Cubone's Ladder! Summer Ladder begins!

[Ray Robo]

lol Cubone. And yes though, SSBB without CP's is defeating part of the strategy in the game. Also confirming smash64 beat me.

 

[kirbywizard]

I just realized I can still sign up @___@

kirbywizard/Mr.2/ 1418-6396-6440/

 

[Aibou]

I just realized I can still sign up @___@

kirbywizard/Mr.2/ 1418-6396-6440/

You just need to give a name. You can use whomever you want. :bigthumbu

 

[#HBC | J]

I just realized I can still sign up @___@

kirbywizard/Mr.2/ 1418-6396-6440/

Yay you finally did it :D


BTW 500th POST!!!!! ^^

 

[kirbywizard]

You just need to give a name. You can use whomever you want. :bigthumbu

Ok then

I'm just used to using the old formatting when signing up.

 

[Knubs.]

I beated Ben, 4-1.

 

[#HBC | J]

Bren vs. 8bit (0-3)

vs. =

vs. =

vs. =


8bit won ;p

 

[Jimmyfosho]

lost to bren 3-0

 

[Cubone]

SoRay vs smash64

vs @ smashville =

vs @ smashville =

vs @ Final Destination =

Sonic Storm vs smash64

vs @ Final Destination =

vs @ Brinstar =

vs @ Smashville =

vs @ Frigate =

lost to zen yesterday, 3-1

/ ENNH vs Exn

1. vs at SV = Exn
2. vs at BF = Exn
3. vs at BF = ENNH
4. vs at FD = Exn

Bren vs. 8bit (0-3)

vs. =

vs. =

vs. =


8bit won ;p

lost to bren 3-0

Adding these and Me > jimmy and my bro > Jimmy.

 

[Aibou]

my bro > Jimmy.

You're joking...

 

[Jimmyfosho]

hooraw for being 1-13.. or 1-14.. w/e lol

 

[Aibou]

I lost to Cubone.

*insert johns here*

 

[PrinceRamen]

Cubone I'm joining your ladder. o.o

/+1

 

[Knubs.]

I lost to Cubone.

*insert johns here*

****, so a tornado hit your house while playing brawl and feeding the childern similtaneously? That sucks.

 

[Cubone]

I lost to Cubone.

*I suck at inputting what I really meant to do*

John inserted.

Cubone I'm joining your ladder. o.o

/+1

Gotcha bro.

 

[Aibou]

****, so a tornado hit your house while playing brawl and feeding the childern similtaneously? That sucks.

Yeah it does suck...But I'm still alive.



Even after Ramen giving me a painful 3-0.

< on SV (Peach didn't do so bad)
< on BF (gimped him, but then he caught up cuz his Snake doesn't DIE)
< on YI (3 stock obv)

Overall, Peach did better than I expected, though I got a little desperate trying to get kills. GGs, Ramen.


Getting wrecked by Ramen's Snake so much yesterday made me want to use Snake even more now. ^_^

<3 <3

 

[Jimmyfosho]

kwiz decided to join the ladder and played me and i lost hooraw i lost all of my points amirite?

vs @ Battlefield =
vs @ Port Town Aero Drive =
vs @ Pokemon Stadium (Melee) =

olimars broken grab range johns

 

[Cubone]

In the process of modifying the stage list. Mostly additions but feedback is good. The new list right now is looking something like this.

Neutral

Final Destination
Smashville
Battlefield
Halberd
Lylat Cruise
Pokemon Stadium 1
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Castle Siege (Previously CP)
Delfino Plaza (Previously CP)

Counter Pick

Brinstar
Frigate Orpheon
Rainbow Cruise
Jungle Japes
Pirate Ship
Pictochat
Norfair
Luigis Mansion
Green Greens
Port Town Aero Drive
Corneria
Yoshis Island (Melee) (New)
Big Blue* (New)
Summit* (New)
Pokemon Stadium 2 (New)

* = I want to test the stage with people before a final decision is made.

Rumble Falls is teetering, if it can gain enough support it will also be added as a cp.

