~Edge Game~ & Stuff

[Sosuke]

All of the following things are from the point of you already grabbing the edge

Projectiles: the are multi-uses for most of the projectiles.
Boomerang~
Drop down, jump and throw a boomerang. It'll just barely graze the level. Opponents either get hit or jump. They get hit: follow-up. They don't: It'll come back and graze at their feet. This is very very veryyyy good. If they shield in advance from KNOWING its gonna come back, its going to hit them in that one tiny place the shield doesn't cover. Since your grabbing onto the edge, you'll have no lag from catching it. Which means free fair/nair/Zair to grab, whatever.
If you just barely skim the surface when you throw it, it will curve and instead of coming back to you, continue going. This means you can edgegaurd someone from across the level, or just hit someone standing about 3/4 of the stage away from you. This means a boomerang at the edge covers 75% of the level!
At FD, if you throw it at the lip, it curves down, STRAIGHT down. And comes back up. There are a few possibilities. Drop, jump towards the stage, and the boomerang will miss you and go up and hit the opponent. They NEVER see this coming. It's honestly one of the least predicable things you can do. So I do it like this: boomerang, drop down a little, move towards the edge, let the boomerang miss me (so its going up from behind you), use my mid-air jump,any airial. The boomerang and airial should hit around the same time. You can also just let either hit first, its up to you. If they shield, you can move away after the airial and arrow. then grab the edge again. Also, one other thing you can do is drop, pull away from the edge, boomerang down at them, then Z to grab the edge really fast. Try it.

Arrow~
The best way I've found to use the arrow is to drop, jump, and arrow so it just grazes the level. Unlike Links, TL's has a lot of horizontal, which means the arrow can go pretty far like this. It also hits the part of the charecter a slightly depleted shield doesn't cover.

Bombs~
When on the stage throwing a bomb at a guy grabbing onto the edge is the best thing you can do. It works VERY well. There are waayyy too many things you can do with bombs. Like my personal favorite: Drop, pull out a bomb, jump, place the bomb on the level. This takes a little timing at first, but I promise it'll be really easy once you try it out a little. The bomb on the edge is sort of like a time bomb. The opponent cant really approach you carefully because theres a lot of things you can do. Basically, Everything with boomerang and arrow, but the opponent can't get close to you. The best part is you don't have to only put one bomb. Just do it again and put two. But on some situations, the second bomb falls off. I figured out if you keep to the left (stay as close to the level by tilting left on the control stick) when placing your bombs, they wont fall off. But if you Do want them to fall of to hit someone whos recovering or something, move to the right when placing them. You can just drop from the edge, jump, fair to pick it up, and drop it at the edge again OR just pull out another bomb and drop it. Now, when theres two bombs, your safe. Ultimate defense. If they try to pick up a bomb, the other one explodes (meaning free follow-up fair or whatever you want). If they shield, one will explodes, and then the other one will. After that, I suggest you fair them. A huge chunk of their shield will be gone. Honestly, you can do pretty much whatever you want when you have two bombs on the edge.
Ultimate edgegaurd: -You can drop a bomb (or 2) on the edge and grab the edge with your chain to prevent an opponent from a safe recovery <Thanks Cloud Cleaver>-
Bombs can also help you stagespike and get free airials. Drop down, pull out a bomb, and grab the edge again. Then drop down, throw the bomb up, and up-B. If you time it right, they can't hit you because they'll hit the bomb too, and we have less lag from the explosion in that scenario, meaning a free airial for you. I suggest Fair. Also, you can stagespike with this if you hit them with Up-B.
-Bomb Juggling:Basically you have two bombs going vertically along the edge at the same time.There is a little timing to it and if timed a certain way both bombs pass eachother at the same place a little over the ledge.You do this by: dropping down, pulling out a bomb,throwing it up, Up-B to grab the edge, drop down, jump and catch the bomb, throw it up,Rinse & Repeat.,<Thanks Santi>-

