An Atheist's Perspective

[whaahppnd]

Why are atheists bent on "educating" people, and making them leave their religion? People like Richard Dawkins have even gone so far as to describe faith as one of the world's greatest evils. He compares it to the smallpox virus, but harder to eradicate.

Religious people are bent on spreading their beliefs because God told them to do so, and because they want to save people from hell. But what motivates atheists if we are all simply going to die anyway?

 

[RDK]

Why are atheists bent on "educating" people, and making them leave their religion? People like Richard Dawkins have even gone so far as to describe faith as one of the world's greatest evils. He compares it to the smallpox virus, but harder to eradicate.

Religious people are bent on spreading their beliefs because God told them to do so, and because they want to save people from hell. But what motivates atheists if we are all simply going to die anyway?

Maybe it pains us to see people devote their entire lives to a fallacy. I'd rather that people know the truth than walk around in ignorance. If we went by your line of logic, why even try to spread any truth at all? With that attitude, education is useless.

But Karl Marx was right in saying that religion is "the opiate of the people".

 

[Jam Stunna]

I've never seen an atheist standing in front of a grocery store handing out material or selling CDs like how I see Christians, and I've never seen an atheist with a building that can hold 5,000 people preaching their message, and I've never seen an atheist with a televised show, so I'm not sure where you find these atheists "educating" people.

Somewhat off-topic, but funny story: I was walking in front of said grocery store, when a young man walks up to me and says he wants to give me his free gospel CD. I say thanks, and then he asks if I would like to make a donation. I say that I don't have any money (I really didn't), and he says that I can't have the CD, and he actually took it back from me.

 

[SkylerOcon]

Somewhat off-topic, but funny story: I was walking in front of said grocery store, when a young man walks up to me and says he wants to give me his free gospel CD. I say thanks, and then he asks if I would like to make a donation. I say that I don't have any money (I really didn't), and he says that I can't have the CD, and he actually took it back from me.

That's... kinda sad.

Honestly, I have never see other atheists going around telling people what to do. If the topic brought up, they'll debate their point, but they won't go out of their way to tell people that they thing religion isn't right. I guess they understand that it's annoying when people bother them with stuff like that.

I don't preach atheism, and I've never seen another atheist preach it.

 

[RDK]

I've never seen an atheist standing in front of a grocery store handing out material or selling CDs like how I see Christians, and I've never seen an atheist with a building that can hold 5,000 people preaching their message, and I've never seen an atheist with a televised show, so I'm not sure where you find these atheists "educating" people.

Somewhat off-topic, but funny story: I was walking in front of said grocery store, when a young man walks up to me and says he wants to give me his free gospel CD. I say thanks, and then he asks if I would like to make a donation. I say that I don't have any money (I really didn't), and he says that I can't have the CD, and he actually took it back from me.

That's incredibly unfortunate, but it does reflect on most large churches today. What did you say to the guy?

That's... kinda sad.

Honestly, I have never see other atheists going around telling people what to do. If the topic brought up, they'll debate their point, but they won't go out of their way to tell people that they thing religion isn't right. I guess they understand that it's annoying when people bother them with stuff like that.

I don't preach atheism, and I've never seen another atheist preach it.

I don't go out of my way to tell people religion isn't right, but that is my opinion, and if it comes up in a conversation, that's what I'll tell people.

 

[Jam Stunna]

I just walked away. I was only taking it to be nice.

 

[AltF4]

I think that XKCD has said it best:

 

[Amide]

That cartoon is awfully candid, but oh so brilliant.

 

[whaahppnd]

Maybe it pains us to see people devote their entire lives to a fallacy. I'd rather that people know the truth than walk around in ignorance. If we went by your line of logic, why even try to spread any truth at all? With that attitude, education is useless.

That's exactly my point. What motivates you to spread "the truth"? We are all simply going to die anyway, so instead of having these debates, why not just let people live the lies that they are living? What is wrong with ignorance, terrorism, slavery?

And the big one: what is wrong with suicide? edit: (sorry if this is going off topic, leave this one out)

My point wasn't that atheists are going around preaching and giving out CD's like members of churches; it simply asks what their motivation is in improving humanity.

