Character Discussion Thread

[Autumn ♫]

I honestly think that even if the Mario Theory was true at a point in time, it no longer works, since transformations are now independent.

 

[EbonyRubberWolf]

I honestly think that even if the Mario Theory was true at a point in time, it no longer works, since transformations are now independent.

Why? The numbers are still adding up, even with transformative characters now independent of each other.

 

[Weeman]

Fair enough. We'll shift discussion then. What do you make of the utter silence regarding newcomers as far as the Gematsu leak? 11 newcomers and then a dead halt to communications. Add Rosalina, and that makes twelve. For a fighter to get twelve newcomers at once is very impressive. This also seems to tie in with Sakurai's belief that Smash is reaching its maximum capacity regarding quantity of characters and his renewed focus on quality(or other modes, can't rule that out). A 47 character roster is huge among fighting games, and very few can boast more. It's also well within the range of newcomer addition numbers(+13-14(depending on if you count Sheik/Zelda as two separate reps) from 64 to Melee, +10-13(again, dependent on how one interprets multiple characters with regard to slots) from Melee to Brawl, +12 from Brawl to Smash 4).

No one is denying that possibility, it's definitely a plausible assumption, but as said before, we cannot be 100% sure if there are not more newcomers yet to be revealed that are not Gematsu, and honestly a 51 roster could also still be very well be within the realm of possibility, i mean i'm aware of the statement that Sakurai made regarding the roster but that i think that would only apply if people were expecting a 60+ roster, otherwise i think up to 54 or 55 could still be the limit that Sakurai hinted at.

 

[False Sense]

Fair enough. We'll shift discussion then. What do you make of the utter silence regarding newcomers as far as the Gematsu leak? 11 newcomers and then a dead halt to communications. Add Rosalina, and that makes twelve. For a fighter to get twelve newcomers at once is very impressive. This also seems to tie in with Sakurai's belief that Smash is reaching its maximum capacity regarding quantity of characters and his renewed focus on quality(or other modes, can't rule that out). A 47 character roster is huge among fighting games, and very few can boast more. It's also well within the range of newcomer addition numbers(+13-14(depending on if you count Sheik/Zelda as two separate reps) from 64 to Melee, +10-13(again, dependent on how one interprets multiple characters with regard to slots) from Melee to Brawl, +12 from Brawl to Smash 4).

The leaker has leaked bits of outdated information at separate times, with no reason given for why this is so. Also, considering that this person seems to have a fair amount of knowledge about the roster, it's odd that he hasn't leaked anything else, like veterans. This leads me to believe that the leaker is either withholding information for some unknown reason, or has limited information about the game. In either case, it opens up the possibility of further newcomers beyond those he listed.

 

[Tr1pleDee]

Oh, heres a topic. Tonight will be the final PotD for this week. While there is no evidence of anything happening, do you think we may get a surprise veteran reveal (like how Ike was revealed), and if so, who?

 

[Kenith]

Fair enough. We'll shift discussion then. What do you make of the utter silence regarding newcomers as far as the Gematsu leak? 11 newcomers and then a dead halt to communications. Add Rosalina, and that makes twelve. For a fighter to get twelve newcomers at once is very impressive. This also seems to tie in with Sakurai's belief that Smash is reaching its maximum capacity regarding quantity of characters and his renewed focus on quality(or other modes, can't rule that out). A 47 character roster is huge among fighting games, and very few can boast more. It's also well within the range of newcomer addition numbers(+13-14(depending on if you count Sheik/Zelda as two separate reps) from 64 to Melee, +10-13(again, dependent on how one interprets multiple characters with regard to slots) from Melee to Brawl, +12 from Brawl to Smash 4).

Smash 64: 12 Newcomers
Melee: 14 Newcomers
Brawl: 18 Newcomers

If we making assumptions based on the number of newcomers each installment, the number is actually increasing.
Though, if the pattern were 12, 14, 18, then the amount of newcomers we would get this time is 36, which is highly unlikely unless a lot of cuts take place.

 

[Autumn ♫]

Why? The numbers are still adding up, even with transformative characters now independent of each other.

In Brawl, the numbers were adding up too, and we had more Zelda and Pokemon characters than Mario. Now that the transformations are getting their own slots, there is no reason to believe in the slot theory anymore. (Take this from a person who used to believe in the theory too.)

