Championship Details!!

[viperboy_74]

use the wildcard idea, but base it on points like kish2 said... it's much more fair, gets 8 more in, and makes everyone happy...

thanks for comprimising tim and jeff, if you use that idea anway...

 

[KishPrime]

Yes, points would then be the tiebreaker. It's the championship, so points have to mean something. I would still think that enough of the 2nd place people would drop rounds that it should be mostly irrelevant.

The best thing about the wildcard system is that no one SHOULD get eliminated from a three-way tiebreaker for first, which sucks anyway.

EDIT: By the way, tiebreaker rules should be clearly outlined prior to this event.

 

[KishSquared]

Hey, whatcha think about this - top 12 get pulled from Round 1. Then, the top seed from each pool moves on, and 4 wildcards as well.

Thoughts??

 

[KishPrime]

I don't get it.

 

[AOB]

I think he means that top 12 get a bye for the first round. Then the top 16 from pools advance, and 4 more wildcards... for 32 people in round 2.

And then round 2 is 4 pools of 8? Sounds all well and good to me--and I'm sure no one will be crying if crews is left out. It seems that, by doing crews first, we were trying to force interest in them anyway (in fact, that's exactly what we were doing)... but you know.

I have no problem with giving the top 12 players a bye--just don't make it 16. Then wiperboy would get one.

 

[KishSquared]

Haha, yeah, I didn't explain it well. Congrats to AOB for understanding me.

AOB, you're exactly 60 posts behind Tim. Do you stalk him and post every time he posts?

EDIT: Pulling top 12 out makes Round 2 look like this:

Pool 1
Tink
Bushman
Vidjo

Pool 2
Dope
Iggy
Eddie

Pool 3
Dark
Squared
Cunning

Pool 4
Drephen
Prime
Trail

That's only 3/8 of the pool, and only top 2 move on!! Crazy competition!!!

 

[Tink]

wow, next event, ima shoot for lower points, if 1st gets that pool <_<. having this wouldve made me vote for bracket =(.

 

[viperboy_74]

whichever method is fine with me, for the record... i like jeff's idea though.



lol andy, i know, i stated 16 shouldn't advance . wish i woulda made FRI

and, tink has a point... you should probably re-seed those sumwhat...

 

[AOB]

AOB, you're exactly 60 posts behind Tim. Do you stalk him and post every time he posts?

I remember I was ahead of him for a while.

And... you're not allowed to call me that anymore. See the username?

 

[Black Hayate]

i think i should try to attent this

 

[AOB]

Why did we stop discussing this? Is the most recent proposal good, or what?

 

[KishPrime]

Shrug. I don't see a reason to pull out 12, as I'd rather just see 8 wild-cards. The more people we leave in RR the more matches people get, and it reward people for coming to tournaments and getting their points. Alas, that's just me, and I'm not a council member.

 

[kamikaze falco]

can't wait. & Did you quit smash?
Also I have never got any points <_< because this will be my first circuit tourney

 

[Faellie]

As someone who isn't particularly interested in the myriad ways of running the top brackets, (I'll never see them..), what will the lower parts of SMYM7 be like? What will entry fees be, etc.? Same as previous SMYM?

Also, I don't think people are realizing that this topic IS for SMYM7 because it doesn't have it in the topic title. Maybe a change of the title or a new topic, specifically for the masses to discuss SMYM7 on, might help and encourage attendance. It's getting to the point where it'll be hard to get off work for some if they don't hear about the tournament soon...

 

[KishPrime]

It'll be the same as normal SMYM, pools elimination. Same entry fees, you'll get 4-5 matches in your pool, winner plus wild-cards move on.

And yes, AOB, can you post this up in the main room?

 

[Cherokee Warrior]

this sounds like fun, even though i wont play many matches. oh well, im to blame for that.

hey, so me and drew discussed it, and we came up with a better system for honor society, i think you will like the changes. if you like them enough, maybe youd consider posting the button on the op for smym?

