Did America lose a generation?

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Don't you agree that it is more difficult to get a good education if you grow up in poverty/low income?

A degenerative economy leads to a degenerative culture with degenerative habits.

And I think that it is becoming increasingly difficult for many people to attend college because of increases in prices for college tuition. Some colleges are even trying to make it a requirement that freshmen live on campus, which costs even more money.

On the other hand the amount of student aid scholarships for high performing low income and minority groups has spiked. Not to mention pell grants, stafford loans, and work study programs have seen surges to reflect dependency on the programs to subsidize increasing costs of education or just the raw influx of income that comes from initiatives like S.T.E.M. to increase the overall aptitude of the United States with respect to enriching themselves with the sciences.

Colleges are also incredibly diverse in what they offer in terms of financial aid or scholarship, especially whether they are a public or private institution. There is a solution for students who get into schools that force them to live on campus their freshman year when they can't afford it... the solution is to attend a different college that you can afford given how your academic profile is awarded and leveraged against financial costs. This is common sense.

Let's not wallow in self-pity on the education spike when most developed countries have been controlling inflation to a 2-3% annual spike. Life becomes increasingly difficult for everyone the more time passes demanding that people find solutions to increase their own income and means of living. Affording college is sadly one of the easier financial problems in life to personally broker for those who sincerely tackle the financial side of the problem with genuine concern. The fact is that most students don't have the acumen to make a rational and calculated decision because they don't do sufficient research or work hard to give themselves enough options to work with in negotiating student tuition. People fail to realize that there are hundreds of private benefactors that want to literally throw money at you and all you need to do is write them a one page letter indicating an interest as to what you think you will be doing with the degree.

To be frank, if someone attended a top notch school, say an Ivy League school for $40,000 and they are worried about coming out with compounded interest, they should do themselves a favor and not eat into the pity pie that most delusional college graduates are putting in front of them. There are frankly so many funding options and so many investors that require absolutely no actual returns aside from requesting individual success that it's embarrassing. A lot of students willingly choose to remain ignorant because they eat into that pie rather than actually do something about it. It's sickening.

Yeah, I sounded like an idiot when I said, "I've seen it happen", however haven't you ever read or heard accounts of people who came from the depths of poverty yet they were determined to succeed, pursued an education and became successful? It's something that appeals to people, because it enforces the feelgood idea of "you can do anything if you try hard enough". Also, If you find anything wrong with my posts, just PM me. I'm more than happy to edit them. And if you're going to quote my post, at least explain why you did so, or what it is about my post that you disagree with.

This portion is completely unnecessary because it's followed by a conjunction. When people use conjunctions in contested conversation on forum boards, the statement prior to the conjunction has no bearing to the individual typing it because their real point lies after it. In other words, your acknowledgment 'I sounded like an idiot' is either insincere or has no bearing to you... 'I sounded like an idiot'... but I don't care. Which is a shame, not to me personally but to users like @Empty Number who try to sincerely engage your phrasing with the belief that it makes a difference. I personally feel that any sincere attempt by me to engage in a conversation with you will just end up contested because your frequent use of conjunctions connotes to me that you feign 'acceptance' over a mistake to generate the impression that a conversation is viable, but still attempt to justify or contest the point you just conceded on. Like wtf man.

My use of the image from "The Sixth Sense" wasn't to belie the point that "... some low income people can be smart though, I've seen it happen..." but rather to poke fun at you for having the need to state that you being a personal witness to such events had to be shared to establish credibility to the statement that 'low income people' can 'be smart.' The reference is to the actor Haley Joel Osment who makes the statement, "I see dead people" to establish context to his emotions for Bruce Willis. This embodies what I found to be ludicrous as people use personal explanations to appropriately explain personal opinions, thoughts, motives, and thought process as demonstrated even in absurd movies like "The Sixth Sense." However, when someone uses a personal explanation to legitimize a global event, truth, or situation without impunity... it's absurd.

 

[FirestormNeos]

Regarding the music of my culture I agree that the Hip-Hop now is no good but looking past that the genre goes deeper than what's on the surface now. Not all of it is bad it's just people need to dig for the real music that talk about real life issues. Songs like Bobby B*tch or Hot ***** are doing nothing than making the problem worse and that is why I don't listen to the music of now. But some songs in my opinion that are gold to the genre are by 2pac and they relate real to the issues of now and they are Changes and Keep ya head up. But there is great music farther than that and as of late I have been listening to a lot of 70s and 80s groups that some of you might never heard of like Zapp, Parliament-Funkadelic, Earth, Wind and Fire, Gap Band and Cameo. My point is that some people just look at the surface and judge when sometimes they have to dig to find the treasure and there is more to African American music than what is destroying and creating chaos in this generation.

90% of any music genre is absolute garbage. And 90% of that garbage is hurting-the-cause, ruining-the-reputation abominations whose ultimate fate is to be torn to shreds by a angry canadian youtuber (and I say Canadian because that's supposed to tip you off that I'm referencing someone).

btw are Earth, Wind and Fire all one band/group/whatever, or are those all individual bands/groups/whatever?

At no point is it OK to equate "people of low income" with "gangsters" as you did. It's not that you're grouping them together, but rather to many people "gangster" means "black person", and by irresponsibly saying such things you are giving credence to the stereotype that black people are poor.

EDIT: I know you didn't mention specifically "black people", but the term you used is racially charged so that in many people's minds they think of a black person at that word's mention. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you didn't mean harm, but it's not really your intent that matters - it's the power and effect your words have in the minds of OTHER people.

