According to the rumors: Both Marth and Roy are endangered

[FieryRebirth]

Hello, I'm new here, I wanted to register to help clear up things regarding Ike in Brawl as well as other FE RD and PoR character appearances.

Now, despite their popularity overall in Melee, Marth and Roy might just be scrapped for the 'newer' FE characters if the series were to advertise the newer Fire Emblem games in someway and with the announcement of Ike being in Brawl gives us a clue: Are we going to have the possibly 3 playable characters of the Fire Emblem series in this title as either:


Micaiah http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDMicaiah.jpg - The female protagonist for about the first half of Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn and the series' first Mage hero unit if I recall. To be honest as a veteran FE player and Smasher I'd hate to see her in Brawl since I hated her as a unit in RD, sure she had great offensive abilities and resistances like most priests/bishops it's just the poor speed and defense is a real turn off but it was something new and can be easily ignored since Ike was a very broken Hero unit.. If she is in Brawl, I can see her as a magic-user like Zelda(Of course)or Mewtwo and practically never even throw punches or kicks

Sothe http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDSotheart.jpg - Micaiah's 'guardian' or 'boytoy'. He was introduced in PoR and is the 'super-unit' that aids your army surprisingly well for a Rogue(thief unit)early in RD. Recently confirmed in Japan that he's an AT and he was the only likely RD Playable character I had seen. It's disappointing to me, IMO.

Soren http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDSorenart.jpg - Apparently popular to most FE fans, he's Ike's best friend and one of the strongest magi in both PoR and RD, making him irreplaceable for FE fans with a brain. Him being in Brawl is about as unlikely as Micaiah but it's a possibility, again, I'm leaning toward 'no' because he's a squishy mage and is pictured as a regular unit in the games' story despite him being involved in numerous cut scenes.

I was brainstorming on what recent new FE character seemed worthy of the latest installment of Smash Bros. so the top 3 may actually have a chance of being a playable character. These characters have like a Zero percent chance of appearing, IMO:

Mist http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDMistart.jpg - Ike's sister and the one-and-only Cleric unit like most FE titles, Since there were no Troubadours in PoR and RD, she is promoted to the only Valkyrie unit in the game, riding a horse and wielding a sword as well as staves to aid her army. Overall, she is a healing unit and most likely confirms her unlikely appearance.

Mia http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDMiaart.jpg- The fanboy/girl-attracting female Myrmidon/Swordmaster with a happy-go-lucky attitude and bearing of heavy blood lust for a good one-on-one duel. She, like Soren, is one of the best Swordmasters in both PoR and RD, comparable to Zihark.. Seeing her in Brawl would be understandable because of all the fanboy/girls she has, it's ridiculous and is of course, a sword user which could make things even more unoriginal in Brawl as another FE character that uses a sword. If the game's playable character roster is truly based on the fan's desires, she may actually make an appearances either as an AT or playable character. Lyn has that AT spot though. Also like Soren, she is portrayed as a regular no-name mercenary/soldier in the official games.

Ranulf http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDRanulfart.jpg- A laguz unit with the ability to shift into a vicious cat form. He pretty much serves as Ike's best-laguz-friend. With a laid-back attitude, caring and somewhat cocky at the same time, he was a pretty good Laguz unit in PoR and not-so-much in RD. A character that can shift into a 'beast' form at certain intervals would be more interesting than that of Zelda/Sheik. Still hard to imagine as a playable character, perhaps as an AT at best.

I enjoyed RD a lot and I play the Fire Emblem games mainly for the challenging gameplay and not the story with that, that's the type of gamer I am, one who loves a good challenge and enjoys every bit of it. I know this topic has very little to do with Ike and mainly about the games he is in but again, I'm here to help clear up anything that seemed very likely/unlikely to happen. Thanks for reading and share your thoughts. I will post pictures of each listed character eventually for the curious/horny ones.

 

[Torchik]

First of all, welcome! ^_^

Second of all, this should've gone in the general character discussion since it's not about Ike. It's fine, though.

