Chaos Control: Shadow the Hedgehog for SSB4!

[JaidynReiman]

Wow, um, damn, this topic... I have no words to express everything in it.

It is really odd but I had heard that Shadow and Gray Fox were concepted by Sakurai as playable characters but Konami and Sega denied them. I've heard this numerous times, not just from one source. Is that actually false? I wasn't aware.


I love Shadow the Hedgehog, and I really, really want Shadow to appear in another fighting game again. I'd love a new Sonic fighter, or even a Sega fighting game as well. Shadow CAN be a clone of Sonic, but Sonic Battle is my reply to any arguments made about a Sonic character being a clone of another Sonic character. Shadow is completely and totally epic in Sonic Battle, and there's no way he would simply HAVE to be a clone of Sonic if he was added to Smash Bros. I completely disagree with any arguments like this.

At the same time, I completely agree with any arguments against Shadow getting in due to lack of third-party characters. It is PERFECTLY fair that any third-party franchise has only one playable character. With so few third-parties, its better to focus on a larger variety of third-parties featured than multiple third-party characters, or better yet, more Nintendo characters. It is a Nintendo fighter, after all. Granted, third-party characters with a huge focus on Nintendo consoles I also support, hence why Sonic and Mega Man are such great suggestions.


If the option were available, I would totally support Shadow being in Smash Bros. But let's be real, its not going to happen. So, yeah, that's my opinion. Totally love Shadow, love that he was brought back after SA2, hate the WAY he was brought back, and don't see him going anywhere anytime soon. Heck, since he was chosen as an Assist over anyone else in Brawl, I do feel that if Sonic WERE to get a second playable, Shadow would be it, but obviously it won't happen.

 

[Dr.Megaman]

I'M WEARING LADIES UNDERWEAR.

 

[synesthe-sia]

Wow, um, damn, this topic... I have no words to express everything in it.

It is really odd but I had heard that Shadow and Gray Fox were concepted by Sakurai as playable characters but Konami and Sega denied them. I've heard this numerous times, not just from one source. Is that actually false? I wasn't aware.

I've never even heard of that. I think both Shadow and Gray Fox would be cool. For what it's worth, Sakurai did say something a bit intriguing about Gray Fox when introducing him as an assist trophy.

He approaches stealthily with lithe jumps, coming right in then slicing repeatedly. Awww! It makes you want to use him as a playable character.

Source: http://www.smashbros.com/wii/en_us/items/assist/assist11.html

I agree with Sakurai 100%. I'm a fan of fast characters and Gray Fox would likely be fun to play as. What he said doesn't necessarily make him likely or anything like that, but it seems that he at least sees the appeal behind him being potentially playable.

 

[StaffofSmashing]

Shadow is... an interesting Sonic pick. I always wanted characters like Egg Robo in the game because they are my favorites. but I guess Shadow also could do.

Silver4smashsilver4smashsilver4smash.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Ok, i wasn't gonna say it, but as much as I do want Shadow in the game as playable, he won't be. The only reason I'm not as rough against him as other users are is that there is an extremely high possibility that Nintendo is about to buy SEGA. That wouldn't only get Shadow in, it would also bring in Tails, Amy, Knuckles, Sticks, maybe Silver and Rouge.

 

[Reila]

I would much rather have either Knuckles or Tails over Shadow in Smash. They are more important in the series and have more potential for an unique moveset. Plus, Shadow is kind of a cringe worthy character (no offense to his fans, of course).

Ok, i wasn't gonna say it, but as much as I do want Shadow in the game as playable, he won't be. The only reason I'm not as rough against him as other users are is that there is an extremely high possibility that Nintendo is about to buy SEGA. That wouldn't only get Shadow in, it would also bring in Tails, Amy, Knuckles, Sticks, maybe Silver and Rouge.

What? lol

 

[Substitution]

Honestly, if we're getting a second Sega rep, I'd much prefer it that we go a new franchise all-together. And even if we get a Sonic rep it would most likely be Tails.

 

[Welshy91]

This thread is bad and you should feel bad.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Honestly, if we're getting a second Sega rep, I'd much prefer it that we go a new franchise all-together. And even if we get a Sonic rep it would most likely be Tails.

Unfortunately, this I disagree on. Why did they pick Shadow as an AT for Sonic the Hedgehog instead of Tails? If Tails were a better Sonic pick, I think Tails would've been the AT instead. I honestly do believe if we HAD a second Sonic rep, it'd be Shadow. (That said I'm well aware it won't happen, just speaking figuratively here. )

 

[SonicMario]

Unfortunately, this I disagree on. Why did they pick Shadow as an AT for Sonic the Hedgehog instead of Tails? If Tails were a better Sonic pick, I think Tails would've been the AT instead. I honestly do believe if we HAD a second Sonic rep, it'd be Shadow. (That said I'm well aware it won't happen, just speaking figuratively here. )

I think they picked Shadow because it was an easier Assist Trophy to make. Since Sonic was pretty last minute. Shadow was basically a shorter version of the Timer. While Tails being an Assist Trophy could of been something a little more complicated. I don't think Shadow being the one assist trophy instead of Tails means all that much. By this logic, Waluigi should have been the fifth Mario rep over Rosalina. But no, he's still an assist trophy.

