Character Discussion Thread

[Wolfie557]

Got insane support due to 3 reasons
1.He's the Godfather of video games and a big icon. (He's got a Super Bowl commercial)

2.Myamoto pushed for him in Brawl and inspired him for his video games

3.Right when Bamco was announced that they will help work on the next Smash, guess what everyone thought, confirmed.


Rayman never had that support until Artsy trolled the whole internet, and even then he had his trophy which was only revealed in a POTD (right before a Smash trailer)

Same with Banjo who Phil Spencer only said to draw up interest for Banjo but fans took it a mile. It's always been like that. Hint out a character or act like this character is gonna be in and everyone will push for it.

It's a bit unbelievable to me lol, but I know the lack of support!

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I still want to know the reason why Snake was removed in the first place, and is that reason going to prevent him from becoming DLC?

 

[Graizen]

Use it if you want!

 

[Champ Gold]

I still want to know the reason why Snake was removed in the first place, and is that reason going to prevent him from becoming DLC?

Simple, see these 3 games:


No releases on the Wii U so no Snake

 

[JamesDNaux]

Simple, see these 3 games:

View attachment 48268 View attachment 48269 View attachment 48270
No releases on the Wii U so no Snake

I sure love playing all these brand new Mega Man games on the Wii U.

 

[Wolfie557]

yolo. old news okay,.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

I sure love playing all these brand new Mega Man games on the Wii U.

It's not like he's an NES icon or anything, nope, not at all

Also, he at least has some games on the E-Shop, that's not something snake can say

 

[JamesDNaux]

It's not like he's an NES icon or anything, nope, not at all

Also, he at least has some games on the E-Shop, that's not something snake can say

You missed the point completely. Snake wasn't removed because "no Wii U games well!" Not to mention Snake Eater 3D.

The first two Metal Gears were on the Virtual Console.

 

[Champ Gold]

I sure love playing all these brand new Mega Man games on the Wii U.

Yeah but count how many Megaman games on Nintendo consoles and MGS games then talk to me

 

[Wolfie557]

You missed the point completely. Snake wasn't removed because "no Wii U games well!" Not to mention Snake Eater 3D.

The first two Metal Gears were on the Virtual Console.

Megaman contributed more to Nintendo this gen than other platforms.......digitally, but still. He is practically dead when it comes to new games anyways.
Snake almost completely contributed to other platforms. Snake Eater 3D (sold 0.3m) is nothing compared to multiple games on other platforms, including MGS5. Those actually contribute a lot to sales of hardware.

would like him back someday since he is a veteran and looked fun...

 

[JamesDNaux]

Yeah but count how many Megaman games on Nintendo consoles and MGS games then talk to me

Good thing Sakurai specifically stated that their only needs to be one game on Nintendo consoles.

A single game is required, not "the majority of their franchise." It means absolutely nothing how many games there are.

It means absolutely nothing that MGSV is not on the Wii U, neither is Street Fighter V, and oh look, Ryu.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

You missed the point completely. Snake wasn't removed because "no Wii U games well!" Not to mention Snake Eater 3D.

The first two Metal Gears were on the Virtual Console.

Except that's exactly the reason he was removed, snake just isn't relevant on nintendo consoles and honestly never was, In brawl snake was a favour to a friend and nothing more

 

[Wolfie557]

Good thing Sakurai specifically stated that their only needs to be one game on Nintendo consoles.

A single game is required, not "the majority of their franchise." It means absolutely nothing how many games there are.

It means absolutely nothing that MGSV is not on the Wii U, neither is Street Fighter V, and oh look, Ryu.

Sakurai broke like 5 of his rules between after Brawl's release and now. lol.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Except that's exactly the reason he was removed.

I didn't know you were Sakurai.

No one knows why Snake is gone. There's no proof that he was "removed." Nothing more than bias.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

I didn't know you were Sakurai.

No one knows why Snake is gone. There's no proof that he was "removed." Nothing more than bias.

He was cut though and from what we know that's probably why

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Sakurai broke like 5 of his rules between after Brawl's release and now. lol.

"Takamaru lacks familiarity in the West to be playable"

*Adds him in Smash 6*

Totally gonna happens in the future.

 

[JamesDNaux]

He was cut though and from what we know that's probably why

"We" know absolutely nothing at all. Sakurai added Snake so clearly he doesn't care if he's not "Nintendo enough." Even Iwata said that Snake was a great addition, so exactly who at Nintendo wanted Snake gone? They have already stated themselves that the Wii U isn't in direct competition with either the PS4 or the XBone. Every argument against Snake is a load of complete BS.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

"We" know absolutely nothing at all. Sakurai added Snake so clearly he doesn't care if he's not "Nintendo enough." Even Iwata said that Snake was a great addition, so exactly who at Nintendo wanted Snake gone? They have already stated themselves that the Wii U isn't in direct competition with either the PS4 or the XBone. Every argument against Snake is a load of complete BS.