Words are powerful, use them mindfully and responsibly. Think what might go through someone's mind upon reading your message or hearing your speech, and choose your words thoughtfully and with regard for others. That's all.

Al Capone is doing a Spin Dash in his grave.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Regarding the music of my culture I agree that the Hip-Hop now is no good but looking past that the genre goes deeper than what's on the surface now. Not all of it is bad it's just people need to dig for the real music that talk about real life issues. Songs like Bobby B*tch or Hot ***** are doing nothing than making the problem worse and that is why I don't listen to the music of now. But some songs in my opinion that are gold to the genre are by 2pac and they relate real to the issues of now and they are Changes and Keep ya head up. But there is great music farther than that and as of late I have been listening to a lot of 70s and 80s groups that some of you might never heard of like Zapp, Parliament-Funkadelic, Earth, Wind and Fire, Gap Band and Cameo. My point is that some people just look at the surface and judge when sometimes they have to dig to find the treasure and there is more to African American music than what is destroying and creating chaos in this generation.

Find me a song that doesn't involve profanity, dressing provocatively, and most importantly a rapper that sticks to that all their life.

2Pac and every other rapper did influence great words like 'Dear mama' but then destroyed that credibility in the next song like 'Hail marry' and 'f them up' and so on.

You wont find a rapper that won't change the way Hip hop is, it HAS to involve profanity and other bs.

I don't see EVER using profanity solves anything to begin with, it will just partake in a harsher environment. If I was to come up to a random person or person and say "Hey F or f'er', or sob" would you react with 'hey'? Nope you will be mad and become hostile.

And yes sure, like I wrote there is good lyrics to some, but the profanity has got to go. NO ONE has changed that and that is why people like me see them as 'the same'.

Heck, parody songs could change the feeling, but the profanity and all that unnecessary bs will stay. And it will just continue to grow and cause trouble like the, NYPD tragedy RIP is part of this 'uplifting' tune of sample beats to make a beat.

It's affected the new generation as well and it's the number one most listened to, 'music'. It hasn't done NOTHING but destroy. And if you seriously want to write I don't know what I'm ranting about, then you're delusional people that live under a rock all your lives and never view what goes on in this bs society.

 

[LightlyToasted]

"Gangsters" as they are known are typically associated with low income areas, often with worse schools, which causes the youth to congregate in less productive means(gangs typically doing illegal activities) that they see as a way to look out and protect each other. This is the "blue Collar" gangster. Al Capone would be a white collar gangster, partaking in things such as money laundering tax evasion ect. Both are bad but both do often get glammed in the media.

Regarding the music of my culture I agree that the Hip-Hop now is no good but looking past that the genre goes deeper than what's on the surface now. Not all of it is bad it's just people need to dig for the real music that talk about real life issues. Songs like Bobby B*tch or Hot ***** are doing nothing than making the problem worse and that is why I don't listen to the music of now.

There is still plenty good hip-hop, Kendrick Lammar has some very good songs on social commentary.

See I was once one of those people that was all "THIS MUSIC SUCKS, SHOWS THE DAYS DON'T LIVE UP TO THE STANDARDS OF MY CHILDHOOD." Then I just realized I was being an angry young man. But I believe I've passed the age of consciousness & righteous rage. Though life goes on no matter who is wrong or right.

I have a very friend who I relate to very much when it comes to music, though she has remained vehement in her stance, like getting mad and insisting Burger King was bastardizing the Dire Straits by using "Walk of Life" in one of their ads, and that sampling is the worst. Even just fun music non commentative music there is plenty of good stuff. I am not a big Bruno Mars fan but I have loved the disco/funk tunes he's done recently. Sorry for this tangent but I just cry when people go for retro eyes only and just assume all new stuff is bad, or especially that ALL POP is bad.

I'll end this post with a great ted talk for anyone that loves music....

Edit: This thread has been won.

Spoiler

"... some low income people can be smart though, I've seen it happen..."

 

[FirestormNeos]

"Gangsters" as they are known are typically associated with low income areas, often with worse schools, which causes the youth to congregate in less productive means(gangs typically doing illegal activities) that they see as a way to look out and protect each other. This is the "blue Collar" gangster. Al Capone would be a white collar gangster, partaking in things such as money laundering tax evasion ect. Both are bad but both do often get glammed in the media.

Darn kids these days with their Scarface and their Godfather! In my day, people like Al Capone were the scum of the universe!

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Edit: This thread has been won.

You... can... you ser.. the art... oh lord... I'm done ~prog

Edit: Using a 'clean' version really does justice to what people like us 'old farts' rant about, huh? And let's just wall out everything that doesn't 'interest' us and proceed with, bs.

 

[LightlyToasted]

You... can... you ser.. the art... oh lord... I'm done ~prog

Edit: Using a 'clean' version really does justice to what people like us 'old farts' rant about, huh? And let's just wall out everything that doesn't 'interest' us and proceed with, bs.

I was referring to Acrostics post being the one that won the thread. And to be honest I know the song so I just grabbed the first link I could find since I am at work. And why bother dissecting a small point like that. Clean vs not is rather irrelevant. the only reason clean versions exist is because radio edits exist to give people a sense of security that their kid's won't hear anything they shouldn't, when in reality we have things like love line playing on FM radio at 10 pm.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

I was referring to Acrostics post being the one that won the thread. And to be honest I know the song so I just grabbed the first link I could find since I am at work. And why bother dissecting a small point like that. Clean vs not is rather irrelevant. the only reason clean versions exist is because radio edits exist to give people a sense of security that their kid's won't hear anything they shouldn't, when in reality we have things like love line playing on FM radio at 10 pm.

