Enter The Darkness: Dark Samus Support Thread

[Ridley_Prime]

I'm alll-for Dark Samus as a character, but there is a problem. She's almost certainly not going to be relevant to new releases in the future. (Hint to the uninformed: DKCR sold better than the entire Prime trilogy combined. There will be no MP4 for a long time.)

Compare instead Fusion Suit Samus, a lighter, faster Samus with Ice Missles. This "character" will certainly be more relevant in the years to come as the series decides to contine the plot beyond Metroid Fusion's ending. I'm not arguing that Dark Samus would be a less unique character, she certainly wouldn't and that's also part of the problem. As much as people complain about clones, they take significantly less development resources to build than new characters/half-clones/etc.

Damn, I knew DKCR sold more than the Prime games, but not by that much. Yeah, Dark Samus hardly has like a future then.

For an additional ice themed character though, I would prefer Rundas over Fusion Samus with ice and/or diffusion missiles. As for there being a post-Fusion title, that's a really big "if" at this point if you ask me, and I've been wanting that to happen the longest since before the Prime trilogy was finished...

 

[ChozoBoy]

Rundas has even greater issues with relevancy and dev problems than DS, though. DS could at least use Samus's bones and rig to animate from since they have equal proportions. She even has some animation advantages, being a floating character like Mewtwo who doesn't need a run cycle.

Fusion Suit Samus, however, can't get ignored for much longer by Sakamoto's team because it's been over a decade since the plot has been advanced timeline-wise. FSS would also have a Wolf-like special, in that there is an extra attack that occurs just in front of the Charge Beam in Fusion. I also like the unique beam sfx in that game. She may not have Grapple Beam, so perhaps she could be given some additional stat advantages.

 

[Maffewt]

Weird that this is the top character post when I come on, the last few days I've been considering this. Much as I love and want Ridley, everyone talking about him as if he's a given is pretty dumb. He has a lot against him.

Since Brawl's release, DS has been bumped from a one shot metroid villain to a two-game main villain appearance, and thereby a recurring main villain and I guess the main villain of the prime trilogy, the most famous iteration of modern samus. I don't think any of the other 'dark' versions of the main heroes can compare to that; even dark pit was a secondary character in one game.

Though DS has plenty of awesome, original move potential, no one's pointed out that potentially being a semi-clone works in her favour. Compared to ridley, who Sakurai's acknowledged would require their "best efforts" to maybe work, having an altered version of an existing character would be a cinch.

Plus, she'd be more unique amongst the villains (though admittedly not the cast as a whole). A girl for starters, plus much more immediately sci fi than ridley, who alongside k rool and bowser in particular would just be another big, slow reptilian thing. Plus the eerie sci fi style of DS is more in keeping with Metroid's tone.

And a massive part of Samus' thing, more so than Mario/Link/Kirby/Pokemon with their buttloads of team work emphasis, Metroid is about Samus on her own. Prior to Other M she was pretty much the only character, and so having her enemy be herself, essentially, is in keeping with all that jazz.

tl;dr want ridley more, think Dark Samus will make the cut first. add me to supporters pls.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Rundas has even greater issues with relevancy and dev problems than DS, though. DS could at least use Samus's bones and rig to animate from since they have equal proportions. She even has some animation advantages, being a floating character like Mewtwo who doesn't need a run cycle.

Fusion Suit Samus, however, can't get ignored for much longer by Sakamoto's team because it's been over a decade since the plot has been advanced timeline-wise. FSS would also have a Wolf-like special, in that there is an extra attack that occurs just in front of the Charge Beam in Fusion. I also like the unique beam sfx in that game. She may not have Grapple Beam, so perhaps she could be given some additional stat advantages.

