Character Discussion Thread

[praline]

Konami didnt own hudsonsoft until 2012...try again

I know that. I meant in general.

 

[MYU2]

In my mind, I feel that because there actually are some fans, like me, who like clone characters, Sakurai would probably add a few for those fans while all of the other newcomers are about as unique as they can get. This probably has been the most unique batch of newcomers we've gotten in a Smash game so far, but there should still be a few clones to make the roster that much larger while giving people different variations of a play style to try out. The party that like unique newcomers and the party that don't mind clones both win.

I'm perfectly fine with clones, but i would be upset with Sakurai for giving us 2-4 newcomer clones especially if they have the potential to be unique

 

[Scamper52596]

I'm perfectly fine with clones, but i would be upset with Sakurai for giving us 2-4 newcomer clones especially if they have the potential to be unique

I agree. That's one thing if a newcomer has enough potential to be unique. Also I think two or three more clones is acceptable.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Black Shadow is the only other newcomer clone I would accept.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Clones: Hate them, unless they're there to expand the roster a bit more at the end of the game's development time.
Would I like them?
Well, ok, but JUST for the lesser franchises. I don't like Mario/Zelda/FireEmblem and Pokemon overcrowding the roster.


F-Zero: Black Shadow (I HATE this guy, much rather have Goroh, but sadly he's an AT. And it's about time Ganondorf got his own moves.

Punch Out!: King Hippo or Doc Louis, as heavier/slower/stronger versions of Little Mac

Donkey Kong: Dixie, if she's a "Wolfination" of DK and Diddy.

Mother: Ninten. Hey, we got Lucina, there's NO excuse.
-

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

I know that. I meant in general.

well if thats how you want to see it...

 

[praline]

well if thats how you want to see it...

I'm not against his addition. I love Snake and desperately hope for his return to Smash 4.

 

[ihskeyp]

Clones: Hate them, unless they're there to expand the roster a bit more at the end of the game's development time.
Would I like them?
Well, ok, but JUST for the lesser franchises. I don't like Mario/Zelda/FireEmblem and Pokemon overcrowding the roster.


F-Zero: Black Shadow (I HATE this guy, much rather have Goroh, but sadly he's an AT. And it's about time Ganondorf got his own moves.

Punch Out!: King Hippo or Doc Louis, as heavier/slower/stronger versions of Little Mac

Donkey Kong: Dixie, if she's a "Wolfination" of DK and Diddy.

Mother: Ninten. Hey, we got Lucina, there's NO excuse.
-

Ninten as his own character would cause so much hate. He would literally be the most simple alternate costume to make, of all time. Lucina has a completely different model than Marth, there is no excuse to put Ninten in.

 

[MYU2]

Ninten as his own character would cause so much hate. He would literally be the most simple alternate costume to make, of all time. Lucina has a completely different model than Marth, there is no excuse to put Ninten in.

What's wrong with Ninten?

 

[praline]

Clones: Hate them, unless they're there to expand the roster a bit more at the end of the game's development time.
Would I like them?
Well, ok, but JUST for the lesser franchises. I don't like Mario/Zelda/FireEmblem and Pokemon overcrowding the roster.


F-Zero: Black Shadow (I HATE this guy, much rather have Goroh, but sadly he's an AT. And it's about time Ganondorf got his own moves.

Punch Out!: King Hippo or Doc Louis, as heavier/slower/stronger versions of Little Mac

Donkey Kong: Dixie, if she's a "Wolfination" of DK and Diddy.

Mother: Ninten. Hey, we got Lucina, there's NO excuse.
-

Because Ness with a neckerchief is more different than Lucina is to Marth, right?

 

[Doompatron3000]

You are the first person to have this roster. The same roster/hopeful/possible roster as me.

Edit: Minus Bowser Jr for Captain Toad

I personally don't think we'll ever get a playable Toad. With normal Toads being used as a shield for Peach, and Captain Toad, freezes when in front of an enemy. If you have seen any gameplay of Captain Toad's game, it's really just a toad exploring the Mario world, without getting injured, or worse, killed.
That's why Bowser Jr makes more sense as another Mario character. He would of course be a little more lighter than Bowser, and he probably could do some spells with his paintbrush.
Although I do think having Bowser Jr on there is just wishful thinking on my part, since transformations are gone, that takes the more obvious Shadow Mario transformation part of what would probably be Bowser Jr's moveset away.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Ninten as his own character would cause so much hate. He would literally be the most simple alternate costume to make, of all time. Lucina has a completely different model than Marth, there is no excuse to put Ninten in.

He's got the cap facing another way, a neckerchief, and mildly different colors. He also uses a slingshot instead of a yoyo.
Lucina's a slightly shorter Marth with long hair. And apparently is female, but I don't see much difference from Marth

Because Ness with a neckerchief is more different than Lucina is to Marth, right?

That's my whole point.

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

I'm not against his addition. I love Snake and desperately hope for his return to Smash 4.

then i apologize sir, with all the aggression snake gets from people it causes me to usually be hostile towards that in most cases since it happens quite often.

