Best Buy Demo Discussion - What do you think of Little Mac in Smash 4?

[Krynxe]

This thread is to discuss your thoughts on Little Mac from the playable demo at Best Buy. Please visit the other characters boards to discuss different characters.

---

With the playable demos on Wednesday, June 11 and Saturday, June 14, smashers who couldn't attend e3 will have the chance to experience Super Smash Brothers for the Wii U hands on for the first time.


- For information, Click here.
- To find a location near you, Click here.

 

[Primid]

I guess I will start off the discussion because got the chance to play as Little Mac today at Best Buy! It was only a 2 minute battle, so it wasn't a whole lot of time to actually get to know the moves or really analyze him as a character. But here are some things I noticed.

1.) Easy to use.
I initially picked him because I thought he would be pretty easy to use for the first time since he just punches stuff and for the most part, I was right. He'd be a good starter choice since if you're new to the game, you can still "button mash" and do some damage. Kinda reminds me of Mario in a sense because he's average and well rounded, and fairly simple to get the hang of.

2.) His recovery isn't the best.
They weren't joking when they said that he isn't as powerful when he's in the air. I was knocked off the stage twice and couldn't return to the stage because his recovery move is so bad. However, it does work fairly nicely as an offensive attack.

3.) Very fun and very satisfying.
Punch, punch! Jab, jab! It's is very satisfying to do all these cool punching combos on your foes. His A combos are very nice and I used his side-B (his long distance jump punch), his up-B (Mac's spinning uppercut), and his neutral-B (a punch that you can charge similar to Falcon Punch). All of these moves seem very useful in battle. I didn't get to try out his KO move or his final smash though...

Overall, I can't wait to try Little Mac out again. Like I said, I didn't really have much time to experience the game and I even ended losing the battle I was fighting in. But I still had a blast playing as him. He's a very strong and fast character and everyone should give him a try!

 

[Raziek]

@Croi 's impressions:

Little Mac:
Not a good choice of character for a Wario main.
*Very* strong ground game. Jabs, tilts, smashes, grab game, everything on the ground is very rigid and powerful.
Recovery is literally the worst I've ever seen. Side+b and up+b are useless in the air (both are very strong on the ground).
Uncharged fsmash does 20%.
Uncharged usmash killed Rosalina on Battlefield at ~80%.
OHKO (which isn't, by the way) has very good frame data: just a little slower than his jab and has super armour, possibly invincibility, until end.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Mac is a character of extremes--Very weak aerial mobility but incredible ground speed and positioning. Three of his aerials seem borderline useless in the neutral position, but maybe the angles they send at could be of note in specific positions. N-Air and D-Air definitely seem like they have potential.

N-Air is a very quick jab at a 45-degree angle forward and down with something like 15 frames of animation altogether. Doesn't seem to have much knockback, but I could see it setting up for other moves, like a stronger aerial or a grab. N-Air -> footstool will probably be a reliable thing!

D-Air hits straight down and doing it immediately out of a shorthop makes it finish before landing. With his good runjump speed, I could see it being useful as a safe poke that could be set up on. Going into neutral before landing in that probably means that run-jump D-Air -> B-Reversed specials (B-Reversing is confirmed, as an aside) would be a solid hit-confirm, which should combo into his KO Punch.

Ground speed is great and dash/run is very low to the ground (think a faster Sheik). He has a walljump, too, which is neat and could be important for recovery purposes.

I didn't get well-acquainted enough with the Pro Controller to try Jab -> Grab stuff. Rapid Jab seems good in 1v1 but takes a while otherwise. F-Tilt is a quick, safe one-two that should be solid for spacing. U-Tilt seems like a good combo option, kind of Fox-ish. D-Tilt is slow but has good range and might pop up well for follow-ups.

U-Smash has GREAT speed with reasonable KO potential. With super armor on top of all that, this will probably be his go-to option for all sorts of stuff. F-Smash has solid range and is more powerful; could be a good counter-poke with the armor. D-Smash swings around quickly and has solid range, too.

B-Throw has solid power; should set up for potential edgeguarding well. One of his throws (U-Throw, I think?) has low knockback and pops them up in front of you. I expect it to trap people really well with a potential super-armor attack like running U-Smash.