Zair grab~
Now one things that ALWAYS bothered me was how Toon Link doesn't superarmor frames during his grab onto the edge with the chain. Oh well, I guess that would make him broken. Well I say this because every time I try to gimp my one Wario friend be grabbing the edge with the chain, he hits my with his infinity-multihitting up-B. I can't grab the edge fast enough if I'm above it. TL's way to floaty. So the problem is that when you grab the edge with the chain, you drop down and dangle for a second before you can pull yourself up. Thats when he hits me. So I found out you can drop out of the chain. by pressing down. So if your above the edge, press Z, then down as soon as it grabs the edge, and its like a super-fastfall. This is almost pointless, but if the situation arrives, it could get you an edgegrab. So might as well just keep it in the back of your mind.
Also, Z can stop punishment from using projectiles at the edge. As in, after dropping down, jumping and (insert projectile), you can grab the edge with Z. So you don't have to risk up-B. It prevents punishment/ getting gimped.
Zair can be used as a mindgame too. By grabbing the edge, the opponent thinks your going to go dangle, then pull yourself up. Now instead of doing that, grab the edge, press down and drop of it, and hit the opponent with a Bair or the back part of a Nair. Very useful and no one ever sees it coming the first time.

Wall Jump~
The wall jump throws people off. And don't you hate it when your grabbing the edge and you want to kill your opponent whos trying to recover, but your forced to go with a weak, vertical sending move like Bair? Wall jump. Problem solved. The wall jump with turn you around, letting you Fair. Also, a wall jump is faster then your normal mid-air jump, which will both throw opponents off when trying to predict you, and lets you have a few more options. After a wall jump, you can shoot an arrow in either direction. you can even shoot 2 of them at the level at about the heights of a SHDA.

Aerials~
Uair-When having someone standing on the level trying to hit you on your way up, dropping down, jumping, and using Uair is a good option. Best used for characters that have little to no guard under them. Also good for when you KNOW the opponents going to hit you later on your way up, rather then with something like a Dtilt.
Bair- Drop down, just as much towards the opponent ads you can, and Bair. Good for setting up combos/ getting them off the edge to gimp THEM, rather then getting gimped yourself.
Fair- A killing move, if used alone, better to use when they have high %s. Also has some start up time, so you want the the start up time to be while your on your way up, and just barely have the Fair connect when your capable of hitting them.
Dair-no.

BEST AERIAL TACTIC FROM EDGE- Drop down, Fair, Nair. You want the fair to connect and have enough time to use the front hit of Nair before you land. Trust me this is GODLY.
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Extra Stuff - Not edge stuff!!!
SHBD:Short Hop Bomb Drop
In one shorthop, you can pull out a bomb and drop it on the level. This means you can throw two bombs consecutively (SHBD, pull out a bomb, throw it, pick up the other one, throw it). Also a few other things you can do with it in the vid, but they're no that important.
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VID'S:
General Intro~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WreiUKatNlw

Bomb Stagespike~
4:45, 7:25 are examples. 8:17 is it in action
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phxYVgMHHhk&feature=related

Chain Canceling Thing + Ultimate edgegaurd + SHBD~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O559UOs0AFo


Bomb Juggling -Santi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ianIhUxUnp8




-Other stuff coming. It'll just be updated when I figure things out/ remember them.

-If anyone has anything further to contribute to this, please tell me.

 

[Santi]

I can aslo help with video if you need it.
I'll work on some of the stuff we talked about in the PM when I come back home.

Time to go wrapping
:D

I'm anxious to see if any other toons know some helpful edge stuff.

 

[Trifroze]

These look like expert stuff haha. Very useful though, seems like some of it is hard to learn but once you get it down it's easy? Anyway, great tips.

 

[Ørion]

Very nice guide with lots of helpful hints. Someone should make a directory or something that links to all these useful threads so someone trying to learn toon link can get past all the "rate my tlink plz" threads with ease.