 

[praline]

then i apologize sir, with all the aggression snake gets from people it causes me to usually be hostile towards that in most cases since it happens quite often.

It's alright dude you didn't offend me or anything.

 

[ihskeyp]

He's got the cap facing another way, a neckerchief, and mildly different colors. He also uses a slingshot instead of a yoyo.
Lucina's a slightly shorter Marth with long hair. And apparently is female, but I don't see much difference from Marth



That's my whole point.

Lucinas colors are similar to marths, but everything about her outfit is different, the details and what not. Far more different than Ninten is to Ness.

 

[ElPanandero]

I honestly think Ganondorf is getting a revamp. He may not have a sword, but he honestly deserves a new moveset.
But I don't really think that's fair on Ganondorf mains over the past few games so it could go either way.
Though it would be sweet if Ganondorf gets a new moveset and Black Shadow retains Ganondorf's moveset.


Eh, if that's what he meant, I don't see how a copypaste of Palutena is hard work. Yeah, making a new model and re-texturing some of the moves might be hard but I highly doubt it.

As a Ganon main (and a ganon fan) I really don't get the gripes against his moveset. Other than the fact that he doesnt use hot OOT light blast attack, his moveset suits him. He's got close to highest power (if not the highest) a handful of moves that can kill at impossibly low percentages, and he's an intimidating bruiser. Sure he doesn't use a sword, but seeing him as a Roy Ike Marth Link clones another sword user in a packed field where he stands out. And making him a ranged wizard might be more directly tied to canon, but they'd have to balance him by making him a wuss in physical altercations which would be way too unlike ganondorf.

He really just shares animations with Captain Falcon, but plays so differently from him that I don't even consider him a clone. Gameplay is the most important aspect of a character and Ganon plays just fine.

Though the Triforce Mod for PM is pretty convincing

 

[AEMehr]

I just want Ganondorf to use his Dead Man's Volley and replace his blatant dark Falcon Kick.

I would be perfectly fine with him staying the way he currently is if these two changes were the only ones made.

 

[queenrosetta]

I personally don't think we'll ever get a playable Toad. With normal Toads being used as a shield for Peach, and Captain Toad, freezes when in front of an enemy. If you have seen any gameplay of Captain Toad's game, it's really just a toad exploring the Mario world, without getting injured, or worse, killed.
That's why Bowser Jr makes more sense as another Mario character. He would of course be a little more lighter than Bowser, and he probably could do some spells with his paintbrush.
Although I do think having Bowser Jr on there is just wishful thinking on my part, since transformations are gone, that takes the more obvious Shadow Mario transformation part of what would probably be Bowser Jr's moveset away.

At least he has enemies in his game. Unlike wii fit and villager. So it's not impossible

 

[Rockaphin]

Fixed for realism.

Funny, I didn't know that you knew who I'd like to see more than myself. I never said that's the order I'd expect to see them.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

As long as there's a Ganondorf discussion going on, I wouldn't mind what AEM said happening, but I would also add that Ganondorf hasn't put good use to that sword we see in that one Melee trophy. I just want him to keep the Warlock Punch to see what the Customization options are for it.

 

[Burruni]

As a Ganon main (and a ganon fan) I really don't get the gripes against his moveset. He really just shares animations with Captain Falcon, but plays so differently from him that I don't even consider him a clone. Gameplay is the most important aspect of a character and Ganon plays just fine.

This. This is what I have tried to get people to understand. Ganondorf is the Gerudo King raised by two witches and has the third of the relic of the gods devoted to raw power embedded into his very soul. This feels perfect with his Smash self because every hit FEELS filled with power. Sure, he doesn't use his sword, because he doesn't NEED to. Why change what isn't faulty?

 

[AEMehr]

I think the only reason people even bring up his Sword is because of how it was portrayed in Melee. I mean Ganondorf's challenger approaching render was him JUMPING INTO BATTLE WITH HIS SWORD IN HAND
and one of his winning animations is him shaking the BLOOD OF HIS FOES off of his sword that he never used.

Ganondorf was basically false advertisement in Melee.

 

[ElPanandero]

This. This is what I have tried to get people to understand. Ganondorf is the Gerudo King raised by two witches and has the third of the relic of the gods devoted to raw power embedded into his very soul. This feels perfect with his Smash self because every hit FEELS filled with power. Sure, he doesn't use his sword, because he doesn't NEED to. Why change what isn't faulty?

Thank you, that was a great way to get what I wanted across.

 

[Weeman]

Black Shadow, i feel that it would be a win win to get him in the roster:
- We get new F-zero rep.
- Ganondorf gets new moveset.
- We get to keep te concept of his old moveset through Black Shadow, wich makes sense for him to be similar to Captain Falcon.

 

[The Light Music Club]

Black Shadow, i feel that it would be a win win to get him in the roster:
- We get new F-zero rep.
- Ganondorf gets new moveset.
- We get to keep te concept of his old moveset through Black Shadow, wich makes sense for him to be similar to Captain Falcon.

