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Engage the Enemy - Match Up Voting

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Neo Zero

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First off, reposting this

So the game is out. Yay.

But the match up thread isn't open yet? What gives Ne--Shu, why is that? The answer is simple my fine party members, @Hokoriand I have decided how we're going to rock MU discussion.

The main thread will remain locked, and will be a general haven for cataloguing all MU discussion. You might be asking, how am I supposed to discuss a MU in a locked thread? The answer is, you're not. Instead, every 2 weeks (may be shortened or increased depending) we'll be creating 3 MU threads, to discuss Shulk's MU vs the character the thread corresponds to. This first week though, we encourage you to practice, learn the character, and during your online and tournament exploits, to post here which 3 characters you want to be discussed first. Think we struggle against Bowser? Having trouble defeating Zero Suit Samus? Maybe you've figured out how to stomp Rosalina and want to share it. When casting your votes for the MUs you want discussed, please tag myself or Hokori so we can easily keep track of them. You can vote for 3 MUs, and the order you vote won't change the priority, top 3 get threads made for them first. We may even introduce a poll in another thread if need be. Until then, have fun guys, and lets make Shulk the best character he can be.

With that copy paste out of the way, lets get started.

RULES:
1)Thread will run until next Friday, where the top 3 choices will get threads for the directory
2)Please only post once.
3)List the names in any order you want. Remember you only get three choices though. You can vote for just one or two if you want though. If more than 3 names are listed in your post, only the first 3 will be counter
4)Match up threads will run for two weeks (again, may be subject to change). Regardless of time given, this thread will be reopened 4 days before and voting will begin a new
5)It's not mandatory, but a nice explanation of why you'd like the characters you picked to be discussed would be good, and may help sway others
6)Do not argue with anyones choices. Goes along with only posting once
7)In the case of edits, please PM myself or @ Hokori Hokori so we know

STANDINGS:
Bowser: 10
Charizard: 1
Ike: 1
Greninja: 2
Little Mac: 16
Shulk: 13
Dedede: 2
Toon Link: 3
Sheik: 5
Marth/Lucina: 2
ZSS: 3
Duck Hunt: 1
Megaman: 1
Sonic: 2
Link: 1
Robin: 1
Rosalina: 1
Pit/Dark Pit: 1
 
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Jgod

Smash Cadet
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I'll avoid the more technical characters for now and aim for the heavys.

Bowser - honestly I think Shulk eats Bowser as a soup dish.

Charizard - I definitely want to learn more about the new improved Charizard. Ive seen little of him but I'm looking at him like Charizard on red bull (wings).

Ike - Absolutely want to explore this. Ike has great range, a counter, some hard ass hitting aerials. Feels similar to Shield Shulk.
 
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Masonomace

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  1. :4shulk:
    Explanation: Reposting this:
    :4shulk:= Art Countering. Example: If they choose Shield, you choose Jump or Speed.
    This seems self-explanatory, but the Shulk Ditto MU may literally come down to who can outplay who with Arts. No puns intended, because an Art has boosts to various stats & various setbacks to other stats. You'll counter the other Shulk's Art with yours, or vice versa. A < / > chart of Arts vs Arts can look like this:
    Jump > Speed or Shield
    Speed > Shield or Buster
    Shield > Buster or Smash
    Buster > Jump or Smash
    Smash > Jump or Buster
    For an example: Jump could be greater than Speed or Shield because Jump's stat boost Jump Height is a setback that both Speed & Shield share. Jump can also be greater than Speed or Shield because Jump's setbacks of Lighter Weight & Damage Taken Increased aren't curcial against Jump when Speed & Shield's Damage Dealt is Decreased, making Jump a favorable Art when versing another Shulk using these Arts.
    the tl;dr version is that we know so much about Shulk, that if there's any MU's we'd discuss early it'd be Shulk plus to get it over with & move onto more important MU's that may come down the road later on. It may seem like a bad idea to discuss about Shulk dittos because we don't know everything about the character quite yet, but the same can be easily claimed by every character in Smash3DS. So yeah.
  2. :4dedede:
    Why: Personally it's for my advantage to boost my performance if I ever play Smash3DS, but mainly will be playing SmashWiiU. My friend who's a DDD main in Brawl & Project M likes what viability DDD got in this Smash title, & I plan to make this certain MU favorable for me by learning it to the fullest, thus shutting down all of the King's options grounded & airborne. You can say this is a selfish choice alone, but for the sake of bacon brought home to the Shulk boards, I think we should learn this MU & utilizing how to face a Very-Heavy-Weight like DDD is with multiple jumps. Avoiding his Jab1+Jab2 is crucial as watching my friend play around with the King made me realize his Jab+Grab game seems unchanged even if you take away the CGs.
  3. :4bowser:
    Why: Why not? The character is basically the MK of Brawl in our hearts, right? But honestly the character is the most noticeable fighter with so many buffs & re-vamped changes to his move-set he's basically a brand newcomer. Common things like NEVER SHIELDING HIS BOWSER BOMB is wise, and that Vision countering it is the cheezy-easy alternative rather than dodge-rolling OR SHIELDING IT. No need to say more as heavy weights can still be a threat to Shulk even if his Monado sword has good spacing with the assorted hit-box properties it has. Buster versus Bowser is risk & a patient Bowser versus Speed or Jump can probably deal with Shulk when using those Arts anyways. Shield is a likely Art to be used & Smash is out there too but with more caution to be used than Buster imo.
 
