Best counterpick stage for Zelda?

[SilverPaladin]

Tourneywise, what do you think are the best stages for Zelda?

I definitely like FinalD a lot as a starter stage. I dislike Smashville, because the moving platform sometimes neutralizes the effectiveness of Din's Fire as a gimping tool. I'm neutral on Battlefield; really depends on the opponent. Marth can tear Zelda up on it with his FSmash and UTilt, but it really hurts spammers like Pit.

As far as counterpicks go, I like Corneria a lot. The fin allows you to use Uair effectively and the back part of the ship combined with the short porch behind makes her FSmash exceptionally powerful. It gives her DSmash a nice careen also. Also the fin combined with Farore's Wind makes Zelda's Keep away game much better.

 

[Tsuteto]

I don't like FD that much. Has potential to screw you over. But yeah, good stages IMO are Smashville because of the moving platform. You can stand on the platform and spam Din's Fire like no other due to it's controllability. Also Battlefield is good because the platforms are just low enough to strike with just about any up controlled attack (tilt, air, and smash). Corneria if you can spam your d-tilt like mad on a heavy type character when you catch them at the fin. Shadow Moses is just good overall. And I personally just like Lylat Cruise, even though it's probably a bad choice for her.

 

[S2]

Its iffy to say which stages are best for Zelda. Obviously certain stages give her advantages, but sometimes these stages are actually worse for her because it gives your opponent a greater one.

For instance, Zelda does well on Battlefield because she can up-smash through the platforms. But this can be problematic against a character, like Olimar, who can also up-smash for kills through the platforms with little lag and complete immunity (since its his pikmin and not him - you really can't punish this if your above him and he's under the platform). So your advantage is his advantage. In that matchup, you might be better set picking FD, since that stage has probably the biggest Din spamming potential.

Likewise, Smashville, which is usually a good Zelda pick can be bad against a character like Ike. Since the stage is small (making it harder to Din spam him) and you don't want to accidently get hit if he jumps up on the platform after you. Since that matchup is very much about you spamming him and forcing him to come to you, Smashville will hurt you since you won't have FD's length to Din's spam nor Battlefield's platforms to abuse.

So yeah, it depends on the matchup.

 

[Kayzee]

Smashville in my opinion. The moving platform can work against you just as much as it can work in your favor.

 

[Tsuteto]

I have no idea what you're doing then S2. For me it's easy to get around Ike on Smashville. Typically as the platform heads back you can jump high enough and get on the platform, avoiding all of Ike's attacks (even Aether). You can then Din's Fire spam all you want XD If you need to get down, rolling, side dodging, and knocking away works well. Air dodging too.

Just have to set yourself right ^^

 

[Luthien]

I have no idea what you're doing then S2. For me it's easy to get around Ike on Smashville. Typically as the platform heads back you can jump high enough and get on the platform, avoiding all of Ike's attacks (even Aether). You can then Din's Fire spam all you want XD If you need to get down, rolling, side dodging, and knocking away works well. Air dodging too.

Just have to set yourself right ^^

I don't know why, but I have a lot of problems with Smashville, especially against Ike. I'm not sure why, but the stage seems to help Ike a lot more than it helps Zelda. Seriously, an Ike main should post the reasons why, because I am unsure. I do know that it is a bad stage for an Ike matchup, however.

 

[RedMage8BT]

I like Port Town and Spear Pillar, but I'm not sure if those are counterpickable.

 

[S2]

Tsuteto,

I can see where you're coming from. You seem to have some good strats with the platform, that perhaps some players (like myself) don't use. But in general I find that against Ike you want to pick big stages or Battlefield (only because of platform abuse, since its smaller than I would like against Ike).

So I'm going to agree to disagree with you on this one. I still think that the stage size combined with certain places on the platforms trajectory make you have to face Ike up close too much. You probably have strats that work well on Smashville (I gotta practice that stage more, I know), but I still feel its safer to take him to say Final D if your choosing a counterpick. Since you can run very far away and he's got few approaches on that flat ground.

