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Critique thread (hoping to be stickied)

Lv.99

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
227
Location
Pondering questions
Greetings wolf boards. Not too long ago, a finally chose wolf as my secondary. Now, so I learn upfront what I'm doing wrong, I'm starting a critique thread.

Now wait...
before you form an angry mob and burn me at stake, let me say that this is to be a general critique thread. Judgement will pass on more than just I.

So, here are my most recent 1 on 1 battles...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkoR6byQ7P8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KV-RUNSuDXY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eo0zznTOHC0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDmbJqZQMfY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4xAaEBskC0

Thanks for any comments.

And please, don't spam
 

~ Gheb ~

Life is just a party
Joined
Jun 27, 2008
Messages
16,916
Location
Europe
Solid Wolf but there's room for improvement.

Some suggestions...

Needs more:

- Shield. You roll way too much. No Shieldgrabs despite many opportunities
- Bair. Wofs best move...don't underuse it like that (unless you have a very good reason...)
- 0 lag fair, a good alterneative finishing move, especially at high %

Needs less:

- Roll / Spotdodge...use a little more Shine and a lot more Shield to add variety to your defense
- fsmash. The ending lag leaves you open for too long. Use it for punishment only
- dsmash. Seriously, having troubles to finish off TL and Marth? Rather keep it fresh, instead of overusing it...
 

Lv.99

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
227
Location
Pondering questions
I know what you mean by the roll and spotdodge spam. But, I play R.O.B. The roll is a staple of his playstyle. It will take some time get a solid second style going. And, you advise less d-smash? I find it to be wonderful to end a combo with. But, it is one of the best kill moves.
 

~ Gheb ~

Life is just a party
Joined
Jun 27, 2008
Messages
16,916
Location
Europe
If you're having troubles to finish off a leightweight like TL or Marth, it's almost always b/c you overused your dsmash
 

ElPadrino

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
Messages
166
I don't mind him using spotdodges and rolls that much, he could use a little shield but Wolf's grabs arn't even that good.

You mostly us shine randomly and away from the oopnent, while it might be good for mindgames and whatnot, its just really not worth it, use shine as a counter and juggle-breaker... and of course reflecting projectiles <_<

Also I think you lack a bit of edgeguard, you just waited for the toon link to get back on stage most of the time, Wolf has exelent edgeguards when used correctly, such as Bair, Spike, down tilt, Nair and sometimes even shine.

And again the overuse of Down Smash, D-smashing TL on 146% and not killing him is almost blasphemy.

Everything else has been said.

Though you did pretty nice, that Toon Link was really good.
 

Captain Sa10

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 23, 2007
Messages
390
Your wolf's good and doesn't seem to have to many problems at all, if any that I could really find in plain site, so I had to look a bit deeper in your playing:

I figured your playstyle was unique like mines, so I didn't worry to much about the random shine here and there since I do the same, but just not from a distance and more near to them which can sometimes work as a strange approach, especially on battlefield. I also saw that you went for the wolf flash distant spike which is a maginificent implementation when you can land that 90% of the time (sometimes you miss but hey, it was worth a shot. And I can understand that it takes alot of interpretation in order to land it, which is why I always say advanced players should explore it a bit more). Although I understand you spotdodge alot due to Rob maining, but if anything it's not a bad thing, it's just that wolf's is not as good and can get him killed in some situations, so try and use it a bit less. D-smash was spammed a bit, but you still understood the uses of the other smashes so that's all I'll say towards that. Other then that, a very good wolf secondary, and seems you can hold a nice ground game with him. That TL was good though.
 

ArcPoint

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
1,183
Location
NorCal, California.
I honestly hate to be rather general, but the only real critique I can give you is simply "play smarter"

That was a very innovative Toon Link player, I have to admit that. But why were you trying to reflector away his Zair? It's not a projectile, it won't go back at him =S The only thing that could be useful there is the invincibility frames, which an airdodge or shield could have done. With a SH airdodge you could have buffered an Fsmash to punish his Zair. Just really simple things like that. This is really based on player's actions and your ability to read said player's actions. But it also requires a another skill: The ability to know what options you have. That is absolutely essential, this is why characters aren't just "Pick up and instantly be good with them" Because you have to know what they have available in order for you to be good with them.

So in essence, the above paragraph suggested that you get to know Wolf more, know the advantages and disadvantages to approaching with Bair vs Fair, know about how long it takes to SH vs a fast ground move, like Ftilt (Which starts just as fast Dsmash, just doesn't get both sides), know how punishable Fsmash is, and guage each time you use it whether you can get them without getting punished. Consider Wolf's Aerial mobility, how that affects spacing and how much of directional input you have to put in to achieve proper spacing. There is simply a crapload of crap that affects your game, that many people do not consider. The first step to becoming good with character is knowing about everything about them. With that knowledge you can do so much better than without.