 

[blazedaces]

That's exactly my point. What motivates you to spread "the truth"? We are all simply going to die anyway, so instead of having these debates, why not just let people live the lies that they are living? What is wrong with ignorance, terrorism, slavery?

And the big one: what is wrong with suicide? edit: (sorry if this is going off topic, leave this one out)

My point wasn't that atheists are going around preaching and giving out CD's like members of churches; it simply asks what their motivation is in improving humanity.

Who cares if we're going to die? The fact that we're going to die is the only reason we want to improve the world. Our lives are everything we have, so why not try to make the best of our lives and the lives of others?

You see, we actually want to improve the world because we think it makes sense to do so, it actually is the "right" thing to do. The extremely religious just do it because "god" tells them to...

And the problem arises when according to their interpretation god is telling them to do what is obviously "wrong"...

-blazed

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Why are atheists bent on "educating" people, and making them leave their religion?

I don't see how people that groom 3 year olds into believing some book is any better.

People like Richard Dawkins have even gone so far as to describe faith as one of the world's greatest evils. He compares it to the smallpox virus, but harder to eradicate.

Some people have even gone so far as to describe homosexuality as one of the world's greatest evils, just because some book said it was. And anyway, Richard Dawkins always puts forward good debates, he does his research.

Religious people are bent on spreading their beliefs because God told them to do so, and because they want to save people from hell. But what motivates atheists if we are all simply going to die anyway?

I don't see how that gives someone the authority to do something like go into a school and preach to small children that they must believe this book or they're going to burn forever.

For me, personally, I don't really care what you believe, as long as you don't try to force it on other people, like almost every religion does. I would much rather try to live my life as best I can without having to go around thinking that being gay is as bad as killing someone.

 

[Crimson King]

There is a lot of reasons why atheist educate Christians. Christians take it upon themselves to indoctrinate their kids to fear evolution, to fear science, and to make uneducated decisions based on prayer. George W. Bush claims he was chosen by God, a lot of his voters PRAYED to god to decide who to vote for. This is such a dangerous trend of trusting NOTHING to decide president versus using political affiliations to make that decision.

 

[Moy]

Religious people are bent on spreading their beliefs because God told them to do so, and because they want to save people from hell. But what motivates atheists if we are all simply going to die anyway?

Since we only live one life, we should be willing to change the world for the better.

If you believe in "when you die, you go to heaven or hell", then you're either going to go one way or the other. If you believe that heaven is way better than hell, then which one would you want to end up in?

And if you believe in the Rapture, you never know how long you have until you're taken up into heaven anyway.

Atheists have the choice to believe in whatever they want, but Christians only want to help people go up the staircase, instead of down the elevator.

I hope that made sense.

 

[snex]

these responses have been somewhat silly.

the reason we want to educate people is because of the simple fact that their beliefs influence their actions and their actions affect us.

 

[Deleted member]

I think snex said it best. However you guys need to focus on Islam more these days. At its most orthodox, it's way scarier than Christianity

/doesn't have a problem with Christianity

 

[The Executive]

However you guys need to focus on Islam more these days. At its most orthodox, it's way scarier than Christianity

Saudi as arguably the most "orthodox" Islamic state is a very oppressive place. Just being over the causeway in Bahrain gave me chills...

 

[whaahppnd]

I think snex said it best. However you guys need to focus on Islam more these days. At its most orthodox, it's way scarier than Christianity
[/img]

Islam as a culture, or the way Arab states practice it might be "scarier" than Christianity. But as a religion, at its fundamentals, the Quran is pretty much no different from the Bible.

A lot of the "Sharia" law that exists in Saudi goes against the Quran.

Note to snex: Good answer =]

 

[RDK]

I think snex said it best. However you guys need to focus on Islam more these days. At its most orthodox, it's way scarier than Christianity

As with many religions, most of its problems lie within how you can interpret the source of their faith (Bible, Quran, etc.). That's why Christianity has a billion kajillion denominations--nobody can agree on anything.

