BattleField or Final Destination stages?

[J.I.L]

If you want a full analysis, I can really give one on the differences between FD and BF. In terms of movement, the simplest way to explain it is this way:

On FD, the only form of movement you have is horizontal, left and right. Smash is a platform fighter, you're meant to be in the air jumping about and fighting. FD COMPLETELY removes that last part to a great degree.

On BF, you have every form of movement available to you. Vertical and horizontal. Verticality is a big part of Smash in terms of positioning and stage control. As I said earlier, Smash is a platform fighter. Remove the platforms, and you just have an (arguably) below average fighting game.

Smart use of platforms can help extend combos, tech chases, and pushing your advantage state (or even getting out of the disadvantage state against certain characters) that FD can't.

You can reply to what I said above if you wish, but I have a more specific question: How long have you been playing in tournaments if any (local, paid entree, official ruleset) and how long have you been attempting to play competitively? It feels like you haven't been exposed to the true Smash competitive community yet.

I don't know how you say BF is more vertical when you get fight via arieals on FD... the only differnce is you can jump as high. What about those platforms make vertical fighting better?

I really don't use advance combas. I'm just now starting to use falcos basic up throw then up kick combo. So those don't really effect me. And again, how to platforms allow better combos?

Apart from a club....i've never really played in an actual tournament. I only play online. From brawl (causal) to smash 4 and ultimate online is where I learned how to play.

 

[Venclaire]

I don't know how you say BF is more vertical when you get fight via arieals on FD... the only differnce is you can jump as high. What about those platforms make vertical fighting better?

I really don't use advance combas. I'm just now starting to use falcos basic up throw then up kick combo. So those don't really effect me. And again, how to platforms allow better combos?

Apart from a club....i've never really played in an actual tournament. I only play online. From brawl (causal) to smash 4 and ultimate online is where I learned how to play.

NOTE: Whenever I mention a stage on here, assume that hazards are set to OFF. Hazards are always disabled in tournament play. Also, please don't try to take anything I say offensively, I'm not trying to sound rude as I type this up even if it looks like it at times : (.

Platforms allow you to push disadvantage state on your opponent by allowing yourself to get higher when juggling your opponent. Movement on and off of platforms is extremely important in competitive play. As succumbio said earlier in the thread, "BF is and always has been centric (for tournament play)." Out of all the stages that the competitive scene consider the "golden grail", or as the standard for stages, it has always been Battlefield. Although, if you ask me, I believe Pokemon Stadium has been taking that spot more recently.

The platforms make vertical fighting better and more interactive by allowing you to position yourself with more variety. This is even more apparent on other legal stages for tournament, such as Town & City, Kalos, and Pokemon Stadium. EDIT: Don't see platforms as a hinderance to how you can play, see them as an invitation as to how you can play more creatively.

If you're at the stage where you are just now starting to use Falco's up throw up air, you still have a lot to learn. I don't mean that in a bad way of "you're really bad" or whatever, you probably realize that there is still a lot for you to learn yourself. What I should mean is, start taking yourself out of your comfort zone. Start practicing on BF instead of FD. Now, do I mean make a full transition to only playing FD? Not at all. I mean to devise a different strategy on BF and learn how to play on it.

When it comes to tournaments, the community has devised a com,only agreed-upon ruleset, which can be summarized down to this:

• 3 Stocks, 8 Minutes
• Starter Stages: Pokemon Stadium, Smashville, Lylat Cruise, Battlefield, Town & City.
• Counterpick Stages: Final Destination, Kalos Pokemon League, Yoshi's Story (Melee)

I can't easily explain how a set works, but if you're interested in learning how they work, this video easily explains it. I'd like to point out that FD is a counterpick stage which means it can not be selected the first game. This is very important as starters are meant to be the least polarizing stages and the most "fair," so every character doesn't have an immediate advantage over everyone else. Currently, this is the ruleset the community uses for tournament play.

As to the last part, I could tell you weren't the most experienced when it comes to a tournament scene. Your mentality and how you typed about other people picking BF showed it off a lot. It also might be part of the reason people were calling you a "troll", smashboards is primarily a competitive, tournament focused forum. To put it bluntly, the way you're acting right now is considered a stereotype in the Smash community, which is why a few probably wrote you off as a troll and nothing else.

What do I recommend to do? Start watching tournaments, you can find them easily on Twitch or YouTube videos. Look around for your local scene. Are you in the U.S.? If you are, you can easily find a local competitive tournament scene. That is if you have the competitive drive to push yourself as far as you can.