He was added as a favour to kojima though, that's pretty much the only reason he was in Brawl

 

[JamesDNaux]

He was added as a favour to kojima though, that's pretty much the only reason he was in Brawl

You're contradicting your own point. During Brawl's time, the upcoming MGS4 was PS3 exclusive, and now MGSV is also not coming to Nintendo consoles. Favour or not, if Sakurai cared about Snake "not being Nintendo enough" then he would have never added him in the first place. And if he only added him as a favour, what's stopping him from doing the same thing? Kojima already stated once in an interview for Sakurai to "please use Snake," and Snake is high on nearly every poll related to the Smash ballot, so if Sakurai decides not to add Snake for some petty reason then he'd be spitting in both Kojima and the fans' faces.

And again, to further the point, Street Fighter is hardly a Nintendo related franchise, and the latest game is not coming to Wii U, yet here's Ryu. Explain to me why Ryu isn't "some Sony guy" and why he gets a free pass into Smash but not Snake.

 

[Ura]

What about the 3DS port of MGS3? That's still fairly recent no?

 

[Strofirko]

I think right now is not even the:
"Snake is not nintendo"
That is keeping the character back
And more:
"Konami vs kojima"stuff.
I even could assume ditching david hayter as the voice of snake may messed up a little...
But I am no metal gear expert.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

You're contradicting your own point. During Brawl's time, the upcoming MGS4 was PS3 exclusive, and now MGSV is also not coming to Nintendo consoles. Favour or not, if Sakurai cared about Snake "not being Nintendo enough" then he would have never added him in the first place. And if he only added him as a favour, what's stopping him from doing the same thing? Kojima already stated once in an interview for Sakurai to "please use Snake," and Snake is high on nearly every poll related to the Smash ballot, so if Sakurai decides not to add Snake for some petty reason then he'd be spitting in both Kojima and the fans' faces.

And again, to further the point, Street Fighter is hardly a Nintendo related franchise, and the latest game is not coming to Wii U, yet here's Ryu. Explain to me why Ryu isn't "some Sony guy" and why he gets a free pass into Smash but not Snake.

I actually didn't know Kojima said he wanted him in, fair enough I guess

 

[JaidynReiman]

Solid Snake accidently steps on a landmine.

THIS is the reason why Snake is no longer in the game. :D



Honestly, I'm not sure about Snake at this point. I still think Nintendo made a special deal with Capcom and Ryu was part of the exchange. All we know is that Snake is gone, and we don't know exactly why. I'd presume there was a falling out with Konami and the original deal wasn't quite as cut and dry as we've come to believe.

But I do once again think Snake is the most likely third-party at least.

if Sakurai decides not to add Snake for some petty reason then he'd be spitting in both Kojima and the fans' faces.

This is a VERY narrow-minded thinking of the whole situation. The problem, as you state, is we don't KNOW why Snake has been cut. However, there was OBVIOUSLY a problem with bringing him back. Now, why could that be the case?


Odds are, whatever kept Snake out in the first place could very easily keep him out again. Sakurai probably doesn't care. You have to consider Nintendo's stance on this, not Sakurai. Who would've really kept Snake out? Probably Nintendo, not Sakurai. Sakurai doesn't have 100% jurisdiction over who gets added to the game, especially when it comes to third-parties. Nintendo has to also agree to it.

 

[JamesDNaux]

What about the 3DS port of MGS3? That's still fairly recent no?

We also have the Snake Eater theme on the 3DS. "Snake isn't Nintendo enough to get a theme!" but there it is.

I think right now is not even the:
"Snake is not nintendo"
That is keeping the character back
And more:
"Konami vs kojima"stuff.
I even could assume ditching davey hater as the voice of snake may messed up a little...
But I am no metal gear expert.

Even Konami wants Snake back, Kojima or not.

 

[Ura]

We also have the Snake Eater theme on the 3DS. "Snake isn't Nintendo enough to get a theme!" but there it is.


Even Konami wants Snake back, Kojima or not.

Theirs still a MG theme on the 3DS version? I must be reading that wrong lol.

It really baffles me how he got cut. He was one of the most popular third party characters so I thought his return would have been inevitable .

 

[Oracle_Summon]

These may have been taken out of context, but to further on:

No one knows why Snake is gone. There's no proof that he was "removed." Nothing more than bias.

For Snake to be removed he must have been planned to put into the game.

"We" know absolutely nothing at all. Sakurai added Snake so clearly he doesn't care if he's not "Nintendo enough." Even Iwata said that Snake was a great addition, so exactly who at Nintendo wanted Snake gone? Every argument against Snake is a load of complete BS.