Forward-B appears to have a Smash and Tilt version of it, which is better for recovery than one might initially suggest. Up-B is garbage for recovery. I couldn't tell how powerful Down-B (CROSS COUNTER) was.

 

[Blackrider213]

Any idea what are the differences between the Smashed and tilt versions of his side-B is?

Also, can anyone test stuff out regarding the differences on his angled forward smashes?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Any idea what are the differences between the Smashed and tilt versions of his side-B is?

Also, can anyone test stuff out regarding the differences on his angled forward smashes?

The Smash version goes further and probably does more damage. I'm thinking similar stuff to Diddy's Forward-B.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Thanks for all that! I'm assuming his air speed is slow?

In general though how are his aerial stats? Air speed, fall speed, all that. Even weight.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

His horizontal aerial mobility/speed is pretty garbage. Carries runjump momentum well, though. Fall speed seems somewhat high (relative to the cast, anyway). Shorthop is somewhat short. Hard to tell weight since knockback feels all over the place for moves since we don't know what each thing has power for and stale moves makes it hard to test in an FFA environment.

For anyone planning on playing on Saturday, get your hands on the 3DS version with a friend. You have a Waiting Room where you have to press a certain input to start the match with someone else. If you don't do the L+R+Start (or whatever it is), you can practice and mess around as much as you'd like on the Sandbag.

3DS connection play was super-laggy the whole time I was playing, so if you want to have any enjoyment/learn anything from it, just mess with the Sandbag for a couple of minutes and play with a friend who also wants to learn about the characters.

 

[Astronut]

I thought he was a very fun character to use. U-smash is a very reliable kill move, with decent range (seems to be around on par with Fox).

Dash-attack is amazing, fast and seems to be disjointed, as well as a lot of knockback.

He's definitely more of a grounded fighter than an aerial fighter. You definitely want to focus on staying on the ground and utilizing his super fast grounded movement.

Also I found that rapid jabs are more rewarding in Smash 4. This is due to the fact that Mac (and others), can finish his rapid jab with a finishing move that deals more knockback, which puts your opponent far enough away so that they can't punish you.

Up-b may not be a great recovery move, but can be used as an offensive move on stage. It may be a great option oos, if you're getting pressured.

Like Raziek said, the OHKO is decently fast and is absolutely amazing. His KO meter fills up pretty quickly; I found that once you reach around 80% on a stock you should have around a full meter. Assuming you can take the stock from them without the punch (which Mac can do fairly reliably), now you've got a KO punch to take their 2nd stock in the blink of an eye.

The 1v1 potential of this character is going to be be great imo.

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

Could someone tell me if Rapid Jab > KO Punch finisher is a thing? I doubt it is but someone in our group mentioned it.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Pretty sure Rapid Jab ends with the normal combo ender all the time. I wouldn't be surprised if Jab1 were a reliable hit-confirm into it, though.

 

[B!ggad]

His horizontal aerial mobility/speed is pretty garbage. Carries runjump momentum well, though.

Wait so that exists?

 

[papagenos]

I played Mac every match I had, terrible in the air great on the ground exactly what we were told haha

I won my very first match as him and after waiting 15 years to play as this guy I was very happy to get that win!

I forgot to test out his taunts and havent found anyone online who checked them, anybody see what they were?

 

[Anthinus]

Little Mac got an excellent Dash Dance and Fox-Trotting.
Watch this video from 3:45 and on:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faBCVxldMFA

 

[antiglare]

Are his aerials really that useless? I mean iseless like which other character in the series?

That jab > ko punch would be sweet btw

Mac is a character of extremes--Very weak aerial mobility but incredible ground speed and positioning. Three of his aerials seem borderline useless in the neutral position, but maybe the angles they send at could be of note in specific positions. N-Air and D-Air definitely seem like they have potential.

N-Air is a very quick jab at a 45-degree angle forward and down with something like 15 frames of animation altogether. Doesn't seem to have much knockback, but I could see it setting up for other moves, like a stronger aerial or a grab. N-Air -> footstool will probably be a reliable thing!

D-Air hits straight down and doing it immediately out of a shorthop makes it finish before landing. With his good runjump speed, I could see it being useful as a safe poke that could be set up on. Going into neutral before landing in that probably means that run-jump D-Air -> B-Reversed specials (B-Reversing is confirmed, as an aside) would be a solid hit-confirm, which should combo into his KO Punch.