You still have a lot to be exposed to in the competitive Smash community, be the best you can be, and have fun.

 

[Venclaire]

As a second part, an easy video series to follow by Izaw that might help jumpstart your career in competitive smash (should you choose to take the endeavor) is this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ta3L35wsE6o

He goes over all of the basics and advance techniques in Smash Ultimate, from jumping to attack cancelling.

 

[J.I.L]

As a second part, an easy video series to follow by Izaw that might help jumpstart your career in competitive smash (should you choose to take the endeavor) is this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ta3L35wsE6o

He goes over all of the basics and advance techniques in Smash Ultimate, from jumping to attack cancelling.

NOTE: Whenever I mention a stage on here, assume that hazards are set to OFF. Hazards are always disabled in tournament play. Also, please don't try to take anything I say offensively, I'm not trying to sound rude as I type this up even if it looks like it at times : (.

Platforms allow you to push disadvantage state on your opponent by allowing yourself to get higher when juggling your opponent. Movement on and off of platforms is extremely important in competitive play. As succumbio said earlier in the thread, "BF is and always has been centric (for tournament play)." Out of all the stages that the competitive scene consider the "golden grail", or as the standard for stages, it has always been Battlefield. Although, if you ask me, I believe Pokemon Stadium has been taking that spot more recently.

The platforms make vertical fighting better and more interactive by allowing you to position yourself with more variety. This is even more apparent on other legal stages for tournament, such as Town & City, Kalos, and Pokemon Stadium. EDIT: Don't see platforms as a hinderance to how you can play, see them as an invitation as to how you can play more creatively.

If you're at the stage where you are just now starting to use Falco's up throw up air, you still have a lot to learn. I don't mean that in a bad way of "you're really bad" or whatever, you probably realize that there is still a lot for you to learn yourself. What I should mean is, start taking yourself out of your comfort zone. Start practicing on BF instead of FD. Now, do I mean make a full transition to only playing FD? Not at all. I mean to devise a different strategy on BF and learn how to play on it.

When it comes to tournaments, the community has devised a com,only agreed-upon ruleset, which can be summarized down to this:

• 3 Stocks, 8 Minutes
• Starter Stages: Pokemon Stadium, Smashville, Lylat Cruise, Battlefield, Town & City.
• Counterpick Stages: Final Destination, Kalos Pokemon League, Yoshi's Story (Melee)

I can't easily explain how a set works, but if you're interested in learning how they work, this video easily explains it. I'd like to point out that FD is a counterpick stage which means it can not be selected the first game. This is very important as starters are meant to be the least polarizing stages and the most "fair," so every character doesn't have an immediate advantage over everyone else. Currently, this is the ruleset the community uses for tournament play.

As to the last part, I could tell you weren't the most experienced when it comes to a tournament scene. Your mentality and how you typed about other people picking BF showed it off a lot. It also might be part of the reason people were calling you a "troll", smashboards is primarily a competitive, tournament focused forum. To put it bluntly, the way you're acting right now is considered a stereotype in the Smash community, which is why a few probably wrote you off as a troll and nothing else.

What do I recommend to do? Start watching tournaments, you can find them easily on Twitch or YouTube videos. Look around for your local scene. Are you in the U.S.? If you are, you can easily find a local competitive tournament scene. That is if you have the competitive drive to push yourself as far as you can.

You still have a lot to be exposed to in the competitive Smash community, be the best you can be, and have fun.

I don't think i'm cabable of ever being a good combo fighter. It's why my mains are falco and lemmy. I use my projectiles, and I use them well. Making a transtion to be more combat orineted.... Idk if such a transtion is attaniable in any near future, my girl.
Like on BF, as I said - i'm already started to get better adapted to it...but that's by doubling down on camp and run. Before I'd try to punish BF users who tried to escape my projectiles like how I did in FD... but it wouldn't work as well. Now when I'm not sure I can punish BF, I just run to the other stage and throw more projectiles. After two or three times of just running back and forth without trying to punish. The player ajudt and tryies to get in my way. Then I attack. I'm still not really good, but i'm imprvoing.

And the thing with tounrment.... I don't want to get heckled. I camp/zone heavily and I tbag/taunt after every KO (It's force of habit now). That's going to get me eneimies quick and who wants that type of stress? Plus those tounrament, aren't they also to meet new people who love smash and to like build friends? you see, Ven, I have no interest in that. If I were ever going to go to one of those tournaments, my sole purpose is to destroy anyone (as ruthlessely as neccessary) who lies in my pathway to victory and then to claim that champioship. Then I see if the prize is worth something, if it is I leave. If not, I donate it then leave. I'm not interested in actually emersing myself into the literally offline competitive smash community.