Hey, I have a better idea, instead of 'radio' edits, why don't they just, oh idk kill, ban, shut down or whatever to, Hip Hop/Rap/R&B. I know it's a dream but, I'll dream big like my man Martin Luther King Jr RIP. Thanks.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Find me a song that doesn't involve profanity, dressing provocatively, and most importantly a rapper that sticks to that all their life.

Google told me that Lecrae is a Christian rapper. I've gone through three of his songs, which I'm betting is three more songs than you will bother to listen through to verify that I'm telling the truth. The songs that I've gone through with music videos:

1) All I Need Is You

2) Tell The World

3)Church Clothes

​

To reiterate these are just three songs and I don't know if Lecrae will become an atheist or suddenly decide to 180 his Christian reputation into the gutter. That's something God only knows, however I do know that he is not the only Chrisitan rapper and your insinuation that all rappers rely on profanity and sexual appeal through sensual attire is false as evidenced through the use of Google, Metro Lyrics, and Youtube. Three resources that should available to you if you took three seconds to seriously consider that your three point opinion could be wrong.

2Pac and every other rapper did influence great words like 'Dear mama' but then destroyed that credibility in the next song like 'Hail marry' and 'f them up' and so on.

Dear Mama appears to be him being regretful about how he treated his mother.

F Them Up is not the title to any song by Tupac. There is a song with a similar name called Hit Em Up where he's calling out Biggie for having a part in him being shot. And another song called F Em All which also references his cred as a West Coast rapper and calls out Biggie again for playing a part on the ambush put on him. Neither song contradicts the message in Dear Mama.

In fact some direct lyrics from Dear Mama:

"I moved out and started really hangin
I needed money of my own so I started slangin
I ain't guilty cause, even though I sell rocks
It feels good puttin money in your mailbox
I love payin rent when the rent's due
I hope ya got the diamond necklace that I sent to you"​

"And there's no way I can pay you back
But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated"​

Now with respect to Hail Mary:

"Mama told me never stop until I bust a nut
**** the world if they can't adjust, it's just as well, Hail Mary"

"Hell, 'til I reach Hell, I ain't scared
Mama checking in my bedroom, I ain't there
I got a head with no screws in it, what can I do?
One life to live but I got nothing to lose
Just me and you on a one way trip to prison
Selling drugs, we all wrapped up in this living life as thugs"


Now I don't see a contradiction between either song about his promise with his mother. However, I think I can see a potential misunderstanding.

See, you may have misinterpreted Dear Mama into being a song about him reevaluating his life style in order to make good to his mother based on the lyrics:

"But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated"​

However, unlike forum posts, in rap lyrics we should consider what precedes the conjunction:

""And there's no way I can pay you back"​

This makes it a measured response. Tupac admits that he can't pay his mother back, however his intentions are to reach out to her on his own accord to have her understand she is appreciated. You issued the statement:

There was no credibility he was trying to establish aside from stating his interest in using his own path to do what he could do to make his mother understand that he appreciates her. I don't understand how either of the songs you mentioned (one of them does not exist) and the one that does correlates with the message in Dear Mama demonstrates in any capacity that credibility was destroyed. Mainly because I don't see any strong credibility actually being established in Dear Mama. Maybe we have vastly different interpretations of the songs in question, however I beg to question if you even really bothered to review the actual lyrical content considering the fact that you gave me a song title that does not actually exist.

Going to comment on the second part a bit later because it's getting late.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Google told me that Lecrae is a Christian rapper. I've gone through three of his songs, which I'm betting is three more songs than you will bother to listen through to verify that I'm telling the truth. The songs that I've gone through with music videos:

1) All I Need Is You

2) Tell The World

3)Church Clothes

​

To reiterate these are just three songs and I don't know if Lecrae will become an atheist or suddenly decide to 180 his Christian reputation into the gutter. That's something God only knows, however I do know that he is not the only Chrisitan rapper and your insinuation that all rappers rely on profanity and sexual appeal through sensual attire is false as evidenced through the use of Google, Metro Lyrics, and Youtube. Three resources that should available to you if you took three seconds to seriously consider that your three point opinion could be wrong.

Dear Mama appears to be him being regretful about how he treated his mother.

F Them Up is not the title to any song by Tupac. There is a song with a similar name called Hit Em Up where he's calling out Biggie for having a part in him being shot. And another song called F Em All which also references his cred as a West Coast rapper and calls out Biggie again for playing a part on the ambush put on him. Neither song contradicts the message in Dear Mama.

In fact some direct lyrics from Dear Mama:

"I moved out and started really hangin
I needed money of my own so I started slangin
I ain't guilty cause, even though I sell rocks
It feels good puttin money in your mailbox
I love payin rent when the rent's due
I hope ya got the diamond necklace that I sent to you"​

"And there's no way I can pay you back
But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated"​

Now with respect to Hail Mary:

"Mama told me never stop until I bust a nut
**** the world if they can't adjust, it's just as well, Hail Mary"

"Hell, 'til I reach Hell, I ain't scared
Mama checking in my bedroom, I ain't there
I got a head with no screws in it, what can I do?
One life to live but I got nothing to lose
Just me and you on a one way trip to prison
Selling drugs, we all wrapped up in this living life as thugs"


Now I don't see a contradiction between either song about his promise with his mother. However, I think I can see a potential misunderstanding.

