Continuing Moveset Discussion -- DOWN B

[Scala]

Discussing all of yoshi's moves and their uses
Current discussion: Down B


Changed the layout, instead of creating a summary for each move, I'm just sending a link to the section of whatever thread discussed the move in the first place so you can read it as it was described originally, not regurgitated by me.
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A, A Combo

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4868352#post4868352

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FORWARD TILT

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4876710#post4876710

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DOWN TILT

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4885106#post4885106

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UP TILT

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4892818#post4892818

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FORWARD SMASH

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4920789#post4920789

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DOWN SMASH

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4931299#post4931299

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NEUTRAL B

• http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=5025791#post5025791

 

[Scala]

OK, here we go with this again. I made a new topic since BlisteringSpeed was the only one that could edit the OP on this last thread, so I made a new one and I'm linking to the old one for reference.

Neutral B I think has a lot of potential. Nobody uses it very often but I think the best application is for increasing agility across the map. Since DJC isn't in brawl, B moves are yoshi's only moves that will cancel out his double jump. Unfortunately, his neutral B is the ONLY one of this attacks that doesn't force him to move in a certain direction.

Applications:
--You double jump to get out of some combo but you want to get back into the fight asap, use your b move and cancel your DJ so that you don't have to travel all the way up before you want to come back down again.
--The needle tongue thing that I've seen in a few videos that lets you pull someone close to you and footstool them off the ledge. Anybody use this??
--If you're hanging on a ledge and your opponent is standing right on the edge about to do something when you come up, you can press down and drop off the ledge, DJ and use B just as you get above the ledge. You might eat them and have a free ride back to solid ground.

Other questions, I don't really pay attention to how much my moves are doing damage-wise during the match, does this move do any damage?

Lastly, I need something to put for the priority for tail swipe in the first post for completeness.

 

[Forsworn]

I don't use it too often, mainly just to mix up my approach. It's fun when an opponent shields expecting a B-air, then they get gulped by a reversed Egg Lay; just part of the charm that comes from playing Yoshi.

I do agree it has a lot of potential seeing as it's a command grab that can be used as a frontal or reverse move. The fact that it puts opponents in the air helps to lead into eggs/U-air/etc.

 

[DarkLeviathan89]

I've been trying to use this a lot more. It mixes things up and lets you either get a free hit or two (usually with bair) or it lets you retreat to shoot eggs or adjust spacing. It's very situational and hard to land, but I like using egg lay sometimes when they're at high damage to lead into an uair. This move does have a lot of potential, and I think people should try using it more often.

 

[Wafles]

I'll use Neutral B if I can see a clear opening, usually if I dodge an fsmash I can follow it quickly enough with the neutral B.

 

[DstyCube]

Egg lay has probably been my most favorite move since melee. I didn't use it much in the beginning of brawl because I found it painful to use because of its nerfed range and speed from melee. But I know it's just ******** to not use it because it was changed a little, and I can happily say that it's been incorporated back into my game.

Analysis:
- Good range, up there with dtilt (I think they're actually the same).
- 7% initial damage, attacks done to foes in the egg deal half damage.
- Grab hit box, useful for countering through attacks due to the weird super armor frames grabs give when they connect and you get hit.
- I would say its extremely hard to start up combos with egg lay (compared to melee) because there's a lot of invincibility frames when you break out, giving lots of time to air dodge, jump, or counter.
- It's a very flexible move imo. It can be used defensively or offensively, you just have to find the openings when they present themselves. Reversed/Wavebounced egg lays are sexy. Mix it up, just don't over use it and become predictable!
- Very fun move, lots of humiliation points for whoever gets caught in it!

 

[_Ubemaya_]

These are some of the uses I’ve found for it (I was about to start a new topic concerning the neutral B, but since this came up I'll just post it here).

DJC egg lay: When grounded, press jump, immediately press double jump (and input a direction on the control stick), and then immediately press B. If done correctly, Yoshi looks like he slides along the ground and then performs the egg lay. When done from the center of FD, Yoshi slides to about the end of the inner diamond. You can vary the distance that Yoshi travels by delaying the second jump slightly. Yoshi’s farthest grounded range (him performing the egg lay on the ground) is about one third of FD. You can go a little farther than that by delaying the B slightly, but Yoshi will be slightly above the ground. From the center of FD, Yoshi can egg lay a Bowser past the outermost diamond. This is really great for spacing because of it's huge range, and the fact that you can control its range.

