Chaos Control: Shadow the Hedgehog for SSB4!

[Tetra's Tracker]

People have suggested Shadow being a colour swap for Sonic...

Isn't that all Shadow's ever been anyway?

 

[Zigzagar]

Naah that is adding more characters to a 3rd party franchise

 

[StupendousMike]

I didn't make this clear in my post, but I do believe Tails in the ONLY choice for a second Sonic rep. It won't happen, but on the off chance that it does, it HAS to be Tails. Tails is the Luigi to Sonic's Mario.

 

[YoshiandToad]

I think Shadow the Hedgehog is actually the one game character I actively hate with a passion and here are three reasons why:

His inclusion pretty much marks the dark ages of the Sonic games, that the titular hedgehog is only just managing to move away from.
Everyone would rather forget Shadow the Hedgehog(the game), Sonic the Hedgehog(the one where Shadow is again a playble character alongside Silver and Sonic), Sonic Heroes and anything after Sonic Adventure 2 and before Sonic Colours.

He's the embodiment of bad story telling and BS fan pandering in the games industry.
His backstory was fine, don't get me wrong, and his arc within Sonic Adventure 2's Dark side story was good. Frankly his heroic sacrifice didn't make much sense at the end(spoilers; but by this point anyone who wanted to play it would have) but the way it was done seemed to wrap up his arc very nicely and he finally found peace.

AND THEN HE SURVIVED. Sorta. A bit. Maybe. Heroes suggests he's a robot clone, Shadow the Hedgehog(the game) has several nonsensical solutions to how he survived, but of course the real reason he survived? Pathetic Fan Pandering.

Shadow turned out to be more popular with the teenage market than they'd anticipated because he was black(yes black was considered cool at the time), tormented and was an anti hero. So Sega wussed out of their ending, a perfectly fine ending which could have made Shadow one of most well remembered characters, gave some nonsense reasoning to how he survived and hoped this would be enough to trick people into thinking this was clever storytelling rather than a cynical money making stunt.
Didn't work.

As a character he's redundant for Smash and arguably even in Sonic itself:
Sonic can do anything he can do(including Chaos Control as we saw in SA2), Shadow's a third party character from a company who obviously already has a rep, and Tails, Eggman AND Knuckles are all more unique than Shadow, have senority, and are more relevent to the current games than Shadow who is basically there to appease the fans who wanted a darker and edgier Sonic character. Shadow's as edgy as a satsuma even if you add guns, swearing and motorcycles he's still an unrealistic cartoon hedgehog.


Obviously this post is made of bile and bias, but considering the general viewpoints on having clones in the first place, a third party clone character(whose even a clone in the Sonic games, sometimes a robotic clone at that) is one of the stupidest character support thread ideas I've seen on this board and that is saying something.

 

[Jacob Listerud]

Obviously this post is made of bile and bias, but considering the general viewpoints on having clones in the first place, a third party clone character(whose even a clone in the Sonic games, sometimes a robotic clone at that) is one of the stupidest character support thread ideas I've seen on this board and that is saying something.

Well, thank you very much for admitting how biased this post was, because I can easily get the impression that you're being a troll.

 

[Jacob Listerud]

Oh, and one more thing: I actually like Shadow the Hedgehog(the game).

 

[8-peacock-8]

Shadow The Hedgehog (Video Game) - Terrible game but not as bad as SAWWNAC OH SIX.

Also, only one SEGA rep and thats Sonic himself. Shadow can stay as an assist trophy.

 

[Yoichi Hiruma]

Shadow the Hedgehog was a great game IMO. My FAVORITE Sonic Game.
IF, and I mean IF, he was somehow included, his moveset should consist of moves from Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic Battle, Sonic Heroes, and SA:2 Battle.
Shadow the Hedgehog gave him HUGE moveset potential.
Street Signs, Alien Blasters, Shadow Rifle, His Bike, Satellite Lasers, Triangle Jumps, Hand to Hand fighting, it'd be great.
And he could have the Black Tornado, Chaos Moves, and Punches and Kicks imbued with Chaos, like in Sonic Battle.
And he'd have a lot of items to contribute, signs, guns, swords, lasers, a ton of other cool tools.