Smash 64: 12 Newcomers
Melee: 14 Newcomers
Brawl: 18 Newcomers

If we making assumptions based on the number of newcomers each installment, the number is actually increasing.
Though, if the pattern were 12, 14, 18, then the amount of newcomers we would get this time is 26, which is highly unlikely unless a lot of cuts take place.

Fix'd for accuracy.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Oh, heres a topic. Tonight will be the final PotD for this week. While there is no evidence of anything happening, do you think we may get a surprise veteran reveal (like how Ike was revealed), and if so, who?

Spill the details on Palutena's default special attacks.

Hell, I'm surprised Palutena isn't milked to death like how Mori pushes Noel.

 

[Tr1pleDee]

Smash 64: 12 Newcomers
Melee: 14 Newcomers
Brawl: 18 Newcomers

If we making assumptions based on the number of newcomers each installment, the number is actually increasing.
Though, if the pattern were 12, 14, 18, then the amount of newcomers we would get this time is 36, which is highly unlikely unless a lot of cuts take place.

Woah, where did 36 come from? I figured following the pattern would give us 24 (which is still a ton). That would make the pattern [Starting #(12), +2 (14), +4 (18), +6 (24)]

 

[Spinosaurus]

Oh, heres a topic. Tonight will be the final PotD for this week. While there is no evidence of anything happening, do you think we may get a surprise veteran reveal (like how Ike was revealed), and if so, who?

The whole alt costumes and such kinda gives me the feeling that it's Wario.

Or maybe I'm being too hopeful. Yep, probably that.

 

[G0LD3N L0TUS]

Oh, heres a topic. Tonight will be the final PotD for this week. While there is no evidence of anything happening, do you think we may get a surprise veteran reveal (like how Ike was revealed), and if so, who?

I think Falco is the most anticipated, but he has been for a long while. I think a reveal is about a 50% chance tomorrow, but I have no guesses.

 

[EbonyRubberWolf]

No one is denying that possibility, it's definitely a plausible assumption, but as said before, we cannot be 100% sure if there are not more newcomers yet to be revealed that are not Gematsu, and honestly a 51 roster could also still be very well be within the realm of possibility, i mean i'm aware of the statement that Sakurai made regarding the roster but that i think that would only apply if people were expecting a 60+ roster, otherwise i think up to 54 or 55 could still be the limit that Sakurai hinted at.

This sounds like a rehash of the language people were spouting here. Look what happened. Where's the evidence for 51+R, or even larger rosters?

The leaker has leaked bits of outdated information at separate times, with no reason given for why this is so. Also, considering that this person seems to have a fair amount of knowledge about the roster, it's odd that he hasn't leaked anything else, like veterans. This leads me to believe that the leaker is either withholding information for some unknown reason, or has limited information about the game. In either case, it opens up the possibility of further newcomers beyond those he listed.

There's also the possibility that there's simply nothing left to leak.

Smash 64: 12 Newcomers

I suppose they're newcomers, but that's... Circling the point a bit.

Melee: 14 Newcomers

Okay, so you believe in the transformation characters actually count for multiple characters.

Brawl: 18 Newcomers

Ah, you're correct. I'd forgotten to take away the cuts from Melee(and I thought the math got screwy for a second, but if you honestly consider PT 3 separate characters(why label him PT then?), then yeah, math adds up).

If we making assumptions based on the number of newcomers each installment, the number is actually increasing.
Though, if the pattern were 12, 14, 18, then the amount of newcomers we would get this time is 36, which is highly unlikely unless a lot of cuts take place.

First, that pattern doesn't make sense. o.O With an initial arrival of twelve, we'd gotten two more than before, and then four more from before. The next number in the sequence would appear to be 24, not 36. >.>;

Second, there is an upper limit to rosters, and Sakurai himself has hinted that we are very close to it. So a lower newcomer count than prior games makes sense.

In Brawl, the numbers were adding up too, and we had more Zelda and Pokemon characters than Mario. Now that the transformations are getting their own slots, there is no reason to believe in the slot theory anymore. (Take this from a person who used to believe in the theory too.)

What? The CSS didn't consider the characters separate, so the theory was still in full effect and applicability.

 

[Tr1pleDee]

The whole alt costumes and such kinda gives me the feeling that it's Wario.