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Mech0nis

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1. :4tlink: Toon Link- from the ones ive played against i have huge amount of trouble facing they usually always space me out then punish an approach i make
2. :4sheik: Sheik- She can pretty much just rush you down and even space you with needles and her off stage kills shulk
3. :4littlemac: Little mac- besides you being able to counter his moves he can pretty much the same problem with shiek when it comes to rushing. (usually only a problem when the enemy is very good little mac)
 

Hokori

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1. :4shulk:- Personally, I feel it's best to just hammer through the ditto match first. Really can serve as a tool to help players to learn the ins/outs of their character.

2. :4bowser:- My beloved secondary option since Melee. He's become super popular in Smash 4, so might as well take care of this one as well. Plus, if we end up going through MUs alphabetically, the Koopa King will be first up anyway ;)

3. :4littlemac:- Yet another popular character. I'd also love to discuss the MU vs. Mac since he's a character that will be glued to the ground unless we get him off. That being said, I find that this discussion will be interesting early on due to the fact that we'll be coming together on how to deal with the best ground-orientated character in the game. Learning how to approach/handle a force like Mac should also prove to be helpful in the future when discussing other characters that favor the ground.
 

CupofT

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My vote is for :4shulk: , :4tlink:, and :4bowser:

need to learn the ditto, how to deal with projectiles, and how to deal with a heavy. Thanks
 

Zephil

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I vote for: :4sheik:, :4duckhunt:, and :4shulk:

I think most of us have the same idea but with different chars: ditto, rushdown, and a campy char.
 

PolarisAegis

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I'm voting for :4dedede:, :4littlemac:, and :4greninja:.

Dedede just is zoning me out too easily and seems like he can just counter half of the things I do because my best approach angle is blocked by a Gordo.

Little mac is just infuriating online, because it feels like there's n effective defense since he ends up past you most of the time or not close enough to deal with before he can freely guard again, and he's got fast enough attacks to deal with Shulk's comparatively high recovery frames on some of his attacks.

Greninja is just an annoying thing for me since he can just be super defensive throwing shurikens and I just don't see him too often so I get wrecked every time.
 

MarioFireRed

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1. :4shulk:: He's the ditto MU that may as well be knocked out first to help all Shulk mains learn their character before figuring out the MUs of other characters.

2. :4littlemac:: An extremely popular online character who, at the moment, has varying degrees of skill. Due to the amount of people using him it's wise to get him voted in order to have people interested in the MUs and get involved more in the Shulk base.

3. :4bowser:: Significantly revamped and buffed compared to previous games. Doing his MU has the same effect as Mac's, having ways to deal with populated and heavily used characters.
 

Opana

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1.Little Mac

I know two great Macs off the top of my head, and they're seemingly common from my experience so:

2.Bowser

I haven't found a Bowser too tough, although as far as I know there's no indication he was a main of theirs, so ay as well so I can discuss why I feel it's favorable.

3.Sonic
I feel we have the necessary tool to handle him, but I'm not entirely sure the best way. I hate Sonic the same reason as I hate Mac,the matches drag on forever and I'd just like to discuss the best possible way to handle them.

I don't know how to use the little images lol.
 

FAir Maiden

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:4littlemac:
Because I have a gut feeling that Shulk will be a good counter to Little Mac, but don't have the knowledge to actually articulate this feeling or work out the most consistently good strategy against him.​

:4sheik:
Mostly for selfish reasons--I have a friend that mains Sheik and I want to know how to destroy her--but also because it looks like Sheik'll be high tier and most people will need to know how to fight her anyway. Also, their names are similar to each other and that amuses me.​

And for what it's worth...