 

[AOB]

Well, there's your topic.

I agree with Tim. Top 8 get byes and then 8 wildcards--any objections?

 

[kamikaze falco]

I'm just getting this straight. If there is 100 Entrants top 16 people (most points) get to go to round 2? Leaving 84 people out of the running?

 

[kamikaze falco]

As someone who isn't particularly interested in the myriad ways of running the top brackets, (I'll never see them..), what will the lower parts of SMYM7 be like? What will entry fees be, etc.? Same as previous SMYM?

Also, I don't think people are realizing that this topic IS for SMYM7 because it doesn't have it in the topic title. Maybe a change of the title or a new topic, specifically for the masses to discuss SMYM7 on, might help and encourage attendance. It's getting to the point where it'll be hard to get off work for some if they don't hear about the tournament soon...

Don't wear anything skimpy because I don't want to get distracted lol.

 

[Overswarm]

I would suggest keeping two things in mind:

1. Crews are awesome, crews are great, but they are also the least popular as far as attendance.

2. People want to play more. Making extra people move on (like saying top 2 move on from pools, period) and ending up with 40 people in the 2nd round isn't such a bad idea. It is worth staggering your rewards for a little extra bit of time.

1rst round all are out except for 32 (top 2 from each pool) and the top 8 that didn't play in the RR (40 left)

2nd round is 40, 5 pools of 8, top 2 move on (10 left)

Round Robin between the 10 players.

It isn't that many matches, it solves the problem of disheartening the players that are right on the brink. I've played my best and have made top 32 at every tournament I've gone to, save for FC6, including MLGs, and the only reason this is true is because it is top 2 advance. If it is top 1 advance, you've already (in the other players eyes, at least) determined who moves on. There are a LOT of players that have the potential to be that #2 moving on, but very few that are the #1 moving on.

If you are worried about time, then just take one extra TV away from Round Robin, or remove crews (as much as I like them, they are really more of a money pit at this point).



Also, if I may make another suggestion....

The big issue in most players' eyes is paying too much money for too little gain. I suggest maybe organizing a low-tier side tournament, or maybe an iron-man tournament (a one man crew battle, 3 characters per person), etc., etc., and just limit those tournaments to one or two TVs.

This way, the people that get knocked out early can go off with other people that have been knocked off early, pay $1-$5 to enter a double-elimination bracket limited to the top 32 entering, and can enjoy themselves. Having one or two of these little side tournaments would ultimately fix the problem of free play, as there would be two groups of 32 players (that is 64!) preoccupied with another tournament limited to two TVs each.

Having a TV left completely for money matches might be an interesting thing too. No one likes watching two guys play friendlies, but people crowd around money matches. Give people entertainment, and they won't be bored.

So...

Let's say we have a total of 18 TVs. Not a huge number, not a small number, and with 100+ people going, not an unthinkable number.

All TVs are designated for the initial round robins. No freeplay is allowed. (18 used)

Assuming you do the top 40, then top 10, as I said above, let's say you have
14 for Round 2, and 5 for Round 3 (final 10 man round robin, instead of 8).

so during round 2, if you are using 14 TVs as best as possible for the large RR, you have 4 TVs leftover. This is where two lower tournaments could start. A low-tier, an iron-man, another singles, whatever you decided, with 32 people in each. If people agreed to it, that would be 64 people playing in the side tournamnets, and 40 people playing in the round 2 RR, which mean 104 people are taken care of.

Any other TVs you may have would be open for free play, money matches, etc.

When Round 3 hits, you've got a large number of TVs open for freeplay, and non-stop exciting matches for people to watch.


Just my 2 cents. I think the solution is to give people either something to watch, or something to do, and if that means taking away crews and extending singles for an hour, why not?

 

[Hank McCoy]

no......SUPER SMASH BROS 64 TOURNAMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 I WILL BE ACCEPTING MM'S!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[viperboy_74]

It'll be the same as normal SMYM, pools elimination. Same entry fees, you'll get 4-5 matches in your pool, winner plus wild-cards move on.