Anyway, it's nice to see his metagame start to develop in earnest.

 

[Sosuke]

Uhh mores coming up this is just what I remembered when talking to Santi.
I'll add more as soon as I play a little. =P
And the vids uploading as we speak.
SLOW *** YOUTUBE! lol

Btw, I'd appreciate it Santi.
My vid sucks. I just put it together in like 30 minutes.
After its uploaded, we'll discuss more.

 

[SonicFire]

Make sure not to put something like,"Use Dair off-stage when edge-guarding, it's a meteor, so if it hits, it has a good chance leading to an KO."

Some people do, a shame, but I know you won't do that.

 

[virtuososteve]

Nice dude, good tactics

 

[Sosuke]

vid updated =o
It's HORRIBLE lol.

 

[Santi]

Holy ****
I'm watching the video now.

I had no idea some of that stuff was possible with the rang

and that was just in the first minute ha


EDIT TIMES OVER 9000!!!

The bombs gave me boners.

No idea you could do that.


*runs to wii*
Grabs Dr pepper*

 

[Sosuke]

Haha enjoy yourself. =)

The best part is IT'S FUN.
You look fancy, play awesomely, and have fun.
You always win.

And the TL shield break thing.
The bomb doesn't hit you?
Does this make sense to anyone? lol

 

[Hyro]

For me, edgeplay isn't just something to do while you are on the edge, it's a big part of my playstyle. A lot if not most of my game comes from the edge. Toon's floatiness makes him amazing in that aspect.

To Sasuke, your edgeplay is nice, but to me, it seems like you have one giant problem. In your vid, it looks like, to let go of the edge, you press down. I don't think I ever do that. I use back. When you press back on the control stick, characters let go of the edge, but they do not fastfall and this opens many possibilities.

I don't really use projectiles off the edge, occasionally I'll throw a bomb to get back on, but I mainly press back, then I'll fair onto the stage. Usually hits. Another great strategy, is when you edgehog, but you know your opponents going to recover, you fake edgehog. When they get close, you press back, and bair them, then get back to the edge. Repeat. You should be able to do this about 3 times and they'll either recover or die. It's very unexpected.

Finally, when both you and your opponent are fighting for the edge, a great technique is to press back to let go of the edge, then meteor them. I can't even count how many times this has worked even to opponents expecting it. It's very spur of the moment.

 

[Sosuke]

^
Down lets you wall jump quickly.
And to pull out a bomb and drop it.
Basically its faster. But yes, if you mess up your screwed. Thats why you don't mess up.

Down just works better for me.
It's also how I get some Dairs.


Oh I forgot to put the chain canceling thing in the vid!
GAHHH!! I'll add it later. You guys'll like this one too.

 

[Ørion]

Nice vid, I thought it helped a lot showing some of that stuff. That boomerang trick on FD where it hits the lip and comes back through the stage is awesome; I never knew you could do that.

 

[Cloud Cleaver]

Blast, I wish I wasn't on dialup.

I've heard of Falco mainers using ledgehopped double lasers. Can that be applied to Tink's arrows as well?

I can see using set-down bombs by the ledge as a form of guard. Put one down, jump out, edgehog with zair. They can't ledgegrab, they can't land.

 

[Santi]

I was working on the stuff you told me about.
I combined the UpB gimp with the bomb drop on the ledge.

Alright try this out. I almost have it down.


Your on the ledge.
Drop low while pulling out a bomb. Jump and throw the bomb up.
Then right after upB to the ledge.
Then drop from the ledge jump and grab the bomb you threw up. Fast fall>drop domb< grab ledge

:D
:D
It looks pretty nifty
and then from there you can mix and match and do more bomb and rang stuff.

 

[Sosuke]

Blast, I wish I wasn't on dialup.

I've heard of Falco mainers using ledgehopped double lasers. Can that be applied to Tink's arrows as well?