If Snake was planned to be in the game then it is more likely that Nintendo contacted Konami, but did not receive an answer before the Smash 4 Deadline. Time Constraints and dead line issues are what likely terminated Snake's chances of getting in the released version.

You're contradicting your own point. During Brawl's time, the upcoming MGS4 was PS3 exclusive, and now MGSV is also not coming to Nintendo consoles. Favour or not, if Sakurai cared about Snake "not being Nintendo enough" then he would have never added him in the first place. And if he only added him as a favour, what's stopping him from doing the same thing? Kojima already stated once in an interview for Sakurai to "please use Snake," and Snake is high on nearly every poll related to the Smash ballot, so if Sakurai decides not to add Snake for some petty reason then he'd be spitting in both Kojima and the fans' faces.

It seems you should be accusing Konami for spitting in both Kojima and fan's faces, since they have not specified whether or not they want Snake in Smash 4. Kojima I know for a fact does, but Konami has not specified (if there is a link that specifies I would like to know).

I am not to speak for Noivern, but it seems the initial post's purpose was to defend Mega Man. You called out Megaman when rdgqw1193 said this:

rdg121193 Simple, see these 3 games:

View attachment 48268 View attachment 48269 View attachment 48270
No releases on the Wii U so no Snake

You do the same thing to Ryu here in defense of Snake:

And again, to further the point, Street Fighter is hardly a Nintendo related franchise, and the latest game is not coming to Wii U, yet here's Ryu. Explain to me why Ryu isn't "some Sony guy" and why he gets a free pass into Smash but not Snake.

It looks as though you are taking Noivern's post of defending Mega Man (if this is true) and confusing that with the statement as to why Snake was "removed".

Even Konami wants Snake back, Kojima or not.

Do you have link to that proof? I have not found it myself and that would be good for Snake's fans.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Theirs still a MG theme on the 3DS version? I must be reading that wrong lol.

3DS theme. It changes the background to Naked Snake and The Boss and the Snake Eater (Brawl instrumental) plays.



With so many people so sure of Snake never coming back, his tagline should be: "Played you like damned fiddles!"

 

[Dragoncharystary]

I regret nothing I said in that post because that is how I truly feel.


I wholly agree with what you said and my post earlier says in it that smash is no more Nintendo history but encompasses gaming history itself and can become more of that if Ryu, Rayman and Snake would come later on in the future.

Don't forget everyone's favorite Bombing hero.

 

[Strofirko]

This thread should be renamed:
"Official running in circles thread."
I mean serious,there is stuff here I thought we solved hundreds of pages ago.

 

[Luigi The President]

Here from the Leaks thread and wow this thread is vicious

 

[JamesDNaux]

For Snake to be removed he must have been planned to put into the game.

Removed between Brawl > Smash 4. I wasn't the one saying he was just outright removed anyway.

If Snake was planned to be in the game then it is more likely that Nintendo contacted Konami, but did not receive an answer before the Smash 4 Deadline. Time Constraints and dead line issues are what likely terminated Snake's chances of getting in the released version.

You're seriously out of context because you're telling this to the wrong person. I wasn't the one saying "Snake was removed because he's not Nintendo enough/MGSV isn't coming to the Wii U, etc. I was the one defending him.

I am not to speak for Noivern, but it seems the initial post's purpose was to defend Mega Man. You called out Megaman when rdgqw1193 said this:

It looks as though you are taking Noivern's post of defending Mega Man (if this is true) and confusing that with the statement as to why Snake was "removed".

The initial post had nothing to do with Mega Man and was just an attack on Snake. All I did was bring up the fact that neither Mega Man or Ryu have Wii U games yet they're here, so it can't be used as a point against Snake. I feel like you didn't read anything.

Do you have link to that proof? I have not found it myself and that would be good for Snake's fans.

Konami retweeted someone who mentioned Snake and the Smash Ballot.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Here from the Leaks thread and wow this thread is vicious

Burb vs Connor was worse.

 

[Rockaphin]

Sakurai got tired of losing to Snake's Up-Tilt, that's why he's gone.

 

[Dragoncharystary]

I think I better take this off my chest right now. Who are Banjo and Kazooie? All I know is this they had some game on the N64 and I learned that recently.

Side Question: How do you make the Smash character icons from N3ON's thread smaller.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Removed between Brawl > Smash 4. I wasn't the one saying he was just outright removed anyway.

I know. I was just responding to it. Removed as in having been in a Smash game. That helps further explain your meaning of removed in context.

You're seriously out of context because you're telling this to the wrong person. I wasn't the one saying "Snake was removed because he's not Nintendo enough/MGSV isn't coming to the Wii U, etc. I was the one defending him.