However, that's beside the point. When presented with ample evidence, Christian shun their noses at scientific advancements, and their doctrine on both God and intelligent design are stuck in the Middle Ages. Which is funny, because my parents made it a point to tell me constantly that I had ignored sufficient evidence given by God (creation implies a Creator) and that I was just being stubborn at this point.

 

[whaahppnd]

Agreed (with first part), and imho Islam is heading towards the same path. Soon there will be many different sects (differing even more in the fundamentals)

 

[Byronman]

However, that's beside the point. When presented with ample evidence, Christian shun their noses at scientific advancements, and their doctrine on both God and intelligent design are stuck in the Middle Ages. Which is funny, because my parents made it a point to tell me constantly that I had ignored sufficient evidence given by God (creation implies a Creator) and that I was just being stubborn at this point.

You are stereotyping. Have you ever heard of Young Life?

And I agree with Whaahppnd (your name is hard to spell...) in that islam is not that different from Christianity at its roots.

 

[arrowhead]

You are stereotyping. Have you ever heard of Young Life?

no, he's generalizing

 

[Skywalker]

As with many religions, most of its problems lie within how you can interpret the source of their faith (Bible, Quran, etc.). That's why Christianity has a billion kajillion denominations--nobody can agree on anything.

It's not a matter of agreement but more of belief. Viirtually every Christian has the same values nailed to the ground... however it's a matter of how you use those values to live your daily life.

(I'm a Christian of no specific faith, mainly because I disagree with every major church out there.)

However, that's beside the point. When presented with ample evidence, Christian shun their noses at scientific advancements, and their doctrine on both God and intelligent design are stuck in the Middle Ages. Which is funny, because my parents made it a point to tell me constantly that I had ignored sufficient evidence given by God (creation implies a Creator) and that I was just being stubborn at this point.

No, most of us do not.

Scientifically it IS probable that a superior being exists. I'm not going to go into this as most of my knowledge comes from unpublished analysis, but search Google or something. It gives a bit of insight.

 

[AltF4]

Scientifically it IS probable that a superior being exists. I'm not going to go into this as most of my knowledge comes from unpublished analysis, but search Google or something. It gives a bit of insight.

Huh? That's news to me. Google can tell me why a "superior being" is "probable" to exist? The only "superior being" I've found on Google is Chuck Norris.

But this thread has already run its course. Someone asked a question, it was answered, end of story.

 

[Skywalker]

Huh? That's news to me. Google can tell me why a "superior being" is "probable" to exist? The only "superior being" I've found on Google is Chuck Norris.

Preferably Google Scholar.

And lol.

But this thread has already run its course. Someone asked a question, it was answered, end of story.

Agreed.

 

[riboflavinbob]

Religious people are bent on spreading their beliefs because God told them to do so, and because they want to save people from hell. But what motivates atheists if we are all simply going to die anyway?

Not much really... I'm a nihilist btw. We live because we, biologically at least, strive for the horomones that our brains precieve as happiness. Once you get past the fact that the only reason to live is only a mere chemical reaction in our skulls, you realize that your life is a waste of time and effort. Well... unless you're a thiest that is, then it's a much brighter story.

 

[Byronman]

Not much really... I'm a nihilist btw. We live because we, biologically at least, strive for the horomones that our brains precieve as happiness. Once you get past the fact that the only reason to live is only a mere chemical reaction in our skulls, you realize that your life is a waste of time and effort. Well... unless you're a thiest that is, then it's a much brighter story.

Nihilism? I never thought that of you. Then what motivates you to even get out of bed or go to school if you think life is a waste of time and effort?

 

[arrowhead]

probably the lack of desire for suffering

 

[snex]

Nihilism? I never thought that of you. Then what motivates you to even get out of bed or go to school if you think life is a waste of time and effort?

the desire to not live in one's parents' house forever. the core question of nihilism is not "why do things?" but "why not commit suicide?" if you can answer that one then youre set. if you cant, well, then youre no longer a nihilist because youre dead.

 

[blazedaces]

Not much really... I'm a nihilist btw. We live because we, biologically at least, strive for the horomones that our brains precieve as happiness. Once you get past the fact that the only reason to live is only a mere chemical reaction in our skulls, you realize that your life is a waste of time and effort.

