Critique my Marth!

[Tee ay eye]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p76-s0i-f70

Thread title says it all

 

[Duff0]

u suk .

 

[Tee ay eye]

Ask someone else to carry you in teams next time

 

[Ndot]

Dang, very nice Marth. :D

 

[Dark Sonic]

Okay now for my critique (I'm gonna mostly comment on the second and third matches, cause I don't have much Pikachu experience.)

First match, let's be honest here. You got pretty lucky when Axe saved you last stock by messing up his uair spike (that and he jumped into a tipped f-smash which he then DI'd the worst possible way). But I'm gonna critique it anyway.

0:00-0:27. F-smash edgeguard is obviously not working. It's honestly looks pretty hard to time against a good Pikachu (who can sweetspot at a bunch of different angles <_<). Glad to see you stopped going for it after it failed 3 times.

0:37. Guess I spoke too soon? This one wasn't even spaced to hit the ledge man <_<

0:55. Messed up a waveland onto the platform and died for it. Figures Q_Q

1:07 You went a new route for edgeguarding and that was good. But you rolled up from the ledge (instead of doing the normal getup) and that was bad. Pikachu's up B isn't THAT laggy, so if you're gonna punish it you want to either roll really early, wait until after he gets above the stage and waveland back on, or just time a normal getup. You would've landed a much stronger punishment than a grab. Also, backthrow was a cool choice, pity he DI'd away from the stage instead of towards it.

1:16 Coolest combo EVER. Probably a bad choice to bair in front of you in general, but hey it worked.

1:22 Not sure why you'd go for a f-smash at such a low percent. Uptilt or grab probably would've been better for getting a combo going and racking damage. At least he didn't punish you for it.

1:38 Watch your opponent. When you saw him run off the stage to get you, you should've either up B'd immediately, DI'd back and fair'd, or not jumped, fastfalled... just SOMETHING. Guess you just weren't expecting a Pikachu to come out to get you?

1:47 You got a grab at a low percent right under a platform. Upthrow would've probably been the better choice

1:58 This is why I said rolling up from the ledge is bad. You missed a chance to punish his recovery. At least you knew not to try to follow it up once you missed the opportunity.

2:04. Try not to side B when you're so close to an opponent. You could've reached the ledge with your jump, or airdodged onto the stage. Marth's very vulnerable right after that side B

2:48-2:53 ....okay 0_o. I think you shouldn't bother with that edgeguard against Pikachu. If you don't use your jump so you can hit him with the fair, you risk him upB sweetspotting the ledge before you get back. But if you do jump...you miss.

3:12. Bad DI

Last stock. Very nice tech chasing. Nice spacing on the f-smash too (walking that little bit makes all the difference).

Second match

4:05. You lightshielded the nair which pushed you out of shine range. I don't know if you realized this, but that would've been a very good time to grab, as the only thing Falco could get you with is a jab.

4:22. You could've got a spike after the bair. And if you wanted to go for fair, you didn't really need to jump (please know that if hey had jumped and side B'd back he would've beat you back to the ledge, that was not a safe edgeguard) You guessed wrong on the up B path he'd take, but you actually could've covered both options had you recovered a little earlier (fast falling before recovering would've saved you a little time)

4:35-4:37. Fail recovery Q_Q You did that a little too much.

4:44. He missed the grab, which was a free chance for YOU to punish him.

4:56 You dodged the getup attack, but didn't do anything with it. Grab? F-smash? It's cool that you tricked him right after and got a grabbed, but you did miss a free punish opportunity from your earlier prediction

4:59. Cool stuff.

5:07. Not much you can really do about that except recover lower. And gamble between a sweetspot and the stage. But you did recover too high which allowed him to hit you back off reaction. Going lower would allow you to at least make it back onto the stage first (and thus get your jump and floaty B back).

5:22. Don't know what that third uptilt was for. Even if it had landed it would've just put him back onto the stage. What you wanted at that point was to jab/d-tilt/falling fair him for a gimp.

5:58. Never use your second jump like that. You were pretty much AT shorthop laser height, and it ate your jump <_<. Use your jump only to jump over the lasers, or if your below stage height (a few exceptions sure, but that was pretty bad)

6:16. What was the nair for?

6:34. Beware of crouch cancels at low percents. Make sure to space your aerials and don't try to follow them up with anything up close for a while.

I'm going to assume the jabs were supposed to be uptilts?

7:00. You had a few options here that would've covered everything he could've done, or most of them. A well timed f-smash would be able to stop any recovery aimed at the stage (up forward, forward, down forward). Going off to hit him would've covered every option. Backing up a little bit and waiting for the up B would've covered forward, up forward, and straight up (which would've landed him on the cloud otherwise), but not a sweetspot. F-tilt only covered two possibilities in this case.

stop using f-tilt so much

7:59 Try not to waveland-> fair ALL THE TIME. It's very predictable. Mix it up with wavelands on the ground, or falling nairs

8:05 Missed jab reset.

8:09 guess you weren't expecting to crouch cancel the nair? You could've grabbed him after that.

8:11. When Falco is above you like that, you really wanna get off that platform ASAP. dropping through would've put you below him and caught him on the paltform.