:4link:
Because Shulk's only looking like a Secondary for me; I main Link and just want to learn more about all of his weaknesses in general.​
 

FlareHabanero

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Voting for Sonic, Little Mac, and Shulk.

Originally I considered Bowser, but I never found problems with the match up.
 

Chappy

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1. Shulk

Like everyone else is saying, it's important to learn the character inside and out before really analyzing and experimenting MUs. I really feel like analyzing the Shulk ditto can just really give us some insight on Shulk's strengths and weaknesses.

2. Little Mac

Probably one of the MUs that gives me the most trouble right now. I simply just can't find a way to beat this character. I'd say a defensive playstyle is best for this MU, but there's just the issue of getting past his ground-game.

3. Toon Link

I'm a bit biased towards this character since he will be my secondary (he's my main atm until I get better with Shulk). I'm still fairly new to Smash and I would just like to know more about T. Link's weaknesses.
 

Goobgoyle

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Personally, I vote for Shulk, Little Mac and ZSS.

1. :4shulk:Mainly due to the fact that knowing your own character's weaknesses will help you cover them.

2. :4littlemac:He is HUGE in online play. I think his speed is going to be a problem in conjunction with his armor, but using a more defensive playstyle may turn it in your favor.

3. :4zss:Because someone I play against mains her and I hate being juggled and kicked around like an idiot. I don't know what Shulk can do against her AT ALL.
 

kenniky

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Little Mac, Robin, and Marth/Lucina... they're the ones I come up against most in online play. Although Shulk or Jiggly would be cool too as those are the ones I'm planning to main
 

xLemmy_KoopaX

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I vote for :4shulk:,:4bowser: and :4zss:.
Shulk and Bowser have been explained, but why ZSS?

I feel like Shulk has a horrid, horrid matchup against her.
Her grab range is just BS, my Visions always whiff against her, and I can't find a way to properly approach her.
Maybe I can get advice here when everyone votes on the match-up.
 

Daryl

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I vote for : Shulk, Bowser, Little mac

Shulk - as I just want to learn the weakness of the character itself
Bowser - the character that I have difficulty to fight for
Little mac - somehow same problem as bowser because his aggresive
 

Goobgoyle

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I kind of feel that the lack of platforms online kills Shulk. His UTilt and USmash are both really nifty juggling tools, and having more places to create space would help in against the likes of ZSS, IMO.
 

Hokori

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The standings are up to date. Pretty sure we're gonna end up discussing Little Mac, Shulk, and Bowser first. Looking forward to it.
 

InfiniteTripping

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I find Little Mac to be an easy opponent. I have trouble with campy characters, there's nothing Shulk can really do against them at times. Bowser is tough too because of his forward B, you can do a quick attempt at a counter, get forward B'd and then lose an entire stock.
 

Neo Zero

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Given the standings, it's safe to say that @ Hokori Hokori is right and we'll be discussing those 3. Still, voting is open until tonight (lets say Midnight PST) and threads will be made tomorrow morning. It's pointless to really vote now, but I'll throw my two cents in anyway

1) Rosalina - This character is a huge nightmare imo, and I feel like she should be priority one in discussion
2) Litte Mac - It's not so much I think the character is to good or anything like that, but given how much he's around right now, I feel like he's a good talking point, especially for the For Glory heroes out there.
3) Pit and Dark Pit - First off, there is zero reason to discuss these two as seperate entries considering Edgy Pit is a glorified Alternate Costume, being 99.99% the same really. More so, they're my main mains so this is a bias vote lol
 

link2702

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Given the standings, it's safe to say that @ Hokori Hokori is right and we'll be discussing those 3. Still, voting is open until tonight (lets say Midnight PST) and threads will be made tomorrow morning. It's pointless to really vote now, but I'll throw my two cents in anyway

1) Rosalina - This character is a huge nightmare imo, and I feel like she should be priority one in discussion
^this

I feel she needs to be discussed soon as possible. running into rosalina's who know even slightly what they're doing is a terrifying experience and the sooner we figure out the best way to approach this matchup the better.
 

g3cci

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Warning Received
Shulk- help us all learn the ins and outs better
Sheik- bc **** sheik and her needles
Little Mac- really popular online, and really annoying
It seems like going jump to get some damage up and then knocking him far enough off the stage with smash is a sound strategy though
 
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