 

[Jacob Listerud]

Personally, I don't think it's fair for a third-party franchise in Smash Bros to have only one character representing it. To me, it feels discriminatory and it doesn't seem to give the third-party franchises nearly as much credit as they deserve. If there's any franchise in Smash Bros. that deserves to have multiple characters representing it, it's Sonic the Hedgehog.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Personally, I don't think it's fair for a third-party franchise in Smash Bros to have only one character representing it. To me, it feels discriminatory and it doesn't seem to give the third-party franchises nearly as much credit as they deserve. If there's any franchise in Smash Bros. that deserves to have multiple characters representing it, it's Sonic the Hedgehog.

It is completely fair.

The fact Sonic, Snake and now Megaman got in is a nice bonus, but at the end of the day it's a game of Nintendo All Stars. Super Smash Bros. is a series dedicated to celebrating Nintendo and Nintendo's history.

Hell; even though I hate this particular Sonic character, doesn't mean I wouldn't love for Tails or Knuckles or someone else from a Third Party Franchise to get equal treatment, but best you can hope for is Shadow continuing being an Assist Trophy or maybe a palette swap/costume change for Sonic. Which is frankly still a lot more than any other minor third party characters are going to get.

 

[Tetra's Tracker]

Personally, I don't think it's fair for a third-party franchise in Smash Bros to have only one character representing it. To me, it feels discriminatory and it doesn't seem to give the third-party franchises nearly as much credit as they deserve. If there's any franchise in Smash Bros. that deserves to have multiple characters representing it, it's Sonic the Hedgehog.

Unfair? Ugh, statements like this go against everything I believe Super Smash Bros should be.

Super Smash Bros is a series for Nintendo all-stars and celebrating Nintendo history, it's not for celebrating third parties. Third party series are there as GUESTS. It's like a person's house, they live there, it's their house, they can do whatever they want in it. However when someone comes to visit, they're a guest in that persons house, which means they can't do whatever they please in it, there's limits. If Sonic wasn't a guest in SSB, if his series was a Nintendo series, then he could be afforded the luxury of a second rep. It's much like the Polish man who came to do some plastering in my house a few weeks ago - he was a guest. If he wasn't a guest and he actually belonged in the house he'd be afforded luxuries such as playing loud jungle music and drinking all the booze.

 

[SonicMario]

Personally, I don't think it's fair for a third-party franchise in Smash Bros to have only one character representing it. To me, it feels discriminatory and it doesn't seem to give the third-party franchises nearly as much credit as they deserve. If there's any franchise in Smash Bros. that deserves to have multiple characters representing it, it's Sonic the Hedgehog.

I'm all for 3rd parties getting proper representation. But a 2nd rep is now how you do that.

Even though Sonic was last minute, he got himself as a playable character, a stage based on his first level in his first game, a nice selection of trophies, stickers, and of course music. In my opinion they did well placing him in Smash even if he got in a bit late. He felt like a proper piece of the game.

I really want him back so they can just have more of that. Have Sonic back with perhaps a tweaked moveset, a level based on Sonic Lost World I imagine would be in the works (Even if I'd personally like one based on the Adventure series.). Some more trophies of Sonic related characters and there's nothing that'd please me more to have much more selection regarding Sonic music given that the one thing that's almost always been strong in the Sonic series is the Music.

But asking for a 2nd rep is just too much and is unfair to those who are fans of a nintendo franchise that are stuck with only one rep like F-Zero. The only chance we get a 2nd Sonic rep is pretty much most of the long standing franchises in the game get at least one more rep or Nintendo buys Sega, making them 2nd Party.

 

[Opossum]

Personally, I don't think it's fair for a third-party franchise in Smash Bros to have only one character representing it. To me, it feels discriminatory and it doesn't seem to give the third-party franchises nearly as much credit as they deserve. If there's any franchise in Smash Bros. that deserves to have multiple characters representing it, it's Sonic the Hedgehog.

