Dissidia Mafia: Over Serial Killer Wiins! ~ Told you $#!* got real!

[~ Gheb ~]

Swiss, you're on a good way to make RF a huge liability if you continue to contradict Ryker's stances.

to #3: i feel that tandora is breaking under pressure, her posts get more and more foggy, and the way she reacted to RFiction was sad.

I think that's a bit unfair of an argument. To me it seems like Tandora felt attacked on a personal level and reacted to that "out of character" so to speak. If I tell you something you take offense in you might react harshly but would you say it's a scum tell if the cause for your anger has nothing to do with the game?

She's scum for other reasons.

i know it's far-fetched but i believe the mafia has a special power in this game, hell....

i might even say that...

okay, so DH didn't die, but why didn't he get roleblocked?

I think this whole speculation about roles has reached a stage where it's obvious that you base things off assumptions too much. We do not know which roles are in this game and for all we know there may not even be a mafia-aligned roleblocker.

And once again even if you got a reasonable answer to your questions, in what way would that knowledge be actually useful for the town?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

@Hida

Hida, why are you still riding the noob train?

i was looking back and you still barely post, state the obvious, and then just mozy on by.

cmon man, get some scum picks out there.

@gheb

you seemed pretty darn confident about DH at the beginning, what happened? what made you change your mind? (BESIDES THE ONE-SHOT WATCHER CLAIM.)

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

V/LA until monday. ciao.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Actually, the watcher claim had nothing to do with why I changed my mind about him. In fact, I openly argued to treat the claim itself as null. It was the fact that he consistently gave me replies that I found genuine. That only thing he didn't actually prove me wrong at was the skimming accusation but at that time a lot of people were skimming harder than him so I thought I exaggerated.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

It was the fact that he consistently gave me replies that I found genuine.

Poor wording.
What I meant to say is that [except for the skimming part] he always was able to give an agreeable answer when I found something worth pointing out. I think if he was scum he would've messed up at that point, especially with all that pressure on him.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

I just skipped the last two pages (15ppp) just to say, wth? I think we can all play a game and get reads without insulting each other. I'll get to a vote count in a min.

No one get's mod killed. But in the event that it happens again, you WILL get mod killed.

I suggest everyone involved to just drop it.

 

[Radical Fiction]

Yes we can, but that affects our ability to play as effectively as possible.

That's like saying we can play a game without changing our vote. It's very possible, it hampers your ability in a similar fashion.

 

[Radical Fiction]

Also, you skipped our Day Kill command, I think.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

Any problems with statement above can be done so privately.

With 10 alive it takes 6 to lynch!

[0] J:
[0] Tandora:
[0] Soupamario:
[1] DatHydra: JTB,
[0] hidajiremi:
[0] Red Ryu:
[0] smarboy69:
[0] Radical Fiction:
[4] JTB: DatHydra, Tandora, Soupamario, Radical Fiction,
[0] Gheb_01:
[0] No Lynch:

Not voting: Glyph, hidajiremi, Red Ryu, smarboy69, Gheb_01,

 

[#HBC | J]

And there we have it.

Why did you fake DayVig again?

 

[Radical Fiction]

And there we have it.

Why did you fake DayVig again?

I'm going to pretend you didn't ask a question you couldn't possibly hope to gain anything from and move on.

Go catch up so we can lynch JTB. I want to actually Day Vig someone tomorrow.

 

[smarboy69]

The real question, J, is why would you think a DayVig RF would waste a shot on JTB obvscum?

 

[smarboy69]

There's surely a RB. With both a doc and a cop, there must be some sort of blocking role to prevent follow the cop scenarios.

That said, I still think JTB is scum.

 

[DatHydra]

@RadicalFiction, from your POV my JTB scum result could have been a blatant lie, certainly considering the gambit I pulled right before it. Why did you take it as fact immediately upon seeing it, without even waiting for a rebuttal from JTB?

It seemed like you knew my claim had weight and that JTB was scum even before his terribly scummy response confirmed him as such.

 

[Radical Fiction]

@RadicalFiction, from your POV my JTB scum result could have been a blatant lie, certainly considering the gambit I pulled right before it. Why did you take it as fact immediately upon seeing it, without even waiting for a rebuttal from JTB?