Or maybe I'm being too hopeful. Yep, probably that.

Oh, thats an interesting point. Just maybe...

i cant wait to see that HD waft

 

[Kenith]

Woah, where did 36 come from? I figured following the pattern would give us 24 (which is still a ton). That would make the pattern [Starting #(12), +2 (14), +4 (18), +6 (24)]

I'm terrible at math. I'm seeing it as this:

10+2, 10+4, 10+8, 10+16.

I accidentally added an extra ten. It should be 26.

 

[Louie G.]

The CSS means jack ****.

Also Sal never said the roster was 47 characters for sure.

 

[Autumn ♫]

What? The CSS didn't consider the characters separate, so the theory was still in full effect and applicability.

My point. If it was true, than it was in full effect and applicability, but it no longer is anymore with the seperation of transformation characters.

 

[Phaazoid]

The CSS means jack ****.

Also Sal never said the roster was 47 characters for sure.

That's the drain I keep circling but I feel less and less hopeful each time 'round : (

 

[EbonyRubberWolf]

My point. If it was true, than it was in full effect and applicability, but it no longer is anymore with the seperation of transformation characters.

...? It's still in full effect right now. 5 Mario, 4 Zelda, 4 Pokemon.

 

[Tr1pleDee]

I'm terrible at math. I'm seeing it as this:

10+2, 10+4, 10+8, 10+16.

I accidentally added an extra ten. It should be 26.

Oh, I see. Though I still think increasing the # newcomers by 2 is the better pattern, because according to that multiplication route Smash 5 would have 42 newcomers.

 

[Louie G.]

That's the drain I keep circling but I feel less and less hopeful each time 'round : (

I'm not necessarily confident that we'll get anything outside of Brawl, Gematsu, and Mewtwo.

But it's still a possibility. Sal never outright said it wasn't happening.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Oh, thats an interesting point. Just maybe...

i cant wait to see that HD waft

Out of all the remaining veterans he's really overdue at this point. Him and Ice Climbers are the only "obvious" (if you will) starters.

I consider MK obvious too but I wouldn't be totally surprised if he's an unlockable this time around.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Where did all this CSS crap come from anyway?

 

[Phaazoid]

I'm not necessarily confident that we'll get anything outside of Brawl, Gematsu, and Mewtwo.

But it's still a possibility. Sal never outright said it wasn't happening.

Well, at least you're optimistic about Mewtwo.

I'm worried we're not gonna see anymore characters that aren't in Brawl/Gematsu.

My pessimism is slowly taking over. Need a vet revealed tomorrow or next week to end this downward spiral haha.

 

[Louie G.]

Where did all this CSS crap come from anyway?

Brawl I guess.

 

[False Sense]

There's also the possibility that there's simply nothing left to leak.



Okay, so you believe in the transformation characters actually count for multiple characters.

No one is denying that possibility. It's certainly a feasible one. However, there's also the very real possibility that the leaker has not named everything so far. At this point, neither possibility can be ruled out.

And yes, transformations count as separate characters. Sakurai himself has made that quite clear.

 

[Kenith]

Oh, I see. Though I still think increasing the # newcomers by 2 is the better pattern, because according to that multiplication route Smash 5 would have 42 newcomers.

Eh, that's tiny, and very unlikely.

Assuming there are 26 newcomers, and Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Snake are cut...

That would be 62 characters. A little ridiculous. But with DLC it is attainable, I think.
So I don't think there's a pattern.

 

[False Sense]

So I don't think there's a pattern.

Do patterns ever mean anything? Haven't a number of "patterns" we thought would have significant impacts on the roster been debunked already?

 

[Phaazoid]

Do patterns ever mean anything? Haven't a number of "patterns" we thought would have significant impacts on the roster been debunked already?

It's Sakurai. The only pattern is whenever we think there is a pattern, he laughs, and destroys it, and shoots the neighbors dog while making it look like it was us, but buys us a lottery ticket to confuse us.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Do patterns ever mean anything? Haven't a number of "patterns" we thought would have significant impacts on the roster been debunked already?

The problem is that people were making patterns out of things that weren't patterns to begin with.

 

[EbonyRubberWolf]

Eh, that's tiny, and very unlikely.

Assuming there are 26 newcomers, and Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Snake are cut...