 

[QuantumKiller]

And the thing with tounrment.... I don't want to get heckled. I camp/zone heavily and I tbag/taunt after every KO (It's force of habit now). That's going to get me eneimies quick and who wants that type of stress? Plus those tounrament, aren't they also to meet new people who love smash and to like build friends? you see, Ven, I have no interest in that. If I were ever going to go to one of those tournaments, my sole purpose is to destroy anyone (as ruthlessely as neccessary) who lies in my pathway to victory and then to claim that champioship. Then I see if the prize is worth something, if it is I leave. If not, I donate it then leave. I'm not interested in actually emersing myself into the literally offline competitive smash community.

This thread is gold.

 

[Venclaire]

I don't think i'm cabable of ever being a good combo fighter. It's why my mains are falco and lemmy. I use my projectiles, and I use them well. Making a transtion to be more combat orineted.... Idk if such a transtion is attaniable in any near future, my girl.
Like on BF, as I said - i'm already started to get better adapted to it...but that's by doubling down on camp and run. Before I'd try to punish BF users who tried to escape my projectiles like how I did in FD... but it wouldn't work as well. Now when I'm not sure I can punish BF, I just run to the other stage and throw more projectiles. After two or three times of just running back and forth without trying to punish. The player ajudt and tryies to get in my way. Then I attack. I'm still not really good, but i'm imprvoing.

And the thing with tounrment.... I don't want to get heckled. I camp/zone heavily and I tbag/taunt after every KO (It's force of habit now). That's going to get me eneimies quick and who wants that type of stress? Plus those tounrament, aren't they also to meet new people who love smash and to like build friends? you see, Ven, I have no interest in that. If I were ever going to go to one of those tournaments, my sole purpose is to destroy anyone (as ruthlessely as neccessary) who lies in my pathway to victory and then to claim that champioship. Then I see if the prize is worth something, if it is I leave. If not, I donate it then leave. I'm not interested in actually emersing myself into the literally offline competitive smash community.

well guys i tried lol

btw jil if you live in the US hmu/DM me if you wanna get destroyed and brought back down to reality in a battle arena. im free sunday, so lets see how good you do, my girl

 

[J.I.L]

well guys i tried lol

btw jil if you live in the US hmu/DM me if you wanna get destroyed and brought back down to reality in a battle arena. im free sunday, so lets see how good you do, my girl

I'm not a girl. And it's J-I-L like KAL-EL.... not "Jil". And I'd destory you (ah shoot...am I allowed to say that? am I going to pick up another strike on my account?). I have a bunch of replays saved, BF and FD. I'd post them here if I knew how. You users need to know who you're dealing with. I'm not the average smash player.

 

[Venclaire]

I'm not a girl. And it's J-I-L like KAL-EL.... not "Jil". And I'd destory you (ah shoot...am I allowed to say that? am I going to pick up another strike on my account?). I have a bunch of replays saved, BF and FD. I'd post them here if I knew how. You users need to know who you're dealing with. I'm not the average smash player.

You're exactly right, you're not the average smash player, you're a below-average smash player with an ego bigger than your brain lol

You act high and mighty, but I'd be impressed if you could take a game off me lol. You really do need a reality check. I'll be more than happy to set up a battle arena tomorrow on Sunday. You just admitted yourself that you can barely do a basic combo, I don't see how you even act the way you do.

DM me or add me on Discord (its on my profile's about page). No point in leaving this on a public thread as I'm sure it's against the rules.

 

[J.I.L]

You're exactly right, you're not the average smash player, you're a below-average smash player with an ego bigger than your brain lol

You act high and mighty, but I'd be impressed if you could take a game off me lol. You really do need a reality check. I'll be more than happy to set up a battle arena tomorrow on Sunday. You just admitted yourself that you can barely do a basic combo, I don't see how you even act the way you do.

Oh that's it...now you've done it. But I'm not sure if I'll be aviable on sunday. Mothers day, erm....mayve late into the evenings hours. What time...? has to be from like 11:30...to 12am ET.

Didn't I say my GSP with falco was at like 4.645 million at one point? My lemmy is at 4.670 million GSP. Above top 2 percentile in the entire online hemisphere. Be careful of that challenge you offer, ven. As I said, i'm not the average smash player.