It seemed like you knew my claim had weight and that JTB was scum even before his terribly scummy response confirmed him as such.

Do you know that we immediately thought you were telling the truth? You only know what we put out in the thread for you to know. Therefore how can you put forth that you know what you are implying that you know what we know?

 

[DatHydra]

Well I know you both are adequate at playing word games when deflection is necessary, but that is not what I am focusing on.

Am I wrong that you chose my side of the story over JTB's before he could even respond? No, I am not because thats where you placed your vote. Don't bother telling me you were just pressuring him to see if he would scum slip under more pressure because I won't believe it. It bothers me because you had a large scum read on me yesterDay and had even brought up that the timing of my claim in itself was scummy (let alone the actual PR claim). Then, when I gambited Smarboy, you said

I'm willing to lynch DH on Smarg saying he isn't a PR. His word is worth more to me.

after waiting until after Smarboy had refuted the result I had claimed. Meaning, you were unsure of the validity of my smar accusation. However, when I outed JTB, you immediately placed your vote without question. You did not even bother waiting for his response to my post. You knew he was caught scum.

The severe doubt you have expressed concerning my alignment pre and post claim coupled with my blatant smarboy gambit certainly gave you plenty of wiggle room to doubt my accusations, yet you did no such thing. This makes your immediate compliance seem very OOC.

Looks to me you were trying to get brownie points for the immediate distancing once JTB flipped scum.

Also, everyone remember early in D1 when Radical correctly latched onto JTB for being overly defensive and then immedietly switched focus upon my entry post. Vult caught onto this connection straight away and look what ended up happening to him.



@Gheb & Smarboy, If I am not around tomorrow can you guys look into Radical and Tandora for me? I personally don't see Hida as scum anymore and would advise against his lynch. I also have RR as town in my notes for whatever reason. Glyph null, Soup leaning scum. D1's aggressive dumb townie status seems to be wearing off for me, especially with comments like

if JTB is town:

go after Glyph.

despite understanding why we are lynching JTB in the first place.

 

[JTB]

DH, you are suggesting that Vult picked up on something between myself and RF, which led to his death. Meaning scum killed him.

But you are claiming that you watched Asdioh get killed by me, who you claim is scum.

Explain this.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

@Gheb & Smarboy, If I am not around tomorrow can you guys look into Radical and Tandora for me? I personally don't see Hida as scum anymore and would advise against his lynch.

I'm always looking "into" Radical anyway because of Ryker.
But I don't understand your stance @ hida at all. This is one of the few cases where I'm asking you to elaborate on your town read on him. If you're going to flip town we can NOT work with your stance if you only say that you doubt he's scum and nothing else.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

DH, you are suggesting that Vult picked up on something between myself and RF, which led to his death. Meaning scum killed him.

But you are claiming that you watched Asdioh get killed by me, who you claim is scum.

Explain this.

That's a pretty stupid question. Feel free to not answer this, DH.

 

[JTB]

How is it a "pretty stupid" question, he just contradicted his whole claim on me in order to place suspicion on RF.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

It's not a contradiction at all. You're just purposefully drawing wrong conclusions. Probably a lame attempt to "trap" DH or something.

 

[Radical Fiction]

Scum read on you had long since deteriorated to null, but I saw absolutely no reason to tell people that.

We had a Smarg town read and a JTB scum read, so how does that make us scum?

Bull**** on Day 1 distancing. We jumped off that wagon because JTB was responding slow as **** and we simply wanted to get the game started.

JTB's or Smarg's town flip would damn you anyway, so why would I not want the the one with the bigger scum read gone first?

 

[Radical Fiction]

Swiss, you're on a good way to make RF a huge liability if you continue to contradict Ryker's stances.

Well I know you both are adequate at playing word games when deflection is necessary, but that is not what I am focusing on.

