person to read (not like post read but like personality read) so that's why you and I both made erroneous assumptions about him which he disproved and owned us on. lol With that, welcome to the boards! If anything you'll learn that if you don't know 100% what you're talking about, you'll get owned (usually by Mann lol he's cool though and knows a lot). I learned that the hard way too.

But yeah anyways after that little tangent I really loved your opening paragraph because that's exactly how things are for me as well. I used to be the unquestioned champion of Smash amongst my friends back when Melee was around, but now with Brawl it's a LOT harder to win and the matches are always competitive (though I still win probably 95% of the 1v1s we do). That's part of the reason why I say that Brawl is the great equalizer in many regards. Sure the pro players will still be better than the noobs but overall the game is much more competitive and significant gaps in skill between players have been reduced. That's how I see it at least. Maybe if I was devoted to someone else I wouldn't feel as strongly about that but honestly I think that all of the characters are competitive now so players can't ride top tier characters anymore. I don't think Falcon is terrible by any stretch but his game has certainly shifted since Melee (and for the worse in certain regards but definitely not all).

Anyways welcome to the Falcon Forum! We're kind of small in numbers (the usual bunch at least) but we seem to be growing by the day. Be sure to check out the Falcon's Worst Matchups thread as well as the Falcon Shows His Moves thread. I think you'll find both very informative (I have at least). I look forward to more discussions with you in the future.

P.S. And yes I'm usually very long-winded. Sorry.

 

[W.Jr]

yea i got to agree, compete downgrade.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Y'know, there are a lot of people here who would say Ganondorf is terrible, and that is probably true.

Now a lot of people here are just going to blatantly disagree with me. I can see why, but the thing that needs to be known is while Ganondorf sucks, he's actually better than one character. That character is Captain Falcon.

There are two main reasons why he's better:
1. He combos better than Captain Falcon.

Now how in the ****ing world is that possible? Simple. Combos hardly exist in the first place due to the new physics engine. Almost anything Falcon can do can be escaped with air dodging, like U-air juggling. You may argue that Falcon can to D-throw to U-air. Guess what. Ganondorf can do that too. His U-air is just as good as if not better than Falcon's. Now where things get really nasty. Falcon's Forward B sucks. Ganon's Forward B on the other hand sucks a lot less. For one, it's a grab. It grabs through shields. Falcon will get punished if he hits a shield with his Forward B. Next, Ganon's Forward B is a techchase setup. There are several characters whom Ganon can immediately jab out of a Forward B, but that isn't his only option. Of course, if he correctly anticipates a tech, which will happen eventually, he gets a free hit. Does Falcon have a true techchase setup? Nope. Oh, and did you know that Ganon has super armor on his Forward B, and that when he misses, he DOES NOT FALL ON HIS FACE?

2. Ganon's kill options are plain better than Falcon's.

I'd say it is equally easy to land either character's Smash attacks. Maybe Falcon's D-smash is faster, but I think Ganon's U-smash is actually faster than Falcon's so that evens out maybe? I guess Falcon can Hyphen Smash better due to a better dash, but I dunno...Oh, but one other thing. Ganon has more range and power on his Smashes. So he gets a small win here.

Next, Ganon's Jab kills at 150%. Big win here.

Ganon's F-tilt is also fast like his Jab, and that has more range and power than his Jab. It sends people at a fairly low trajectory. Amazing kill move. Can Falcon's F-tilt compare? Not really.

Who has a better Up-B? It's debatable. Falcon seems to be able to kill with the grab part, but Ganon can kill with the Uppercut part vertically, and that has insane range.

Ganon's Down-B >>> Falcon's.

Ganon's Dash attack >>> Falcon's.

Falcon does have a less punishable aerial game I guess, but they took away the priority from it so not by too much. All of Ganon's aerials except for his N-air kill, especially his Down-air which appears to actually be a Spike, not a meteor (and if you do it right, you can autocancel his D-air ftw). Falcon can rarely get kills with his U-air, but mainly gets kills IF he sweetspots his Knee. Is his Down-air still a meteor? I guess you could kill with it, but it wouldn't be as effective as Ganon's unless it's a spike.