 

[Venclaire]

Oh that's it...now you've done it. But I'm not sure if I'll be aviable on sunday. Mothers day, erm....mayve late into the evenings hours. What time...? has to be from like 11:30...to 12am ET.

Didn't I say my GSP with falco was at like 4.645 million at one point? My lemmy is at 4.670 million GSP. Above top 2 percentile in the entire online hemisphere. Be careful of that challenge you offer, ven. As I said, i'm not the average smash player.

DM me on Smashboards or add me on Discord (my profile about page has it there) and we can work out a time.

 

[Sucumbio]

Lol nice. My money's on J losing on bf and maybe 50 50 on fd.

J.I.L not another point so long as you keep from name calling but that applies universally as I love a good argument.

 

[Xquirtle]

DM me on Smashboards or add me on Discord (my profile about page has it there) and we can work out a time.

Can you upload it to youtube for the memes?

 

[Venclaire]

Can you upload it to youtube for the memes?

Sure, I'll save and upload a few replays if you want lol

 

[Lunardog15]

best of luck to both

 

[Ethan Weegee]

I like both omega and battlefield forms, but which I prefer depends on the character.
With Ness, I'll go for battlefield because he seems to perform a lot better there than omega.
With Jigglypuff, I'd rather use omega, my Jigglypuff seems better there.
With Kirby, I prefer omega, because battlefield can mess up combos, even though I do somewhat miss up-throw onto the top platform.
With Samus, I prefer battlefield, because her aerials work great there for me.

 

[Lunardog15]

counter point to Kirby on fd
on bf you can down b through platforms to get silly things as they think you wiffed and try to go punish and get hit

 

[Grimel]

Battlefield. I choose it to counter projectile spam and extend my combo game. I have always vastly prefered platform stages to FD.

 

[Ethan Weegee]

Battlefield doesn't counter projectile spam though, it encourages it. In addition to being unable to push forward, coming in from above is no longer an option.

 

[Coolboy]

i prefer BF stages with most of the characters if i had to choose between FD & BF, i guess stages with platforms gives you more room to do things or even avoid stuff if you need to ^^''

my faves like Toon Link for example performs just waaaay better on BF then FD stages,

but if i play Sonic then i like FD stages more cause the platforms kinda get in his way to perform his moves haha

what i still can't figure out is why does Toon Link's Dair sometimes go through platforms sucessfully hitting the opponent and other times they do not? >.<

 

[Naov]

I prefer FD.

I don't think that one is strictly better than the other, but it is a fact that each stage is better for certain characters. FE bowser is greatly benefited by platforms because it can achieve easy KOs. Little Mac will be better at FD, etc.

I play as Mii Gunner who has a very bad air movement, it is floaty slow, but with no horizontal movement. So even dropping from the platforms can make it an easy target to hit.


But as a personal opinion, i don't think BF is a good stage, it feels very cluttered. I actually like Dream Land for example, that has a similar shape and feels more 'platformy' as other argue Smash should be. But dream land has more space between platforms and you do actually feel free moving around.

 

[HeavyMaster]

I prefer Final destination but i still like Battlefield

They never expect me to slip through the platform with my cannon lol so they just run into it and i get free damage and momentum

 

[BEASTMASTERTOAD]

Oh that's it...now you've done it. But I'm not sure if I'll be aviable on sunday. Mothers day, erm....mayve late into the evenings hours. What time...? has to be from like 11:30...to 12am ET.

Did this fight actually happen?

Also, I like both, but prefer BF. Since I’m a DSamus main, I can overcome most projectile campers and shark with aerials. The platforms also are fun to weave through with morph ball bombs. FD isn’t as fun because there’s just once plane, but it makes me laugh when a rushdown player tries to charge at me and eats a morph ball bomb every time.

 

[J.I.L]

BF players, man..... it’s just getting to the point where I don’t have any respect as a smash player to someone who picks BF. stages. I just played this absolute loser mil gunner who just ran away and threw projectiles under the ledges. And he teabagged as if he’s a good player. I lost 1.2k gsp. It’s ridiculous. It’s an common theme of notice among BF players I see. They exert no skill.

It’s like dealing with people who needs tricycle. It’s really exhausting. There’s no reason for BF in competive 1v1 other then “I’m not very good at dodging projectile. I need my baby platforms to hide from projectiles” or B. “I’m a low tier projectile loser who gets body whooped every single time on FD stages so I go to BF stages because it helps me hide out better which covers up my absolute lack of skill of even knowing how to use projectiles”. IMO, these are the two prevelant reason I believe people go to such an stupid stage.