See, you may have misinterpreted Dear Mama into being a song about him reevaluating his life style in order to make good to his mother based on the lyrics:

"But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated"​

However, unlike forum posts, in rap lyrics we should consider what precedes the conjunction:

""And there's no way I can pay you back"​

This makes it a measured response. Tupac admits that he can't pay his mother back, however his intentions are to reach out to her on his own accord to have her understand she is appreciated. You issued the statement:

There was no credibility he was trying to establish aside from stating his interest in using his own path to do what he could do to make his mother understand that he appreciates her. I don't understand how either of the songs you mentioned (one of them does not exist) and the one that does correlates with the message in Dear Mama demonstrates in any capacity that credibility was destroyed. Mainly because I don't see any strong credibility actually being established in Dear Mama. Maybe we have vastly different interpretations of the songs in question, however I beg to question if you even really bothered to review the actual lyrical content considering the fact that you gave me a song title that does not actually exist.

Going to comment on the second part a bit later because it's getting late.

Ohh, if only people were dedicated to more useful stuff than, this. It's been years, like I remember this 'music' like that, thankfully I forgot and I'll never look back. But man oh this generation makes me lose braincells from trying to fathom why are people so dam stupid in their choices of understanding, meh.

I'm against ALL Rap, it just makes the Rap industry live on which is not my or any other smart people that have a mindset to understand that, this is garbage waste of space, 'music'. I remember I wrote somewhere that 'change some parts of Hip hop but at the end of the day the mainstream which is the body will be the true bane in existences'. And I know that will NEVER change so, dream big.

So, Rappers don't have 'credibility' then, right? Guess that stuff LL CoolJ said about him growing in the streets and making a difference, hmm, you want to make a difference? KILL THE MAIN REASON. And the irony is the next song, what do you know, it's 'f this' 'f that' 'something bs and repetitive'. LOL, Tupac was the 'real person' to look up to, therefore, he has, credibility. So, your logic is asphyxiate irrelevant.

This honestly can't be taken seriously, why in the world is this so dam serious. The biggest part of diversity bs generation madness is, Hip hop. It's ALWAYS been the bane and always will be. And people like you will NEVER accept the facts and 'evidence' that many seek, well, it's there now quit bulling around. Oh, and let's just forgot about, Trayvon Martin and the NYPD. Also, for the record one of the cops was, Asian and they had nothing to do with anything of police brutality in that matter, it's all done by White men (Causation) check the facts I'm not 'stutting'. Keeping it 'gangsta' and chasing that 'pappa' straight up 'shot calling' keeping it '100'. LMAO! Oh society, delusional like taking a bunch of Cough syrup and watching The Wiker man by Nicholas Cage and enjoying it.

 

[mark welford]

Google told me that Lecrae is a Christian rapper. I've gone through three of his songs, which I'm betting is three more songs than you will bother to listen through to verify that I'm telling the truth. The songs that I've gone through with music videos:

1) All I Need Is You

2) Tell The World

3)Church Clothes

​

To reiterate these are just three songs and I don't know if Lecrae will become an atheist or suddenly decide to 180 his Christian reputation into the gutter. That's something God only knows, however I do know that he is not the only Chrisitan rapper and your insinuation that all rappers rely on profanity and sexual appeal through sensual attire is false as evidenced through the use of Google, Metro Lyrics, and Youtube. Three resources that should available to you if you took three seconds to seriously consider that your three point opinion could be wrong.

Dear Mama appears to be him being regretful about how he treated his mother.

F Them Up is not the title to any song by Tupac. There is a song with a similar name called Hit Em Up where he's calling out Biggie for having a part in him being shot. And another song called F Em All which also references his cred as a West Coast rapper and calls out Biggie again for playing a part on the ambush put on him. Neither song contradicts the message in Dear Mama.

In fact some direct lyrics from Dear Mama:

"I moved out and started really hangin
I needed money of my own so I started slangin
I ain't guilty cause, even though I sell rocks
It feels good puttin money in your mailbox
I love payin rent when the rent's due
I hope ya got the diamond necklace that I sent to you"​

"And there's no way I can pay you back
But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated"​

Now with respect to Hail Mary:

"Mama told me never stop until I bust a nut
**** the world if they can't adjust, it's just as well, Hail Mary"

"Hell, 'til I reach Hell, I ain't scared
Mama checking in my bedroom, I ain't there
I got a head with no screws in it, what can I do?
One life to live but I got nothing to lose
Just me and you on a one way trip to prison
Selling drugs, we all wrapped up in this living life as thugs"


Now I don't see a contradiction between either song about his promise with his mother. However, I think I can see a potential misunderstanding.

See, you may have misinterpreted Dear Mama into being a song about him reevaluating his life style in order to make good to his mother based on the lyrics:

"But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated"​

However, unlike forum posts, in rap lyrics we should consider what precedes the conjunction:

""And there's no way I can pay you back"​

This makes it a measured response. Tupac admits that he can't pay his mother back, however his intentions are to reach out to her on his own accord to have her understand she is appreciated. You issued the statement:

There was no credibility he was trying to establish aside from stating his interest in using his own path to do what he could do to make his mother understand that he appreciates her. I don't understand how either of the songs you mentioned (one of them does not exist) and the one that does correlates with the message in Dear Mama demonstrates in any capacity that credibility was destroyed. Mainly because I don't see any strong credibility actually being established in Dear Mama. Maybe we have vastly different interpretations of the songs in question, however I beg to question if you even really bothered to review the actual lyrical content considering the fact that you gave me a song title that does not actually exist.