I know that GodzillaWonder said the initial post

I still want to know the reason why Snake was removed in the first place, and is that reason going to prevent him from becoming DLC?

So it is directed towards him, but also to you in a sense. Since it seemed that you were attacking Mega Man to defend Snake.

The initial post had nothing to do with Mega Man and was just an attack on Snake. All I did was bring up the fact that neither Mega Man or Ryu have Wii U games yet they're here, so it can't be used as a point against Snake. I feel like you didn't read anything.

Are you sure that is the case? The Mega Man post, in my eyes, seemed to be defending Mega Man from you when you used it in defense of Snake. Until Noiveron specifies otherwise, I believe that was the purpose of the post. In regards to the Ryu case, that may be different, but you were the first one to bring up Mega Man adding him to the discussion, correct?

Konami retweeted someone who mentioned Snake and the Smash Ballot.

Searched, but I have not seen it yet. I have seen people voting for Big Boss though.

Links: https://twitter.com/Ballot_Confess/status/588005709968711680

https://twitter.com/Alexsmosh/status/584618320822984704

It may be a joke.

 

[Kenith]

I think I better take this off my chest right now. Who are Banjo and Kazooie? All I know is this they had some game on the N64 and I learned that recently.

That's really where their significance to Nintendo ends. They had two really good and beloved N64 games then, after Rareware and BK where acquired by Microsoft, they were drowned like a sack of kittens.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I think I better take this off my chest right now. Who are Banjo and Kazooie? All I know is this they had some game on the N64 and I learned that recently.

Side Question: How do you make the Smash character icons from N3ON's thread smaller.

That's really where their significance to Nintendo ends. They had two really good and beloved N64 games then, after Rareware and BK where acquired by Microsoft, they were drowned like a sack of kittens.

This, pretty much. Banjo-Kazooie and Banjo-Tooie were well-loved games on N64, then they had nothing for the next ten years or so except one crappy game and a GBA spinoff that was originally Diddy Kong Pilot. Ok, fine, there was Grunty's Revenge, a shorter game overall on the GBA.

I've stated this before, but K. Rool's had more appearances since the buyout (with, you know, no new main DK games until Returns and TF, where K. Rool was absent) than Banjo and Kazooie have had total. After reviewing it I guess its technically incorrect if you don't count his three trophy appearances in Smash Bros. (since he has, well, had a trophy in every Smash game that has trophies).

 

[Burruni]

I think I better take this off my chest right now. Who are Banjo and Kazooie? All I know is this they had some game on the N64 and I learned that recently.

Side Question: How do you make the Smash character icons from N3ON's thread smaller.

After the massive successes of Donkey Kong Country 1-3, Rareware released Banjo-Kazooie. It was a 3D platformer/collectathon with the fighting being more of a feature but not a focus. With writing humor, creativity, the looks of it, and music, it is a game that quite a few considered to be Mario 64 done better. Needless to say, it was massively popular. A few years after, the sequel of Banjo-Tooie was made which was a direct sequel that felt perfectly like a continuation of the first title that further evolved the combat, platforming, and puzzle abilities that you had at hand and had a lot more interconnected sense of the levels while having a bit less charm overall. At the end of it, the main villain left off with a great teaser saying that she will exact her revenge in Banjo-Threeie. These two games were some of the biggest sellers of the N64 that rivaled and arguably surpassed OoT-MM and SM64.

After this, Donkey Kong Country 64 was... basically the mediocre result of "Banjoifying" Donkey Kong and just having too much to collect in the game for a few. Later, they worked on a Zelda-ish title by the name of Dinosaur Planet that became Star Fox Adventures.

Sadly, Banjo-Threeie, while being worked on for the Gamecube, was forever lost as a title when Rareware was bought out by Microsoft.

 

[Deleted member]

You know, with Ryu being added and throwing my "3 guest limit" theory out the window, that does raise an interesting question...
Why was Snake not planned for Smash 4 in the first place?

Though considering Ryu was only thrown in as DLC, the "3 guest limit" theory may have applied for the main roster, but DLC is fair game.

 

[Wolfie557]

This, pretty much. Banjo-Kazooie and Banjo-Tooie were well-loved games on N64, then they had nothing for the next ten years or so except one crappy game and a GBA spinoff that was originally Diddy Kong Pilot. Ok, fine, there was Grunty's Revenge, a shorter game overall on the GBA.

I've stated this before, but K. Rool's had more appearances since the buyout (with, you know, no new main DK games until Returns and TF, where K. Rool was absent) than Banjo and Kazooie have had total. After reviewing it I guess its technically incorrect if you don't count his three trophy appearances in Smash Bros. (since he has, well, had a trophy in every Smash game that has trophies).

BK is like irrelevant to the generations after N64.

That's 3 of them.