Wat is dis deflekshun u speek of we no liek words we liek pikchurs. u shud fokus on de orange jooce bekuz it said 'concentrate' hurrrrr durrrrr

Am I wrong that you chose my side of the story over JTB's before he could even respond? No, I am not because thats where you placed your vote. Don't bother telling me you were just pressuring him to see if he would scum slip under more pressure because I won't believe it. It bothers me because you had a large scum read on me yesterDay and had even brought up that the timing of my claim in itself was scummy (let alone the actual PR claim). Then, when I gambited Smarboy, you said

Coastin' to LyLo.



O btw JTB seems to be going out of his way to create links between the two of us, but he only does it as soon as he's about to get lynched.



DH why Hidatown?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

 

[Swiss]

 

[hidajiremi]

1) What do you think of DH's claim?
2) What do you think of Soup's reaction to all this? Are his questions legit?
3) What was your reaction to RF's "dayvig" on you? Don't reveal any PRs if you have any, but how did you feel?

1) At the time that DH made his role claim, I agreed that it was a null read. I still think it's a null read. On the other hand, claiming that he watched asidoh is just bizarre. Asidoh wasn't on anyone's scum list that I can recall, but there were much better choices for a watch, especially if his ability really is only one-shot. Either he's fantastically lucky and caught scum, or he's lying--or JTB has some other reason for visiting asidoh that he isn't willing to talk about. We just don't have enough information yet to decide what it means.

On the other hand, DH was all about "taking complete responsibility" if RoxPSI flipped town, even as he gave himself a buffer zone of "no longer 100% certain," so he's not exactly perfectly reliable. Also:

Be careful, he is at L-2. Don't want him self hammering before we talk stuff out.

Why does he think JTB is likely to self-hammer?

2) He's waffling hard. RR's scum! JTB is scum! Glyph is scum! I'm scum! Protip: There can't be that many scum left. It's just not possible with this kind of setup. And when he's called out as waffling, his response is basically "I'll waffle if I want to!" Then he immediately jumps into defending DH from scrutiny:

DH could still be alive for two reasons:

1) The mafia knew of better targets to kill
2) The mafia considered a one-watch nothing too important, and realized that the chances of one-watch actually getting something were dim
3) the claim is a WIFOM, in order to trick JTB.
4) DH is actually scum fakeclaiming
5) i'm still sticking with this...the interceptor intercepted the doctor and the doctor was killed in place of DH.

they are all most likely.

Also, he can't count; bolded for emphasis.

Seriously, though: Which one is most likely? They can't all be. The fact that he won't pick one is vague-without-seeming-vague. Throwing a bunch of information at people without differentiating between it in any way is unhelpful--as much so as not taking stances.

3) Extremely upset. Because either he was daykilling town, or he was lying about having an ability, and neither of those made me particularly happy.

My scum picks right now:
*DH: He made it through the night alive after role-claiming. It was the only claimed role we had at that point, so either scum were amazingly lucky at picking their target while not going for an obvious power role, or he's lying. I think it's much more likely that he's lying, which automatically makes him suspect to me.
*JTB: Watching or lying aside, JTB's responses to the whole thing are kind of suspect.

Town picks:
*RadicalFiction: My complaints about his "play style" aside, I think very strongly that he's town. Now that I've taken a day to cool down, I get what he's trying to do: push someone until they break and reveal something. I still think it's anti-town, but it's anti-town played by someone who thinks it's town. His whole attitude just screams "I'm town! And if you disagree, you're dumb!"
*Tandora: I said on the previous day that I think you're town, 100%. I stand by that. I wouldn't presume to make you take the same stance on me, but know that I've got your back... for whatever that's worth at this point.

i was looking back and you still barely post, state the obvious, and then just mozy on by.

cmon man, get some scum picks out there.

Doing my best here. Kinda busy.

 

[Tandora]

Hida, you've made it very clear that you're LAL. You've berated RF for his fake claim several times. Yet you have not said one word regarding DH's stunt of giving a false read to lure out JTB. Why?

J, really looking forward to your analysis of the game. I hope to see a content post from you soon.

Soup, more content, less V/LA and telling Jeremy how much of a noob he is.

RF, do you have any idea on why your dayvig didn't work? What is Eternal Perception? I looked up the move to see which character it was from the game and I cannot find its existence anywhere?

