Example of how ignorant people are to an alternate suggestion.

[WhiteDragon]

You're still misusing it. "Example of how ignorant people are to an alternate suggestion." - How can be showing a lack of knowledge to an alternate suggestion? By not knowing what the heck you're talking about because you're being illogical?


"Someone else said something and people rejected their ideas. They were proven right, as such, I'm probably right as well!"

Yeah, nice try. Come up with valid arguments instead.

And also, pot - kettle, much? Who's being ignorant here, bub? Who's ignoring already established facts about Tripping in favour of their illogical theory? Who here's refusing to accept that certain things have already been proven about tripping simply because it goes against their theory?

Or maybe you just don't know enough about tripping.


Say what?

Anyway, it's not alternate suggestions in general that aren't accept. It's stupidity. We've already said this (me, others), we don't care that you're a newly registered user. We don't care that what you suggest is new. We care that your suggestion is illogical and has already been proven to be false, yet you insist it isn't using nothing but "Because I say so" and Strawman's arguments and whatnot.


You act as if you're right because someone else somewhere was proven right once.


No I'm not. Still misusing the word.


All of which are illogical and based on bupkis.


Tripping is something based on opinion now? As opposed to based on fact? Wow, my opinion is that Fox's Shine doesn't spike. Must mean I'm right.


We're flaming you for being wrong and refusing to see reason despite mounds of evidence on the contrary of what you're saying.

Also, you still have not answered a question I've had to ask, what, thrice now! Have you ever seen this fabled animation where both of a characters' feet are off the ground?! Have you?!

All of your "arguments" insofar have been refuted. I don't understand why you can't see that. You make a lot of baseless assumptions based on nothing but your own opinion what you believe to be true. That's OK. We present you with evidence on why you're wrong. You ignore them and tell us we're being ignorant/insulting/bla. bla. bla. That's not OK.

Just because you're wrong and we're pointing out why you're wrong does not mean we're being ignorant, insulting your intelligence or even flaming. I have yet to outright flame you in this thread, mind you.

Just to clear things up, what is your current theory on why tripping occurs (because it seems to fluctuate a lot. Each time new evidence is presented (evidence you should be aware of had you not been so ignorant on what's already been established about tripping), your "theory" on why tripping occurs changes drastically. Whenever something you claim is proven spectacularly wrong, instead of admitting defeat, you ignore it as if you'd never said it in the first place and formulate new (and illogical) theorems.

Here's a question, Mr. Pot:
Who's the one being "ignorant" to alternate suggestions here?

You have a theory (which changes with every other post you write). We present you with evidence on why Tripping is Random. Instead of admitting that our evidence is sound (which it is), you resolutely state "No, tripping can in no way be random!" and refuse to accept even the possibility of it being random.

You're dead serious on that you're the only one who's right and that anyone who says tripping is random is wrong despite the fact that we have proof and clinical tests proving our point whilst you have nothing.

Some people just aren't worth it after a while

 

[Yuna]

LAWL, irony.

yuna for prez

I was replying to his points, which require me to repeat certain things to refute them. What he did was repeat two paragraphs almost verbatim.

Now scamper off.

 

[Taso]

While I'm aware that throwing my opinion in the thread this late(after nine pages... heh) is kinda' worthless, I'd just like to get it out anyway.

Has anyone thought, perhaps, that the OP is correct, but only partially?

Perhaps it IS random just as people in the real world randomly trip say when they hit the ground too fast with the front of a shoe as it comes down to step.

While at the same time, you trip if you try to have two feet off the ground.

I've been playing as Zelda nonstop for a few days now, and I can honestly say without a shadow of a doubt that her tripping is NOT random. It's happened far too many times. Unless her wearing heels causes her to trip more, the OP is correct to a degree.

Most of my tripping occurred after using Din's Fire and immediately attempting to run. I tripped. A lot. I think it's no coincidence that the end frames of this attack leave her with her back foot off the ground for just a second.

This explains his two feet-theory, but at the same time, I've stood completely still and tried to run in the direction I was facing and tripped. Easily had one foot on the ground. This doesn't happen often, however, so attributing it to a random generator within the game seems like the smartest thing.

And perhaps there is a third variable. And a fourth.

There may, indeed, be a huge number of factors to take in when a character trips.
This isn't the point. The point is that I've tripped with Zelda more than ten times in a three stock match against a computer on a consistent basis since I started using her. I could save a video to my Wii, but I'm a complete newbie when it comes to transcending the gap between having a video, and making it watchable by all.



I apologize if this theory has been mentioned in the past nine pages and I missed it.

 

[Damax]

While I'm aware that throwing my opinion in the thread this late(after nine pages... heh) is kinda' worthless, I'd just like to get it out anyway.

Has anyone thought, perhaps, that the OP is correct, but only partially?

Perhaps it IS random just as people in the real world randomly trip say when they hit the ground too fast with the front of a shoe as it comes down to step.