One last thing, with such a huge stage list I'm considering making it 2 bans instead of 1. Opinions plox

 

[#HBC | J]

Okay 2 bans please :D

And just something from me,

make Corneria, YI (melee), Big Blue, and Summit GTFO! Goodness I really dislike those stages.

Otherwise Q, I <3 this new stagelist cuz it is like MLG.

Otherwise I will test out these stages for you but wow these will make things interesting to say the least. Good job Q. ^-^

 

[Cubone]

Okay 2 bans please :D

And just something from me,

make Corneria, YI (melee), Big Blue, and Summit GTFO! Goodness I really dislike those stages.

Otherwise Q, I <3 this new stagelist cuz it is like MLG.

Otherwise I will test out these stages for you but wow these will make things interesting to say the least. Good job Q. ^-^

Disliking a stage isn't enough to make it banned xD. Productive arguments at least

777 posts.

 

[Mr. Johan]

I'll gladly challenge people on the arguable stages, like Rumble Falls, Summit, and Big Blue, so we can get data on this. I'll try and use it in matches whenever anyone else will allow it.

With that in mind, list looks good.

 

[boo13]

Hi. Can I join this?
Name: Boo
Thanks

 

[Cubone]

Hi. Can I join this?
Name: Boo
Thanks

Just hang out at the chat and once a match gets done and reported I'll add you to the list.

 

[#HBC | J]

well if I dislike it it should automatically be banned. Just saying xD

but nah Corneria some characters have infinites though now that I have one of those characters in my arsenal maybe it isn't that bad a stage >;D

Big Blue people die waaaay too much because of SDing on the road.

YI (melee) the stages middle part is a death trap waiting to happen and the side boundaries are so small. Plus D3 has infinites there. (if I remember correctly)

Summit.......3 words......big ****in FISH! Gah that fish has taken so many of my stocks it is starting to look like wailord. Plus when the stage moves it has the same effect as BB. And some characters will be at a disadvantage here as well.

Imo i just don't like em but ill brawl people on them as well to help with your research.

Btw how many people are on this ladder now :O

 

[Cubone]

well if I dislike it it should automatically be banned. Just saying xD

but nah Corneria some characters have infinites though now that I have one of those characters in my arsenal maybe it isn't that bad a stage >;D

Several stages have places for infinites to be set up, (usually only limited times but still)

Big Blue people die waaaay too much because of SDing on the road.

Their fault.

YI (melee) the stages middle part is a death trap waiting to happen and the side boundaries are so small. Plus D3 has infinites there. (if I remember correctly)

He has the walk off (I thought the hill stopped it but it might not) but the blocks in the center can still disrupt. Other stages still grant walkoffs and infites though.

Summit.......3 words......big ****in FISH! Gah that fish has taken so many of my stocks it is starting to look like wailord. Plus when the stage moves it has the same effect as BB. And some characters will be at a disadvantage here as well.

That fish should not be much issue at all. Its avoidable even after you hit the water.

Imo i just don't like em but ill brawl people on them as well to help with your research.

Btw how many people are on this ladder now :O

I think theres ... 24 or so this season. Still have some updates to get in.

 

[ElNoNombreHombre]

In the process of modifying the stage list. Mostly additions but feedback is good. The new list right now is looking something like this.

Neutral

Final Destination
Smashville
Battlefield
Halberd
Lylat Cruise
Pokemon Stadium 1
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Castle Siege (Previously CP)
Delfino Plaza (Previously CP)

I'm always for more starters. If MLG did anything right, it's that they used a large starter list--better odds of getting a neutral starting stage for both characters.

Yoshis Island (Melee) (New)
Big Blue* (New)
Summit* (New)
Pokemon Stadium 2 (New)

YI (melee):
Two things bug me about this stage,

1. The strange sliding along the ground mechanics (no friction whatsoever)
2. The walkoff on the right side

I don't know how the upward sloping of the right-side walkoff affects CGs and the like, but I have not typically been inhibited by smaller hills on other stages.

Other than that, there's nothing I personally object to.

Opinion: Weak Yea (For testing purposes)

Big Blue:
Now, I really like this stage (it just feels so epic), but on WiFi, any input delay gets magnified. This is not something you want when a match matters. I CPed this stage against Aibou for STTA#1. I don't normally have a problem going from car-to-car but the input delay was making it really difficult.