Be happy we even got Sonic. It's a Nintendo game at heart, and the third parties are more of just, well, bonuses. Sonic, Snake and Mega Man could all be gone in SSB5 or SSB6, and even then, it's still Smash Bros. Asking for additional characters from an already represented third party is just hopeless, really. There are much more important Nintendo characters to add first.

 

[Jacob Listerud]

It is completely fair.

No, it isn't. To me, it feels like Nintendo is deliberately giving third-party franchises the short end of the stick, and are not giving them as much credit as the first-party ones, and look at PlayStation All-Stars. An abundance of third-party characters are in the game. So, I think Nintendo should have more flexibility, and so should you. It really bothers me that you wouldn't even try to encourage Nintendo to have an open mind all because none of you have open minds yourselves. Stop being so stuck-up and be just a bit more willing to encourage Nintendo to support just a little bit more third-party love. Any third-party franchise with a very strong presence on Nintendo platforms like Sonic or MegaMan should receive as much devotion in Smash Bros. as any one first-party franchise individually. Nintendo should feel free to remove Solid Snake and Metal Gear from Smash Bros, but Sonic should remain and if at least one other character from his franchise were to show up along with him, I'd be happy. If Shadow were that character, I'd feel like a kid at a candy store.

And I don't want to hear any excuses for Shadow not appearing. That way, you're just being closed-minded and I have no reason for listening to you. If you don't have faith in the idea of Shadow in Smash Bros, then maybe you shouldn't be posting to this form.

 

[Welshy91]

 

[Jacob Listerud]

Then why don't you just stop being so stuck-up and closed-minded already. I don't wanna hear, "How about no." My way or the highway.

 

[Kapus]

No, it isn't. To me, it feels like Nintendo is deliberately giving third-party franchises the short end of the stick, and are not giving them as much credit as the first-party ones,

They are third parties. This is a game specifically about Nintendo characters, i.e. first parties. This isn't Mugen. Why should the guests get as much attention as the main attraction?

and look at PlayStation All-Stars. An abundance of third-party characters are in the game.

I'm not too familiar with PSAS, so forgive me here, but how many "first party" characters does Sony actually have to use? Isn't the game library on the PS3 composed mostly of "third party" games? PSAS, from my understanding, is about characters who are popular and prominent on the Playstation consoles, which is greatly composed of third parties. Super Smash Bros. is specifically about characters created and developed by Nintendo themselves.

So, I think Nintendo should have more flexibility, and so should you. It really bothers me that you wouldn't even try to encourage Nintendo to have an open mind all because none of you have open minds yourselves.

It's got nothing to do with closed-mindedness. If this was a game about random video game characters in general, then yeah Sonic should get as much attention as Mario or Zelda. But it's not. It's about Nintendo. Non-Nintendo characters are simply appearing as guests. Why is that difficult to understand?

If you don't have faith in the idea of Shadow in Smash Bros, then maybe you shouldn't be posting to this form.

Even if Sonic somehow was offered a second character, Shadow probably would not be the choice. While he does have some unique abilities with his Chaos powers, the rest of his character and appearance is far too similar to Sonic to offer something new.

Shadow is a bit of a side character. Tails is much more prominent and important to the series, as Sonic's Luigi, so he would probably be the most likely choice.

 

[SonicMario]

No, it isn't. To me, it feels like Nintendo is deliberately giving third-party franchises the short end of the stick, and are not giving them as much credit as the first-party ones, and look at PlayStation All-Stars. An abundance of third-party characters are in the game. So, I think Nintendo should have more flexibility, and so should you. It really bothers me that you wouldn't even try to encourage Nintendo to have an open mind all because none of you have open minds yourselves. Stop being so stuck-up and be just a bit more willing to encourage Nintendo to support just a little bit more third-party love. Any third-party franchise with a very strong presence on Nintendo platforms like Sonic or MegaMan should receive as much devotion in Smash Bros. as any one first-party franchise individually. Nintendo should feel free to remove Solid Snake and Metal Gear from Smash Bros, but Sonic should remain and if at least one other character from his franchise were to show up along with him, I'd be happy. If Shadow were that character, I'd feel like a kid at a candy store.