And yes, AOB, can you post this up in the main room?

that works too, but will slow things down about 30 minutes to an hour, putting more people back in pools...

also, if done that way, will wild cards be by records i assume and not points? thats why i thought u were advancing 12 with by's, to reward those who received more points...

 

[KishPrime]

that works too, but will slow things down about 30 minutes to an hour, putting more people back in pools...

also, if done that way, will wild cards be by records i assume and not points? thats why i thought u were advancing 12 with by's, to reward those who received more points...

No, adding 4 people back into pools will have a negligible time effect. Possibly 5 minutes.

The point to wild cards is that you still have to perform. The wild cards will be given to the next-best records in pools. Ties will be broken by tiebreaker rules, but since people are in different pools there will be a lot of exact ties. Exact ties are broken by points. Thus, it rewards points and performance in combination, which is what is required of everyone to make finals, even the people advanced into round two. Even though I'm fifth in points, with the pool I have I have little chance of advancing to finals.

And no offense to anyone, but my goodness has the community been spoiled, much due to the way we ourselves pushed RRs for the very reasons many of you are citing. Two years ago almost half the tournaments didn't even do RR, and two rounds were all that was guaranteed. The Ship pushed these harder than anyway. Let's just remember that playing deep into tournaments is a privilege, not a right. I've gone out early in tournaments too, and I didn't quit. I really am not trying to be an elitist jerk, but we've come a long way as far as trying to give people more matches, especially when you look at the way I structured FC. I personally have always tried to balance competitive fairness with fun for everyone, as much as is possible in an elimination setting.

If there's time, I could see us inserting an extra round into singles, but if we have 100 people, there will not be time. I'll guarantee it. This isn't an elitist policy, it is a time problem.

 

[kamikaze falco]

I can't complain to be honest i'm not running it lol. I am a little confused but I will find out when I get there lol. There might not be friendlies during the tourney for those who got knocked out early but good luck with everything. No matter what happens it will still be worth it. Good luck council and whoever is also helping running it. Looking forward to seeing everybody there!

 

[Sliq]

I am completely at a loss for what is going on, but I do know one thing:

Viperboy vs. Sliq -- $5 Moneymatch

The rumble in the jungle. The thrlla' in Manilla. Some sort of clash between two participants in a competition involving money and birds and lasers and ****.

BE THERE, SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY!

That was sort of obnoxious, huh?

 

[KishPrime]

There will still be friendlies! As long as people bring TVs...

 

[Tink]

maybe we could make the championship a 2 day event next season? that would allow time, low tier could be done, more frinedlies, teams teams maybe....but thats just an idea.

 

[KishSquared]

This format allows for LOTS more friendlies, Tink. Hopefully you'll be pleasantly surprised.

I see no reason to make it 2-day. We'll see if I change my mind after SMYM7.

 

[AOB]

Well I am not hosting a two-day event. If you want to do that somewhere else, that's fine and dandy.

 

[viperboy_74]

i can look into it... the 45 minutes can't be too bad for anyone, 'im sure...

if it's necessary anyway...

 

[KishPrime]

By the way, I will go on record to say that teams teams is a much better idea in theory than it ever will be in practice. People have a hard enough time getting a singles crew together. Whoever wants the credit for that idea can take it.

 

[AOB]

Wrong topic?

--oh, nevermind.

 

[KishPrime]

Seriously, are you shadowing me?

<_<

 

[Mars-]

I'm going to try to make this so I can have a ditto with Watty.

Yes that is the only reason why I want to make this. J/k lolerskates

 

[kamikaze falco]

Well I am not hosting a two-day event. If you want to do that somewhere else, that's fine and dandy.

You know you want to.

 

[nikePK]

Seriously, guys, the Round Robin idea for the whole tourney is really great. I like it a lot. Also, I'm glad you guys went to lengths to get that 8-man wild card thing going. It really is a very good idea and it will definitely keep people playing hard. I think that with that in place, it's almost like an extra guy is getting in from each pool.