It also helps in Tails favor that he's been more important in recent games then Shadow has. Shadow's last appearence in a big Sonic game was as a boss in Sonic Generations. Otherwise he's been relegated to spin-offs ever since Sonic 06 which was his last major role. And it came in pretty much the worst game of the franchise that also was not put on a Nintendo console whatsoever. Tails has at least had supporting roles in Sonic Colors, Sonic Lost World, will be playable in Sonic Boom, and while it wasn't on a Nintendo console. Sonic 4 Episode 2 also had Tails following Sonic as he once did back in Sonic 2.

That said I share the opinion regarding just how likely it is that we even get a Sonic rep in Smash 4 at all. Which is really unlikely. But I think regarding circumstances now, Tails has the upper hand. If Sonic ever gets another rep. We should remember the Mario series got Luigi before Bowser, Peach, or Wario. Tails is pretty much Sonic's Luigi, so it's likely he'd get in over the also equivalent characters of Eggman, Amy, and Knuckles and/or Shadow respectively

 

[Opossum]

Ok, i wasn't gonna say it, but as much as I do want Shadow in the game as playable, he won't be. The only reason I'm not as rough against him as other users are is that there is an extremely high possibility that Nintendo is about to buy SEGA. That wouldn't only get Shadow in, it would also bring in Tails, Amy, Knuckles, Sticks, maybe Silver and Rouge.

There's really no reason to believe Nintendo is going to buy out SEGA. You should stop saying that.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

There's really no reason to believe Nintendo is going to buy out SEGA. You should stop saying that.

I seriously doubt there is any truth in that, but very well, I will limit the times I bring it up. I can see how it may be annoying, but that wasn't the overall intention.

 

[SmashShadow]

I think they picked Shadow because it was an easier Assist Trophy to make. Since Sonic was pretty last minute. Shadow was basically a shorter version of the Timer. While Tails being an Assist Trophy could of been something a little more complicated. I don't think Shadow being the one assist trophy instead of Tails means all that much. By this logic, Waluigi should have been the fifth Mario rep over Rosalina. But no, he's still an assist trophy.

That's not a good argument considering no Mario Galaxy content was in Brawl and the game had just come out. Rosalina may as well have not existed at that time. By Smash 4 though she had been in many roles including playable character in a platformer Mario game which did make her more important.

 

[SonicMario]

That's not a good argument considering no Mario Galaxy content was in Brawl and the game had just come out. Rosalina may as well have not existed at that time. By Smash 4 though she had been in many roles including playable character in a platformer Mario game which did make her more important.

My point was not just about Rosalina though. Jaidyn was saying Shadow being the Assist Trophy was reason enough for Shadow to be the most likely should Sonic get a 2nd rep. I was saying Waluigi in regards to the fifth Mario spot in general. Rosalina just happened to be the character that filled that. If characters from already represented franchises (LIttle Mac is so far the only Assist Trophy to have been promoted to a Playable Character. And that was because he was a popular representative of his very own franchise that also had a revival on the Wii recently) being Assist Trophies meant that much, then Waluigi would of been our new Mario rep instead of someone else. Even removing Rosalina from the equation, does Waluigi being an assist trophy put him above Toad or Bowser Jr. when they've played roles in actual platformers as of recent while Waluigi from his very debut was relegated to Spin-Offs and not even put in any of the Wario games even?

I don't think it does. And the same goes for Tails Vs. Shadow in the hypothetical situation there's room for another Sonic rep.

I'd personally like Tails and Shadow to perhaps be both assist trophies in SSB4 however. Or one of the two at least, for different reasons at that.

 

[SmashShadow]

My point was not just about Rosalina though. Jaidyn was saying Shadow being the Assist Trophy was reason enough for Shadow to be the most likely should Sonic get a 2nd rep. I was saying Waluigi in regards to the fifth Mario spot in general. Rosalina just happened to be the character that filled that. If characters from already represented franchises (LIttle Mac is so far the only Assist Trophy to have been promoted to a Playable Character. And that was because he was a popular representative of his very own franchise that also had a revival on the Wii recently) being Assist Trophies meant that much, then Waluigi would of been our new Mario rep instead of someone else. Even removing Rosalina from the equation, does Waluigi being an assist trophy put him above Toad or Bowser Jr. when they've played roles in actual platformers as of recent while Waluigi from his very debut was relegated to Spin-Offs and not even put in any of the Wario games even?