Every time I win against a BF player, I make it point of emphasis to make them miserable. I played a Wario in BF a few days ago as falco. I just sat under ledges and shot lasers. Every time he got near me, he’d do down a and hit that dumb platform since i shot lasers under that platform giving me chance to run to the other side and do more laser. Like you want to pick a dumb stage like this Wario, I’ll use it against you in the worst way possible. I slugged that game out to like 5-6 minutes, and I won semi easily. I steamed him up some nice teabag to go, as well. That imbecile didn’t rematch. He was probably upset and sad. GOOD. Use that lesson to never pick such a dumb stage agaian. But when you play against actual swamp monsters like snake, samus and mii gunner; there’s nothing you can do. They are apex beings of their swamp biome that is battlefield. Just hide under ledges and shoot projectiles, jump on ledges to avoid other projectiles as they charge up their own, lay booby traps all over the stage, spam shield knowing that’s basically the only option your oppenet can do when attacking you on such a dumb stage and just run away for more camp on, under, inside and wherever on those platforms.

Battlefield is such a disgraceful stage. That stage is a swamp and people who master playing on that stage are just swamp monsters IMO. Swamp monster aren’t usually good players, they just swamp it up in their habitat. Once they leave their habitat, most of them they are average players at best as they get completely annihilated on normal FD stages. I would know because I just abused a swamp monster snake on FD with just falco.

 

[Coolboy]

BF players, man..... it’s just getting to the point where I don’t have any respect as a smash player to someone who picks BF. stages. I just played this absolute loser mil gunner who just ran away and threw projectiles under the ledges. And he teabagged as if he’s a good player. I lost 1.2k gsp. It’s ridiculous. It’s an common theme of notice among BF players I see. They exert no skill.

It’s like dealing with people who needs tricycle. It’s really exhausting. There’s no reason for BF in competive 1v1 other then “I’m not very good at dodging projectile. I need my baby platforms to hide from projectiles” or B. “I’m a low tier projectile loser who gets body whooped every single time on FD stages so I go to BF stages because it helps me hide out better which covers up my absolute lack of skill of even knowing how to use projectiles”. IMO, these are the two prevelant reason I believe people go to such an stupid stage.

Every time I win against a BF player, I make it point of emphasis to make them miserable. I played a Wario in BF a few days ago as falco. I just sat under ledges and shot lasers. Every time he got near me, he’d do down a and hit that dumb platform since i shot lasers under that platform giving me chance to run to the other side and do more laser. Like you want to pick a dumb stage like this Wario, I’ll use it against you in the worst way possible. I slugged that game out to like 5-6 minutes, and I won semi easily. I steamed him up some nice teabag to go, as well. That imbecile didn’t rematch. He was probably upset and sad. GOOD. Use that lesson to never pick such a dumb stage agaian. But when you play against actual swamp monsters like snake, samus and mii gunner; there’s nothing you can do. They are apex beings of their swamp biome that is battlefield. Just hide under ledges and shoot projectiles, jump on ledges to avoid other projectiles as they charge up their own, lay booby traps all over the stage, spam shield knowing that’s basically the only option your oppenet can do when attacking you on such a dumb stage and just run away for more camp on, under, inside and wherever on those platforms.

Battlefield is such a disgraceful stage. That stage is a swamp and people who master playing on that stage are just swamp monsters IMO. Swamp monster aren’t usually good players, they just swamp it up in their habitat. Once they leave their habitat, most of them they are average players at best as they get completely annihilated on normal FD stages. I would know because I just abused a swamp monster snake on FD with just falco.

calling people bad because they like BF is kinda lame don't you think? you just hate it that people use BF in their advantage, if you can win from those advantages well awesome for you and if you can't..well you know what they say ''git gud!''

let me tell you a funny story that happend a few days ago. i was playing Fox admittedly i am still not all to great with them so my GSP was low aka under 2.0 mil with him, but i got matched against a over 3.5 mil player (silly matchmaking again) we had a FFA and a team match with other players..but then everyone else left and we had a 1v1 on a FD stage, at first i performed bad but on my last stock i made a comeback but meh to late to win lol
but then we had a 1v1 on a BF stage and i used it in my advantage and i won from him. it's a match i personally am very proud of and nothing you or anyone can say to change that.

using a stage in your advantage is nothing to feel bad about and if you have problems with BF players who prefer this stage then that really is a you problem!