With Fusion being my favorite of the sidescrollers besides Super (though I replayed Fusion more), I have to agree. I think it made the best use of the whole stackable beam system and such, and I love the idea of that Wolf-like attack, as he was one of my secondaries in Brawl. With how low a priority a Fusion sequel seems to have been though, and knowing my luck, I still wouldn't be surprised if a game that takes place after Prime 3 and before Metroid II happened first, that involves what looked like Sylux's ship in Prime 3's 100% ending, and it wouldn't have to be a Prime 4 necessarily; could be something else, like a spinoff sequel of sorts. Again though, I'd want a Metroid V long before that, but I can see the former happening first for some reason. Well that and I can (sadly) see Sakamoto taking a long hiatus from his involvement in the series after the amount of criticism he got from Other M.

As for Rundas, don't know about him having more of a relevancy problem than Dark Samus, as they both met their end in the same game, but point taken on him having more of a dev problem than her. I figured he wasn't anymore likely than her, though in theory he'd be one of the coolest to have as an ice-based character and out of any of the other hunters from Prime 3 and MPH (no pun intended).

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Weird that this is the top character post when I come on, the last few days I've been considering this. Much as I love and want Ridley, everyone talking about him as if he's a given is pretty dumb. He has a lot against him.

While Ridley has some things against him like not having the kind of popularity in Japan that he does in the West (which comes with the territory when it comes to Metroid), to say he has a whole lot against him would be a bit of an exaggeration IMO.

Plus, she'd be more unique amongst the villains (though admittedly not the cast as a whole). A girl for starters, plus much more immediately sci fi than ridley, who alongside k rool and bowser in particular would just be another big, slow reptilian thing. Plus the eerie sci fi style of DS is more in keeping with Metroid's tone.

Being more unique is definitely debatable, especially given what Sakurai said about Dark Samus in her Brawl trophy description. Ridley would prolly be slow while on the the ground admittedly, but his aerial game would be a different story, and with how floaty Dark Samus came off during her boss fights, I wouldn't be at all surprised if she had the same speed and floatiness problem that Mewtwo had in Melee, making her an even lower tier character competitively than "another big slow reptilian thing".

edit: It's possible for Ridley to be Mewtwo-esque in that regard too, but even more likely for DS.

More or less agree with everything else you said though.

 

[Maffewt]

While Ridley has some things against him like not having the kind of popularity in Japan that he does in the West (which comes with the territory when it comes to Metroid), to say he has a whole lot against him would be a bit of an exaggeration IMO.

yeah you're right brah, a lot is a bit of an exaggeration... But yeno what I mean, aye? Very few people seem to be acknowledging that he isn't a shoe-in, which I think will result in much butthurt. I just don't wanna see all those disappoints.

Being more unique is definitely debatable, especially given what Sakurai said about Dark Samus in her Brawl trophy description. Ridley would prolly be slow while on the the ground admittedly, but his aerial game would be a different story, and with how floaty Dark Samus came off during her boss fights, I wouldn't be at all surprised if she had the same speed and floatiness problem that Mewtwo had in Melee, making her an even lower tier character competitively than "another big slow reptilian thing".

edit: It's possible for Ridley to be Mewtwo-esque in that regard too, but even more likely for DS.

More or less agree with everything else you said though.

Yeah, that trophy's a problem... but trophy's aren't major, I don't know for sure but I doubt those things were written by Sakurai personally, or even are a reflection of his opinion on the character.
even so, it compliments the whole semi-clone thing being an advantage bit.
I do think Ridley would be more unique to play as; DS' advantage is more in terms of style and comparison with other villains.

and yeah, the mewtwo problem could be the case... but I think DS would probs be a lot faster than him, when she dashes she moves so quick you can barely see her.

 

[ChozoBoy]

I really don't think that Mewtwo's tier buisiness will factor into DS's chances at all. Even if she played exactly like him, tiers only apply to a fraction of the top percentage of players... and even then, only in 1v1-no-items-and-approved-stages-only matches between said competitive players. Tiers for your average Smash player, even with tourney rules, are different from the tiers for top players. This is most evident by watching how tiers evolve as players learn the nuances of the characters.