I don't think it does. And the same goes for Tails Vs. Shadow in the hypothetical situation there's room for another Sonic rep.

I'd personally like Tails and Shadow to perhaps be both assist trophies in SSB4 however. Or one of the two at least, for different reasons at that.

Waluigi being an assist doesn't put him above the others but Toad was clearly never seen as important by Sakurai as shown by his 3 time role of of being butt fungus for Peach. And no, I'm not being biased here by saying that because I wanted Toad to be a playable character. There's also reason that Sakurai may not add Junior on the basis of being too similar to Bowser especially if uniqueness is what Sakurai is looking for.

Also, the Tails vs Shadow debate is a lot closer because they've both reprised several important roles and while Tails has more history, Shadow has more popularity.

 

[SonicMario]

Also, the Tails vs Shadow debate is a lot closer because they've both reprised several important roles and while Tails has more history, Shadow has more popularity.

But Tails has both in his favor. He may not be requested multiple times every single day on places like Miiverse on the same level Shadow is. But even if Tails is not as popular as Shadow. He's still pretty much #3 on most popular Sonic characters. I just can't see a 2nd Sonic rep if it were to happen, being anything other then one of the most iconic video game sidekicks in history.

 

[Altais]

Why do people hate Shadow so much? Sure, his solo game was not all that good, but he is not a bad character. Also, though Sonic the Hedgehog for the X-Box 360 was not exactly a blockbuster either, in that game I think Shadow developed quite nicely as a character; still cynical, but no longer a prisoner of his past. Despite his callous nature, he has plenty of redeeming qualities. Heck, if you want mine opinion, the Sonic character with the weakest personality is Silver--there is just no charm to that character's personality. At all. (Not saying that to troll; just constructive criticism.)

Anyhow, as interesting a character as Shadow is, I think it is realistic to say he will be lucky to maintain his status as Assist Trophy. If he has returned as an Assist Trophy, I hope Kirk Thornton voices him, and maybe Meta Knight, too.

 

[Deleted member]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again.

Despite being a Shadow fan, I feel that he shouldn't have been brought back into the story as it cheapened his "death" that followed his redemption. Or at the very least, how he was brought back shouldn't have been the route chosen.

The whole "Eggman saved him at the last minute with robots off-screen and now Shadow has amnesia" thing looking back at it, was poorly done. Made worse by Shadow being angsty and obsessed over his past.....but at least he got over it at the end of the game that established said trait.

 

[SmashShadow]

Confirmed assist trophy 4:36

 

[JaidynReiman]

Not at all surprising. I'm happy his AT is back. I didn't expect a second Sonic character at all anyway.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Confirmed assist trophy 4:36

This is not over yet. There's still the chance of Nintendo buying SEGA in between this smash and the next, (yes, that is possible, some people just choose to ignore the facts behind it)

 

[Substitution]

Maybe next Smash, but not Four.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, that's mildly disappointing.

 

[JaidynReiman]

This is not over yet. There's still the chance of Nintendo buying SEGA in between this smash and the next, (yes, that is possible, some people just choose to ignore the facts behind it)

Nintendo isn't going to buy Sega.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Nintendo isn't going to buy Sega.

Just saying that at random like that is far from true. You should probably take a look at these, neither of the, are biased in any way. So yes, it is possible!
http://mynintendonews.com/2014/01/3...ing-mergers-and-new-game-studio-acquisitions/

 

[Welshy91]

Maybe there is a god in heaven, watching over us, protecting us from angsty hedgehogs in our beloved Smash Bros.

 

[Master Of Blades]

Suks 2 b u

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

R.I.P. Shadow. i saw him in the stream as an Assist Trophy.

 

[nskid]

He is an assist trophy. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO (
Watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bocVx20fS_M starting at 4:28

 

[nskid]

At least Super Sonic is still as good as ever.

 

[Kind Dedede]

This is not over yet. There's still the chance of Nintendo buying SEGA in between this smash and the next, (yes, that is possible, some people just choose to ignore the facts behind it)

Yes they can buy Sega within that time. They could possibly turn them around and make a huge return with their IP's. Will they though, who knows. All we have seen is Camelot and Game Freak sitting as a second party companies with no intentions of acquiring them. Rare was bought out by Microsoft without even a glimmer of remorse from Nintendo, same with Hudson Soft going over to Konami.