 

[Tandora]

1) At the time that DH made his role claim, I agreed that it was a null read. I still think it's a null read. On the other hand, claiming that he watched asidoh is just bizarre. Asidoh wasn't on anyone's scum list that I can recall, but there were much better choices for a watch, especially if his ability really is only one-shot. Either he's fantastically lucky and caught scum, or he's lying--or JTB has some other reason for visiting asidoh that he isn't willing to talk about. We just don't have enough information yet to decide what it means.

Why would a watcher choose scum?

Why does he think JTB is likely to self-hammer?

When scum is confirmed beyond a doubt (like a cop read), they will often selfhammer to deny town further reads. It cuts the Day short.

2) He's waffling hard. RR's scum! JTB is scum! Glyph is scum! I'm scum! Protip: There can't be that many scum left. It's just not possible with this kind of setup. And when he's called out as waffling, his response is basically "I'll waffle if I want to!" Then he immediately jumps into defending DH from scrutiny:

There's waffling and then there's not being sure of your reads. Only scum are 100% certain of who's town and who's scum. Many town players switch back and forth because of uncertainty.

 

[DatHydra]

I can sit here and WIFOM over 10 possibilities why I was not killed last night, all of them just as good of a guess as you could come up with. I won't, because WIFOM gets you nowhere, but there are plenty of factors that could have played into my survival.

As for Asdioh, it was quite the lucky pick. The most obvious choice would for me to watch Gheb, as he was my strongest town read going into the Night. However, I have played a fair amount of games as scum myself, and I never like killing the most townie player on the playing field. Ever. Always too risky. I decided scum would not likely target Gheb, thinking that either I would save my watch for later or that I would ignorantly watch Gheb and waste my one shot. From there, I crossed out everyone that was obvscum or leaning scum as I figured scum would keep them alive to mislynch for later days. I then came down to two players left as a solid watch choice, Asdioh and Vult. I debated amongst which of the two to pick for some time. I then looked at Seik's scum picks and compared them with mine and we both agreed that Asdioh was looking slightly townier than Vult so we went with him. Turns out I would have been right either way.

There is no ability besides vig that would allow JTB to singlehandedly kill Asdioh and the fact that he even denies the visit confirms him as scum beyond any doubt.



Gah, maybe I can't get a solid on Hida. I thought he was town but that last post was eww.

Hida/Tandora relationship bugs me a lot. Hida is sucking up to Tandora while Tandora tries to make it clear that she needs no special treatment. Yet, I get the feeling that she is covertly buddying back.

 

[th3kuzinator]

There is no ability

EBWOP: There is no town ability

 

[~ Gheb ~]

or JTB has some other reason for visiting asidoh that he isn't willing to talk about. We just don't have enough information yet to decide what it means.

And if we don't have said information we use common sense. JTB has explicitly mentioned that he did *not* visit Asdioh toNight. Since his life is on the line then there's no reason to assume he wouldn't have revealed "the truth" behind that by now.

On the other hand, DH was all about "taking complete responsibility" if RoxPSI flipped town, even as he gave himself a buffer zone of "no longer 100% certain," so he's not exactly perfectly reliable.

Apples to oranges. There's a difference between being unreliable in terms of scumhunting [which everybody is to a different degree] like he was yesterDay in Rox' case and being unreliable in terms of obtaining a night actions result ... in which case he's either right or wrong period. The question of reliability is out of place here as opposed to yesterDay.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

 

[hidajiremi]

Hida, you've made it very clear that you're LAL. You've berated RF for his fake claim several times. Yet you have not said one word regarding DH's stunt of giving a false read to lure out JTB. Why?

Read my post again. Do we know it's a stunt? If so, then he falls under my LAL policy--which would contribute even harder to being my top scum pick.

Honestly, at this point, DH and JTB both look scummy to me, for different reasons. If DH is telling the truth, then JTB is scum. There's no other reason I can think of that he would be visiting someone at night since the doctor is already dead. People questioned DH's claim yesterday, but everyone has seemed to let it slide since then. In my previous post, I even asked: If he's telling the truth about having a PR, how did he live through the night?

