to the best of my understanding, the strong hitbox on Falco's dair is the same in PAL and it's just that the weak one doesn't spike anymore. confirm/deny?
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Q&A Falco Q&A
- Thread starter Mogwai
- Start date
Fortress | Sveet
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Confirm .
Orko
Smash Apprentice
So I did that thing.
Where instead of playing Smash I played League of Legends.
And now i'm even worse than before.
Also, ****.
Where instead of playing Smash I played League of Legends.
And now i'm even worse than before.
Also, ****.
True. First half of the attack's frames is the strong one that spikes, and second half of the animation is a weak version that sends them slightly up. If I am not wrong, the second half also does less damage. Don't know exactly if it's less damage then in NTSC.
Anyway, it's just a little harder to combo. I Just have to focus on hitting them with the first few frames, obviously. If you hit them with the weak hitbox it basically ends your combo and saves your oppponent. But my question about Marth still stands: he's lighter in PAL, so he's flying more upwards / it's easier to DI. It's a lot harder to combo a lvl 7 Marth. Any tips on that? Aside from that, pillaring Fox, Falco and C. Falcon is still do-able in PAL, of course
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X to B or Y to B is a better way in my book. Thumb speed inside the X,Y,A and B button region translates better into things like shuffling, multishining, SHL, etc. Basically anything that involves jumping. If you can shine oos without leaving the ground using X or Y to jump, then you're probably fast enough.
Maybe, using the c-stick to buffer shine oos could be considered if you use claw grip or don't mind using more than one finger to shine oos.
I understand that the ability to buffer a shine oos is very useful. However for most people is very unpractical. If you have the time and dedication, then by all means continue your journey on learning how to buffer shine oos.
I would advice creating some kind of routine to learn it, that way you will save time and build strong muscle memory without acquiring any kind of bad form or habit. Maybe something like drilling it a bit slowly then fast, maybe when you woke up and when you go to bed, no more than an hour for a day.
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Basically what Oskurito said.
Falco has 5 frames of jumpsquat and is airborne on the 6th, meaning that in order to effectively buffer a Shine OoS, you need to be able to react within that 6 frame window to seeing your character start his jump animation. 6 frames is 100 milliseconds which is a noticeable chuck outside of even incredibly fast human reaction times, so even with buffering the jump, your shine timing has to be just as precise to get the fastest shine OoS possible.
Falco has 5 frames of jumpsquat and is airborne on the 6th, meaning that in order to effectively buffer a Shine OoS, you need to be able to react within that 6 frame window to seeing your character start his jump animation. 6 frames is 100 milliseconds which is a noticeable chuck outside of even incredibly fast human reaction times, so even with buffering the jump, your shine timing has to be just as precise to get the fastest shine OoS possible.
Pwii
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Mar 13, 2014
- Messages
- 105
So i can buffer the jump while in shieldstun, but not shine.
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Yes, you'll have to do something like hold down on the control stick, up on the c-stick asa you get hit and spam B.
Learning the timing to shine oss very fast is more important imo.
You can practice that using the 20XX hack pack. In 20XX melee you can make a spacie pressure your shield with nair/dair shine, or make a character repeat X move forever, and you can practice that way.
as far as I know, that is always your best bet for a follow up.
Spluvin
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2014
- Messages
- 30
When I watch pro matches they do not always do that. Matbe they're just reading needlessly
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Alexander Duprey
Smash Cadet
I've noticed that mango WD down in place and then quickly (very quickly) reacts to DI and chooses where to go from there, usually extending the pillar or going for a DI mix up and ending the combo early. That's on stages with platforms tho, On FD I see him WD forward more, I assume because your opponent is way less likely to escape your combo when trying to DI behind falco on FD. And even if that did happen you can adjust and start WD back out of shine
well, there are a lot of things at play here. like, you might not know whether the shine's going to hit and follow with sh aerial anticipating shield pressure, or you might hit very close to their center point and not know which direction to WD in immediately. but ideally you should be WDing to follow them for the most options for follow up.
Smog
Smash Journeyman
I'm a falco scrub. What can I do against someone that just shield grabs all my approaches. They only do it when I am approaching obviously with lasers or an aerial. I feel like I can read their shield like a book, I just don't know how to respond to it. Paper cuts or whatever the heck Ken calls it.
Are they shield grabbing you before your aerial, after your aerial, or after your shine?
Input your aerial right before you land so that he doesn't have enough time to shield grab. By the time you have l-cancelled your aerial, your opponent will still be in shield stun, allowing you to shine or grab. Mix up your approaches with your lasers. You don't need to go aggro all the time. Wavedash/dash back and mix up your laser game.
Smog
Smash Journeyman
They grab after my aerial. Sometimes I would laser to dash attack, sometimes I'd try laser to f-smash and they would also end up shielding.
Now that I think about it, I feel like the only time my aerials worked are when I did that and then I started pressuring his shield.
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Mprime
Smash Ace
from my experience, it is extremely easy to punish if you aren't 100% precise.
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Smog
Smash Journeyman
Against marth, can you not juggle him with u-tilt? I tried juggling a marth and he kept getting his counter off in between u-tilts. Am I just doing it too slow? Or should I pick a different follow-up after u-tilt to keep the combo going?
I honestly don't go for utilts on Marth unless it's mid combo and if it's mid combo, I'm going for Shines up until like 60% or so. When you hit a utilt on Marth around 60-80%, you should be going for full hop or double jump into dair to combo or bair to kick him off stage.
If for whatever reason you're hitting a low % utilt on Marth, I would be looking to short hop bair/dair, but again, this really doesn't come up munch in my experience, Marth is a rough one to fish for utilts against as it doesn't space well against his neutral game.
Also as a general note, if you notice a pattern of things where a Marth is just mashing counter out of, just exploit it by stopping your sequence and punishing the counter, as you can get huge damage on Marth off a free hit at the tail end of his counter.
To me, playing defensive Falco is about learning spacings where your opponents can punish lasers, staying out of them, and playing hit and run when they do manage to get up in your grill. It's about taking easy combos and using them to put distance between yourself and your opponent and then lasering a bunch. Also camping dairs on the top platform vs. characters with ****ty vertical games like Peach and Jiggs.
hmmm, I'll have to check, it's been a looooooooooong time, so I might not. Will see if I can fix that sometime this week, if I don't it'll be pretty sadbois.
alpha_leonis
Smash Cadet
if you watch the falco trials by Hell in the stickied post, they pretty much show the same thing.