Oh, and Ganon gets guaranteed suicide kills from his Forward B in the air. Is Falcon's Forward B a spike or a meteor? I think it's a meteor, because that is what it was like in Melee, but correct me if I'm wrong. Falcon could potentially win here if it's a spike.

Yeahyeah Falcon wins in mobility. Great mobility didn't stop Sonic from being low tier (he suffers from horrible priority and bad kill options. Nuff said). Good mobility and crap variety that doesn't have amazing priority certainly isn't going to make Falcon from being close to good. Ganondorf has a little bit of something Falcon doesn't, and that is variety. I know it's hard to believe. It was hard for me to believe at first, but Ganondorf really does have more going for him than Falcon.

 

[KeyKid19]

Falcon's UpB >>>>> Ganondorf's. More range, uncounterable, less landing lag, and thanks to Falcon being a much better jumper than Ganondorf it is able to be followed up more easily. I've also never seen the punch be any significant weapon so there's really negligible difference between G-Dorf having one and Falcon not having one. Anyone attacking with Ganondorf's UpB is pretty desperate anyways because Uair is a much better option. The punch doesn't really do much to stop edgehoggers either because they will just start climbing up and not get hit by it due to invincibility frames and you'll die because his UpB has terrible range. I've never fallen due to Falcon not being able to recover, but I have many times because Ganondorf can't.

Ganondorf's dash attack is also not better because he is so slow that you'd have to be stupid to get hit by it. Falcon's comes at you so fast that it's useful.

Falcon Fair >>> Ganondorf Fair. Incredible lag on both ends of G-Dorf's and both versions of the knee have upsides to them. The gimp trips the opponent fairly often and the sweetspotted one kills at 75%.

Falcon's Dair can spike and is autocancelable just like Ganondorf's. However I think that both versions of the move are too hard to use in Brawl to be very effective at anything.

Falcon Bair >>> Ganondorf's because it's easier to use thanks to Falcon not sucking at jumping. Try using it as an edgeguard with Ganondorf and you're likely to fall just because your jump sucks so much. It may be stronger but it's less useable so I think that makes it worse.

Falcon Uair > Ganondorf's for the same reason his Bair is better. More useable. However the two versions are very comparable. Falcon's Uair does get kills because it can be used as an edgeguard unlike Ganondorf's because he sucks at jumping so much. Also you said that Falcon's was not good because it was airdodgeable, but the same goes for Ganondorf's so you really didn't prove anything.

Ground Raptor Boost <<<< Ganondorf's version (forgot the name). The essentially lagless ending on a whiff is a major plus for Ganondorf and the fact that it's a grab is nuts.

Aerial Raptor Boost >>>> Ganondorf's version (still don't know the name). If you like moves that kill you when used, this is a great move. No use whatsoever against edgeguarders (Falcon's does spike by the way and it also gives him a little hop which prevents him from dying when it connects). Also Falcon's has waveland properties when used JUST off the ground so you can not fret about using it as long as you don't use it too far off the ground.

Falcon's Utilt >>>> Ganondorf's. G-Dorf's version was nerfed in power and is still just as slow. Falcon's is incredibly useful.

Smashes are about the same because Ganondorf's have more power but Falcon's have less cooldown lag so are less punishable.

Falcon maneuverability >>> Ganondorf maneuverability. No need to even say anything else.

Falcon's weight is also slightly less than Ganondorf's so the fact that he weighs almost the same and has a significantly smaller frame is a big boost. Ganondorf is clearly more punishable than Falcon which is enhanced even more by his comparably laggier moves. Also edgeguarding Ganondorf is ridiculously easy whereas the same can't be said about Falcon. Once you get Ganondorf offscreen he's essentially dead, whereas Falcon is far from dead.

So yeah I really don't see where you're getting this Ganondorf > Falcon idea.