In Smash, every frame counts, and you did a LOT of unnecessary spotdodges, those take up about a third of a second. 20 entire frames, in which you could have been moving towards an opponent or 20 frames that you could have used to properly space yourself against an advancing opponent. There was simply a lot of unnecessary things that were done, Dairs while above the stage, did you know that those Dairs are almost as bad as doing a fully lagged Fair? Seriously, Dair is for use off stage (Which you did do, impressive edgeguarding =D ) and NEVER on stage. It simply isn't worth it. Just try and avoid doing anything that is unnecessary, that doesn't contribute towards getting yourself out of a bad situation, getting percentage on your opponent or KOing them.

On the note of KOing... yeah, everyone pretty much got this one, save your Dsmash. The difference between a completely fresh Dsmash and the next best fresh is 2%, that may not seem like a lot, however it's the difference between your opponent living and your opponent getting KOed. Save it, it's Wolf's only reliable kill move, Fair may be decent... but your opponent is going to be on the ground (Dictated by gravity) More often than in the air =/. Plus Fair is a good solid move, so it shouldn't be completely fresh like your Dsmash should be...

Next I'll go over the shine, the shine is not as great as people would have you believe, yes, it has invincibility frames, yes, it stuns your opponent, yes, it has a lot of freakin' lag afterwards. Seriously, it should only be used defensively, not offensively unless you KNOW it's going to hit -- because otherwise you WILL get punished. And even if it's used defensively... you have faster options, Fsmash starts faster than Shine, so does Bair, Nair Uair, and possibly Fair (Not too sure on Fair)

Spotdodges and rolls... I don't care, just use them for your benefit.

All in all, not a bad Wolf, definitely a unique playstyle ^^

Oh, and Bair, RAR are your best friends, SPACE YOUR BAIRS WELL. Also keep in mind the aerial mobility for the spacing...blah I'm repeating myself.

This is rather long....
 

Lv.99

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
227
Location
Pondering questions
Wow guys, that's incredible. My friend made a critique board for my R.O.B. (yeah, that was weird to me too) and they never game me this detailed feedback. Now for some comments.

1.)I understand about saving d-smash. My main issue there is that I train against (spelling?) Lv.9 CPU's. They always take the d-smash wrong and I continue to combo them. Go figure.
2.) As for shines, most of them were on impulse so I knew they weren't going to be my best choice. Need to work on that.
3.) I am working on more RAR usage. B-air is (I think) his best approach.

And some extra stuff:
1.)How do I do a lagless f-air. I know there is a desciption elswhere but I think I would benefit more from step by step, what-to-do-when.
--------------------
Edit: What? I uploaded all the battles you recorded except for the super laggy one. I can't help it too much if I still suck with wolf.
 

VietGeek

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Messages
8,133
Immediately jump and do Fair at the same. Basically a rising Fair. You have to do it quick so I suggest Using X/Y + A instead of the C-stick (I don't know if you use that thing religiously though, you're name isn't Marth so probably not as much).

Yeah, me offering you advice is weird too isn't it?

EDIT: By jump, I mean shorthop. Knowing you personally, you may not have understood it that way. So, just to clarify.
 

ElPadrino

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
Messages
166
Yes what VietGeek said, though he forgot to mention that you can DI while doing a lagless Fair, therefore dividing it in two.

The most important Lagless Fair in my opinion is the retreating one, because even if you miss you won't be shield grabbed.

Then there's the persueing Lagless Fair, if the first one hits you can follow it up with another as soon as you land, or follow up with another move, this one is important too if you want to take the risk of your opponent shield grabbing you.
 

Ishiey

Mother Wolf
BRoomer
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
7,292
Location
Land's End (NorCal)
TBH, I only watched the video Viet posted up of you vs his marth (well, I watched a little bit of the other ones but don't remember any specifics), and I just keep wondering why you actually approached him during his fairs instead of hiding and blastering until he approaches you. I mean, nobody likes to spam, but the blaster does come in handy against anyone without projectiles, so use it to force an approach. Otherwise, very nice, I like how you dair as the opponent is getting up (probably so used to it from maining rob :laugh:).

Your wolf seems to be pretty up to speed though. You might want to start thinking about jab mixups and see if you can work them into your game, they're pretty effective once you get used to it. Also, see if you can learn illusion cancelling, it's probably not worth your time, but it does come in handy sometimes. With wolf, you need to minimize all possible chances of being punished, not to say that being agressive is bad but you should just work on that in general (even though this goes for every smasher, mistakes are never good). Especially against opponents with good killing moves, such as a tippered marth fsmash (I just wanted to point that out because you used sideB and didn't cancel it once in the marth match, leaving you vulnerable for potential ownage, but it didn't happen). This is just why all the little things are helpful. And I didn't mention this, but you can never practice too much perfect spacing on bair. It's a great move, probably wolf's best, so use it to its full potential.
 
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