Back Slash

[Jasou]

Opinions on backslash? I only find it useful for jumping over projectiles while approaching in the air and an occasional back slash from the ledge. (only if they are far away).

It's a very situational move, but I was wondering if you guys found a use for it vs players.

 

[Berserker.]

Default back slash is useful for punishing. Period. Very situational. It can also be used as a follow up from b-throw or u-throw but it's not as consistent as Enduring back slash. Also, don't use it to approach people from the air. They can see that coming easily

EBS is basically back slash but 100x better because of the armor

 

[Jasou]

Oh, I meant I only do it in the air while approaching if they are charging some sort of projectile. It is easy to see otherwise. Things like luma charge, toon link arrows etc.

I'd have to check out his custom side b's. I actually haven't tried those out yet.

 

[DaDavid]

In For Glory it's very useful to punish roll spammers. For example, when I start an aerial approach and I notice that the opponent decides to roll underneath me, I start Back Slash in the direction that they are rolling/where I jumped from and I usually hit them with the tip of it right as their roll finishes. With Buster active that's like a clean 15 or so percent (I don't know numbers but it's decent damage for little risk)

 

[Claxus]

The most practical offensive use is probably using it after a back-throw. Not directly chaining it, but on opponents at 40%ish and more, the b-throw will toss them up a good distance facing back, and you may be able to jump up after them and hit them in the air if they don't land fast enough or try to jump away. This is mostly ineffective against multi-jump characters though, as they can easily turn around in mid-air (but then it can still get a front-hit at least). But it's something. And if it's high up enough, you won't be punished too hard.

 

[Masonomace]

Back Slash is one of those obscure moves in Singles, but has greater use in Doubles. I'll list some uses, but I will disregard the Custom Special variations of Back Slash & talk about strictly Back Slash itself:

• Punishing longer-ranged mistakes, whether they're landing poorly, or it's for edge-guarding mix-ups
  
  
• Back Slash ***** the RAR approaches. Anytime you see someone do RAR+Bairs for zoning you out, please Back Slash them because it will defeat that approach & deal additional damage for them turning their back for us
  
  
• Usage as a horizontal recovery, otherwise it's not good if you have jumps & an Air Slash savored for regular recovery
  
  
• Mix-up after a throw. This includes Bthrow, & Uthrow, sometimes Fthrow if you're attempting to punish their landing. Back Slash can be used in a setup after throwing them upwards frame trapping their airdodge

 

[meleebrawler]

Anybody notice that when you input side b, if you VERY quickly tap the opposite direction,
you'll switch direction? Don't really see the use of this, but...

 

[Berserker.]

Anybody notice that when you input side b, if you VERY quickly tap the opposite direction,
you'll switch direction? Don't really see the use of this, but...

Yep. We know of that already but thanks for reminding

Also quite useful for mind games

 

[Jade_Rock55]

Guys back throw and backslash the edge while recovering after they midair jump,its how to kill little Mac in two hits.(Its risky as you may jump of the edge while recovering.)

 

[Masonomace]

Guys back throw and backslash the edge while recovering after they midair jump,its how to kill little Mac in two hits.(Its risky as you may jump of the edge while recovering.)

This early on does work, because players use their doublejump in a matter of panic thinking, "I must recover" when they get Bthrown off stage like that. The alternative to avoiding the SD Back Slash is to space it naturally, given the situation you can pivot Side-B or stutterstep it away or towards them. I dig it

Although later on players will be conditioned not to jump & wait for you to try it again if you do.

 

[Jade_Rock55]

If they catch on I use nair fair and Angled forward smash. Though 1 stock so easily is helpful.

 

[Phampy]

I also enjoy using it on people that like to air dodge through me. When my opponent is above me and their momentum is carrying them forward towards me, I either use f-air to attack them or if I think they'll air dodge through me, I'll respond with back slash. It's a pretty good option if you condition your opponent to air dodge in the air often.

 

[meleebrawler]

Yep. We know of that already but thanks for reminding

Also quite useful for mind games

But it's not like it causes a weird visual effect where Shulk starts slashing in one direction then flips
around.

The only "mind-game" I can think of is when you're looking at your opponent's
controller. (Apparently pros can see Akuma's Raging Demons coming because of
it's unique input.)

 

[Berserker.]

But it's not like it causes a weird visual effect where Shulk starts slashing in one direction then flips
around.

The only "mind-game" I can think of is when you're looking at your opponent's
controller. (Apparently pros can see Akuma's Raging Demons coming because of
it's unique input.)

It's nothing much but that's the only way I could think about utilizing it

 

[Farkle the Oddly Shaped]

But it's not like it causes a weird visual effect where Shulk starts slashing in one direction then flips
around.(Apparently pros can see Akuma's Raging Demons coming because of
it's unique input.)

That's cause it's just a standard B-reverse. It was a tech in Brawl that they continued into Smash 4. All neutral B moves can B-reverse and I'm almost certain it's the same case for side B's and down B's.