That would be 62 characters. A little ridiculous. But with DLC it is attainable, I think.
So I don't think there's a pattern.

You're trying to count how much DLC there will be? Good luck, I'm not touching that with a 100-foot pole. Down that way lies madness.

Well, at least you're optimistic about Mewtwo.

I'm worried we're not gonna see anymore characters that aren't in Brawl/Gematsu.

My pessimism is slowly taking over. Need a vet revealed tomorrow or next week to end this downward spiral haha.

It stings less if you think of it as realism.

 

[False Sense]

Speaking of DLC characters, I have to wonder what kind of impact they'd have on the ever-so-important character select screen. Wouldn't it force the selection screen to change and shrink even further?

 

[Kenith]

Speaking of DLC characters, I have to wonder what kind of impact they'd have on the ever-so-important character select screen. Wouldn't it force the selection screen to change and shrink even further?

I imagine so. It happens in Brawl; the dimensions of the roster icons changes depending on every character you unlock.

 

[Phaazoid]

It stings less if you think of it as realism.

But that's what makes it sting, because then it's real and I want like a 60 character roster, haha.

It's nice to know where the lower boundary is, though, because then if anything breaks that expectation, you know right away, and it's pretty exciting.

 

[False Sense]

I imagine so. It happens it Brawl; the dimensions of the roster icons changes depending on every character you unlock.

You're probably right. I was just wondering since the number of slots that can fit on the screen seems to be a focal point for debates about the roster size. But if the roster is going to expand beyond the original size through DLC, that would suggest that the selection screen does not have a limited number of slots, meaning that trying to determine the final roster size based on something like that is pointless. Does that sound about right?

 

[Kenith]

You're probably right. I was just wondering since the number of slots that can fit on the screen seems to be a focal point for debates about the roster size. But if the roster is going to expand beyond the original size through DLC, that would suggest that the selection screen does not have a limited number of slots, meaning that trying to determine the final roster size based on something like that is pointless. Does that sound about right?

Yeah, pretty much.

Though, obviously, there will be definite size for the roster.
Also, I doubt that DLC characters will be an afterthought. They will be planned for a while, maybe not since the beginning of development, but definitely towards the end.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Guys

demo

Full roster

Spoiler

 

[EbonyRubberWolf]

You're probably right. I was just wondering since the number of slots that can fit on the screen seems to be a focal point for debates about the roster size. But if the roster is going to expand beyond the original size through DLC, that would suggest that the selection screen does not have a limited number of slots, meaning that trying to determine the final roster size based on something like that is pointless. Does that sound about right?

Yeah, pretty much.

Though, obviously, there will be definite size for the roster.
Also, I doubt that DLC characters will be an afterthought. They will be planned for a while, maybe not since the beginning of development, but definitely towards the end.

It's like the 51-character thread all over again. DLC will probably be dealt with in a manner separate from the main roster. Again, I suspect it will be on a separate page dedicated to DLC characters.

Guys

demo

Full roster

Spoiler

What's this aiming to prove?

 

[Kenith]

It's like the 51-character thread all over again. DLC will probably be dealt with in a manner separate from the main roster. Again, I suspect it will be on a separate page dedicated to DLC characters.

I don't know, I don't think it would be cluttered enough for that. Besides, in Smash all the players select at the same time, so it would throw people off.
However, due to the small screen size and personal nature of the 3DS version, I could easily see that being the case on that version.

What's this aiming to prove?

That we shouldn't assume the final roster size based on a demo.
You know, sort of what we've been discussing for a while.

 

[False Sense]

It's like the 51-character thread all over again. DLC will probably be dealt with in a manner separate from the main roster. Again, I suspect it will be on a separate page dedicated to DLC characters.


What's this aiming to prove?

An entirely separate page for DLC? Wouldn't that be kind of... odd? For one, that means that players would have to alternate between screens just to select certain characters, which could become rather annoying for groups. Not to mention that the second page of DLC would likely be drastically smaller than the regular roster... And if we have more than one page of the roster, who's to say that we couldn't get more than one page for the default roster?

Frankly, I just don't see how we can accurately determine the size of the roster based on the character select screen. There's too many variables and too many unknowns, I think.

 

[Starcutter]

Guys

demo

Full roster

Spoiler

that's not the full roster if you include ultimate.


How dare you leave out Wright!?