Going to comment on the second part a bit later because it's getting late.

thank you for trying to make him see that not all of it is bad but people will believe what they want to believe. And Dear Mama is a song that makes me tear up every time I hear it because it makes me think all the things my mom has done for me in my 16 going on 17 years of life. Can I recommend you go see the video?

90% of any music genre is absolute garbage. And 90% of that garbage is hurting-the-cause, ruining-the-reputation abominations whose ultimate fate is to be torn to shreds by a angry canadian youtuber (and I say Canadian because that's supposed to tip you off that I'm referencing someone).

btw are Earth, Wind and Fire all one band/group/whatever, or are those all individual bands/groups/whatever?



Al Capone is doing a Spin Dash in his grave.

that is there name Earth, Wind and Fire and yes they're one group look them up you might recognize 1 or 2 of their songs. Actually their song Shining Star was on one of the Lilo & Stitch movies.

 

[TheVillainous]

Considering schools are teaching children exactly how to say no to drugs and the different ways of telling no because people are obviously that stupid to not know how to say no, lie, or back out of something and due to the fact that most kids can't even get past the first level of super mario bros then yes. We did lose a generation.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Considering schools are teaching children exactly how to say no to drugs and the different ways of telling no because people are obviously that stupid to not know how to say no, lie, or back out of something and due to the fact that most kids can't even get past the first level of super mario bros then yes. We did lose a generation.

The Mario one gave me a laugh, well done.

Edit: All true man, you hushed many like that, now I have a question, what are your thoughts and knowledge through the overrated, Hip hop.

 

[LightlyToasted]

Considering schools are teaching children exactly how to say no to drugs and the different ways of telling no because people are obviously that stupid to not know how to say no, lie, or back out of something and due to the fact that most kids can't even get past the first level of super mario bros then yes. We did lose a generation.

While a funny anecdote the fact that younger kids can't get past the first level of an older platformer is rather irrelevant considering the amount of new non indie platformers that exist today.(the majority of game listed here are 2005 and earlier) And if your evidence is the kids react, that is anecdotal at best as many of the interviewed kids are not big gamers.

Also you imply that the fact that programs attempting to teach students to say no to drugs automatically makes that group of kids stupid. That is quite a large leap to make with no evidence, and considering you list as being born in 1990, if you grew up in America then that would mean you were part of the biggest generation the D.A.R.E program targeted. The drug education program was most active, considering they received a $13 million boost in funding around the time you likely would have been in middle school. D.A.R.E has also been shown to be quite ineffective possibly leading to more drug use from curiosity and experimentation. ( Yes I remember the Hilarity of getting the pencil that said "Friends don't let friends do drugs...." And sharpening it down to have it eventual read "Let friends do drugs" and finally "do drugs.")

Some posts here have ******* about kids with iphones, when I am sure they grew up with a personal or family pc. A concept that would have been ridiculous in the years proceeding. As it evolves and becomes cheaper to obtain it ends up being taken for granted. Just something that comes with technology. The concept of even owning books before the printing press was ridiculous. If you look at a book like the bible, something that while contested most state it would take a skilled monk/coppyist 6-10 months to write at todays minimum wage of around 8 dollars an hour, that would be $10,000+ worth of labor alone. And that is undershooting the cost.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Intermittently, my theory perpetually synthesize me deliberately fascinated beneficially, and obligingly as by virtue of what umpteen are destituted approximately. Whence society is just deficient in their apothegm, demeanor, connective nonsensical.

Edit: Boy this gave me a laugh.

 

[LightlyToasted]

Intermittently, my theory perpetually synthesize me deliberately fascinated beneficially, and obligingly as by virtue of what umpteen are destituted approximately. Whence society is just deficient in their apothegm, demeanor, connective nonsensical.

Edit: Boy this gave me a laugh.

(I get this may not be relevant to the thread conversation change, and I understand that English probably isn't your first language, but when posting you should try to use simpler words, so we can be sure we know what you are typing, and can understand that what you say is actually the point you convey. You are not really making a point in that post, as it lacks a concrete subject, and while grammar isn't always an issue, this is one case where subject verb agreement DOES change what you might be trying to say. Thanks and sorry for the off topic post)

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

(I get this may not be relevant to the thread conversation change, and I understand that English probably isn't your first language, but when posting you should try to use simpler words, so we can be sure we know what you are typing, and can understand that what you say is actually the point you convey. You are not really making a point in that post, as it lacks a concrete subject, and while grammar isn't always an issue, this is one case where subject verb agreement DOES change what you might be trying to say. Thanks and sorry for the off topic post)

Sigh, I know, I hope you've noticed the "edit" where it means something. I'm aware of that thanks for pointing out the obvious.

 

[LightlyToasted]

I thought that may be what you meant, but with how you've responded previously in this thread I wasn't sure of the "this gave me a laugh" was self referential or not.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Idk why I did that, but I did, I guess I was brushing up on my big words that mean the same-thing as I'm writing.

Anyways, let me just write to you this, do you feel the world is a better place now, or not?