 

[Jerm]

Default back slash is useful for punishing. Period. Very situational. It can also be used as a follow up from b-throw or u-throw but it's not as consistent as Enduring back slash. Also, don't use it to approach people from the air. They can see that coming easily

EBS is basically back slash but 100x better because of the armor

i gotta try out this EBS you keep talking about! What is the fastest way to get it?

 

[Masonomace]

That's cause it's just a standard B-reverse. It was a tech in Brawl that they continued into Smash 4. All neutral B moves can B-reverse and I'm almost certain it's the same case for side B's and down B's.

I haven't seen a Reverse Vision yet, I'm confused why because I believe I've seen Smash 4 Marth use his Reversed Counter before. .

Reversed Vision would be really helpful for characters who Dash attack to punish our landing since the Reverse momentum takes us back further away, helping us land our regular Vision parry a lot easier. Vision makes Shulk turn around if the attack hits from behind for when those certain Dash attacks have a lot of carried over momentum like Zamus' & Captain Falcon's. Then again. . .Forward+Vision is the better alternative but still.
. . .
What am I doing discussion about RV in a Back Slash thread. . .

i gotta try out this EBS you keep talking about! What is the fastest way to get it?

Classic mode, pressing the home button during the roulette to see if any red wrench icons appear, since those are how you get Custom Specials. Pressing the home button again & holding A when you see the red wrench silhouette is probably the quickest way.

 

[Madolche ♦ Procione]

I use it to punish rolls and as an interception to condition opponents not to immediately double jump.
I'm pretty sure that if you go deep enough with it against a roll it "crosses them up" and deals the added damage. Or maybe I'm mistaken.

 

[guedes the brawler]

it's funny when you are on the upper corners fo the stage, preferably occulted by the magnifying glass, and your opponent is getting ready for a back air. they usually don't see you sinking with back slash til it's too late.

using this as a pseudo-shulkicide is interesting if you have a stock advantage. risky, but very rewarding.


obviously should be used very sparringly, since it's not safe AT ALL. especially if Shulk doesn't do the move silently.

 

[Berserker.]

Must... Find... Practical... Use...

ugh. come on. Back slash. Don't be useless

 

[Masonomace]

Must... Find... Practical... Use...

ugh. come on. Back slash. Don't be useless

Hmmm. . .

Back Slash's over-had hit-box for low platform pressure?. . .Maybe not, they could shield it & punish us

Back Slash edge-guarding?. . .Well. . .that will vary because a spaced SH > BS or FH > BS could connect if they ledge-jump, get-up, edge-attack, or do ledge-drop > aerials or something, but then they could roll on-stage, which we would have to predict that happening & do Reverse Back Slash at the last second. . .so it seems like a decent thing to do but it's not guaranteed good to do

Back Slash for punishing landings?. . .Maybe, a spaced Back Slash with the ridiculous range it has would avoid most landing options an opponent would challenge with exxxxxxxxxxxcept for Parry moves

So yeah. . .Back Slash is better off using either Custom Special variation in replace of regular Back Slash? Dibs on EBS!

 

[Berserker.]

Yeah but what if customs are banned in certain tournaments? It's really dependent on the TO

as of now

 

[Masonomace]

Actually I remember this from watching & testing it once, but Back Slash's red visual slash that stays out lingers just for a tiny bit during the Monado slamming down on the ground. So characters who run into the very tip of the Beam will get hit.

Note: If Back Slash already hits you or your shield then it may not linger. This is about the times when Back Slash whiffs & you run towards Shulk to punish him so-to-speak.

Yeah but what if customs are banned in certain tournaments? It's really dependent on the TO

as of now

Then those certain tournaments dependent on the TO organizing it, imo are fest. In this case, fest = lame. Custom Specials not allowed for those certain tournaments would be bland game-play, & it's not that big of a deal to be aware of a few extra special moves in each character MU. I mean it seems like a big deal because 51+ characters & 6 Customs for each estimately is around 300 extra moves. . .so now it sounds like a lot of hassle & work. Honestly though some characters NEED those Custom Specials in order to help them get by in a specific character MU so. That'd be lame but this is about those certain tournaments.

 

[MajorGamer14]

I use Back slash to punish projectile spammers. SH + the jump from Back Slash allows me to hop over nearly every projectile in the game. Opponents don't usually see it coming, IMO.

 

[Masonomace]

I use Back slash to punish projectile spammers. SH + the jump from Back Slash allows me to hop over nearly every projectile in the game. Opponents don't usually see it coming, IMO.

I dig this, but it's dependent on which character you're doing this against. Like for example, this is definitely not okay to do versus Lucario, but Link & Spamus are better choices to SH > BS against them charging an arrow or missile.

 

[Berserker.]

I really don't get back slash. Best way to damage with it is by hitting the back but in a 1 on 1 situation, that's rarely gonna happen. Freaking Sakurai and his vision of a party game (Shameless selfishness)

Plus, what's the point of using back slash anyway? Up front, it does 10% damage if tipped and 9% if hit with the base. I could probably do much more with n-air to grab/jab.... And n-air's range is awesome so.... *sigh*

There's gotta be something about back slash.... Maybe I'm not u-throwing -> back slashing enough. Forgot about that :|

 

[Masonomace]

Back Slash 1v1 in all seriousness has little usage. .unfortunately. There are ways & tactics of implementing Back Slash into our play-style, but fat chance it actually gets any mention of any big plays.