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

Keykid, thank you for the warm welcome, I really appreciate it, and I must state that Mann confuses me. One moment I think he's an opponent, the next moment he turns out to be a Falcon supporter. Which one are you Mann!? lol If anything Mann, judging from KeyKid's statement about you, I think you're baiting us into doing a charge attack (throwing assumptions at you) and then spot dodging and punishing us for our missed attack. Why the torture~~? @_@;; lol

Thanks for your comment on my post, lol. I was thinking my long post just went unheard or something. I usually am long-winded myself, so no worries, we're on equal grounds so I understand where you're coming from, haha! xD
I agree that Brawl is a lot more equal now, which, personally, is a lot more fun since most of my friends who didn't pose a challenge before, are actually a lot more fun to play. I never really bothered with Captain Falcon too much in N64 and Melee, except maybe use him as a joke character because of his awesome Falcon Punch (which still rocks in this game and surprisingly gets me lotsa kills). I started realizing his true power ever since I discovered BOTH, The Knee and the infamous Falcon Anime Super Falcon Punch (link here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFtw7qW7Vcw). From then on, I was a big fan of Captain Falcon. I bought F-Zero GX, watched part of the anime, and listened to his great songs, especially Meaning of Truth, and showed my friends the power of Captain Falcon. Even today, among my group of friends, Captain Falcon is honored as the greatest, sexiest, and manliest character ever to have appeared in Smash! That and they fear my own personal rendition of Falcon Punch as well. xD

Hmm, think I went a lil too far with my own personal history of admiration to the Captain... But all of you, recall the first time you ever started playing, maining, and admiring the great Captain Falcon. Remember what you felt when you first played him. I still have those feelings even after 7-8 months, which may be short compared to some of your veterans, but they still run strong in me even now. That is my reason for playing as Captain Falcon, he's simply an awesome character and one that's fun to play as for me.

Hah! Take that for long-winded Keykid, and btw, nice counter on that Ganondorf topic. However, have you ever considered Ganon's reverse-uair? Isn't that kinda dangerous still? lol

 

[Mann]

So yeah I really don't see where you're getting this Ganondorf > Falcon idea.

Because of his power.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rivRtJ16RMU Even though the Wolf player wasn't that great, you can see that Ganon has more reach than Falcon does. Like his jab.

His forward B, which used to be Gerudo Smash or something, keeps them close range so you can decide what to do with them, as opposed to Falcon's knock back. Not only that, it can be used as a recovery more than Falcon's can, as it can grab even though the person is shielding.

Ganondorf's Fair is superior to Falcon's Fair. That's already noticeable. You say that it's worse than Falcon's. Ganondorf's doesn't have a sweet spot. If it hits, it will hit. As for Falcon, it varies. The reason why I see it as superior is because you can already imagine what to do after it hits. As for Falcon's, you are forced to make more decisions, which can lead to a mistake. You just can't depend on it as much as Ganon's Fair.

Falcon's Usmash > Ganon's Usmash.

If it's a match up with Falcon against Ganon, I find that Falcon has more chances of going up against him.

One moment I think he's an opponent, the next moment he turns out to be a Falcon supporter.

I love Falcon, and will almost always be using him in gameplay. But I already have experienced why he's a challenge to play. It's quite frustrating to have a hard time against a Jigglypuff.

 

[Ayato]

Jiggly was a tough match in the previous game too.. I found that Jiggly is one of the characters that uses the least advanced techs and, like Marth, plays so much like his Melee counterpart that Melee players can come in and still play extremely well. It's ridiculous.

And right now I perform a lot better with Ganon than I do Falcon. The only difficulty I find with Ganon is that he can't chase his opponents down after hitting them because he hits out of his run range.

Falcon should be able to outplay Ganon easily though as a matter of styles. Ike isn't SO much of a problem for Falcon either because of his general lag, so as a matter of playstyles, I'd actually say that Falcon has the upper hand in an Ike vs Falcon match. Ike is the one that needs to be on defense in that match, not Falcon. One mistake from Ike and combos ahoy. Moreover, Ike is tall, so that makes hitting crap easier for Falcon.

Olimar is the worst for me so far. He's ridiculous. You can't approach him when he's beneath a platform, it's impossible.

 

[Runeblade279]

Jiggly was a tough match in the previous game too.. I found that Jiggly is one of the characters that uses the least advanced techs and, like Marth, plays so much like his Melee counterpart that Melee players can come in and still play extremely well. It's ridiculous.

And right now I perform a lot better with Ganon than I do Falcon. The only difficulty I find with Ganon is that he can't chase his opponents down after hitting them because he hits out of his run range.