Opinion: Weak Yea (Because it's sheer awesomeness gives it the nod over a neutral stance)

Summit:
No. The lack of edges, the hazards, the temporarily lowered gravity/wind don't bother me as much as the solid chunk of stage that prevents me from being able to get to my opponent.

I'm certainly willing to attempt to time someone out. My Pikachu nearly pulled a Wario routine against Josh's Ike for STTA#2 on Brinstar. If I have a tool such as a solid wall between me and my opponent, it'd just make it easier.

Circle camping makes this stage unviable.

Opinion: Nay (Circle camping FTL)

PS2:
My least favorite part of this stage is the ELECTRIC transformation. Those conveyor belts make it stupid hard to get back onstage if you're on the edge.

I've never found the ICE transformation to be a terribly big hindrance (though it'll probably be nasty vs the Ice Grabbers).

The GROUND transformation is pretty neutral. The steep side of the mound can act like a temporary wall, though.

I do love the AIR transformation though. Air camping with Thunder is just too much fun. But that's really the biggest problem: if one person doesn't have the tools to deal with an air camper, it allows the air camper to effectively stall for 30 seconds.

"But, but, MK dair!" You say. To that I say: "PIKA!"

Opinion: Yea (Because it's not as bad as people think it is)

 

[Mr. Johan]

You never realize the 7-frame input delay that Wi-fi provides until you suddenly fall onto the track and suicide.

The only thing I can think of against Summit and circle camping is that you would probably be banking on the ice's traction and increased trip rate, and water flow from the Polar Bear at the bottom, to hinder circle camping and allow people to catch up. But that's still banking on a random mechanic.

 

[sunshade]

Corneria
Yoshis Island (Melee) (New)
Big Blue* (New)
Summit* (New)

* = I want to test the stage with people before a final decision is made.

Rumble Falls is teetering, if it can gain enough support it will also be added as a cp.

One last thing, with such a huge stage list I'm considering making it 2 bans instead of 1. Opinions plox

I may not be an actual part of this ladder although I would strongly recommend against the use of Big Blue, Corneria, and Summit.

Summit is the easiest to dispute as competitive stage due to the solid block in the central area of a stage allowing a player to camp for an infinite amount of time assuming they are faster than their opponent. Circle camping is completely unbeatable assuming the player camping is at least somewhat competent as a player and is playing a faster character. The stage allows a player to literally always have a safe point to retreat to while using projectiles to deal damage. This ultra-defensive play style causes player skill to become significantly marginalized due to a single hit being all it takes to allow the camper to gain the all encompassing advantage of no longer being required to approach due to the timer being on his/her side.

Big Blue suffers the same fate as Summit although the circle camping is not a constant issue although it is as definite issue on a variety of transformations (The large falcon like car, the circular camera thingie, and the clustering of three aerial platforms). During the other portions of the combat the stage gives massive advantages to select members of the cast causing the stage even regardless of its serious issues with camping to become a hard counter to many characters in multiple match ups. Big Blue also shifts the style of play in a major way due to it causing shielding the most safe actions in the game to become a very dangerous choice due to shield push being capable of forcing a player off of the cars and onto a track throwing them into the grounded animation making it frame impossible to recover. Circle camping, a major shift in play style, and unacceptable amounts of influence on matches causes Big Blue to be in my opinion and the opinion of the BBR a non competitive stage.

Corneria unlike summit and big blue has zero issues with circle camping however the stage has major issues with camping of the typical variety. The fin area of the ship is a prime area to camp, there are no safe ways to approach someone camping the lower section (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAHlBz541H4Skip skip the first 4 minutes of the "fight") and fighting in the bottom area places characters at risk of being caught in innfinite down tilt locks, and chain grabs against the wall (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pY-RawBFqAo). The stage was legal for a while but after being played and abused in tournament the general consensus what that the stage is to advantage giving for competitive play.

I would also like to point out that the walk off on yoshi's island brawl is not an actual issue in terms of chaingrabs or infinites. Jupz did an amazing post on the topic and did research on who can be chaingrabbed on the stage and the conclussion was that only Lucario and wolf are actually affected (Wario, and DK can be chain grabbed up the slope but they can be chain grabbed on every stage. Ganondorf/Link could also be chaingrabbed but they have no chance in a serious match against an equally skilled D3 either way.)