Third of all, I doubt that Roy is comming back. Marth might have a chance, though I would rather see more new characters. Very well thought out post, by the way! ^_^

 

[3D King]

Marth is Fire Emblem, well the closest one can get. He was the first, and he's got that DS remake in the works too. Besides that, he's insanely popular nearly everywhere (except here)

For Roy, sadly, it doesn't look so well...

 

[FieryRebirth]

Sorry, guess this was indeed the wrong kind of forum for this after all and thanks for the greeting.

 

[Torchik]

No, I'm sorry, I wasn't trying to be mean!! I was just letting you know for next time!

 

[Ike's Biggest Fan]

dude i would LOVE Ranulf for brawl. sadly, i can't really see Soren as a playable character. and if sothe is an assist trophy, i dont really thinnk he can be a character

 

[Torchik]

I can't see Soren either. Ranulf would be pretty cool.

 

[Deathparasol]

Soren http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/ShatteredCrystal/TemporaryFERDSorenart.jpg - Apparently popular to most FE fans, he's Ike's best friend and one of the strongest magi in both PoR and RD, making him irreplaceable for FE fans with a brain. Him being in Brawl is about as unlikely as Micaiah but it's a possibility, again, I'm leaning toward 'no' because he's a squishy mage and is pictured as a regular unit in the games' story despite him being involved in numerous cut scenes.

*strangled-sounding noise*

... I am wishing my friend never suggested this idea to me.

Oh yeah, good points too. Mia is the most popular non-important character, but that prolly doesn't help her that much.

The characters on the poll that appear in FE 9/10 were Ike, BK, Mia, and Soren, right? *goes to check*

Oh, and hi.

 

[T-major]

all those rumours are false. they were made up by random people looking for attention... word of advise; don't believe them, it just makes you look bad...

also theres no way in hell that Marth is out (Roy is though)... go to the Marth support thread, and read the main post; than come back and tell me that they would replace the most deserving FE character, with side characters from two out of TEN games. it's absolutely ridiculous to think that... even if you are new here, it should be common sense in the first place to any fire emblem fan...

 

[Hallowed Storm]

I don't think Marth would be out.
And I'd love to see Soren appear in Brawl. He's one of my most favorite people in Fire Emblem.

Sadly, I don't think Fire Emblem will have many representatives besides for Ike, (most likely) Marth, and (a very slight chance of) Micaiah.

 

[Rakath]

This can go either way (well, for Marth, Roy is screwed):

9/10 only: This would be more effective for SSE plot to consolodate the cast from Fire Emblem to 1 world, so they have some history already between 'em. Having 3-4 characters from one game makes sense. This leads to an easier split of classes (Lance: Nephenee, Axe: Boyd, Sword: Ike/Mia/Mist, Magic: Soren/Micaiah, Stave: Mist/Micaiah/Soren) by narrowing the view on games.

9/10 and 1/3/11 split: This covers the alpha and omega of the series. Some of Marth's friends, some of Ike's friends, hits everything. Marth is the most used lord in the series, Ike is second chair to him (tied with Leaf - nobody loves Leaf). This would cover a broader sense of the series by game, not by class. The most we can hope for weapon-wise: Sword, Lance (Sheeda from 1/3/11), Magic (Soren or Micaiah).

No evidence so far suggests either one more than another. Lyn being an AT slightly cuts it for 'broad coverage' but that doesn't mean 'broad coverage of playable characters'. Sothe is also out playable (which doesn't surprise me and can be used to argue for Micaiah) and that cuts it more towards FE9 and 10.

Not much to work with right now, I just hope Mia is playable. Or Naesala, he was never unfun to have. ^_^

 

[Hallowed Storm]

Naesala... or Tibarn... would be crazy to play as. It would really add a new perspective to Brawling, don't you think?

9/10 and 1/3/11 split: This covers the alpha and omega of the series. Some of Marth's friends, some of Ike's friends, hits everything. Marth is the most used lord in the series, Ike is second chair to him (tied with Leaf - nobody loves Leaf). This would cover a broader sense of the series by game, not by class.

This is a good way of what I think will happen... in a way. Marth is the alpha, Ike is the omega. There could be one or two other Fire Emblem representatives in with them, but they would have to be people like Soren or Micaiah (characters in a game with Ike in it).