Regarding a DS appearance, the Corruption version of her is more recent but the Echoes design is way cooler. I'd imagine she might have her scattershot beam in a Lucario-style Final Smash.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

yeah you're right brah, a lot is a bit of an exaggeration... But yeno what I mean, aye? Very few people seem to be acknowledging that he isn't a shoe-in, which I think will result in much butthurt. I just don't wanna see all those disappoints.


Yeah, that trophy's a problem... but trophy's aren't major, I don't know for sure but I doubt those things were written by Sakurai personally, or even are a reflection of his opinion on the character.
even so, it compliments the whole semi-clone thing being an advantage bit.
I do think Ridley would be more unique to play as; DS' advantage is more in terms of style and comparison with other villains.

and yeah, the mewtwo problem could be the case... but I think DS would probs be a lot faster than him, when she dashes she moves so quick you can barely see her.

Yeah, I know what ya mean. I don't see Ridley as a shoe-in either. Closest thing to that is probably Mewtwo due to his popularity and demand in both the East and West and having that new form, among other things.

Yeah, ya could be right too.

I hope that'd be the case with Dark Samus's dashing then. It's just that in all of her boss battles, while on the ground, she would always levitate slightly above it like Melee Mewtwo or something, while only using her feet to walk occasionally in the cutscenes if I recall correctly.

I really don't think that Mewtwo's tier buisiness will factor into DS's chances at all. Even if she played exactly like him, tiers only apply to a fraction of the top percentage of players... and even then, only in 1v1-no-items-and-approved-stages-only matches between said competitive players. Tiers for your average Smash player, even with tourney rules, are different from the tiers for top players. This is most evident by watching how tiers evolve as players learn the nuances of the characters.

Regarding a DS appearance, the Corruption version of her is more recent but the Echoes design is way cooler. I'd imagine she might have her scattershot beam in a Lucario-style Final Smash.

I mostly brought up the Mewtwo floatiness comparison to DS as a jab in response to the slow reptilian comment about Ridley, not to say it would be a factor in decreasing DS's chances or anything. And I know that competitive Smash mainly revolves around what you described. However, SSBM Mewtwo's weaknesses made him a rather unpopular choice compared to most others even amongst the casual crowd that plays with 3 to 4 players and items on, and even as a huge Mewtwo lover I felt like I was punishing myself by playing as him most of the time, regardless of how many people or items I was playing with, and I'm not even a tourney player or major wavedasher.

Anyway, I agree that DS's Echoes design is better. I actually like her transparent appearance at the end of the game the best, but with how grotesque it kinda looks in a way, I doubt they'd actually use that as a skin. And I think the Phazon scattershot thing should be a special of hers rather than a final smash, while the final smash would involve dropping a Leviathan on the hapless opponents or something.

 

[ChozoBoy]

Haha... That sound's kind of hard to dodge! How about Phazon tendrils that grow out of the ground to grab the players as she attacks with her death angel form from Corruption that killed the other characters. Something that actually corrupts players with growing Phazon would be cool.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Aren't most final smashes hard to dodge? And it would depend on how big they were to make the Leviathan I guess. Do like your idea a little more though now that you mentioned it.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

I'm sorry to all of the DS supporters out there! I became very busy and couldn't find time to keep of this thread. However, thank you everyone for keeping it alive by posting in it, offering ideas, and generally supporting DS.

I'll try to be more active and, in time, update the front post.

 

[Arteen]

I'm surprised there's not more activity in this thread. Dark Samus is my top choice for a second Metroid character. What better character to represent the Metroid games (and the Prime trilogy in particular) than the Metroid Prime itself?

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Well I'd be glad for the Prime series to get a little respect. The Japanese seems to think Prime is as nonexistant of the Highlander sequels.

 

[Knight Dude]

Well I'd be glad for the Prime series to get a little respect. The Japanese seems to think Prime is as nonexistant of the Highlander sequels.