Ground speed is great and dash/run is very low to the ground (think a faster Sheik). He has a walljump, too, which is neat and could be important for recovery purposes.

I didn't get well-acquainted enough with the Pro Controller to try Jab -> Grab stuff. Rapid Jab seems good in 1v1 but takes a while otherwise. F-Tilt is a quick, safe one-two that should be solid for spacing. U-Tilt seems like a good combo option, kind of Fox-ish. D-Tilt is slow but has good range and might pop up well for follow-ups.

U-Smash has GREAT speed with reasonable KO potential. With super armor on top of all that, this will probably be his go-to option for all sorts of stuff. F-Smash has solid range and is more powerful; could be a good counter-poke with the armor. D-Smash swings around quickly and has solid range, too.

B-Throw has solid power; should set up for potential edgeguarding well. One of his throws (U-Throw, I think?) has low knockback and pops them up in front of you. I expect it to trap people really well with a potential super-armor attack like running U-Smash.

Forward-B appears to have a Smash and Tilt version of it, which is better for recovery than one might initially suggest. Up-B is garbage for recovery. I couldn't tell how powerful Down-B (CROSS COUNTER) was.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I'll try to see if there are any sweetspots I'm missing on Saturday, but the coverage and power are pitiful on U-Air and B-Air. I'm talking "sourspot Zelda F-Air/B-Air" power. Not very fast on startup or endlag, either; they didn't end before landing when used immediately out of a shorthop.

F-Air has a good arc (think Ganondorf with less range) and some modicum of power; at high percents you can reasonably knock someone offstage, at least.

 

[Anthinus]

There could be an option in the air that gives him a decent way to approach enemies on platforms. Then strike with grounded attacks.
Something like an auto-cancel aerial or an aerial with enough hitstun to follow up the moment you touch the platform.
Or maybe his neutral B or Counter?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

That's very likely going to be N-Air and D-Air. N-Air has weak range but incredible speed/very low endlag, and D-Air sends them downward (and therefore upward when the opponent is on a form of ground). They're also both much faster overall than the other three aerials.

 

[Anthinus]

Sounds good. Something to practice a lot to learn the timings.

 

[antiglare]

Damn, that's weak

I'll try to see if there are any sweetspots I'm missing on Saturday, but the coverage and power are pitiful on U-Air and B-Air. I'm talking "sourspot Zelda F-Air/B-Air" power. Not very fast on startup or endlag, either; they didn't end before landing when used immediately out of a shorthop.

F-Air has a good arc (think Ganondorf with less range) and some modicum of power; at high percents you can reasonably knock someone offstage, at least.

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

I would hope someone would test out Jab > KO Punch amongst the chaos

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I'll try to manage it tomorrow; I'll also try to get a recording of myself against the Sandbag testing different moves.

 

[Anthinus]

I'll try to manage it tomorrow; I'll also try to get a recording of myself against the Sandbag testing different moves.

BTW, would you mind to test this one thing? The SH lagless aerials (you know, like Thunderstorming with Ganondorf). It would be awesome if that could be done with Mac's dair. Other characters would benefict a lot if that mechanic is back too.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

BTW, would you mind to test this one thing? The SH lagless aerials (you know, like Thunderstorming with Ganondorf). It would be awesome if that could be done with Mac's dair. Other characters would benefict a lot if that mechanic is back too.

I already said that it's possible. You can actually double N-Air and still land laglessly, while single D-Air is possible:

D-Air hits straight down and doing it immediately out of a shorthop makes it finish before landing. With his good runjump speed, I could see it being useful as a safe poke that could be set up on.

 

[Anthinus]

Excellent, great news for me! I read your post but looks like I misread that part. Sorry about that and Thanx a lot!

 

[HipsandChips]

Nailing a smash attack on someone felt really good, and the KO uppercut is strong, though did not live up to it's name.

I don't think I landed a single ariel attack though.

 

[Wicked Sick]

I feel like he was really fun when i played today, I think if they buff his recovery game just a tiny bit so he is impossible to get back on stage with then he'd be a solid pick. I mean like Falcon levels of recovery, not the best but still something.

If his K.O. punch really is that fast to come out i think it would decent to use in air after a Usmash.