If DH is lying, then all it means is that JTB didn't give the defense that DH is offering as "the only right choice." Then it still comes back to deciding which of them is scummier, and while JTB's answers are suspicious, at least he wouldn't be a confirmed liar. Faced with two potential scum leads, pick the one that's had a lie revealed.

 

[hidajiremi]

As for Asdioh, it was quite the lucky pick. The most obvious choice would for me to watch Gheb, as he was my strongest town read going into the Night. However, I have played a fair amount of games as scum myself, and I never like killing the most townie player on the playing field. Ever. Always too risky. I decided scum would not likely target Gheb, thinking that either I would save my watch for later or that I would ignorantly watch Gheb and waste my one shot. From there, I crossed out everyone that was obvscum or leaning scum as I figured scum would keep them alive to mislynch for later days. I then came down to two players left as a solid watch choice, Asdioh and Vult. I debated amongst which of the two to pick for some time. I then looked at Seik's scum picks and compared them with mine and we both agreed that Asdioh was looking slightly townier than Vult so we went with him. Turns out I would have been right either way.

That's... extremely solid. Unless JTB can give a solid defense at this point, I'm not sure I can side against it. I want to give him a chance before I vote, though. Now that Tandora's explained why a self-hammer would be a good thing for scum, I don't want to put him at L-1.

 

[hidajiremi]

And since the mod apparently either didn't see my vote or count it, just to be safe:

Unvote

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Self hammers would be used to end the day prematurely, that is the main thing I see happening. I'm doubtful of a self-hammer role, those are pretty unpopular, well at least to me they are. Hero was the only role I've seen that involved being lynched to go off.

If we're worried of DH lying tomorrow we will see who lied when JTB flips. I don't have doubts on him right now and see JTB as scum.

These pics still annoy me. :/

 

[smarboy69]

So tell me how I'm a hydra and I'm coastin. Cool story amirite?

I'll get back to this game with shiz when I talk to smargz about things. Not before that. If she posts it's cuz she posts. But I'm not gonna post till we talk again. Smargaret take this as a note to try and get @ me on AIM. I should be here all day and we need to talk ASAP. That's all.

 

[smarboy69]

Okay, post after discussion:

Right now, the only scumread we agree on to the point where we'd vote is JTB. Consider our hypothetical vote there. Glyph/J is another strong candidate, but we want to see his catchup post and reevaluate. Gboy has a slight scumread on Tan, I can't read her at all.

What's the logic behind the RFscum argument? As far as we can tell, people don't like the pictures and Gheb is seeing inconsistencies between Ryker and Swiss - is there anything we're missing, or is that it?

Soupa, we'd like to hear you explain your early dumb town gambit a bit better. What did you hope to gain from it? Why did you reveal it when you did? Why are you still making dumb town posts?

Also @ Soupa, we see that you're subbing setup speculation with scumhunting. WGOEOY.

Hida: You're all for LaL, right? So why aren't you pursuing RF for the fake dayvig? And Soupa for the fake dumb town? Inconsistency is noted. Also, your two scumpicks are JTB and DH - are they scum together? If not, who are their buddies?

RF: For the sake of our sanity, are you or are you not a dayvig? If you answer "yes" I will initiate a policy lynch in every future game I play with you.

Gheb/DH/RF, what are your thoughts?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Soupa, we'd like to hear you explain your early dumb town gambit a bit better. What did you hope to gain from it? Why did you reveal it when you did? Why are you still making dumb town posts?

Also @ Soupa, we see that you're subbing setup speculation with scumhunting. WGOEOY

i said it once, i will say it again.

Playing your best=/=Acting your best

What did you hope to gain from it?

I was hoping to attract the attention of scum, i wanted them to come after me, sadly, it backfired.

why did you reveal when you did?

Simply because of the above, it backfired.

Why are you still making dumb town posts?

because not everything i'm gonna say is gonna be perfect or helpful. any posts i make are for the sake of my own understanding, and then i combine that with what the town has said to get a conclusion.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

On what exactly, smar? My lynch pool is more than obvious as I have specifically mentioned even the order [which is JTB -> Tan / hida -> Glyph playerslot in case you missed it].

And there's no "RFscum" argument coming from me jfyi.