One other thing that I believe Prime mentioned is taking 12 people in for byes. I think your top 8 is a better idea because some of us look forward to playing people like Jiano & Viperboy who aren't in the t8, and now we'll get the chance to BUT we'll still have that chance to move on w/ the Wild Card if we can't beat them in our pool. I think its the best of both worlds the way you have it set up with the t8 byes and t16/8WC format.

My only question is about Wild Card ties. Will those people play off for it in a best of 3? I know that's another almost 20 minutes or so to play a round, so I wasn't sure how you guys were going to do that.

And for the record, I had a lot of fun at SMYM6 hanging out with everyone I rarely get to see and playing some really intense games. That said, I think that this year's is going to be even better ^_^


OH! One other thing. EVERYONE BRING A TV AND A CUBE/WII!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Last year I saw all the TVs that were there and was like "oh i don't need to bring mine in." I guess I was mistaken lol. Bring it no matter what... there can't be enough setups!

 

[KishPrime]

I actually supported Top 8 only.

Besides that, wild card ties will be broken by Circuit points. It'll have to be an exact tie, matches and rounds both.

 

[Kel]

I think that the wild card system is a great way to get people in pools that are already "determined" to continue fighting.

I don't know how well this would work but I had this crazy idea in my head for round robing 1 that each round robin placement could sort of be worth points, to be added to your circuit points, and then overall best points wins. For example, first place in the pool would be worth 5 points and second would be worth 3 and 3rd could be worth 1. Say player 1 has no circuit points and wins his/her pool so this person's accumulative points would be 5. Second place already had 3 points in the circuit but adds 3 extra due to his/her round robin placement, thus putting them in first seed to move on.
I know this is kind of complicated and wouldn't likely work or anything, I was just thinking of a way to reward players (even the "lesser" players) that maker more events and earned points and fealt I could add to the brainstorm.

Another brainstorm idea is that for next season, divide the MW into 2 or 4 areas. The Midwest is HUGE and this has been an addressed issue, however if we divided it into East and West areas with the championships being the big tourney that everyone attends it could work in more people's favor. I'm just thinking in the way that the NFL does things. two divisions with individual tournaments and then the championship to decide the big winners. This way everyone would be able to accumulate points. This also may be entirely too complicated and would take a lot of troubleshooting and trial and error. I'm just throwing ideas out.

Regardless I have thoroughly enjoyed the Midwest circuit and I appreciate the organizers and the runners of the tournaments a great deal. The goal was to bring the Midwest together and make people better. I think that for being individually run tournaments that the circuit has been a huge success and I'm sad that there isn't a tournament to look forward to at the beginning of each month right now. I'll surely attend almost (if not) all of next season's circuit stops despite being a "lesser" player because I enjoy smash. So thanks to the organizers and runners, you guys did a great job for the community.

haha things might be looking sloppy for the MidWest with the EC players coming. We've gotta step it up!

 

[KishPrime]

Kel, that's kind of worked into the system because points are a tiebreaker for wild-card ties.

It's nice to see people enjoying the circuit. I am not opposed to the two division format. I think that changes will be limited in this season because we're running out of time before FC.

I'm also not on the panel. ^^

 

[kamikaze falco]

Wow.......I finally finished reading every single post Painfull. A few things I would like to say is that I liked kels Idea of splitting the midwest up. Because I can't go to very many circuit tourny's at all due to location. Thus me not having any points <_<. I understand that trying to merge the circuit championship with the tourny is hard. Especially trying to give the "lesser" players the most for their money as well as trying to reward top placers and as well as top point holders. Thank you for helping out with everything kishes, &, every one who as had an opinion or two. But I like wild card. And I believe the oh snaps darkrain is in my pool i'm not even trying thing has been resolved due to seeding.

But how is seeding the pools going to work? By how many points people have in the midwest circuit? Someone plz answer.