Falcon should be able to outplay Ganon easily though as a matter of styles. Ike isn't SO much of a problem for Falcon either because of his general lag, so as a matter of playstyles, I'd actually say that Falcon has the upper hand in an Ike vs Falcon match. Ike is the one that needs to be on defense in that match, not Falcon. One mistake from Ike and combos ahoy. Moreover, Ike is tall, so that makes hitting crap easier for Falcon.

Olimar is the worst for me so far. He's ridiculous. You can't approach him when he's beneath a platform, it's impossible.

The new Ganon is fun indeed, I like playing him as well, but I've put so much more time into training as Falcon. They play more differently in Brawl than Melee, but still some similarities. As for chasing with Ganon, his dash attack is good at low-mid percentages, at higher percentages, just hit them with a kill move, Ganon has tons.

And yes, I hate olimar too. =(

 

[Andromeda]

Just because characters are nerfed since Melee, it doesn't mean they're terrible.

 

[Mann]

Just because characters are nerfed since Melee, it doesn't mean they're terrible.

Your boat left days ago.

 

[KeyKid19]

Because of his power.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rivRtJ16RMU Even though the Wolf player wasn't that great, you can see that Ganon has more reach than Falcon does. Like his jab.

His forward B, which used to be Gerudo Smash or something, keeps them close range so you can decide what to do with them, as opposed to Falcon's knock back. Not only that, it can be used as a recovery more than Falcon's can, as it can grab even though the person is shielding.

Ganondorf's Fair is superior to Falcon's Fair. That's already noticeable. You say that it's worse than Falcon's. Ganondorf's doesn't have a sweet spot. If it hits, it will hit. As for Falcon, it varies.

That Ganondorf is very good I'll give you that. But the Wolf is not. I know that's not everything but many of Ganondorf's best moments in the video were just a result of the Wolf player seemingly not knowing how to fight a Ganondorf at all. The B-Over double suicide near the beginning was just ridiculously stupid on Wolf's part and if he had not been up a stock already it would've been stupid on Ganondorf's part as well. Also if Ganondorf is down a stock you can essentially gimp him out of his SideB recovery because you can just jump in front of it and have him kill himself. So the move is really not that beneficial because it's a double-edged sword.

I never said Ganondorf lost in the reach department. He certainly has a slight advantage there. But overall it doesn't matter because he's so much more punishable. Especially his Fair which is easily avoided and even more easily punished. Falcon's is like that as well but to a much less degree. It is signifcantly faster on both the starting end and finishing end so therefore more useful. The gimp is not as bad as people make it out to be. Sure it won't kill but you at least don't get punished when it happens. Falcon Fair upside > Ganondorf Fair. Falcon Fair downside barely < Ganondorf's Fair because it's still faster and less punishable (though not even close in strength).

 

[KeyKid19]

Jiggly was a tough match in the previous game too.. I found that Jiggly is one of the characters that uses the least advanced techs and, like Marth, plays so much like his Melee counterpart that Melee players can come in and still play extremely well. It's ridiculous.

And right now I perform a lot better with Ganon than I do Falcon. The only difficulty I find with Ganon is that he can't chase his opponents down after hitting them because he hits out of his run range.

Falcon should be able to outplay Ganon easily though as a matter of styles. Ike isn't SO much of a problem for Falcon either because of his general lag, so as a matter of playstyles, I'd actually say that Falcon has the upper hand in an Ike vs Falcon match. Ike is the one that needs to be on defense in that match, not Falcon. One mistake from Ike and combos ahoy. Moreover, Ike is tall, so that makes hitting crap easier for Falcon.

Olimar is the worst for me so far. He's ridiculous. You can't approach him when he's beneath a platform, it's impossible.

Yeah I agree with all of this (except I'm not better with Ganondorf like you are lol). Ike isn't as bad for Falcon as people say and Olimar is as bad or worse for Falcon than people say. lol

 

[TheKingofBrawl]

I've ko'ed at least 80 stocks with falcon punch. 100 with the double uair dair combo. I'll play you as CF and beat any of your characters.