While at the same time, you trip if you try to have two feet off the ground.

I've been playing as Zelda nonstop for a few days now, and I can honestly say without a shadow of a doubt that her tripping is NOT random. It's happened far too many times. Unless her wearing heels causes her to trip more, the OP is correct to a degree.

Most of my tripping occurred after using Din's Fire and immediately attempting to run. I tripped. A lot. I think it's no coincidence that the end frames of this attack leave her with her back foot off the ground for just a second.

This explains his two feet-theory, but at the same time, I've stood completely still and tried to run in the direction I was facing and tripped. Easily had one foot on the ground. This doesn't happen often, however, so attributing it to a random generator within the game seems like the smartest thing.

And perhaps there is a third variable. And a fourth.

There may, indeed, be a huge number of factors to take in when a character trips.
This isn't the point. The point is that I've tripped with Zelda more than ten times in a three stock match against a computer on a consistent basis since I started using her. I could save a video to my Wii, but I'm a complete newbie when it comes to transcending the gap between having a video, and making it watchable by all.



I apologize if this theory has been mentioned in the past nine pages and I missed it.

actually its obvious there is more than a factor in the randomness of triping. I think it was already posted

char
whether your winning or not
blabla
blabla

I can't remember it all. Some situation might increase triping too, some things we haven't looked into, like following someone (even though that be dumb and help spammer more I guess Sakurai Could have done that) after all some moves have tripping property but still it doesn't always work.

 

[Taso]

It's more like the situation in which I tripped for a few games was exactly the same every time and I'd like to think that it's possible that this could be one reason people trip among others.

I never really doubted that there were more than a few factors to tripping, but I need to watch what I say lest I say something I can't back up in discussion.

 

[Yuna]

actually its obvious there is more than a factor in the randomness of triping. I think it was already posted

char
whether your winning or not
blabla
blabla

Obvious you say? Yet the 100's of hours people have invested into exploring tripping has revealed no such connections?

Characters do not matter. Who's winning or not does not matter either.

 

[Zankoku]

Obvious you say? Yet the 100's of hours people have invested into exploring tripping has revealed no such connections?

Characters do not matter. Who's winning or not does not matter either.

Ice matters. And Luigi's Final Smash. But I think those are the only things that affect tripping while not directly causing it. : P

 

[Yuna]

Ice matters. And Luigi's Final Smash. But I think those are the only things that affect tripping while not directly causing it. : P

When did I ever say that the surface didn't matter? In fact, I've personally stated that it matters (possibly in this very thread). And Luigi's Final Smash, I've stated that one as well (not in this thread, though).

Saying "Character (who you're playing as) and Who's Winning don't matter" does not equate "Anything else don't matter either".

 

[Taso]

I don't think they were debating what you said, simply adding to it...

 

[Ganny]

I think it all has to do with luck. Sometimes you have bad luck. I trip maybe once in a game, if not 0 times. I was playing this one guy using Dedede and for one game I trip ALOT. He also got 2 smash balls out of capsules which are supposed to be rare right? I think it all comes down to luck.

 

[Samochan]

Tripping is like missfires, peach's turnips/items and GW's nine's, only unlucky. You have to be lucky to get many of those, but you just have to be unlucky to trip many times.

 

[St. Viers]

<_< I don't own brawl, but I've played for hours each day after in came out. I've tripped once <_<

Obviously this means that black bowser has an extraordinary amount of balance <_< wait, no...it means that I jump most of the time, so I'm not dashing much.

JUST TO MAKE THIS CLEAR TO EVERYONE:

NO ONE, not even Yuna has said that there aren't things that can change th probability of tripping. Yuna (as he recently reminded us all) brought up that some things make you more prone to tripping.

That doesn't make it not random. Unless you trip EVERY time you do something, it's random. There may be a greater or lesser chance of it occuring, but so far testing seems to show that nothing causes you to trip EVERY TIME.

But this also means that there may be something that we haven't figured out yet. Maybe tripping will end up not being random, but rather something that is frame perfect. I dunno, just throwing out BS right now. The point is, until we find something that directly correlates with a trip (not "makes the likelyhood greater, because it still isn't 1:1 ratio of action to trip, or a set 1:x ratio, which would make it not random as well) it is random.

 

[SFJake]

Some people just aren't worth it after a while

That so looks like Yuna sometimes. No offense to him. Its the case for too many people as well. After a few posts in a topic, there are points where you must draw conclusion. If you can't change his thoughts in your first few posts you probably NEVER WILL.

The end is everyone is arguing for the same stupid reasons that need not arguing. In fact, it only needs to die, as in the topic should be closed or disappear because no one is posting anymore.

 

[Black/Light]

I thought tripping was the result of someone doing something odd or trying to do some AT at first. . .anthan I got the game.

With in seconds I trpped just by walking in training mode. I tripped well running in SSE. Both me and the comp tripped with our FIRST STEP in a fight. . .at the SAME TIME.