And I don't want to hear any excuses for Shadow not appearing. That way, you're just being closed-minded and I have no reason for listening to you. If you don't have faith in the idea of Shadow in Smash Bros, then maybe you shouldn't be posting to this form.

*sigh*

I've said this once, and I'm only going to say this one more time.

I'm all-for 3rd parties getting the proper representation that they deserve

But a 2nd rep is not the solution

Sonic will be the lone representative of his own franchise unless somehow the rights to the Sonic franchise are given to Nintendo in some way, other Nintendo franchises like Metroid and F-Zero get at least another rep, or whoever is director of a future Smash game when Sakurai isn't the director anymore allows it (Because I think its ultimately Sakurai's choice on how 3rd parties are presented)

At the very least, worry about Sonic first before mentioning Shadow. It's likely he's going to be back, but don't you think the idea of Sonic related stuff not being in the game at all would be worse then not having an additional Sonic character (No matter who it is) regarding your thoughts on keeping 3rd parties equal in standings with Nintendo franchises?

 

[Mabataki]

At the very least, worry about Sonic first before mentioning Shadow. It's likely he's going to be back, but don't you think the idea of Sonic related stuff not being in the game at all would be worse then not having an additional Sonic character (No matter who it is) regarding your thoughts on keeping 3rd parties equal in standings with Nintendo franchises?

Agreed. And as much as id like Knuckles to get in, id be alright with Tails or Shadow. Please not Robotnik though... though he would be fun as a boss.

 

[Tetra's Tracker]

No, it isn't.

Yes it is.

To me, it feels like Nintendo is deliberately giving third-party franchises the short end of the stick, and are not giving them as much credit as the first-party ones

I don't think you understand what Super Smash Bros is. SSB isn't a 'video game all-stars' game like you think it is, it's a Nintendo all-stars game. It's about celebrating games that Nintendo have made, not Sega games or those of any other company. Sonic, Snake and Mega Man are there as guest characters, they're there as side attractions. Therefore it's right that their series gets less content than the Nintendo series. You need to accept this and stop being greedy. You should be extremely pleased about what Sonic got in Brawl. Sonic could easily have not been in the game and at all, there's no great reason why he should've been in the game in the first place, but he was. Once he was in it could've just been him, but no, he brought a lot of content with him - a stage, an assist trophy, twelve music tracks, twelve trophies, about thirty stickers - for a guest series that a lot of stuff!

It's like going to see a band and then complaining that the support band played for less time than the main band - well duh, of course they'll play for less time! They're the support band! It's the main band which the show is all about, just be happy the support band was there at all.

It isn't about not giving third-party franchises credit, it's just that the game isn't about those franchises, it's about Nintendo franchises. Again they're not the main attractions, they're the side shows, it's the Nintendo stuff that's the main attraction. Sonic getting multiple characters defeats the purpose of him being a guest. If you want a crossover game where Sonic and Nintendo is treated equally, play Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games.

If you think the Sonic series is being screwed you should try being a Punch Out, or Wars, or Golden Sun, or Custom Robo, or Puzzle League... These are big iconic Nintendo franchises, yet they've barely had any representation in SSB at all, possibly less than Sonic put together. If any franchises are being treated unfairly it's them, not Sonic. Why should a non-Nintendo series be pumped with more content whilst these great Nintendo franchises are left to rot?

...and look at PlayStation All-Stars. An abundance of third-party characters are in the game.

Your argument completely falls apart here because you simply cannot compare SSB and PlayStation All-Stars or Nintendo and Sony. The reason why PlayStation All-Stars has 'an abundance of third-party' characters is because there is no first-party Sony characters, Sony is a hardware company, they don't make games. That's why it's called 'Playstation All-Stars' rather than 'Sony All-Stars' because it's a game for characters that appear on Playstation consoles rather than characters Sony have created themselves. Nintendo on the other hand is a software company, a company that does make games, something they've been doing for about 40 years now. Apples and oranges.