8:22. If you're gonna grab Falco out of his dair you have to get REALLY far in front of him. It actually has more range in the front than it does in the back (so pivot grabbing behind him is also an option if you think he's gonna dair, though not completely safe)

8:25 Don't ever spotdodge during Falco's shield pressure (or at least...not as Marth)

8:31 Spike would've worked. Or you could've fastfalled after the bair to not tip the fair. Once you did tip the fair, you shoud've grabbed the ledge and immediately ledgehopped a bair and landed on the stage (this would cover a quick side B to try to recover) and then gone out to hit him out of his up B (provided he didn't die already from running into the bair ). Since you didn't do that, the least you could've done is ledgehopped back onto the stage once you saw him start his up B from a fairly high spot to cover more recovery options. Basically, work on your edgeguarding. You're depending too much on stopping one option that you think they will take, when really you could just stop most or ALL of them with one action.

8:47...another jab that was supposed to be an uptilt? Even though I think grab would've worked better here anyway.

9:00. Get a new controller or something. These jabs are costing you the match Q_Q

9:12-9:15. Pretty sloppy tech chasing. Your goal should've been to eventually hit him with a uair WHILE getting onto the top platform. To do this, you should've full jumped AND double jumped with a uair after you hit him with the first one (the one that got him after the tech where he hit the shyguy).

9:26. Shouldn't have fair'd man. He was too low and was bound to tech before you reached him. Landing on the platform with an aerial would've been much better.

9:31. Should've tipped the uair. Untipped uairs have very, very little stun and really don't combo much. A tipped uair (while landing on the platform) would've ensured another hit which would either get you a kill or an edgeguard (for a kill). That f-smash was just you misjudging the hitstun a little bit.

Well, there's my critique. I tried not to comment too much on places where I think you just got tricked and couldn't do much about the situation. Hope it helps you (and other Marth players who read this. I'm sure you noticed a lot of this stuff, but I mentioned it anyway for those who might not have).

 

[The Newb]

Dark Sonic: Redefining "in-depth."

Lots of missed opportunities, but the good outshines the bad. Pretty slick overall.

 

[ChivalRuse]

All I'm thinking right now is - Axe's Falco is perrrrdy.

 

[Tee ay eye]

Thanks a lot, DS.

Um, those jabs were on purpose. I couldn't think of what else to do in the situation lol

Also, it's not really relevant to this match, but how good is nair (shffl and autocancel) for approaching Fox? Compared to fair, and in what situations?

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

i like nair a lot, but i don't like the angle auto cancel gives your sword. i usually delay a little bit so both sword hits are tipping to the ground almost.

nair can be followed by dtilt or utilt depending on how the opponent is approaching you. nair's main weakness is above him (he turns into a ****ing top) and there is pretty much nothing you can do if you commit and they hit you on your head.

i use it a lot vs sheik and fox and tend to stay away from it vs ganon and falco.

 

[AprilShaw]

Thanks a lot, DS.

Um, those jabs were on purpose. I couldn't think of what else to do in the situation lol

Also, it's not really relevant to this match, but how good is nair (shffl and autocancel) for approaching Fox? Compared to fair, and in what situations?

I like the nair, though it can be tough to approach with it sometimes. Personally I SHFFL it instead of letting it auto cancel, not sure but I think that gives less lag overall lol.

One thing I love with nair is, single hit nair -> grab. Can do it on their shield, through their shield, out of SH F-air, etc. Just don't spam it lol

Oh and overall F-air is better really. N-air is just nice if they don't expect it, so don't overuse it.

 

[Dark Sonic]

Thanks a lot, DS.

Um, those jabs were on purpose. I couldn't think of what else to do in the situation lol

Also, it's not really relevant to this match, but how good is nair (shffl and autocancel) for approaching Fox? Compared to fair, and in what situations?

For approaching? Fair is typically better because you can be more flexible with your timing (and you can always back out and just not fair if you think Fox will be able to punish it). Nair can be really good for just applying pressure to a Fox that's near the edge tough (or on a platform), as they don't have room to run around it and it lasts a long time. Really when you approach a good Fox you wanna try to stay grounded and just pressure him until he runs out of room behind him. Or you can fake approaches with empty shorthops and waveland to avoid his "punish" and nab him for it . But they're not always gonna fall for that Q_Q

 

[JesiahTEG]

I'm not gonna lie, it looks like a frustrated really good player chasing around an average player that doesn't know wtf to do, but is smart enough to just Fsmash and run at the right times.

Hint: Start chaingrabbing and edgeguarding. It might help.

 

[ZoSo]

Thanks a lot, DS.

Um, those jabs were on purpose. I couldn't think of what else to do in the situation lol

Also, it's not really relevant to this match, but how good is nair (shffl and autocancel) for approaching Fox? Compared to fair, and in what situations?

Autocancel nair is good because it comes out fast and obviously has very little lag. It's not very good for approaching because it doesn't put your priority where you need it (because Fox is a ******). It's better for stuffing Fox's approaches. It's also good to just throw it out as a bait.

Fair is better as an approach because, like DS said, it's more flexible. You can choose when you want the fair to come out, delay the fastfall, double jump retreating fair if you think you could be punished. You have a lot of options.

Running dtilt is a good approach. Or just grab if you think you can read their dash dance.

 

[datstupidmarth]

Thanks a lot, DS.

Um, those jabs were on purpose. I couldn't think of what else to do in the situation lol

Also, it's not really relevant to this match, but how good is nair (shffl and autocancel) for approaching Fox? Compared to fair, and in what situations?

you should never do anything without a purpose