Which is a real shame since their really, really good games. I actually prefer them to the 2-d Metroid games. But that's just me. I'm not really sure why the Metroid series isn't as big in Japan. I guess that it's just has such a western influence to it. Dark Samus would be a really cool character to add if handled properly. I can see Dark Samus as a last minute choice for any kind of Smash Bros. roster. Animation wise she'd be easy to pull off with having as similar skeleton model than Samus. Just as long as the moveset is different and good. Granted I wouldn't want the Dark Samus as much as Ridley. But she'd be my choice for another Metroid character after Ridley. Heck I'd be ecstatic if somehow both of them made it through.

 

[jaytalks]

Dark Samus's inclusion would be great as long as she is called Metroid Prime. She's a great choice for a villain character, would include the series' namesake, and would not be that hard to make. Metroid Prime has the same amount of appearances as a villain as Ganondorf, who appears as Ganondorf only in three Zelda games (OoT, TP, and WW). Metroid Prime would representing all the metroids in the series.

 

[CardiganBoy]

I fully support Dark Samus to be in SSB4, it/she has a great potential to be a very original character, and can fit very well i Smash Bros, also, Metroid needs more love.

 

[Z1GMA]

I support !

 

[Zigzagar]

Dark Samus nice! I really hope Metroid Prime 3 will be represented! I thought of a good moveset:


Standard B Freeze Zapper: Dark Samus charges her blaster, An ice cube will get bigger and bigger and when you release it will form more in a sphere shape and zaps the opponent on impact.

Side B Phazon Wheel: Dark Samus goes into her morph ball dashing at the opponent with powerful zaps.

Up B Blizzard Tornado: Dark Samus holds her cannon downward and big ice particles come out of the cannon with high power freezing the opponent.

Down B Phazon Shield: Dark Samus causes a blue transparent barrier in front of her.

Final Smash Freezing Thunder: Dark Samus holds out her cannon charging until fully charged and releases blue electric waves freezing the opponents on contact.

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

I support Dark Samus as a close second most wanted character, just a little bit below Ridley. her displayed combat in Prime 2 and 3 show that she can be an incredibly unique non-clone character with strengths and weaknesses in her own rights.

if either Ridley or Dark Samus get put in, I will be perfectly content. if both get in, Sakurai will be able to hear my squealing from Sora headquarters.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Am hoping I'm wrong, but I'm not really expecting Prime 3 to get much content to the extent of a stage or anything like Other M. Japanese-made games tend to get more attention by Nintendo/NoJ than American-made ones, even though in this case Prime 3 was more successful than Other M. Prime 2 didn't get something to the extent of a stage in Brawl, and the first Prime was probably lucky to even get a stage based on an area at the beginning of the game, at that. If Prime 3's lucky it'll get the P.E.D. suit as an alternate palette or something. Would be pretty cool actually... While the rest of the Metroid stuff introduced will be Other M content (whether Ridley's a character or not), aside from trophies.

And man, where did ChozoBoy go not too long after E3? Kinda miss seeing him here now, upon seeing this page again.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Dark Samus has my support.

Unlike the typical "dark counterpart" Dark Samus is quite unique. I'd be happy if she (err...is Dark Samus genderless or female?) and Ridley were able to make it into the game. And I hope her theme would be a song in one stage as well. Any character that has his/her own theme should have their theme song with them if they get into Smash.

 

[Knight Dude]

Well, its been a while since someone posted in this thread. But I wanted to ask if anyone had moveset ideas for Dark Samus. I can see her using a rapid fire Phazon gun instead using the Charge Beam. Maybe use the Boost Ball along with the Morph Ball Bombs. And replace the Screwattack with that attack where Dark Samus covered herself in a field of Phazon, then she jumps into the air and crashes down.

Not sure if she would keep the missiles though. I guess it's possible.

 

[Cpt.]

Awesome thread, Awesome pallets. Awesome moveset!

Add me as a supporter!

I believe that Dark Samus isn't the first logical choice for a new Metroid rep, but I sure think that it is a good choice.

 

[Graydient]

Dark Samus is on one hand the most realistic candidate to represent Metroid alongside Samus, but on the other hand a very unlikely candidate due to clone perceptions and also not a creation of a game developed domestically in Japan.