So, I think Nintendo should have more flexibility, and so should you. It really bothers me that you wouldn't even try to encourage Nintendo to have an open mind all because none of you have open minds yourselves. Stop being so stuck-up and be just a bit more willing to encourage Nintendo to support just a little bit more third-party love. Any third-party franchise with a very strong presence on Nintendo platforms like Sonic or MegaMan should receive as much devotion in Smash Bros. as any one first-party franchise individually. Nintendo should feel free to remove Solid Snake and Metal Gear from Smash Bros, but Sonic should remain and if at least one other character from his franchise were to show up along with him, I'd be happy. If Shadow were that character, I'd feel like a kid at a candy store.

There's a difference between been close-minded and flexible, and not wanting the series to abandon it's core principles and become a completely different game. I want Smash Bros to still be Smash Bros, not Nintendo v Sega v Capcom v Konami etc. Does that make me close-minded and inflexible? I don't think so. Me being close-minded and inflexible would be not wanting any third party characters in the game at all. I actually support third-party representation, within reason, i.e. one character per franchise, only extremely significant characters getting in, one character per franchise... I think that's perfectly reasonable. Giving a third-party series more than one rep, elevating it to the same level and above a lot of Nintendo franchises in the game I think is unreasonable and I think it goes against the point of them being in the game (as guests). Sorry.

And I don't want to hear any excuses for Shadow not appearing. That way, you're just being closed-minded and I have no reason for listening to you. If you don't have faith in the idea of Shadow in Smash Bros, then maybe you shouldn't be posting to this form.

This last part is so pathetic and childish that it's barely worth responding to. You don't want to hear any reason why Shadow shouldn't be in the game because it makes us close-minded? We shouldn't be posting on the forum if we don't want Shadow? It's a shame this is a forum, if it wasn't you could put your hands over you ears and shout, "LA LA LA! NOT LISTENING! SHADOW IS THE BEST! HE SHOULD BE IN SSB4! LA LA LA LA". And you call US close-minded? :O

 

[8-peacock-8]

Then why don't you just stop being so stuck-up and closed-minded already. I don't wanna hear, "How about no." My way or the highway.

No, it isn't. To me, it feels like Nintendo is deliberately giving third-party franchises the short end of the stick, and are not giving them as much credit as the first-party ones, and look at PlayStation All-Stars. An abundance of third-party characters are in the game. So, I think Nintendo should have more flexibility, and so should you. It really bothers me that you wouldn't even try to encourage Nintendo to have an open mind all because none of you have open minds yourselves. Stop being so stuck-up and be just a bit more willing to encourage Nintendo to support just a little bit more third-party love. Any third-party franchise with a very strong presence on Nintendo platforms like Sonic or MegaMan should receive as much devotion in Smash Bros. as any one first-party franchise individually. Nintendo should feel free to remove Solid Snake and Metal Gear from Smash Bros, but Sonic should remain and if at least one other character from his franchise were to show up along with him, I'd be happy. If Shadow were that character, I'd feel like a kid at a candy store.

And I don't want to hear any excuses for Shadow not appearing. That way, you're just being closed-minded and I have no reason for listening to you. If you don't have faith in the idea of Shadow in Smash Bros, then maybe you shouldn't be posting to this form.

1. Super Smash Bros is a celebration of NINTENDO all-stars.

2. Playstation All-Stars is about the console and NOT the company.

3. Since Smash is about NINTENDO all stars, Third Parties will NEVER be very high on priority unless they are on the levels of Sonic and Mega Man.

4. Your way or the Highway? You lose any chance of people taking you seriously after you said that.

 

[Welshy91]

Stop bamping the thread, just let it die along with any chances of Shadow being in SSB4.

