Do you think any previous characters are going to be removed? (Also: A riddance of cloned movesets?

[TheTuninator]

As for Pt I hope they stick with Red on this one. If Sakurai decides to go with the 'most current' route it'll be a sad day for myself. As a big pokemon advocate I don't believe any other trainer could represent the series as well as Red and the original three. Gens will come and go but the first gen will always have this sort of iconic prowness.

I agree, which is why I don't think that we'll see PT going anywhere.

 

[hydrokyogre]

Not confirmed yet =/= Confirmed to be cut. We haven't seen anything of, say, Zalda or Luigi yet, but nobody's going out and saying they've been cut.

Nobody's talking about any characters who are "confirmed to be cut." People are speculating which characters MIGHT be cut, which is what the thread is for

 

[κomıc]

I think Sakurai did say there would be no DLC for Smash, pretty sure that's confirmed. And I don't think Nintendo would really wanna push the mastermind of the game into something he didn't want to do, or to force him to add content that might possibly ruin the work he had already created against his will.

Sakurai said at the "moment", no plans for DLC. He said things could change but his focus is on finishing and completing the game and making it the best it can be. DLC will always be considered.

 

[LiteralGrill]

Sakurai said at the "moment", no plans for DLC. He said things could change but his focus is on finishing and completing the game and making it the best it can be. DLC will always be considered.

That can only scare me... here's hope they don't handle it horribly like most DLC is.

 

[Homelessvagrant]

I'm not expecting much from Nintendo in this regard. I believe if there is DLC, it'll probably fit in characters that couldn't be finished in time rather than chars intended as DLC from the get go.

 

[debbilypoo]

1. So you mean do I think Brawl characters will be removed because the newcomers from SSB to SSBM weren't in Brawl but only one game...? Well, then yeah, it's possible and likely they will already get rid of some or even most of the newcomers from Brawl. I definitely know for a fact some will be removed, but definitely not Sonic. That's common sense really. & for characters removed coming back...I'd always hope for a revival of Pichu but more revamped but that isn't likely haha. Everyone seems to think Mewtwo will come back so that wouldn't surprise me, but with limited roster space and time for creating the game he will probably be the only returning character if any...

2. They will probably find some way to merge those into one character? Like when you chose Falco you could change to Fox and have his different yet quite similar moveset. This would keep a lot of characters in and still create new space for more but this probably wouldn't happen, just an unlikely wish... (ToT) But personally, the "cloned" move sets don't really bother me, I still feel like they add some variety in a way...I just wish there was a way they didn't have to rid the game of so many characters each time a new installation comes around. But out of the newcomers of Brawl, Pit is also definitely here to stay, but I practically main him so I guess I'm biased but come'on!

Also though, if Paper Mario is added to the new game, though he is similar franchise wise and looks wise (lols) to Mario, his moveset would be so different, but then he would be taking up the space of the possibility of adding a completely different character from a different series or something...like would you rather have Mario and Paper Mario, or Mario and Rayman? Same goes with Yarn Kirby but I do love that Kirby. I just hope they make some way to incorporate the wishes of people who still would prefer alternate versions of Mario and Kirby into it without taking up roster space, if you know what I mean. I guess some could even argue this goes for Sonic and Shadow in some way, if that makes sense, I can't explain anything well so I apologize for all those left completely confused by my jumbled thoughts & suggestions. ^_^

 

[Donkeykong98123]

Wolf needs to go. Lucas needs to go. Toon Link, needs to go. Young Link and Toon link were EXACT replicas of Link. Not even a slightest difference, except for YL and TL being faster. K.Rool probably isn't going to be put in. Just because nobody even likes Donkey Kong anymore(Don't know why, but, nobody really likes the big ape anymore) And he's not even relevant anymore. They had kremlings as the enemy in EVERY DK game, then all the sudden in DKCR. They put Tikis, and now for Tropical Freeze, they're putting Vikings. Putting in K.Rool would kind of make sense, because he was the main antagonist for DK for a really long time. But he's just not relevant anymore, so they might not do it.

 

[FalKoopa]

^............Da fuq did I just read?

 

[Frostwraith]

Wolf needs to go. Lucas needs to go. Toon Link, needs to go. Young Link and Toon link were EXACT replicas of Link. Not even a slightest difference, except for YL and TL being faster. K.Rool probably isn't going to be put in. Just because nobody even likes Donkey Kong anymore(Don't know why, but, nobody really likes the big ape anymore) And he's not even relevant anymore. They had kremlings as the enemy in EVERY DK game, then all the sudden in DKCR. They put Tikis, and now for Tropical Freeze, they're putting Vikings. Putting in K.Rool would kind of make sense, because he was the main antagonist for DK for a really long time. But he's just not relevant anymore, so they might not do it.