but do you really have the right to complain about these people when you only spam Falco's laser and Ness PK fire? you despise the exact same things you do to others..hm..we have a word for people like that don't we? it starts with a H :o

 

[J.I.L]

calling people bad because they like BF is kinda lame don't you think? you just hate it that people use BF in their advantage, if you can win from those advantages well awesome for you and if you can't..well you know what they say ''git gud!''

let me tell you a funny story that happend a few days ago. i was playing Fox admittedly i am still not all to great with them so my GSP was low aka under 2.0 mil with him, but i got matched against a over 3.5 mil player (silly matchmaking again) we had a FFA and a team match with other players..but then everyone else left and we had a 1v1 on a FD stage, at first i performed bad but on my last stock i made a comeback but meh to late to win lol
but then we had a 1v1 on a BF stage and i used it in my advantage and i won from him. it's a match i personally am very proud of and nothing you or anyone can say to change that.

using a stage in your advantage is nothing to feel bad about and if you have problems with BF players who prefer this stage then that really is a you problem!

but do you really have the right to complain about these people when you only spam Falco's laser and Ness PK fire? you despise the exact same things you do to others..hm..we have a word for people like that don't we? it starts with a H :o

I don’t give a squat how “lame” I sound, I stand by me opinion, BSTTLEFIELD IS GARBAGE!

Fox is so trash, I’m only at like 1.6-1.7 million with him, too. He’s one of the worst character in the game, the dude sinks to the ground like a metal statue. Anyway, the reason you probably won is you figured the guy out. You said yourself you went on comeback, the next game you carried that momentum and beat the guy. Do you really think BF made a difference?

The only stage you should use to advantage is neutral stage like FD. There’s no barriers, platforms - just open land. If you use that to advantage, that’s creativity and where real warriors shine!

No no, I’m not a hypocrite. I specifically called out projectile users who do it ON BATTLEFIELD. Those people are A JOKE. Those people I believe have no skillful way of using projectile so they go to BF like a child needing a tryicle instead of using a bycle!

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

J.I.L I like both Battlefield and FD stages, but I like FD more, because it gives you more of a challenge. Here's what I mean:

Battlefield is a newbie stage which gives you platforms and a single chunk of land. This gives expert BF players opportunities to dodge your attacks meaning it's difficult to combo with characters that have multi-hit F-Airs like Kirby () and Ganondorf ().

Final Destination gives you no platforms. Just a solid chunk of land. Therefore, multi-hit attacks are better to use on FD stages, it gives opponents less opportunities to dodge, it gives you more opportunities to combo, and it's just plain fun! It's just plain fair! It's balanced... as all things should be!

 

[Xquirtle]

J.I.L I like both Battlefield and FD stages, but I like FD more, because it gives you more of a challenge. Here's what I mean:

Battlefield is a newbie stage which gives you platforms and a single chunk of land. This gives expert BF players opportunities to dodge your attacks meaning it's difficult to combo with characters that have multi-hit F-Airs like Kirby () and Ganondorf ().

Final Destination gives you no platforms. Just a solid chunk of land. Therefore, multi-hit attacks are better to use on FD stages, it gives opponents less opportunities to dodge, it gives you more opportunities to combo, and it's just plain fun! It's just plain fair! It's balanced... as all things should be!

I strongly, strongly, disagree that BF is in any way a newbie stage. The platforms only add complexity in basically every way. Yes, the platforms can break up combos, but they also create more complex combo opportunities on the flip side and create lots of tech reads. They also make landing more complex, and provide a new advantage state (being under somebody that is on a platform). The only way that they make the game simpler, for anybody, is by providing players a means to not be camped out by projectiles as easily.

There is a reason that competitive play has 1 FD map, and every other stage has platforms. FD is not balanced by any means and is almost always used as a counter pick stage since it frequently highly favors one side of a matchup. and I get your attraction to its simplicity, but its simplicity is what makes it an imbalanced stage in many instances. It provides less tools to work with to differentiate your 'skill'

 

[Sucumbio]

I'm not sure I understand what everyone's problem is... Since at least Brawl (and prolly before but that was my first game) BF has always been a legit starter stage and counterpick. It may heavily favor certain play styles but it's not degenerate, not over centralizing and is far more interesting to play on than omega/fd stages.

While this is my opinion it's rooted in tournament results and rulesets as well as results from literally three different smash games. Projectile camping is NOT favored on BF which is why as an Ike main I prefer it.

The specific grievances against so called projectile campers that still flourish on BF like snake simply have better toolkits to use static platforms to their advantage which is why SV/Town are popular choices for a balanced match.