 

[volbound1700]

Shadow would be a clone of Sonic. He often is already in the Sonic Series (See SA2 multiplayer, Sonic Heroes, etc.).

 

[woopyfrood]

Shadow is possibly the epitome of trite anti-heroes. His clichedly dark appearance, personality, and story are either cringe-worthy at worst or comical at best, carrying with them all the eloquence of an "Original Character" drawn up by an angst-ridden preteen on DeviantArt. His mere concept renders every word he speaks, every action he takes, blunt and overdone. I cannot think of a character that panders to the inherent appeal of conflicted negativity more awkwardly or laughably than Shadow the Hedgehog. He is the Linkin Park of video game characters.

...But I like him, and I wouldn't be mad if he got in. In fact, I find him rather endearing in an odd, audacious sort of way.

Here's to you, Shadow.

 

[Welshy91]

Shadow is possibly the epitome of trite anti-heroes. His clichedly dark appearance, personality, and story are either cringe-worthy at worst or comical at best, carrying with them all the eloquence of an "Original Character" drawn up by an angst-ridden preteen on DeviantArt. His mere concept renders every word he speaks, every action he takes, blunt and overdone. I cannot think of a character that panders to the inherent appeal of conflicted negativity more awkwardly or laughably than Shadow the Hedgehog. He is the Linkin Park of video game characters.

...But I like him, and I wouldn't be mad if he got in. In fact, I find him rather endearing in an odd, audacious sort of way.

Here's to you, Shadow.

I'm breaking my own rule by bumping this, but your post has stirred me into action. You essentially just said that Shadow is one of the worst characters ever but you wouldn't mind him in Smash. That's like listing off every terrible thing Hitler did and then giving him a medal.

 

[woopyfrood]

The difference is that fiction can be so bad it's good, while invoking Godwin's Law is always bad.

 

[SonicMario]

He is the Linkin Park of video game characters.

Is it weird that I like Linkin Park's music but I've never been an "emo preteen" at any time of my life? :S

 

[UltimateWario]

If Sonic were, by some insane "miracle" to get another rep, it wouldn't be Shadow.

It seems like Sonic Team has wised up (partially) and stopped cramming his face into everything. Tails and Eggman are much bigger Sonic characters now, and also have plenty of moveset potential (although Tails, like Shadow, would likely end up a semi-clone), so I'd imagine Eggman would probably be the second Sonic rep, if such a thing existed.

Also, Metal Sonic has pretty much reclaimed his (rightful) throne as Sonic's primary rival, so there's always that. Shadow kinda just does his own thing now.

 

[woopyfrood]

Is it weird that I like Linkin Park's music but I've never been an "emo preteen" at any time of my life? :S

Not really. Their tunes are pretty catchy by design.

 

[Autumn ♫]

I don't get what's up with the general hatred towards Shadow. I've always liked him as a character and I always liked Sonic Heroes (my personal favorite out of the few Sonic games I've played) and Shadow the Hedgehog (the game). I can however, understand why people don't want to see him playable, as I don't care to see him playable either, especially before Vaati.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

It is completely fair.

The fact Sonic, Snake and now Megaman got in is a nice bonus, but at the end of the day it's a game of Nintendo All Stars. Super Smash Bros. is a series dedicated to celebrating Nintendo and Nintendo's history.

Hell; even though I hate this particular Sonic character, doesn't mean I wouldn't love for Tails or Knuckles or someone else from a Third Party Franchise to get equal treatment, but best you can hope for is Shadow continuing being an Assist Trophy or maybe a palette swap/costume change for Sonic. Which is frankly still a lot more than any other minor third party characters are going to get.

No, it isn't fair, you have pointed out absolutely nothing. The only reason that Metal Gear and MegaMan don't get second reps is that Nintendo does not help those franchises stand out. Nintendo does a perfect job making Sonic stand out, so Shadow has an extremely high chance whether it makes sense to you or not!!! You don't like it, then stop trying to crush other peoples hopes like some crazy maniacal dictator.

Yes it is.