B-reversal egg lay: This can be done from the ground just like a pivot grab, except it is faster and Yoshi does not slide, so it’s easier to grab your opponent with it. This can also be done short hopped, so for example, you short hop away to escape and then B-reverse the egg lay. This sort of looks like an RDJC from melee.

Reverse B-reversal egg lay: This is one of my favorite techniques. Jump with your back toward your opponent, as if you’re about to perform a B-air. When you’re almost on top of him and he gets into his shield or spot dodges, do a B-reversal egg lay. What happens is you go back the way you came (away from him), while simultaneously turning around (toward him) and grabbing him into an egg. The effect is pretty weird; the first time I did this I was just like WTF. This move can also be used in other ways; for example, once I used it to escape a Pikachu that was about to D-air me and then ate him.

That’s it for my neutral B uses, but on the subject of B-reversals, you can also B-reverse your egg toss. This means that momentum is no longer a problem for Yoshi’s recovery, because you have control which way your momentum goes. For example, if you’re caught under FD’s edge and you use your double jump to get out, your momentum if going away from the stage and if you use your egg toss, you’ll be getting farther. However, by B-reversing the egg toss you turn your momentum back towards the stage.

 

[Kiwikomix]

Something Les did on me that would probably work better against non-Yoshi characters is egg lay in midair, then chase to a uair once they escape. It's unconventional but works pretty well for KOs.

 

[bigman40]

If DJC egg lay is used, then you need to have some good spacing (as the startup is a little too long) to not get hit.

 

[DstyCube]

I guess I should add that down throw into a wavebounced neutral b works wonders, have fun .

 

[Gindler]

Great move...

-Great range to speed ratio
-the new pull them in thing (drag them to you without an actual egg lay) is both unexpected and a sexy way to get a kill
-I mix this in to be one of my approaches since Bair gets predictable and since egg lay is a "grab" it goes right through shields of course.
-Using it to bait someone who hasn't played a yoshi, by making them think it's a slow grab and punishing them for it is always fun.
-absorbing hits when using it (kinda like how grab has those wierd no knockback frames), I've used this in the air to avoid a fatal blow, once even countering and winning with an Uair on the last stock (don't count on this one alot but it's a sexy sight to see)

 

[Scala]

How do you wavebounce this? Don't you need to be b-sticking?

 

[DstyCube]

Wavebouncing was originally discovered it while b-sticking, but you can do it without b-sticking also. To do it with Yoshi's neutral b, you jump in a direction, hit b, then 'slam' the control stick in the opposite direction before you actually start the neutral b animation. If done right your momentum will switch directions in mid air and you do the move in the opposite direction.

 

[Scala]

Great response for this move, it seems like we all agree that the move is actually very effective. I used it a few times on other people and they didn't know how to react in the egg, it was great. Throws off their game completely.


NEXT DISCUSSION: Down B (ground pound)

Down B is a really great move. You can counter approaches by using it on the ground. Powershield->Down-B can cause them to get hit by both parts of the attack.
KOs reliably at 150.
Continue......

(also, new format for the original post of this thread which I think is more useful and organizes content better)

 

[Blistering Speed]

I just got back from a long trip, do you mind if I use this for the original thread, as Im now going to be updating regularly again.

And maybe close this, so we can have the original one to focus on.

 

[Chaco]

Grounded down B's kill at excellent %'s.

 

[Blistering Speed]

People should finish their discussion of Down B here, then I'll add it to my thread to save everyone hassle. After that, my thread will be the one you should discuss moves in. Thanks for the help Scala !

Im going to make a contribution, cos I only get to in the summary in my thread lorl

Down B has poor priority in the air, but its speed and KO power mean you will rarely get punished for using it. Stars form after the pound, protecting you from a counter. Not a move to be spammed, as people will catch on and get you in the air or attack after the move because it has bad afterlag. Never the less, it's still a viable KO move at around 130 on most characters and is important in your mixup game.

O and Chaco, I've always wanted to say Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,256
Wtf!?

 

[Chaco]

One thing, it always does not have aerial priority. A Usmash can knock you out of it as well as most well placed Uairs.


Cuz I'm *****in.

 

[Scala]

One thing that I've found noteworthy is that his down b will go through snake's mortar