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=244610 (Jupz's post)

In terms of Rumble falls I say go for it for the sake of testing but if you want a stage which has a less foreign style of play I would suggest Onett. The cars come every 13 seconds making grabs against the wall only repeatable for 2-3 grabs. The cars have set knockback and can never kill (assuming correct DI). The stages biggest concern is the use of walk off camping to marginalize percent advantages and escalate stock advantages however the cars severely diminish the effectiveness of this form of camping.

Just my two cents.

 

[Jimmyfosho]

keep all the stages.. more stages = more fun

 

[Aibou]

Yoshis Island (Melee) (New)
Big Blue* (New)
Summit* (New)
Pokemon Stadium 2 (New)

* = I want to test the stage with people before a final decision is made.

Rumble Falls is teetering, if it can gain enough support it will also be added as a cp.

One last thing, with such a huge stage list I'm considering making it 2 bans instead of 1. Opinions plox

Yoshi's Island...It's an OK stage, though the blast zones are incredulously small, the ceiling is small, and there is a walkoff. But meh, it's not so bad.


Big Blue...offline maybe since it's easier to control your character from SDing, but with LAG in effect, then SDing becomes way too common and removes any and all skill from the match. Take some friends there for a friendly FFA, but not an important 1vs1 match.


Summit...why even suggest this? The fish is the least of the problems here. The icy floor makes anyone but the Ice Climbers have worse traction than Luigi. There's NO ledge, so tether recoveries are screwed. And I'm sure no one would like getting eaten by the fish because of LAG.


PS2...that's a fine stage. The transformations, though more game changing than the Melee version of PS, are still only temporary and still fairly balanced (barring the Ice and Electric transformations). And who doesn't love jumping around in the wind transformation? <333



Cubone, I really think you should take into account that this is WIFI we're talking about. And that just saying that "Oh it's their own fault for SD'ing" isn't valid because of that. There's lag all over wifi, making stage hazards even harder to avoid. Especially hazards like those on Big Blue.

Just my opinion, but I really think you should take it into account.

 

[Cubone]

The road on big blue isn't nearly as deadly as everyone claims it to be. Lag could skew results on Big Blue but why would you try to cp it in lag?

Summit I doubt is going to make the cut anyway, but I haven't had the chance to test yet.


The 2nd ban is also being added for a reason.

 

[Jimmyfosho]

if big blue is legit.. and my opponent bans the CPs Port Town Aero drive & Corneria.. im definitely picking Big blue

 

[Aibou]

The road on big blue isn't nearly as deadly as everyone claims it to be. Lag could skew results on Big Blue but why would you try to cp it in lag?

If that's the case then why CP it at all? WiFi is lag. No matter how small, it's still there and can mess you up on an easy stage to die on like that. But whatever, I've said what I had to say. If Big Blue is a CP, then I guess I have a new ban...

 

[PrinceRamen]

Cubone I beat Jimmy, 3-0
Makes my score 5-0.

vs. = on Smashville

vs. = on Port Town: AD

vs. = on Rainbow Cruise

GGs!

 

[Jimmyfosho]

playing olimar is a pain in the .. lol but its always fun playing ramen..

GGs

 

[Cubone]

The lag wasn't bad enough earlier to affect it

I'll update tmw probally Ramen.

 

[Ray Robo]

Big Blue and Summit are a no no on wifi for me. I like the other stages but I'll have to test YI (melee) to see if it affects my CG.

 

[#HBC | J]

I love YI Melee for now on :3

Keep that and PS2

 

[Cubone]

Big Blue, PS2, and YI Melee will be added and 2 bans will be allowed. Delfino and Castle Seige will move up to starter position.

I'll the update the list to make it official here shortly.

 

[#HBC | J]

forgot to report these:


Jbandit vs. Jimmy (0-3)

vs. = (Battlefield)

vs. = (Port Town Aero Drive)

vs. = (Big Blue)


Jimmy won of course. I always lose to him.