I don't think you understand what Super Smash Bros is. SSB isn't a 'video game all-stars' game like you think it is, it's a Nintendo all-stars game. It's about celebrating games that Nintendo have made, not Sega games or those of any other company. Sonic, Snake and Mega Man are there as guest characters, they're there as side attractions. Therefore it's right that their series gets less content than the Nintendo series. You need to accept this and stop being greedy. You should be extremely pleased about what Sonic got in Brawl. Sonic could easily have not been in the game and at all, there's no great reason why he should've been in the game in the first place, but he was. Once he was in it could've just been him, but no, he brought a lot of content with him - a stage, an assist trophy, twelve music tracks, twelve trophies, about thirty stickers - for a guest series that a lot of stuff!

It's like going to see a band and then complaining that the support band played for less time than the main band - well duh, of course they'll play for less time! They're the support band! It's the main band which the show is all about, just be happy the support band was there at all.

It isn't about not giving third-party franchises credit, it's just that the game isn't about those franchises, it's about Nintendo franchises. Again they're not the main attractions, they're the side shows, it's the Nintendo stuff that's the main attraction. Sonic getting multiple characters defeats the purpose of him being a guest. If you want a crossover game where Sonic and Nintendo is treated equally, play Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games.

If you think the Sonic series is being screwed you should try being a Punch Out, or Wars, or Golden Sun, or Custom Robo, or Puzzle League... These are big iconic Nintendo franchises, yet they've barely had any representation in SSB at all, possibly less than Sonic put together. If any franchises are being treated unfairly it's them, not Sonic. Why should a non-Nintendo series be pumped with more content whilst these great Nintendo franchises are left to rot?

Your argument completely falls apart here because you simply cannot compare SSB and PlayStation All-Stars or Nintendo and Sony. The reason why PlayStation All-Stars has 'an abundance of third-party' characters is because there is no first-party Sony characters, Sony is a hardware company, they don't make games. That's why it's called 'Playstation All-Stars' rather than 'Sony All-Stars' because it's a game for characters that appear on Playstation consoles rather than characters Sony have created themselves. Nintendo on the other hand is a software company, a company that does make games, something they've been doing for about 40 years now. Apples and oranges.

There's a difference between been close-minded and flexible, and not wanting the series to abandon it's core principles and become a completely different game. I want Smash Bros to still be Smash Bros, not Nintendo v Sega v Capcom v Konami etc. Does that make me close-minded and inflexible? I don't think so. Me being close-minded and inflexible would be not wanting any third party characters in the game at all. I actually support third-party representation, within reason, i.e. one character per franchise, only extremely significant characters getting in, one character per franchise... I think that's perfectly reasonable. Giving a third-party series more than one rep, elevating it to the same level and above a lot of Nintendo franchises in the game I think is unreasonable and I think it goes against the point of them being in the game (as guests). Sorry.

This last part is so pathetic and childish that it's barely worth responding to. You don't want to hear any reason why Shadow shouldn't be in the game because it makes us close-minded? We shouldn't be posting on the forum if we don't want Shadow? It's a shame this is a forum, if it wasn't you could put your hands over you ears and shout, "LA LA LA! NOT LISTENING! SHADOW IS THE BEST! HE SHOULD BE IN SSB4! LA LA LA LA". And you call US close-minded? :O

SETTLE DOWN!!!!!!!!!

 

[Tetra's Tracker]

SETTLE DOWN!!!!!!!!!

No, it isn't fair, you have pointed out absolutely nothing. The only reason that Metal Gear and MegaMan don't get second reps is that Nintendo does not help those franchises stand out. Nintendo does a perfect job making Sonic stand out, so Shadow has an extremely high chance whether it makes sense to you or not!!! You don't like it, then stop trying to crush other peoples hopes like some crazy maniacal dictator.

Hi Jacob.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Hi Jacob.

Is this a joke?