 

[zapados3]

Shadow The Hedgehog is the only other sonic character that should be added and I will be telling you why in this reply:

Tails - So sure, you can build somethings, up special would be flying with the two tails, blah, blah, blah, but what else? What would his regular attacks be? Punching? Kicking? Tails doesn't do any of that stuff and even if he does, it's rare. They're not gonna make tails ride his machine for every fight either. If anything, he would get into his machine and fight with that as a final smash. Still, Tails isn't much of a fighter and in my opinion it makes no sense to add him.

Knuckles - Gliding, Punching, Digging, Uppercuts. Not much creativity there. Sure he's a fighter, but it just wouldn't be unique.

Eggman - Basically same problems as Tails.

Rouge The Bat - Same problems as Knuckles.

Chaos - Actually would be cool to add Chaos. He is very unique and his final smash could make him become Perfect Chaos, flood the entire stage, and damage everyone with watery arms.

Metal Sonic - Once again, very unique and would be a nice addition. Only problem is that since Metal Sonic is literally a better, metal version of Sonic, almost everything Metal Sonic did would be the exact same stuff sonic has. Metal Sonic's final smash could have him change into the Metal Overlord and unleash a ton of attacks.

Amy Rose - Swings hammer...that's it.

Silver The Hedgehog - Very unique and would be a nice addition. *Inserting pun* We already know Silver will be added because the creators can't deny it. No matter what they do, it's no use! But seriously, he would make an epic addition. However, since he would only attack with telekinetic powers, he wouldn't be much of a melee fighter, which is what pretty much all characters in smash bros fight like. It's not impossible, but it would be difficult to make him a fighter with no melee attacks.

Now, here's why Shadow the Hedgehog should be added instead of all of the characters above:

Shadow the Hedgehog is very popular. He has a sad back story, an epic plot twist in his first game, and he has tons of special powers. He would be far more unique than any other character because of his main focus on Chaos Emeralds and the many powers he gets from them.

He wouldn't be a clone of Sonic because as stated above, he has many different special moves. Here's what I think Shadow's move set should be:

B - Special = Same Homing Attack as Sonic
Up - B Special = Chaos Control Teleport like MewTwo in melee
Side - B Special = Chaos Arrows that can be charged up into Chaos Spears
Down - B Special = Same Spin Dash as Sonic

As for his regular attacks (A), they would either be the same as Sonic's or very similar with a slight change or some slight changes.

His Final Smash would be a Chaos Blast that would have the same size as Luigi's Negative Zone in Brawl. It would have a ton of power to inflict tons of damage and tons of knockback.

Up Taunt - Pulls out a Chaos Emerald and makes it glow then puts it away.
Side Taunt - He does a turn and a pose and says" I am the Ultimate Life Form."
Down Taunt - He does a pose and asks "Are you ready to admit your own foolishness?"

 

[Levelup3]

Okay,shadow would be great to add here is my moveset ideas:

Up B: Chaos control it would be like meta knight's down smash in brawl but much easier to control and has much longer range.

Down B: chaos boost from sonic 06, it would have a charge bar like little mac's ko uppercut bar it would go up the same way little Mac's did, then when fully charged it would enhance all of shadow's abilities for a short time, and if make the bar go up 3 times in a row then shadow will have chaos boost lvl3! Enhancing his powers 3x for a short time.

Or, chaos magic (from sonic battle): you can charge it up and make up to 4 appear in one straight line.

Side B: chaos spear it would be a projectile you could charge up and store for when you want to use it and it would do more damage than Samus's charge shot.

Taunts:

Up taunt: takes out a chaos emerald then flips it up in the air then catches it then puts it away.

Down taunt: shadow laughs and says: "hah! weakness disgusts me!"

Side taunt: crosses arms and says "hmph...not even a challenge.

Final smash:
Shadow will take off his inhibitor rings then become ultra powerful. Type: transformation.

Or, chaos rift (from sonic chronicles): shadow will trap you in rift of time and space close it then blow it up. Type: trapping and it's a one hit KO.

Or, hero and dark shadow form ( from shadow the hedgehog): shadow would get chaos blast and chaos control, he would run around using chaos blast and chaos control until the both bars run empty or when 14 secs are up, standard attack button for chaos control, special attack button for chaos blast. Type: Transformation

The rest should be from sonic battle and other sonic games.

I will make special move variations later.

Thanks for reading!

Oh! And chaos control will slow down time like in boss battles in shadow the hedgehog

 

[SonicMario]

@Zapados: Regarding Tails, Knuckles, Rouge and Amy. A certain Sonic game on the good ol' Game Boy Advance would like a word with you...

Besides, both you and Levelup are a bit too late. Shadow has already been confirmed to return as an assist trophy.

(At about 4:30 in the video)

 

[DustyPumpkin]

@Zapados: Regarding Tails, Knuckles, Rouge and Amy. A certain Sonic game on the good ol' Game Boy Advance would like a word with you...

Oh my god I loved that so much
Cream was amazing to play as~