BF only real issue is the smaller blast zones in general but with the mechanics of Ultimate KO earlier than previous games I honestly don't see how it would be considered unfair.

 

[J.I.L]

J.I.L I like both Battlefield and FD stages, but I like FD more, because it gives you more of a challenge. Here's what I mean:

Battlefield is a newbie stage which gives you platforms and a single chunk of land. This gives expert BF players opportunities to dodge your attacks meaning it's difficult to combo with characters that have multi-hit F-Airs like Kirby () and Ganondorf ().

Final Destination gives you no platforms. Just a solid chunk of land. Therefore, multi-hit attacks are better to use on FD stages, it gives opponents less opportunities to dodge, it gives you more opportunities to combo, and it's just plain fun! It's just plain fair! It's balanced... as all things should be!

Dude, that was just 100% facts. No disagreement here(apart from the “I like both”).

Also I love that scene of Goku turning ssj against cooler.
“Why don’t you wake up!? You’re hurting people, what have they done to you? I can’t allow you to take your unhappiness out on others anymore.” - that phrase always hits a soft spot inside me.
Plus, the transformation and voice acting was awesome. Lol.
Xquirtle what complexities? All I see is cheese and choppy movement due to those platforms siphening fluid movement. I agree with rhythm their that it is a newbie stage hence my tricycle analogy.
And exactly my point, people who lack skill to avoid proejecie go there... so they can have... wait for it.... a HANDICAP... which is what newbs need. I played this inecoraor who’s ruleset was 7 min 3 stock omega stage while I was falco. HE DESTORYED ME, by figuring out techniques to avoid my laser. He played like a true warrior which is why his gsp was 4.9634 million and I had nothing but respect for him which I played him multiple times which I lost every time.
Point is, it can be done. But that’s where imagination and skill needs to happen. Not places with hills, platforms and other Jank there to assist you. That’s lower level IMO.
Sucumbio dude. You main Ike and go to BF? Isn’t your jump movement limited. Most Ike I play play on Fd since they like to spam their cheap forward jump Nair attack.

 

[Sucumbio]

Nah man. BF is great for ike. He pretty much owns the middle of the stage forcing projectile users to the edges to camp. Ike is naturally aggressive so it really plays to his strengths. Plus his uair is demonstrably terrifying to deal with on bf.

Whereas on fd he's wide open and forced to approach from literally one vector. It's limiting to his toolkit and pretty much negates his ability to force approaches because he can't out camp anyone.

Really all the non projectile sword characters do better on BF. Cloud can at least camp with the best of them and shulk has way better mobility to name some exceptions.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

We all have different opinions, and I can understand yours. However, the trouble with platforms is that it gives players an opportunity to camp, so that's why I like FD better.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

Dude, that was just 100% facts. No disagreement here(apart from the “I like both”).

Also I love that scene of Goku turning ssj against cooler.
“Why don’t you wake up!? You’re hurting people, what have they done to you? I can’t allow you to take your unhappiness out on others anymore.” - that phrase always hits a soft spot inside me.
Plus, the transformation and voice acting was awesome. Lol.

I agree, that transformation was awesome. Although I still don't understand how Goku would get upset at a simple robin dying. There's plenty of them out there!

But, yeah, Sean Schemmel and Andrew Chandler did a great job with the voice acting, and the soundtrack was awesome as well.

 

[Xquirtle]

We all have different opinions, and I can understand yours. However, the trouble with platforms is that it gives players an opportunity to camp, so that's why I like FD better.

I don't see how that logic is not not 8 times worse on the flip side, with FD heavily favoring players camping projectiles. And anyway, camping platforms is generally a bad strategy... like being above somebody, on a platform, is a serious state of disadvantage. You can't hit them, and you have limited defensive options. and being on a platform in shield is realllly bad in this game. If you're having issues with people jumping back and forth on the platforms, then that is most likely a deficiency in your game play. Its not hard to get a read on a player that is trying to do that. they only really have 1 way to go, and that is above you, which is bad.

And you're obviously welcome to your preference, but FD being a more polarizing stage, and thus inferior starting stage to BF, is just factual. This has been true in every smash game that has had both stages (melee and onward). FD is just not a neutral stage, where as BF is arguably neutral, but some of the other platform stages are even better. Also, I'd almost certainly be running BF on Kirby. Not only does it help with getting camped, but BF is just really really good on characters like Puff and Kirby that have multiple jumps, and can use the platforms to quickly reset them.