Now, if we're talking about Doubles, then Shulk's Back Slash gets 200% more usage & mileage out of it. But I've said this so many times in so many Shulk threads I'm sounding like a Broken Record now. .

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Using Monado Speed and running past your opponent so they shield and Back Slash when you sense they'll drop their shield is situational but I've been able to pull it off a lot in For Glory.

 

[-_skinny_-]

Sorry i stopped reading after like the 10 posts so idk if anyone said this already but, I love backslash mainly because of the range as you leap forward but what makes it even better is the arc you follow. With practice and spacial judgement you can recover from the air and punish edgehogs. but to me the MAIN DOWNFALL is that Shulk likes to announce it... otherwise its a great move because people usually underestimate the arc so they get their foot sliced by the tip of the Monado

 

[Masonomace]

Sorry i stopped reading after like the 10 posts so idk if anyone said this already but, I love backslash mainly because of the range as you leap forward but what makes it even better is the arc you follow. With practice and spacial judgement you can recover from the air and punish edgehogs. but to me the MAIN DOWNFALL is that Shulk likes to announce it... otherwise its a great move because people usually underestimate the arc so they get their foot sliced by the tip of the Monado

There are times Shulk doesn't announce it. I was curious & did a tiny bit of analyzing in hoping why he doesn't, but I gave up trying to figure it out. Maybe we'll know eventually.

 

[-_skinny_-]

Im pretty sure its random but if it isn't I would love to know how

 

[Augi Jr.]

Using Monado Speed and running past your opponent so they shield and Back Slash when you sense they'll drop their shield is situational but I've been able to pull it off a lot in For Glory.

This seems like a really good mind-game tool and a nice way to switch up the approach.

Conceptually (I haven't had time to actually try this...) but if your opponent likes to dash attack/grab, if you jump over the dash attack/grab then immediately back slash you might be able to hit them... It would definitely catch them off guard as you're traveling through the air in one direction then backslash immediately takes you in the opposite direction.

Backlash might also be a better aerial alternative to Bair while over the stage... Your opponent sees you moving away from them through the air, they're not expecting an attack, then BAM backslash direction switch.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

This seems like a really good mind-game tool and a nice way to switch up the approach.

Conceptually (I haven't had time to actually try this...) but if your opponent likes to dash attack/grab, if you jump over the dash attack/grab then immediately back slash you might be able to hit them... It would definitely catch them off guard as you're traveling through the air in one direction then backslash immediately takes you in the opposite direction.

Backlash might also be a better aerial alternative to Bair while over the stage... Your opponent sees you moving away from them through the air, they're not expecting an attack, then BAM backslash direction switch.

Yeah Back Slash is great for confusing your opponent. Something else you can do like you were saying about confusing the opponent with what direction you go is up throwing them, running past them, baiting the air dodge, and HYAH BACK SLASH!

Edit: I just remembered with Buster at about 0-50% on most characters you can do bthrow > Back Slash which does 35% fresh and is a great mixup out of throws. Just make sure you're certain about doing it closer to the 50% range as at higher percents lighter characters might be able to tech the ground.

 

[Solfiner]

I do find Back Slash a bit useless, but lately I've been having a lot of fun with using it in mindgames. Like jumping up in the air, Back Slashing towards the pit, but reversing it in the last second. It's quite hilarious when it works.

 

[N7Kopper]

It's not, and won't ever be a mainstay. In singles.

I'm pretty sure that if you go deep enough with it against a roll it "crosses them up" and deals the added damage. Or maybe I'm mistaken.

No, you're right. It's very possible to jump over an opponent and then bash them with the Monado's hilt, getting the back attack critical. It takes rather ridiculous precision, though, and might not even be possible on every character. I only ever did it by sheer luck.

But, yeah. Back Slash in singles is relegated to punishes and mindgames. But doubles makes it a potent weapon, true to the Xenoblade spirit.

 

[L9999]

So which of this moves is the suckiest?
Back Slash, PK Flash or Ganon Punch?

 

[Claxus]

None are bad... They're just all situational. PK Flash can do some pretty good edgeguarding pressure, and if it hits, man does it hit. But it's pretty safe at least. Warlock Punch has some super armor frames now. With a good read, rest in peace. Heck, I'm pretty sure Ganon can take a Falcon Punch and not flinch if you time it right. So it's good as a counter of sorts, or reading some landings.

Backslash is the most reliable of all, though, because it's fairly fast and has great range. You can generally hit with it multiple times a match if you use it well, but it's not really going to be very rewarding unless you get the back hit, and it's also risky. Landing the back hits though, is much more situational and requires good prediction, but he has some good setups for it like B-throw or using it on an opponent above him or punishing landings from behind with it.