1) You don't understand Links problem. I assure you, the community of Link mains understand him better than you. Link didn't kill fast enough for his poor physics and even more importantly, highly punishable moveset. Ask any Link main and they will tell you the same. I won't respond to this point again because no matter how many times we Link mains such Matt4300 and myself say "Link mains know Link better than you," People who have dedicated a few hours of day training with him to fight the likes of Marth MK and Snake you seem to shrug it off so I will ignore future responses to this.
2) I don't expect tiers to be gone, I expect them to be less than they are and for continuous improvement as we move towards gold.
3) No game has ever been hacked to the extent B+ has. The possibilities are endless and so is the potential. Name me one fighter that has been hacked to the extent B+ has.
4) From what I have heard there have been games that came close-----VF 4 fans tell you tiers don't mean ****, We are hacking the game, we can get closer than predecessor.
there is no need to use the "lol Sworplay expects a game without tiers" card. I'm not that stupid though apparently you think I am.
Furthermore: you continue to treat me as if I am new to the scene and don't know anything about "physics" or "momentum" when infact I have been around the scene for a very long time and know just as much as you do.
Im not saying i know more about link that u or shadic. Im saying the way you worded your posts seems like your putting movesets and physics as being the same thing. Im not treating you like anything. Im simply stating my opinions. Maybe im not doing it in the kindest way but thats just how i am. Nothing personal. It's not like im bashing you personally.
Tiers are already less then they are. I dont think there is a single matchup in this game right now that is 70-30 imo(of course nothing can be said as fact until we get a gold set)
Yes u right no game has been hacked to the extent of brawl. But this also falls into another argument i had in another topic. Sometimes it seems like the coders buff chars just because they have the power to do so. Not because they need it. Chars don't need to be buffed simply because they have problems against certain chars. This is where matchups comes into play.
Since mk is a sticky subject here let me talk about him. Snake is the most even matchup against mk in brawl. I truly believe snake ***** mk in brawl+. Snake has the best defensive game out the whole cast. And while he did receive a few nerfs i think the engine compliments snake very well. Snake already had minimal hitstun in vbrawl. In brawl+ snake truly has some devastating combo's. Also like i said before mk's weight is now a legit flaw thanks to histun. You can kill mk reliably around 95-110% from the center of the stage. Get a smash attack in while he's near the ledge and you can kill him even earlier.
Lets go to diddy. He's also a char that could hold his own against mk in vbrawl. In brawl+ i think he is a true counter to mk. Diddy's on stage game is completely ridiculous. Even without his nannerz he would be high tier. With them and diddy is a monster. Only thing keeping diddy balanced is his horrible recovery(which mk can have a field day with) If diddy stays on stage and racks up the damage with the nannerz i dont see how diddy can lose to mk. Also not to mention uthrow to dair with diddy is legit.
I also think zss beats mk. The addition of hitstun helped out her offensive game TONS. And she is still one of the best spacers in the game. Side b will give mk plenty of problems and i have landed 5-7 hit combos on mk with her. She can actually combo into fair and with her buffed fsmash a simple dsmash to fsmash will kill mk around 100%.
Like i said i dont think mk is broken at all. He is just a noob char who can be picked up easily. That doesn't mean he needs to be nerfed more then he already is. It simply means the opponent needs to learn how to fight him.
And yes games have been close to not needing a tier list. But the fact that it didn't reach that point says something. I think guilty gear is the only fighter where every single char has won a tournament at least once. That don't mean their isn't a tier list. It simply means every char has the tools to win in the right player hands. And this is what b+ needs to be aiming for.
Well, playing MK because he is awesome? Let me tell you my story:
I was, without looking at the tier list, trying to find my main in vBrawl. I looked for a while, and then I thought that MK was pretty cool and wanted to play him. When I saw his position in the tier list, I dropped him.
Now that he is actually not God tier, I'm thinking of playing him again, because now it is a challange instead of just a walk in the park. I am pretty sure I'm not the only one thinking like this.
Im sure there are other people that thinks like this. I simply stated the vbrawl mains that have been playing their char for over a year have no incentive to play mk in brawl+ as mk offers nothing new unlike every single other char in the game who have at least received one buff. And yall talking about nerfing mk even more?
but if MK is still top tier, it should continue.
No it shouldn't top tier and broken are 2 different things and this is what i think yall are getting confused.
I would rather play the game that is fun not the one were my char is the best... and I am a tourney player melee and brawl. Its not fun playing link in melee and loseing my first match to a marth and haveing to go play freindlys in a corner... you could tell me " should have played marth" well then why am i there? im no longer haveing fun... We have the power to change this game and balance the **** out of it... but if moneys on the line poeple will say anything to keep there chars the best (marth fox?) This needs to be stoped in order to have a well balanced game. If you want the money you should have to work for it and not pick the best char.... all that gets us is metabrawl...
wrong. WRONG!
While balance is a very important aspect in the overall brawl+ process tournament play is just as important. The wbr should not nerf chars simply because link(just using him as a example) isn't the best.
I hate when people act like mk is the only char of winning tournaments in vbrawl
snake
mk
wario
falco
diddy
marth
ddd
ic's
All those chars are viable and very capable of winning a big tournament. Yes mk over dominates mid-level play but this is where the balance part comes in.
There is a fine line between casual and competitive play and i don't want to see brawl+ sacrifice competitive play because of the casuals.