Personally I feel like he is the only other one with a chance to be a newcomer clone besides Lucina, and it's a slim one at best.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Ganondorf was basically false advertisement in Melee.

...I thought that was Pichu.

 

[Autumn ♫]

...I thought that was Pichu.

Sakurai flat out said he was a bad character, so it doesn't really seem like false advertisment to me.

 

[AEMehr]

...I thought that was Pichu.

I'm not entirely sure how you would come to that conclusion.

Pichu, the Tiny Mouse Pokémon. A pre-evolved form of Pikachu. Despite their size, Pichu release bursts of electricity that can shock even humans. However, Pichu are unskilled at controlling their electricity, and sometimes release it by accident when surprised, or when laughing and shock themselves.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

I'm not entirely sure how you would come to that conclusion.

Sakurai already referred to Pichu as a joke character, didn't he? Either way are you just calling Ganondorf a false advertisement in Melee because of his similarity to Captain Falcon?

 

[shinhed-echi]

I don't mind Ganondorf not having a sword.
But I admit they could have made him not... Falcon-y.


And I don't really care a good deal about Black Shadow. Samurai Goroh and Jody Summers are the next go-to F-Zero candidates for me.

But I have a more interesting question. What if someone would get the Ganondorf treatment?
Meaning, the character is a clone, but it's for a different franchise than the original moveset.
Who would you pick, based on who?

I haven't seen a whole lot of Villager, but I'd have him be the candidate to make a Balloon Fighter clone.
I'd just get rid of all the junk he carries around, and turn it into a bare-handed mimicry of the Villager's moveset.
Except for the balloons of course.

Or take Zero Suit Samus, clone her and make her a heavyweight. Now change the model to Mach Rider, and make his attacks explosive instead of shocking, and BAM!

 

[Cobalsh]

I couldn't care less about clones. If they're in, good. If they're not, good.

But I swear to God if Bowser Jr. is a clone...

 

[Silverjay323]

Lucinas colors are similar to marths, but everything about her outfit is different, the details and what not. Far more different than Ninten is to Ness.

If that's the case then Lucas has no merit, his only differences being a color palette and a haircut. There's no reason Ninten couldn't be an alt, or even a newcomer since he arguably has more moveset potential than Lucina.

 

[KageJuin]

bowser jr as falcon clone. please. nao. do want.

 

[AEMehr]

Sakurai already referred to Pichu as a joke character, didn't he? Either way are you just calling Ganondorf a false advertisement in Melee because of his similarity to Captain Falcon?

I mean Ganondorf's challenger approaching render was him JUMPING INTO BATTLE WITH HIS SWORD IN HAND

Spoiler

and one of his winning animations is him shaking the BLOOD OF HIS FOES off of his sword that he never used.

He had his sword in his official artwork too.

Ganondorf was false advertisement because they constantly showed him with his sword in hand, but he never could use it during gameplay.

 

[Deleted member]

Heres what we need that nobody has thought of...a playable vehicle like the Hornet in Fighters Megamix!

Bike from Excitebike, Mario's Kart, the Arwing, you name it!

 

[The Light Music Club]

Honestly be glad Gdorf made it in melee. If it weren't it for Falcon, he wouldn't have made it.

 

[ihskeyp]

If that's the case then Lucas has no merit, his only differences being besides color palette and a haircut. There's no reason Ninten couldn't be an alt, or even a newcomer since he arguably has more moveset potential than Lucina.

Lucas really didn't need to be his own character, why do you think many think he may be cut? Lucina had plenty if move set potential, but her being a clone is fine and makes sense. Ninten could easily be an alt, I'd be happy with that.

 

[Doompatron3000]

At least he has enemies in his game. Unlike wii fit and villager. So it's not impossible

But unlike those franchises, there are still other characters they could use, before scrapping to a character that doesn't fight.

 

[Silverjay323]

Lucas really didn't need to be his own character, why do you think many think he may be cut? Lucina had plenty if move set potential, but her being a clone is fine and makes sense. Ninten could easily be an alt, I'd be happy with that.

I was being sarcastic. My point being if we can have 4 FE reps, there's no reason we can't have 2-3 Mother reps, with Ninten having less of a reason to be a clone than Lucina and could be more than just an alt.

 

[AEMehr]

Honestly be glad Gdorf made it in melee. If it weren't it for Falcon, he wouldn't have made it.

I would have been happier if they didn't show him a sword consistently.

In Brawl it was funny because Sakurai made it sound like Ganondorf just carries it around to show it off and then beat his foes to pulp with his fists, because he doesn't need to use a sword forged by the GODS to kick your ass.
In Melee it was just like, "Oh hey, check out this nifty sword we advertised with Ganondorf multiple times! Now watch him not use it because he's a Captain Falcon Clone. What made you think he would actually use it?".

Heres what we need that nobody has thought of...a playable vehicle like the Hornet in Fighters Megamix!

Bike from Excitebike, Mario's Kart, the Arwing, you name it!

F-TYPE RACES IN!!