Also does he have a spike at all? I think I'm going to main him and i love to dumpster people off stage

 

[TheReflexWonder]

The Best Buy employees wouldn't let me record. That said, I have more info.

Jab seems to go into his various tilts; wouldn't be surprised if Jab -> KO Punch worked (and his Jab has great range).

N-Air does 2% and D-Air does 4%. U-Air and B-Air still look useless, so sticking to the ground for punishes might be necessary. N-Air doesn't send people anywhere but has a little knockback, so I expect to get the first footstool combo KO in Smash 4. D-Air is a very weak meteor/spike, perhaps like Zelda sourspot D-Air.

Neutral-B doesn't look useful for recovering, but I didn't charge it for a really long time or anything. Aerial Up-B does decent damage but shouldn't really KO anyone; not sure if grounded Up-B has significantly more power, but I would hope so.

KO Punch can be done in the air, but it's wayyy weaker that way (like "maybe KO at 110%" weaker). I think that damage is still very high (though I'm not sure), so it still has a use in that case.

Down-B resets vertical momentum and slows your fall speed, like other Counters before it.

 

[Deleted member]

I'll just leave my general thoughts here:

+Incredibly powerful in the right hands, and has an easy time finishing people.

+Good specials. His sideB is good for approaching, but not the best, his counter isn't as strong as some others (especially when stacked up against fellow newcomer Greninja's) but still good, and his upB has some good damage on it. Neutral B is somewhat unreliable though.

+Great throws that have some good potential to lead into combos.

-KO Punch isn't really a OHKO. This could change when the game is released though.

-He really ain't no air fighter, and his recovery is probably the worst out of any Smash game ever. He really just has a hard time getting back on the stage in general.

-Very susceptible to grabs, especially considering that he needs to be in close.

 

[Aefice]

does the ko uppercut in the air have super armor?

 

[Pazzo.]

It seems that Little Mac is a glass cannon... is that true?

 

[Peru]

Little Mac's N-air is gonna have some serious follow up potential, or at least good for pokes

 

[Krynxe]

It seems that Little Mac is a glass cannon... is that true?

That's what he feels like

I mean the traditional idea of that term is that they have low vitality but high strength, but the only thing little mac lacks is a solid recovery. Really though, he's just forced to approach all the time, so he's definitely going to be smacked around a lot in the progress, but he does indeed hit hard. He's probably the closest thing to a glass cannon that you'll see in smash 4

 

[Moon Monkey]

 

[shinhed-echi]

Awesome! Thank you for the video! Mac looks like a solid fighter. I really like what I'm seeing. I don't even care about the bad recovery. And the bad air game has to get some use (at least Nair and Dair).

Hmm.. I wonder if there's footage of FUsmash and FDsmash anywhere. A lot of people forget that Little Mac has 3 different Fsmash attacks. :D So it'd be nice to see them in action.

 

[Pazzo.]

That's what he feels like

I mean the traditional idea of that term is that they have low vitality but high strength, but the only thing little mac lacks is a solid recovery. Really though, he's just forced to approach all the time, so he's definitely going to be smacked around a lot in the progress, but he does indeed hit hard. He's probably the closest thing to a glass cannon that you'll see in smash 4

So he's a lot like he was in the original Punch-Out! games.... Can deal punishment, but will also get smacked around if the player isn't thinkinf.

 

[Venks]

Awesome! Thank you for the video! Mac looks like a solid fighter. I really like what I'm seeing. I don't even care about the bad recovery. And the bad air game has to get some use (at least Nair and Dair).

Hmm.. I wonder if there's footage of FUsmash and FDsmash anywhere. A lot of people forget that Little Mac has 3 different Fsmash attacks. :D So it'd be nice to see them in action.

I've also been looking everywhere to see if anyone uses his up-tilted or down-tilted side smashes but to no avail. Everyone who could play him just seems to of forgotten.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I know this will probably take a miracle and a half to set up, but does anyone know how effective is Giga Mac's KO Punch? :D

 

[FooltheFlames]

so how does his super OHKO move work?
It's not really a OHKO?

 

[Moon Monkey]

so how does his super OHKO move work?
It's not really a OHKO?

No, it's more similar to Wario's Wario Waft than a OH-KO.