 

[J.I.L]

I agree, that transformation was awesome. Although I still don't understand how Goku would get upset at a simple robin dying. There's plenty of them out there!

But, yeah, Sean Schemmel and Andrew Chandler did a great job with the voice acting, and the soundtrack was awesome as well.

Look at how this guy says BF is an neutral stage but always ends offf saying how certain characters get extra benefits and advantages playing on battlefield. Exactly our point. BF in our opinion is a newbie stage where people who struggle doing certain s move sets on FD go to BF because it’s easier for them to do it because of platform.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

Not to be offensive and all, but you quoted the wrong post.

 

[Sucumbio]

I'd argue that bf is more advanced rather than noob bc it requires better anticipation and strategy to deal with static tri plats. But I agree that at least on quickplay bf is abused by lesser skilled players because there's far more players not able to correctly use the stage and who lose due to frustration and loss of concentration. And it also ipunishes players that rely on specials/most projectiles.

 

[J.I.L]

I'd argue that bf is more advanced rather than noob bc it requires better anticipation and strategy to deal with static tri plats. But I agree that at least on quickplay bf is abused by lesser skilled players because there's far more players not able to correctly use the stage and who lose due to frustration and loss of concentration. And it also ipunishes players that rely on specials/most projectiles.

This I can concede too. In a lot of my BF battles, I’m usually winning then I choke due to weariness and frustration of the stage. But I don’t know how that’s be differnt if someone cheesed BF offline like in tourney or with friends.

 

[Sucumbio]

Well at tournament level the degenerate camping strategies you see on quickplay are easily punished. That's true for any stage too. It really is a different game at that level. What's interesting is the focus required to not revert to bad habits when you're down 2 stocks. Excessive rolling, spot dodging, etc. Patience is key. Watching your opponent and reacting the right way is already difficult but online it's even harder because of the issues inherent to wifi.

If BF really is a difficult stage to win on, I'd actually suggest practicing on it all the more even offline. Especially offline. And especially if you main characters like Ness or Lucas whose specials require fewer obstacles to be effective. The fact that the tri plats are static definitely feels at first like a hindrance but changing up play style will be rewarded. Focus on mobility. Practice quick attacks and hit and run maneuvers. Shield less, stay ariel and most of all just don't spam lol

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

J.I.L Another thing I like about FD is it gives me room to dashdance.

 

[J.I.L]

Well at tournament level the degenerate camping strategies you see on quickplay are easily punished. That's true for any stage too. It really is a different game at that level. What's interesting is the focus required to not revert to bad habits when you're down 2 stocks. Excessive rolling, spot dodging, etc. Patience is key. Watching your opponent and reacting the right way is already difficult but online it's even harder because of the issues inherent to wifi.

If BF really is a difficult stage to win on, I'd actually suggest practicing on it all the more even offline. Especially offline. And especially if you main characters like Ness or Lucas whose specials require fewer obstacles to be effective. The fact that the tri plats are static definitely feels at first like a hindrance but changing up play style will be rewarded. Focus on mobility. Practice quick attacks and hit and run maneuvers. Shield less, stay ariel and most of all just don't spam lol

Nah bro. There’s nothing I can do against swamp monsters. Mostly every time I lose on that stage, I don’t feel like I lost to a superior player... just some person who used a stage as assistance. There’s just no skill. I don’t have any respect as a smash player for people who main that stage. That stage is a swamp, filled with either swamp creatures or swamp monsters.

I played this dark samus whom I took care of with falco (two stocker him), changed characters to ness. Played the same guy on BF (good thing I didn’t rematch with falco. After I won, I click remwatch... saw he was in the room ready to go... immediately clicked out before game locked me in) this time as ness. He did what a typical swamp creature samus does, throw projectile under platforms and every time I tried to get near him, samus would run away to under a platform, do his down b to get separation just as I’m running for him with ness, charge up his B a little. Throw some side b missle, and punch me away then charge B again. Rinse and repeat. O thing I can do since I’m struggling to maneuver through that horrid stage. I lost (thankfully it’s my troll/3rd main ness so I wasn’t that mad). I just said to myself what I usually say after losses on that stage: “ you weren’t a good player. You just used a stage as assistance. You have no skill you disgusting swamp creature (or monster if they are really attuned with the stage), I’m not playing you again”.

I get mad losing on quickplay... in a tourney setting with actual stakes? Losing to a BF player? Lol, no way I could control myself from saying some hurtful things to my oppenet.