When you walk down or drive your car, do you see a world that is meant to look like this. And In my peaceful neighborhood, someone robbed an old lady. Thank God she wasn't home or they would have killed her.

And get this, she told me that was her son that wants to kill her for insurance money. I'll stop here since I know there will be an answer that wont really show if we really lost a generation or not. But through evidence and a particular object in everyone's faces. I see we have no doubt lost a generation which in other words doomed for humanity.

 

[Sucumbio]

So long as there's an Olympics I feel like the world is going on okay.

 

[greatbernard]

Stupid people always existed. They're just more televised now. Idiots back then didn't have instagram to share their idiocy to the world. But on the positive side, intelligent creative people have more tools than ever to better the world.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

More like everyone that follows the media will show their ideology of "how to become a moron 101". Idk what this "better" atm is; if by you mean people are being more stubborn towards whatsoever the concept my be (good or bad), then yes! They also have a wonderful super power to deny the difference of opinions, even if the concept makes sense which is the truth. I just believe people can act more manner-like with their choice of action and voice. I feel it's the people around them (media and family) that suppresses this theory of mine.

 

[Undrdog]

Normally don't meander back here, but I'd like to throw out some suggested reading. Research a bit about how the "No Child Left Behind Act" plays nicely with the "H-1B" initiative. This in combination with our obsession with a double standard on freedom is the backbone of the issue.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

I'll take a stab at this statement of yours; I believe you're implying the true conundrum of this issue is our phenomenal, sensational, tremendous, and awe-inspiring society, right? If so then affirmative, I accede that our society is trying any program to balance the bs that perambulates throughout society.

Finally someone gets it! The freedom to do whatever the flip you want to do is totally irrelevant, the means to fathom this monstrously is totally behind my chemical Brain balance understanding of my reach.

Edit: Btw @
Undrdog

What is your take on society's awe-inspiring music wise towards attitude, living, and fulfillment. And I believe you're Underdog the Pit main since 2009 debut appearance (brawl), right?

 

[Callu-chan]

Just as a disclaimer, I did not read the entire thread, just the first post and I want to offer my opinion.

The following is a post regarding the economic fall of America in regards to immigrants filling jobs. I will address popular social norms in another post, because I know long paragraphs of rambling can be tough to follow...

Firstly, the power of empires and nations have always changed throughout history, and in the age of communication and technology the ability to see that is greater than ever. First it was the Romans, then the French, then the British, then America (this happened around post-WWII) and now the change is shifting to countries in Asia like China and India. The reason for this shift is because of a major cultural difference between the west and the east. Productivity and reproduction is so much higher in countries like China and India because its embedded in their culture, and seeing that western culture promotes liberty and choosing ones own future (not a bad thing, also not saying that eastern countries are lacking liberty) it is only inevitable that a culture that breeds a more productive and organized future will overtake America. But in the end its the numbers that really matter, and in the matter of reproduction it is common for families in eastern countries to have 5 or more children, whereas in the west it is more common to have 2-3. So America "losing" is only inevitable when eastern cultures, cultures designed to win, win.

None of the above is saying, Asia is better than the West. You've probably heard the stories of child exploitation in the east for things like labour, war and etc. So with the above being said, just because one system is the most efficient, doesn't mean its the best (morally or politically).

So to summarize my first paragraph; I have grown up being taught to respect all races, colours, and nationalities. To judge a person based on their personal traits, not based on who they are associated with or where they come from. No matter where you come from, you have to try if you want to be successful. Just because you have an Asian doctor, does not mean that he only got the job because he is associated with a race commonly known for being intellectual. He had to try at some point. So if Americans wish to keep jobs filled equally by immigrants and Americans, then they cannot just sit back and wonder why they feel so underrepresented in the workplace. They have to get off their asses and do something about it. If you do not try, then you will never achieve what you are looking for.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

You'd be flabbergasted man, America is "laid back" more than Hippies like the Peace, love motto of their lifestyle.

Also same-here I've been taught more than well about race and such. Yes there are some people like you me and a few others that live this way (work respect and such). But what about the other quantities?

 

[Braydon]

I'd say that not only has America lost a generation, but most of the developed world seems to have been similarly effected, if not to the same degree. Some people may mention the problems of previous generations, but the difference is the prevalence of these issues in the current generation. Yes previous generations have had drugs and violence but it wasn't as common. Yes previous generations had racism, but the current generation has developed a multitude of new ways to arbitrarily discriminate against people.

Some people like to blame hip hop, I don't see it as a cause but a symptom, however it does illustrate the point about this generation, how so many people are fine with violence and depravity.

If I had to say the one thing I thought had the worst impact, I'd probably say the news media. It's destructive on multiple fronts, first of all it actually really only isolates people from news. Once news corporations realized they could draw bigger crowds while reporting on scandals they started trying to make everything into a scandal, and stopped actual reporting. This took reporting away from anything decent that ever happens in the world, and they essentially sold out hope, everyday it's the same story, "____" was murdered by "_____", (insert country) in crisis, terrorists springing back.

Further more sadly a lot of people follow with the news medias attempts to make anything into a scandal, they see them making accusations and pointing fingers at people and see it as authorization for they themselves to be accusatory and condescending.

The biggest problem with the news though, is it's influence on politics. In order for anyone to stand a chance of being elected to office they need to be heard through the media, but the media will only spend time on perceived major candidates, meaning republicans and democrats. There's no way for an independent to stand a chance, so the government is for all intensive purposes to bickering dynasties, the two parties produce puppet candidates that allow the parties to entirely control the government.