Why is life a waste just because biology can be explained? Do you not feel happy regardless of being to explain why you feel happy?

-blazed

 

[yossarian22]

Let's derail this thread further shall we?

Not much really... I'm a nihilist btw. We live because we, biologically at least, strive for the horomones that our brains precieve as happiness. Once you get past the fact that the only reason to live is only a mere chemical reaction in our skulls, you realize that your life is a waste of time and effort. Well... unless you're a thiest that is, then it's a much brighter story.

I very much doubt that you are a nihilist, which has sadly because a useless buzzword replacement for atheistic existentialism, which, although similar, is very distinct from nihilism.

An existentialist argues that life lacks meaning (what you said). A nihilist would agree, but would also ontologically reject the notion of truth, both moral and otherwise. Essentially, nihilism is a fancy way of saying "It is true that there is no truth", which is about as idiotic as statements can get. A nihilist can kind of get away with this by saying that the axioms of logic are false and therefore cannot be applied, but that is just pointless justification, because nihilism suddenly finds itself unassertable.

The confusion is understandable as Nietzsche was a major part of both movements.

probably the lack of desire for suffering

That does not answer the point. Why should he care about suffering? Is it somehow bad for him? If so, it is arguable that he accepted a form of morality and is no longer nihilistic. Even an appeal to biology falls into this trapping, as there is no reason for him to follow his biological impulses. But nobody is ever really a nihilist while staring down the barrel of a gun.

 

[RDK]

That does not answer the point. Why should he care about suffering? Is it somehow bad for him? If so, it is arguable that he accepted a form of morality and is no longer nihilistic. Even an appeal to biology falls into this trapping, as there is no reason for him to follow his biological impulses. But nobody is ever really a nihilist while staring down the barrel of a gun.

Like Snex said, the question for nihilists is "Why not commit suicide?". The whole point of life having no meaning per se is sort of a paradox when it comes to nihilistic motivations, but the gist of it is that no action is logically preferable to any other in regard to the moral value of one action over another.

You don't have to attach moral value to something in order to strive to do it. In a nihilistic viewpoint, existence is essentially pointless, so instead of just saying "Why bother?" and committing suicide, you find something to live for.

 

[IWontGetOverTheDam]

There's nothing wrong with religion. It's when it becomes an orthodox extremist nutball factory that it becomes a problem.

 

[The 5th Horseman]

Religion: Something one believes in and follows devotedly. Basically atheism is a religion in itself. Just like Christianity, Buddhism, Ect. Just a different set of believes. I have also seen atheists preach there believes on other people (In these forums and people have come to my door, seen rallies, in front of stores, Ect). So if you look at it from a broad point of view, we are all the same.

 

[snex]

if atheism is a religion, then not collecting stamps is a hobby.

 

[The 5th Horseman]

if atheism is a religion, then not collecting stamps is a hobby.

Hobby: an activity or interest pursued for pleasure or relaxation and not as a main occupation. If people get pleasure off not collecting stamps then you're right.

 

[Aesir]

Hobby: an activity or interest pursued for pleasure or relaxation and not as a main occupation. If people get pleasure off not collecting stamps then you're right.

No because there's no activity involved in not collecting stamps, or interest only lack of interest in the hobby.

 

[RDK]

Religion: Something one believes in and follows devotedly. Basically atheism is a religion in itself. Just like Christianity, Buddhism, Ect. Just a different set of believes. I have also seen atheists preach there believes on other people (In these forums and people have come to my door, seen rallies, in front of stores, Ect). So if you look at it from a broad point of view, we are all the same.

I laughed.

 

[The Executive]

if atheism is a religion, then not collecting stamps is a hobby.

Can I sig this?

 

[Miller]

Let me ask the OP, What causes Christian's to spread 'the word'. All your asking us is why we want people to know the truth, but why do Christians want to spread lies? Answer that.

 

[RDK]

Let me ask the OP, What causes Christian's to spread 'the word'. All your asking us is why we want people to know the truth, but why do Christians want to spread lies? Answer that.

Most of them don't actually think that they're spreading lies. The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

Edit: What a terrible analogy to use when my purpose was to bash religion.