A lot of people are unaware that Dark Samus is Metroid Prime donning the Phazon Suit, in other words making the entire trilogy centered around her as the main antagonist. While Metroid Prime may not have fared very well in Japan, the trilogy is critically acclaimed and well-received outside of Japan. Considering the split between the Metroid main series and Prime trilogy, on top of how polarizing Other M was, Dark Samus would be the best way to give proper representation to the entire series.

I would love to see Dark Samus as an addition. But to be honest, I'm not very confident about her chances..

 

[Guybrush20X6]

With Little Mac's inclusion maybe western intrests are been taken into account a bit more this time for Smash. I wonder if Dark Samus will get some action.

 

[Arteen]

I'd love to see Dark Samus on the roster, but even an assist trophy appearance would be nice.

 

[CardiganBoy]

I hope Sakurai put more attetion on the Pime sub-series this time around, that could give Dark Samus more chances.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Dark Samus fans, we put up one hell of a fight. We saw our dedication to the bitter end and now we just have to enjoy what we have. Don't cry our else Dark Samus will absorb you into her being. Dark Samus hates crying.

However, we do have Dark Samus as an Assist Trophy and, to me, that means a lot. At least she's in the game.

Thank you for your support and may you always embrace the phazon.

 

[CardiganBoy]

What is horrible is that Metroid could be doomed to just Samus again, first Ridley, then Dark Samus?! my 2 most wanted killed in one shot.

I just really want some justice for Metroid.

 

[Arteen]

I can't complain. Dark Samus is a pretty awesome-looking assist trophy!

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Well Metroid technically got two character slots and the Prime Sub-Series isn't forgotten.

 

[Kalamadea]

Rundas has even greater issues with relevancy and dev problems than DS, though. DS could at least use Samus's bones and rig to animate from since they have equal proportions. She even has some animation advantages, being a floating character like Mewtwo who doesn't need a run cycle.

Fusion Suit Samus, however, can't get ignored for much longer by Sakamoto's team because it's been over a decade since the plot has been advanced timeline-wise. FSS would also have a Wolf-like special, in that there is an extra attack that occurs just in front of the Charge Beam in Fusion. I also like the unique beam sfx in that game. She may not have Grapple Beam, so perhaps she could be given some additional stat advantages.

That's likely because the lore says Samus retires shortly after Fusion. We probably won't see a Metroid 5 where Samus is the main protagonist because of that.

Anyway, I'm severely disappointed by DS being reduced to Assist Trophy status. I wouldn't be satisfied with anything less than a playable Dark Samus character. Who knows, maybe we'll see some awesome Dark Samus mods for Sm4sh like we did for Brawl.

 

[Sonicguy726]

That's likely because the lore says Samus retires shortly after Fusion. We probably won't see a Metroid 5 where Samus is the main protagonist because of that.

Anyway, I'm severely disappointed by DS being reduced to Assist Trophy status. I wouldn't be satisfied with anything less than a playable Dark Samus character. Who knows, maybe we'll see some awesome Dark Samus mods for Sm4sh like we did for Brawl.

Hey lets just be happy she got in in some form and they didn't completely ignore the prime series

 

[Arteen]

Dark Samus is now up on the website in the assist trophy section.

Dark Samus
An energy-based life-form that bears a striking resemblence to Samus. Dark Samus will fire high-speed and homing missiles at opponents and, if approached, will use strong attacks to launch enemies.

While I would've liked to see her as a fighter, I'm still quite happy to see her promoted to assist trophy status. She looks so awesome.

 

[Altais]

Though it is a shame Dark Samus won't be playable, it looks like we got second best: an alternate costume. I must say, the recolour looks absolutely awesome.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The alt is something, right? Shame that she isn't playable, even if Ridley would be in before her. Here's hoping for smash 5!

 

[Da Black Rabbit]

I give my condolences as a Metroid fan. I think Dark Samus would of made for a unique "clone" and given Metroid another rep it needs/deserves.

Now all hope is in Ridely.. -_-