I think idiots see this shambling wreck of a government, and they take it out on the values it claims to represent, even though it's really

 

[Callu-chan]

I'd say that not only has America lost a generation, but most of the developed world seems to have been similarly effected, if not to the same degree. Some people may mention the problems of previous generations, but the difference is the prevalence of these issues in the current generation. Yes previous generations have had drugs and violence but it wasn't as common. Yes previous generations had racism, but the current generation has developed a multitude of new ways to arbitrarily discriminate against people.

Some people like to blame hip hop, I don't see it as a cause but a symptom, however it does illustrate the point about this generation, how so many people are fine with violence and depravity.

If I had to say the one thing I thought had the worst impact, I'd probably say the news media. It's destructive on multiple fronts, first of all it actually really only isolates people from news. Once news corporations realized they could draw bigger crowds while reporting on scandals they started trying to make everything into a scandal, and stopped actual reporting. This took reporting away from anything decent that ever happens in the world, and they essentially sold out hope, everyday it's the same story, "____" was murdered by "_____", (insert country) in crisis, terrorists springing back.

Further more sadly a lot of people follow with the news medias attempts to make anything into a scandal, they see them making accusations and pointing fingers at people and see it as authorization for they themselves to be accusatory and condescending.

The biggest problem with the news though, is it's influence on politics. In order for anyone to stand a chance of being elected to office they need to be heard through the media, but the media will only spend time on perceived major candidates, meaning republicans and democrats. There's no way for an independent to stand a chance, so the government is for all intensive purposes to bickering dynasties, the two parties produce puppet candidates that allow the parties to entirely control the government.

I think idiots see this shambling wreck of a government, and they take it out on the values it claims to represent, even though it's really

Braydon, I'd like to correct you. Drug use has increased over the past few decades, however it is currently the same as it was in the 1980s. Racism is at an all time low. I know you may think that with recent events like the shooting in Ferguson indicate increasing racism, but the truth is that is a single incident, not apart of a recent trend all over the USA. People are generally more respectful towards different races now than in the 20th century.

I do actually agree with you on news media to a point. Some news institutions - like CNN - rely so heavily on the news to turn a profit, that the main goal becomes to make drama out of almost nothing. This can actually result in things like fear mongering. But there are news institutions that are still trustworthy, like the CBC in Canada, or the BBC in the UK. These institutions actually report the news without bias. So not all hope is lost on that front.

True, that media has influence on politics, but is it from this that results in the two party majority. The two parties became the majority parties long before media became a strong influence on politics. The media may exacerbate the problem, but small parties not being able to make a difference in the political landscape is a result of democrats and republicans representing majority of the USA's views and the FPTP voting system. The smaller parties would have a better chance at making a difference if they were elected on the STV system.

 

[Braydon]

Braydon, I'd like to correct you. Drug use has increased over the past few decades, however it is currently the same as it was in the 1980s. Racism is at an all time low. I know you may think that with recent events like the shooting in Ferguson indicate increasing racism, but the truth is that is a single incident, not apart of a recent trend all over the USA. People are generally more respectful towards different races now than in the 20th century.

I do actually agree with you on news media to a point. Some news institutions - like CNN - rely so heavily on the news to turn a profit, that the main goal becomes to make drama out of almost nothing. This can actually result in things like fear mongering. But there are news institutions that are still trustworthy, like the CBC in Canada, or the BBC in the UK. These institutions actually report the news without bias. So not all hope is lost on that front.

True, that media has influence on politics, but is it from this that results in the two party majority. The two parties became the majority parties long before media became a strong influence on politics. The media may exacerbate the problem, but small parties not being able to make a difference in the political landscape is a result of democrats and republicans representing majority of the USA's views and the FPTP voting system. The smaller parties would have a better chance at making a difference if they were elected on the STV system.

If you look at statistics for high school students you see an entirely different story for this generation, with 35% of twelfth graders having use marijuana. I didn't say we had more racism now I said kids made up new ways to arbitrarily discriminate. However I wouldn't say racism was at an all time low I'd just say people tried harder to hide it.

I don't know anything about Canadian news honestly, or British news, I kind of just glazed over it because the thread is mainly about Americans, and also there are people who are not Americans, who will follow the terrible example set forth by Americans, so the effect on America does have an effect abroad though to a lesser degree.

The media I'd say is largely to blame for party line voters, they like to project one part as good and the other as evil, and brainwashing people into thinking that if they don't vote for one party the evil monsters will take over and ruin their lives. Almost no one truly has the same exact values as either party, they're just convinced evil will destroy everything they hold dear if they do not vote for a certain party.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Anyone read that and heard that, Obama is the lowest/worst president to ever take control of, America? They even said they would rather have a Middle Eastern man (forgot name) to run for office than this monstrosity. The fact that even congress is even IMPLYING foreign presidents contain a more sophisticated intellectual understanding than their own Candidates that are trained for years to run for office is so saddening and at the same time refreshing. Why? Americans can learn that their precious "change" person who promised "change" oh and "change" has truly "changed" the perception of how terrible you can create a president to run for office.

"Can we do it"? "Yes we can"! Very saddening isn't it? Another reason towards generation not lost but taken over by other foreign countries dictatorship. What more does this need to stand as? I guess until America gets taken over completely then MAYBE people will understand that yes "we're MORE THAN TERRIBLE" compared to the the older generations that wouldn't even commit half the bs newer generations are committing at the moment. My apologies for the off track topic but someone had to write it. Thanks.