Right, because not appearing in two games is going to deeply affect his chances...

Ganon has also been absent in some Zelda games, but that didn't stop him from appearing in Melee and Brawl, now did it?

 

[Donkeykong98123]

Right, because not appearing in two games is going to deeply affect his chances...

Ganon has also been absent in some Zelda games, but that didn't stop him from appearing in Melee and Brawl, now did it?

Yes, Ganon is still the main antagonist for Link. K.Rool, is not. He's been replaced by Tikis and Vikings

 

[Frostwraith]

Yes, Ganon is still the main antagonist for Link. K.Rool, is not. He's been replaced by Tikis and Vikings

Ganondorf is actually in the same situation as K. Rool. Remakes aside, Ganondorf hasn't appeared as a villain since 2006.
Skyward Sword had Ghirahim as the main villain, Phantom Hourglass had Bellum and Spirit Tracks had Chancellor Cole.

Regardless of the two most recent games on the DK franchise, K. Rool is still the villain in most games of the series, much like how Ganon is still the villain in most games of the Zelda series.

Just because K. Rool doesn't appear in the two most recent games, that doesn't mean he stops being the main villain of the series as a whole and doesn't stop him from being included in Smash 4. There's no correlation between both.

Another thing in consideration is how Sakurai selects the characters for the game and recent appearances are not one of his criteria, so the "X is relevant" argument means nothing.

 

[bobadz]

Fun fact Ganondorf's last non remake appearance outside of cameos in Scibblenauts was Brawl.

tell that to MewTwo.

Mewtwo was meant to be in brawl alongside Lucario.

 

[Squartle]

Why is everyone so bent on cutting Wolf before Falco?

Wolf's moveset is more differentiated from Fox's than Falco's, even more so in his jabs, tilts, smashes, and air moves.

Wolf is the iconic villain of Star Fox.

The only real argument I can see having some credibility is that Falco has been in two Smash games now, while Wolf has only been in one. But beyond that, there is no reason to keep Falco over Wolf. None. At all.

I have two ideal outcomes for Smash 4. All 3 characters stay, or Falco's down-air gets folded into Fox's moveset and he gets cut.

 

[bobadz]

Why is everyone so bent on cutting Wolf before Falco?

Wolf's moveset is more differentiated from Fox's than Falco's, even more so in his jabs, tilts, smashes, and air moves.

Wolf is the iconic villain of Star Fox.

The only real argument I can see having some credibility is that Falco has been in two Smash games now, while Wolf has only been in one. But beyond that, there is no reason to keep Falco over Wolf. None. At all.

I have two ideal outcomes for Smash 4. All 3 characters stay, or Falco's down-air gets folded into Fox's moveset and he gets cut.

Because people think he stole Krystal's spot.

 

[CalumG]

Ganondorf is actually in the same situation as K. Rool. Remakes aside, Ganondorf hasn't appeared as a villain since 2006.
Skyward Sword had Ghirahim as the main villain, Phantom Hourglass had Bellum and Spirit Tracks had Chancellor Cole.

Regardless of the two most recent games on the DK franchise, K. Rool is still the villain in most games of the series, much like how Ganon is still the villain in most games of the Zelda series.

Just because K. Rool doesn't appear in the two most recent games, that doesn't mean he stops being the main villain of the series as a whole and doesn't stop him from being included in Smash 4. There's no correlation between both.

Another thing in consideration is how Sakurai selects the characters for the game and recent appearances are not one of his criteria, so the "X is relevant" argument means nothing.

*Ahem*

...Demise, anyone?

Ganondorf himself hasn't shown up in some 6 years, but I think we're all forgetting that Ganondorf, Demise and almost definitely Malladus (big blue demonic form, his face on the front of the train looking like Ganondorf, doesn't show up in the canon 'til Ganon is dead, etc. etc.) are all different incarnations of Zelda's one true antagonist. The 'Demon King', as they've all been referred to as in Japan - the phrase hasn't really started showing up in English Zelda translations until recently, but in the original Japanese versions its been the Demon King since the very beginning. So maybe 'Ganondorf' won't show up in the strictest sense of his name, but if he doesn't make a re-appearance, I shouldn't think it'd be too farfetched to see him replaced by either Demise or a character that is an amalgamation of features from all three of them. I think the fabled Hero of Men from The Minish Cap may have defeated another, separate form of the Demon King (given the presence of Moblins and the like in Minish Cap), though that's a discussion for a Zelda forum, not here.

Zelda's Big Bad hasn't changed, we've just learnt more about the mechanics of how the Demon King works and how his re-incarnation process came to be. Ganondorf isn't the Big Bad of Zelda, he's just the longest lasting incarnation of the Demon King that we've seen so far. Ganondorf's situation is unique and as such can't really be compared to K. Rool, although I'd like K. Rool to be in all the same.