I've seen multiple players having trouble against Ike on that stage, so if your pwning on it... well than that rocks. Turn a weakness into a strength.

 

[Tsuteto]

Maybe it's just the Ike's I face, but I do have a video of me fighting one that I'll try to upload when I get the chance. I just have to first convert the video from it's DVD format, cut it up to that match, and then transfer it onto youtube XD

I think I'd have more of a problem with Marth than Ike on that map due to Marth's speed. And Metaknight, but Meta would be about just the same as Marth, only more compact... blargh.

Oh, and I'm starting to like Summit. Shame it's going to be banned.

 

[S2]

Yeah, I'd love to see what your strats are for Smashville so that I can incorporate some new stuff into my game. I actually don't have as much stage specific strats for it as I'd like.

It's too bad that you like Summit though, because I agree that it'll probably get banned.

This is less Zelda specific, but I suggest that every player (regardless of character) find a counter-pick stage that they hate and then practice the heck out of it.

I did that with Jungle Japes in Melee and it payed of big (especially because it screwed Foxes and Falcos in that game). In tournaments I could use my counterpick against equally skilled or better players in order to gimp their ability to play, since they were more prone to SDing and didn't have a lot of experience on that level.

I say pick a stage you don't like to get good on, because chances are that other people dislike it too and avoid playing on it as much as possible.

Way too many people counter-pick FD and Battlefield for no good reason. Unless your character gains an advantage, its a bad counterpick. Plus, your opponent is guranteed to know how to play on those stages.

 

[GuiltyPleasure]

I would say Battlefield even though it helps others, I get so many people so often with Usmash through the platform throughout a match

 

[Tsuteto]

Yeah, I always hated summit, and this one guy who plays Metaknight loves it because he could practically control that fish, I swear. But then I started figuring it out. One time when he was in the water, I jumped over, sourspotted a d-air, and the fish came up and ate him. It was hilarious XD

 

[S2]

lol, I wish I could have seen the look on his face.

Guess we now know where the Balloon Fight fish's loyalties lie, Balloon Fish fights for Team Zelda.

 

[goodkid]

I love Mario Circuit, but it really depends on personal preference. Half the tourneys ban it, but if you like a certain stage and can make up for weaknesses with Zelda or any char., then go for it.

 

[KOdEx]

bridge of eldin? when that bridge goes out if you're not facing a pit or another zelda it's like free din spam.

 

[Tsuteto]

There are several stages that I can understand to be banned, but don't think they should, those being Port Town Aero Dive, Shadow Moses Island, Frigate Orpheon, and Mario Circuit. There might be another or two in there, but eh.

Oh, and Pictochat isn't as bad as everyone makes it out to be. Same with Hanenbow.

Yay for random thoughts at the end.

Still though, best counterpick for me would be Smashville.

 

[Eten]

A solid Zelda counterpick stage is distant planet. Using a simple "Din's fire make em' approach" style becomes extraordinarily effective on the layout of that stage. Specially, the close three leaf platforms which sink when stood on above one slightly variating height longer but small central platform greatly reduce effective approach options, and leave many players being caught by upsmashes and uptilts over and over again, while Din's Fire travels about the stage completely unimpeded. In addition, there are two ledges, but both are facing the same direction. It completely eliminates any accidental "under the stage" suicides with Zelda's Farore's Wind recovery, as both the central platform can be passed through from underneath, and the second ledge on the right is completely vertical and is easy to go for if someone attempts to edge-guard you on the right. In addition, the left walk-off and blastline is hard to camp vs. Din's Fire, the occasional water runoff, and Zelda is too light to be chaingrabbed by Dedede and the like off of walk-offs to begin with. Instead, fighting on the left can either mean an easy slope and a raised opponent for sweetspotting fairs/bairs, or a simple Farore's wind escape back on to main platform. The stage simply plays brutally well for Zelda's area of attacks.

Against almost any other character can go from a nearly even match to a 3 stocking by counterpicking Distant Planet and playing Zelda.