Im not a button masher and like to simply play around some times. . . when I got Sonic the first thing I did was run on the Zelda stage with him and, without doing jack but holding the Joy-Stick to the side, I tripped more than once.

I tried to avoid tripping by jumping alot, thinking that walking too much caused it. . . tripped when I landed or walked even after acting like a **** hopping rabbit.

Thats all I need, it's random atleast to me.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Tripping is entirely random.
Case in point.

I tripped with sonic five times in a row.
got up then tripped. Got up then tripped. Wasn't fun

next ten matches no tripping.
next match as soon as I moved, i tripped. It is random.
The only way to avoid it is to jump around a lot and even then it isn't necessarily guaranteed you won't trip since it can happen anytime for no reason.
Its stupid, its useless, and its ruined several kills for me as Sonic.

 

[Taso]

Tripping is entirely random.
Case in point.

I tripped with sonic five times in a row.
got up then tripped. Got up then tripped. Wasn't fun

next ten matches no tripping.
next match as soon as I moved, i tripped. It is random.
The only way to avoid it is to jump around a lot and even then it isn't necessarily guaranteed you won't trip since it can happen anytime for no reason.
Its stupid, its useless, and its ruined several kills for me as Sonic.

Here's the problem with that entire theory, if something's random, it has to have some kind of statistic.

Say, 1/100 steps makes you trip. If that's THE ONLY factor to tripping in any given random situation which excludes ice or luigi's final smash, then the concept of you tripping five times in a row would be a 1/100^5 power. That's....... so..... unbelievably rare.
It was just a number I was throwing out, but if there are NO other factors, then the results of what's happened with Brawl players around the world have been very inconsistent.

My point is that if there's only one factor, then tripping would be a lot more consistent around the world. If you performed a real, scientific experiment over, say 100 games, where they did the same generic actions, the average results should be fairly similar.
They wouldn't be. I can guarantee that.

This would imply that there are several factors. Possibly how fast your character is, possibly how much percentage you've taken, what kinda' moves you're using.
We don't know.

But I can safely say it's not just a random event.

 

[Medori Red]

Wow, this is the longest thread of bull**** I have ever read. I had so many things I wanted to say while reading this...but someone at some point always ended up saying it eventually. Well, I got only one question left then, why exactly is everyone still coming in here and arguing about nothing? Also, Yuna, do you have nothing more important but to yell about this thread? I mean seriously, days? I would've stopped caring after an hour at most. Though I must admit that there was some funny posts in here. I'm most likely never coming back to this BS again after my post. I just hope everyone will just go do something productive, discover something important to one of your favorite characters....that would be better than arguing about something as uninteresting as tripping, which isn't that big a deal once you realize you can almost instantly recover from it during your invincibility frames.

 

[ph00tbag]

Say, 1/100 steps makes you trip. If that's THE ONLY factor to tripping in any given random situation which excludes ice or luigi's final smash, then the concept of you tripping five times in a row would be a 1/100^5 power.

No. No it wouldn't. Study probability. The first occurrence does not affect the probability of the second occurrence. The probability of each occurrence is roughly 0.01 every time. This is invariable. He just happened to get very unlucky 5 times in a row.

Now, I've said this before, but the people who suggest it's not random are right. Since SSBB is a computer program, computer engineers will appreciate that any aspect of the game cannot be random. However, tests have been performed to show that the same exact input from the user will result in tripping about one out of 100 times, and when competitive players speak of randomness, this is what they mean: and event whose occurrence is determined entirely by a convoluted algorithm over which the player has no control.

Get it through your skull.

 

[Taymond]

My point is that if there's only one factor, then tripping would be a lot more consistent around the world. If you performed a real, scientific experiment over, say 100 games, where they did the same generic actions, the average results should be fairly similar.
They wouldn't be. I can guarantee that.

This would imply that there are several factors. Possibly how fast your character is, possibly how much percentage you've taken, what kinda' moves you're using.
We don't know.

But I can safely say it's not just a random event.

The problem is, you can't safely say it's not just a random event. Even if there are several factors that affect whether or not you trip, that doesn't magically make the event predictable. An increased or decreased chance of tripping based on a certain action is still a chance of tripping. There is NO action you can perform that will trip 100% of the time.

It doesn't matter if the probability of tripping changes based on certain circumstances, it's still random, because you still can't predict whether or not you trip. You still have a chance of tripping and a chance of not tripping, all that's changed is what those chances are.

Secondly, such testing has been done, and they HAVE been fairly similar, whether or not you want to believe that.

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=140600&highlight=hitaku&page=20
Refer to post #293 for directions to which pages contain which tests.
Testing showed that character choice doesn't appear to impact tripping, nor does 300% damage affect tripping from movement. Higher damage, however, did increase the likelihood of being tripped by a move that can trip.

Tripping on a normal surface tended towards a 1% chance, tripping on ice tended towards something in the neighborhood of 3%.

Where are your guarantees now?