 

[goodoldganon]

I agree that he isn't as dominant as he was in Melee, but Falcon is far from the games worst character. His knee is no longer as spammable let alone as good of an approach but he still has options. He still has things going for him, but people are looking in all the wrong places.

 

[cwjalex]

I'm not even going to explain why falcon is a bad character because I think it is obvious and feel others have already done a better job than I ever could in that department. Play anyone remotely good and I am confident you will see the frustration of trying to win games with falcon.

The problem is "good" remains an extremely subjective term. When I say "good" I am referring to people who could enter a major tournament and compete at a degree in which they did NOT get 3-4 stocked every match.

Despite most people thinking they fall into this category, it only consists of maybe 500-1000 players in the USA (top 10-20 in each state and I feel I am being generous with that number). Unfortunately, the vast majority of people feel they themselves are "fairly" good and that anyone who puts up a decent fight or beats them must also be good. Although this is stating common sense, it is important to realize that most players are NOT good, they are average. It is logically impossible to not agree that most players are average.

Unless you purposely seek out good players, chances are you will only play average, mediocre people. Against these players it is very possible to utilize falcon to make him appear to be an effective character. However, beating the majority of players I encounter with Mewtwo in Melee does NOT make Mewtwo a good character.

There are plenty of amazing brawl players on these forums, however if you just try playing random users the odds of you finding a good player are slim.

When people say falcon is awful, they are most likely speaking in terms of a 1on1 match, no items, on a neutral stage. On a competitive level, under these circumstances, can captain falcon perform at a level comparable to most other characters in the game? No, he cannot. He went from being one of the top characters in Melee to being Mid-Tier at BEST in Brawl. (with our current knowledge of falcon and brawl of course)

What people need to realize is that although it is possible to be good with bad characters, it requires a lot of mindgames that, if put to use on better characters, would yield much better game results and tournament placings.

 

[.kR0]

When people say falcon is awful, they are most likely speaking in terms of a 1on1 match, no items, on a neutral stage. On a competitive level, under these circumstances, can captain falcon perform at a level comparable to most other characters in the game? No, he cannot. He went from being one of the top characters in Melee to being Mid-Tier at BEST in Brawl. (with our current knowledge of falcon and brawl of course)

What people need to realize is that although it is possible to be good with bad characters, it requires a lot of mindgames that, if put to use on better characters, would yield much better game results and tournament placings.

^
True.
Only a tard wouldn't be able to see what Falcon's limitations are in Brawl.

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

As much as I hate to agree with you two, a lot of us here know that Falcon has a harder time against other characters in Brawl. However, despite the disadvantage you state he has, I believe it's pretty much the same with other characters. Every other character seems to be weak against another, or has some kind of flaw to balance him/her out. My friend's Pikmin & Olimar give my Falcon a hard time, but once I switch to someone with good range or explosives like Charizard, Ike, or Snake, it seems that I have the upperhand.

I just think that, like other people said, since we're so used to Captain Falcon's amazing powers back in Melee, it's harder for us to accept that he still is any good. Maybe you won't agree with me, but once you train with Falcon enough, figure out his moves, his tactics, and develop an understanding of how to defeat your opponents.... You'll soon start taking people down. His speed allows for better mindgames than most, his weight lets you take a little more punishment, and once you hit your foes, you can hit'em hard with the right strategy.

In the eyes of the general public and casual players, Falcon may not seem as good, but because he gets way stronger, in my opinion, as you learn him more, I think he has great potential for more competitive players.

That is what I think of Falcon so far. Does it make any sense? lol

EDIT : Forgot to mention that Falcon's spot-dodge is uber sexy! By utilizing it, you further increase his capacity for uber pwnage. =P

 

[.kR0]

Yeah, I know what you mean. Reaver197 plays Falcon with me a lot and he's a solid Falcon player.

He has a chance when I use Ike but if I switch to any of the characters, like Lucas, ZSS, or Falco, he usually has no chance (especially Falco).

I still think Capt. Falcon would be a solid 2vs2 character. Or at least I hope he would.

 

[RPK]

His knee is harder to land and thus they took away his aerial finisher which pisses me off...There were so many times it was like ITS OVER SON!?! but yeah...soft knee...Such BS...
Ganon>Falcon for the fact that Ganon has more kill options then Falcon...