 

[Frostwraith]

*Ahem*

...Demise, anyone?

Ganondorf himself hasn't shown up in some 6 years, but I think we're all forgetting that Ganondorf, Demise and almost definitely Malladus (big blue demonic form, his face on the front of the train looking like Ganondorf, doesn't show up in the canon 'til Ganon is dead, etc. etc.) are all different incarnations of Zelda's one true antagonist. The 'Demon King', as they've all been referred to as in Japan - the phrase hasn't really started showing up in English Zelda translations until recently, but in the original Japanese versions its been the Demon King since the very beginning. So maybe 'Ganondorf' won't show up in the strictest sense of his name, but if he doesn't make a re-appearance, I shouldn't think it'd be too farfetched to see him replaced by either Demise or a character that is an amalgamation of features from all three of them. I think the fabled Hero of Men from The Minish Cap may have defeated another, separate form of the Demon King (given the presence of Moblins and the like in Minish Cap), though that's a discussion for a Zelda forum, not here.

Zelda's Big Bad hasn't changed, we've just learnt more about the mechanics of how the Demon King works and how his re-incarnation process came to be. Ganondorf isn't the Big Bad of Zelda, he's just the longest lasting incarnation of the Demon King that we've seen so far. Ganondorf's situation is unique and as such can't really be compared to K. Rool, although I'd like K. Rool to be in all the same.

I know all that, but Ghirahim was the main villain of the game, as in, he was the one driving the plot.

All that happens in Skyward Sword is because Ghirahim wants to revive Demise and he succeeds in the end.

Upon defeat, Demise places the curse on Link and Zelda's successors, becoming the main villain of the entire series indirectly through his reincarnation Ganondorf.

 

[SmashBro99]

Give Ganondorf a new moveset with some swordplay. Not fat Toon Ganondorf, he's silly and not badass.

Give Toon Link a new moveset centered around his items from Windwaker, Minish Cap, Spirit Tracks (any other games I'm missing? Four Swords?). I like him alot but if they don't give him a different moveset from Link I'd rather he be removed and replaced with someone who wont have the same moveset as another fighter. They have so many options with items from ALL those games...so use it!

Mario and Luigi have similar powers and abilities, so they should fight the same for the most part, they have many differing moves so I think they are fine as is (after they give Luigi his ghost-vacuum)

Fox, Falco, and Wolf I feel are the same as Mario and Luigi, Fox and Falco have some of the same animations and ideas in their moveset which makes sense. Wolf's is a little different with some of the same stuff still but I'm alright with that. But one problem is THAT STUPID LANDMASTER. I can't believe how lazy they were with this, it's sickening. Falco prefers the air? Then grantg his wish and let him shoot the stage from his Arwing, could work something like Snake's FS. And Wolf could call in support from Star Wolf, with dialogue and everything.

Ness and Lucas...I played about 1/3 of the game with Ness in it so I'm not sure about them and won't comment on those two.

What do you guys think?

And just one last thing, if anyone thinks Paper Mario would be a clone of Mario with his moves, please play the games (the first two are the best, the third is good, the fourth...i dont like so much) and you will be set straight :D

 

[CalumG]

I know all that, but Ghirahim was the main villain of the game, as in, he was the one driving the plot.

All that happens in Skyward Sword is because Ghirahim wants to revive Demise and he succeeds in the end.

Upon defeat, Demise places the curse on Link and Zelda's successors, becoming the main villain of the entire series indirectly through his reincarnation Ganondorf.

That's cool then, I was under the impression you were implying that Ghirahim was a more worthy character in SSB4 than Demise or Ganondorf... forget I said anything

 

[Norm]

Two points of discussion I'd like to propose:
1. Do you think any characters in Brawl have any chance of being removed from the series as with Mewtwo, Roy, and Pichu? Do you think any characters are going to be removed at all?
-Sub Question: Any characters that were removed do you think will be brought back?

2. How do you feel about cloned move sets? (Capt. Faclon/Ganon, Link/TL to some extent, etc.) Will they be finally done and away with? For exmaple. I would REALLY love if Ganon got to use his sword from Twilight Princess

1. I would say Toon Link and either Falco or Wolf have a chance of getting pulled possibly even Sonic or Snake though I don't really want to see them go. Toon Link and the additional spaceimals are clones so if there was a need to drop characters I could seem them going. The same could be said for Gannondorf but I don't think they will drop him I would hope they would finally give him his own move set. Though the same can be said for the other clones.

Sub question. I would like to see Mewtwo brought back. And we've had some inclination that he may return so here's hopping.

2. I dislike them I feel that there should be no clones and that if there's a character in the game they should have their own fleshed out move set. Gannon deserves his own move set and any of the other clones should either get their own moves or be removed from the game to make space for another character who isn't a clone.