I can see using set-down bombs by the ledge as a form of guard. Put one down, jump out, edgehog with zair. They can't ledgegrab, they can't land.

Yeah, I'm just not compleatly sure if you can turn around towards the stage mid-air. Maybe I'm just doing it wrong.
You probably can if you arrow early.
EDIT: You can
Also, mind if I put that last little tidbit in? Sounds useful.

I was working on the stuff you told me about.
I combined the UpB gimp with the bomb drop on the ledge.

Alright try this out. I almost have it down.


Your on the ledge.
Drop low while pulling out a bomb. Jump and throw the bomb up.
Then right after upB to the ledge.
Then drop from the ledge jump and grab the bomb you threw up. Fast fall>drop domb< grab ledge

:D
:D
It looks pretty nifty
and then from there you can mix and match and do more bomb and rang stuff.

Cool. Have fun with it.
Your gettin the idea. =)

I'll make another vid for other uses of the Zair that I forgot to put in this one.
notihn that important, but very good mindgames. VERY good.

 

[Stoo99]

This is freaking awesome! The bomb drop by the ledge is great, you can place it there and then if they dont come to you drop down, jump up, fair onto the stage (picking up the bomb and possibly hitting them), then throw the bomb after them.
wall jump isnt that useful on most stages but it works on yoshis island

 

[Sosuke]

This is freaking awesome! The bomb drop by the ledge is great, you can place it there and then if they dont come to you drop down, jump up, fair onto the stage (picking up the bomb and possibly hitting them), then throw the bomb after them.
wall jump isnt that useful on most stages but it works on yoshis island

If you can wall jump on FD that would help a lot.
Sorta hard to on the tip though.


BTW guys, an easy way to go under the stage and get up the other side:
Pull out the bomb in the middle of the level.
Then you don't need timing. =P

 

[Stoo99]

Just tryed out santis thing - I find it easier to do if you dont fastfall, but rather after the upB drop further so you're just above stage level when you jump
Also this way you're dont have to be as fast because the lag of catching the ledge makes it hard to drop and catch the bomb sometimes

 

[Santi]

Just tryed out santis thing - I find it easier to do if you dont fastfall, but rather after the upB drop further so you're just above stage level when you jump
Also this way you're dont have to be as fast because the lag of catching the ledge makes it hard to drop and catch the bomb sometimes

Yea it is easier when you don't fast fall, but I'm doing it that way because imo it would be safer to fast fall if it was ever performed in a real match.
So I might as well try the hard way when I practice it.

You could drop further and then the jump would barely cover the ledge. True. And then you wouldn't have to fast fall.

It just seems slower to me to do it that way. And right now I want my Toon as fast as it can get.

Fast falling isn't that hard after you work with it for a while.

 

[Sosuke]

The OP thing is updated.
The Up-B stagespike(vid), boomberang thing(vid), and Zair grab mindgame(gonna make one now). >_>




.....
Oh man What if you hit Pit during his recovery from the other side of the stage with a boomerang......that would be amazinggggg.
Very hard to do, impossible to see coming.

 

[VietGeek]

Gotta try some of this stuff once I play Brawl again. I'm on hiatus, lol.

 

[Cloud Cleaver]

Please, add the tidbit.

Do grounded bombs explode when exposed to fire? If so, it's a pretty good mine for a breath-happy Bowser or Charizard.

I use the dair a lot when edgeguarding. You don't actually have to leave the stage; if you hit their body on the side while right above the ledge, you're safe, even if you miss, and they die.

The zair also works wonders against Pit's Wings of Icarus, due to the added range.

 

[Sosuke]

Please, add the tidbit.

Do grounded bombs explode when exposed to fire? If so, it's a pretty good mine for a breath-happy Bowser or Charizard.

I use the dair a lot when edgeguarding. You don't actually have to leave the stage; if you hit their body on the side while right above the ledge, you're safe, even if you miss, and they die.