 

[howbadisbad]

Anyone read that and heard that, Obama is the lowest/worst president to ever take control of, America? They even said they would rather have a Middle Eastern man (forgot name) to run for office than this monstrosity. The fact that even congress is even IMPLYING foreign presidents contain a more sophisticated intellectual understanding than their own Candidates that are trained for years to run for office is so saddening and at the same time refreshing. Why? Americans can learn that their precious "change" person who promised "change" oh and "change" has truly "changed" the perception of how terrible you can create a president to run for office.

"Can we do it"? "Yes we can"! Very saddening isn't it? Another reason towards generation not lost but taken over by other foreign countries dictatorship. What more does this need to stand as? I guess until America gets taken over completely then MAYBE people will understand that yes "we're MORE THAN TERRIBLE" compared to the the older generations that wouldn't even commit half the bs newer generations are committing at the moment. My apologies for the off track topic but someone had to write it. Thanks.

Using "take control of America" with the executive office is misleading, the executive office (the presidency) is not what runs this country, the legislative branch is what primarily runs this country.

All of the 'change' is singularly dependent on the house and senate, obama is a figurehead when it comes to things like obamacare, he most likely had the entire idea created and presented to him by his party members behind the scenes so that he could present it to the general public.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Using "take control of America" with the executive office is misleading, the executive office (the presidency) is not what runs this country, the legislative branch is what primarily runs this country.

All of the 'change' is singularly dependent on the house and senate, obama is a figurehead when it comes to things like obamacare, he most likely had the entire idea created and presented to him by his party members behind the scenes so that he could present it to the general public.

Well yes but the president still has a few says when congress agrees about useless projects and such. The fact still remains ans by congress man that he is the worst president in the history of the fourty three presidents. That says a lot man a lot. That also effects America btw. But I understand what you're ranting about. Thanks.

 

[DrXenoPootis]

Would like to take part of this argument, yes?

I believe that, no, United States of America is NOT losing a generation. While yes there are the usual unintelligent trends created by dumbfounded teens, its always happening in every generation. Sure some other countries are becoming a adequate competitor in education (For instance, Finland), but the US still has a solid educational system. Its just that children today are more exposed to idiotic trends, due to the Internet and the easy access to it.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

By all means join up. Hmm

 

[Undrdog]

I'll take a stab at this statement of yours; I believe you're implying the true conundrum of this issue is our phenomenal, sensational, tremendous, and awe-inspiring society, right? If so then affirmative, I accede that our society is trying any program to balance the bs that perambulates throughout society.

Finally someone gets it! The freedom to do whatever the flip you want to do is totally irrelevant, the means to fathom this monstrously is totally behind my chemical Brain balance understanding of my reach.

Edit: Btw @
Undrdog

What is your take on society's awe-inspiring music wise towards attitude, living, and fulfillment. And I believe you're Underdog the Pit main since 2009 debut appearance (brawl), right?

A little late to the reply, but meh. Anyway I personally don't know much about current music as I don't listen to much of it. Or any. I'm a little out of touch in this way.

Also I am that Pit main. Though the majority of my Smashing came during the Melee days from 2002 onward. ^_^

 

[Xxaz_v]

I read everything. And I have something to say. America did not lose a generation, America made a huge ****in generational gap. A Childs parents could love listening to frank Sinatra, but the child love to listen to Turn down for propane what. The style is COMPLETY different. If you try to get a 60 year old to use a computer, chances are, they aren't gonna be very good at it. But if you try to get a 12 year old to use a computer, they'll be port forwarding that **** in seconds. I don't think I did a very good job explaining what I mean, so if someone understands me, you get a gold sticker.

 

[ELITEWarri0r115]

I'd say America lost it's generation. I'm in the mix too. Watching youtube and playing my 3ds, wii, and little xbox 360... I feel like i'm wasting myself inside instead of going outside to take care of my 50+ rabbits and 6 chickens. I feel like i'm behind in school (all of my classes are A+ through B and my Math is D-) When I want to get up and actually DO stuff, I don't. It is addicting and I can't stop. I'd say America did loose a Generation because kids are choosing entertainment over learning.

 

[Sucumbio]

Video games are definitely addictive for children. I have been playing them for over 30 years, with no end in sight. Meanwhile my folks who loved atari at first, gave it up within less than 6 months. We're the inly current generation of adults who play video games and that says a lot about the power these games hold over our society.

 

[ZeekLTK]

I would argue the opposite - that the current generations are much better than the previous ones. It feels like most people over 40 are the ones with the backward views... they are racists, bigots, homophobic, xenophobic, closed minded, nationalistic, etc. They are the ones supporting bad policies like immigration controls, gun controls, war on drugs, war on Islam, etc. Most people under 40 are much more liberty-minded.

I'd like to assume that these are not views that you grow into when you get older, and that the only reason they have them is because those were the prevailing views when they were growing up in the 1940s-1970s. If that is the case, then it's just a matter of waiting about 40 years for them all to have mostly died off and have the national ideology that is currently only popular among young people today become the prevailing attitude of the future.

 

[Pachinkosam]

Most people over 40 are the ones with the backward views... they are racists, bigots, homophobic, xenophobic, closed minded, nationalistic, etc.

Yeah baby boomers and silent generation are like that.