 

[YoshiandToad]

No, it isn't fair, you have pointed out absolutely nothing. The only reason that Metal Gear and MegaMan don't get second reps is that Nintendo does not help those franchises stand out. Nintendo does a perfect job making Sonic stand out, so Shadow has an extremely high chance whether it makes sense to you or not!!! You don't like it, then stop trying to crush other peoples hopes like some crazy maniacal dictator.

I don't have to stop it.

Sakurai will do it himself.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Shadow has every right to be in the game as playable. This is the Year of Sonic, and Sakurai CAN AND WILL play along in some way. There is always a first time when something like that happens. All these people think they're so smart saying that he's third party, but that is INSIGNIFICANT!! And yes, the rumors about Shadow being planned as playable in Brawl are true, I should know because I've met someone who works for Nintendo. Shadow completely rips off an item as an assist trophy in Brawl, and is far too famous to be an assist trophy in the first place. I've also seen people say that each third party franchise must be limited to one representative, WRONG!!!!!!!! It depends on the popularity of the franchise, and yes, the Sonic Franchise qualifies for a second character as playable because it is far too famous to be given only one playable character.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Shadow has every right to be in the game as playable. This is the Year of Sonic, and Sakurai CAN AND WILL play along in some way. There is always a first time when something like that happens. All these people think they're so smart saying that he's third party, but that is INSIGNIFICANT!! And yes, the rumors about Shadow being planned as playable in Brawl are true, I should know because I've met someone who works for Nintendo. Shadow completely rips off an item as an assist trophy in Brawl, and is far too famous to be an assist trophy in the first place. I've also seen people say that each third party franchise must be limited to one representative, WRONG!!!!!!!! It depends on the popularity of the franchise, and yes, the Sonic Franchise qualifies for a second character as playable because it is far too famous to be given only one playable character.

Of course you have met someone who worked at Nintendo. Who hasn't?

A few things;
1.) development was pushed back for the inclusion of Sonic the Hedgehog. His inclusion meant the cutting of Mewtwo and Roy. We have data on this. Let's say you're not spouting total gibberish on this point; Shadow was planned about as much as Starfy, Isaac, Waluigi, Toad, Ridley, Porky or Gardevoir were in Brawl. In other words a lot of characters were thought about, but this is just plain ol' silly to claim Shadow was planned.

2.) if you wanna support Shadow by all means go ahead. I don't really mind who you support. You wanna support Goku from DBZ? Go right ahead. If you care enough to respond to a post from August 2013, then it's your choice. I'm happy to admit I support some silly choices, so feel free to go and support this incredibly unlikely character.

3.) I have no doubt Sonic will get some cool content to go along with him. I just don't think a secondary character is where it'll be. Again if you want to say you think Shadow is highly likely, that is your choice.

4.) Sakurai has stated that the game is still all about Nintendo first and third parties have to be truly legendary to be considered for inclusion. What has Shadow done that warrants his inclusion over say...Pac-Man, the father of all video game mascots or Bomberman for example...or hell; even Tails from the same series who is Mario's Luigi, and has been included far more of recent in Sonic games than Shadow?

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Shadow would be a clone of Sonic. He often is already in the Sonic Series (See SA2 multiplayer, Sonic Heroes, etc.).

Not necessarily, you obviously have never played the 2005 game Shadow the Hedgehog. I'd say that Shadow knows a ton more about Chaos Control than Sonic does, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living thing could outsmart him in the ways of Chaos Control.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Not necessarily, you obviously have never played the 2005 game Shadow the Hedgehog. I'd say that Shadow knows a ton more about Chaos Control than Sonic does, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living thing could outsmart him in the ways of Chaos Control.

Alright you get a like for the Team Fortress 2 quote.

 

[ToothiestAura]

Shadow has no right to be in this game. The year of sonic has nothing to with Nintendo. 3rd Party franchises are limited to one rep because Smash is about Nintendo characters. Go play the Sonic fighting games and shut up.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Alright you get a like for the Team Fortress 2 quote.

But...

That's a quote from Zhu's Art of War.


Shadow will not get in. He was never planned for Brawl. I have no idea why you think that. Regardless it's false.