The zair also works wonders against Pit's Wings of Icarus, due to the added range.

Thanks. I'll make a vid of it too.
Yes, they take 2 hits I believe?(perfect for IC's) And I'm about to upload a video that should help with the whole bomb thing. =)

The Dair I've known about for a long time.
And the Zair thing too. Zair is pretty much good against all recoverys. It breaks though like everything.

 

[Cloud Cleaver]

I'm still perfecting trying hit short enemies with it, but my game against tall ones has improved massively since hearing about its offensive capabilities.

 

[Hyro]

I'm still perfecting trying hit short enemies with it, but my game against tall ones has improved massively since hearing about its offensive capabilities.

For short enemies, jump, airdodge, then use zair. Usually hits them and you get some defense when starting.

 

[Cloud Cleaver]

Hmm...what's the best way to get the thing to maximum length and still have it low? I've heard of poking people's feet through shields with zair, but I can't do it.

 

[Sosuke]

Just do it regularly and It'll be full length at low. your pressing Z late.

 

[Cloud Cleaver]

...

Dur. It autocancels.

I must have a phobia of letting attacks go late, or something.

Random: Just mastered the SHDA, and I didn't have to mess up my control scheme to do it. Woot.

 

[Sosuke]

Updated. And another video.
This ones shorter. >_>

 

[Trifroze]

Haha awesome. Next thing we'll figure out is short hop double boomerang!

 

[Sosuke]

Haha awesome. Next thing we'll figure out is short hop double boomerang!

Rofl If we had two boomerangs. xD
No man, I swear TL would be broken with more then one.
Like more broken then MK.

 

[TLMarth]

I think this stuff is really good for TL's game.

 

[Alzi]

master plan

 

[Sosuke]

Wow nice boomerang work lol i never knew you could do that or that short hop then drop the bomb i always short hop and drop the bomb but it explodes as it hits the floor i think i need to get my timing right.

Drop it right before you land. And I always shield for a second just in case.
I don't trust myself enough not to.


-> And I updated the OP. Maybe a little easier to understand now. <-
Maybe I should add colors.
Or some way of letting people know whats really important or not.

 

[Lobos]

The only problem with the chain cancel is that you don't get your invinsible frames fast enough and can get punished for it as suppose to just fast fall onto the legde.

The SHDB is actually kinda hard to do for me, I tend to just land and throw the bomb so I never really use it but I do use "the trap" setup sometimes against edgehoggers/campers.

 

[Sosuke]

The only problem with the chain cancel is that you don't get your invinsible frames fast enough and can get punished for it as suppose to just fast fall onto the legde.

The SHDB is actually kinda hard to do for me, I tend to just land and throw the bomb so I never really use it but I do use "the trap" setup sometimes against edgehoggers/campers.

Yeah I guess its something you should use more to stop your momentum.

And the bomb drop thing, think L-canceling.

 

[Sosuke]

Updated with Santis sick bomb juggling.
I'm workin on it. =P

 

[zaf]

k so i didnt see anyone mention uair from the ledge. I must of tried it a few times with some success. I really love toons uair move, well links uair for that matter since it has never changed.

What i will try to do is 2 things.

1- While recovering, when im on the ledge wanting to get back i try jumping up and uair-ing. The hitbox is pretty big for it and you can hit your opponent and have time to follow up.

2- basically the same as 1, but you drop down first. After you drop you jump and uair so that the sword is out before any other part of the toon is available to be hit. If you hit your opponent you can have your space to recover. If you miss, you are still able to grab the ledge and re-think.

While 1 seems to be more risky, i do tend to go with 2 and keep it on the safe side.

The only problem i see is possibly being spiked.

 

[zaf]

kk just watched all the videos.
-1 for ohio is for lovers. lol

i just really wanted to know one thing, which is how do you chain cancel the ledge grab. Must of missed that thread.