 

[Deathparasol]

Some people were suggesting the laguz royals (plus Ranulf) on this one Japanese predictions site.

Again, hope that Sakurai gave more consideration to FE.... because it is awesome like that.

 

[fire_wulf]

I am so hoping for a Laguz character... down B to shift but can only maintain for a little while... think stamina meter for Pokemon Trainer and then wait again until can change again... I really like that idea..

Hopefully they thought of the same thing

 

[NeoZ]

Sothe has been confirmed as an AT, and leaving Marth out is like taking Mario out and putting Bowser Jr. in.

 

[Rakath]

Sothe has been confirmed as an AT, and leaving Marth out is like taking Mario out and putting Bowser Jr. in.

That's a really bad analogy. Marth is not a requirement for the series (He's big, but not important). A much more apt saying would be 'its like taking out Ness for Lucas' which could happen, and even then we've seen lots of people wanting Ness back, like wanting Marth back.

Marth could go either way, it depends on the direction we take Fire Emblem's cast.

 

[FieryRebirth]

I'm a definite Marth user in Melee and discovered his true potential to be worthy as my main alone, not from popular opinion in tourneys. I used to use Jigglypuff beforehand so I too, do not want to even see Marth stepping out of Brawl but wouldn't it be a bit strange that:

Both Ike and Marth are sword users with a set of similar special attacks right now(Actually, his Neutral B and Down B are the only specials that are similar to both Marth and Roy's). Didn't Sakurai say he was cutting out the cloned characters and possibly giving some 'clone' characters their own movesets?

 

[Rakath]

First off: Fire Emblem character movements in Brawl are entirely and totally made up by the Brawl team for Melee, Marth and Roy are both from games without the Skill Learning mechanic that FE4/9/10 (and I think 5) all had. So rightly there is no basis to pull moves but the imaginations of the design team.

Ike has two moves that are references from Fire Emblem 9 (Aether was his Mastery Skill, His Forward Special is similar to Ike's one strike critical animation as a Ranger). Counter and a Chargable B could be the shared mechanics (like the idea that Mario and Luigi will only share Super Jump Punch and Fireball when Brawl is out, if Luigi makes it). So that similarity doesn't mean anything to Marth or Roy's return or lack of return.

Moveset changes and mechanics to the Smash Bros series do not threaten Marth or Roy. The only threats to their return is the standing of Fire Emblem games and where Brawl puts its focus. Roy, quite frankly, as a FE Lord, sucked. His stats sucked, his growths sucked, his sword was made of godliness and epic, but Roy as a unit was USELESS. Also the GBA games are less than loved in Japan. Marth... also sucked as a unit, not like Roy, but he wasn't a picnic to work with. However neither point matters either. If Sakurai sticks with FE9-10 as the game basis, giving Marth's movements to Mist (or splitting them between two characters like Mist and Mia), cutting Roy, and adding Soren or Micaiah, it makes sense to lose Marth to stick with 'one world'. Making Mist to Marth a Lucas to Ness relationship.

The opposite path keeps Marth, adding another character from Akaneia (1/3/11), adding another character from Tellius (9/10).

And the oddball path is to put in two more Tellius characters and keep Marth. Which is what Zelda Series could end up with (TP Link, Zelda, and Ganondorf... but Shiek from OoT and Wind Waker Link are there too).

Can't be certain of anything yet, I want the choice that gives Mist and Mia the best chances for the game.

 

[FieryRebirth]

Indeed, Marth and Roy's movesets were pulled out of their butts but they did have a nice FE feel to it so Sakurai knows what he's doing if he intended to put about 3 FE playable characters and so far only one is a newcomer and one is looking to see the light of Brawl, that leaves one vacant FE playable spot open.

Now, when Ike's specials were announced, I was mighty disappointed on how the glorious eye-candy his Aether skill was in the latest FE titles was his Up B and crappy-by-how-things-look so far. Great Aether, his FS was surely made up but Sakurai certainly knew about the Aether skill in FE 9 and 10 but I guess he wasn't feeling on adding something more unique to Ike and his move sets. This being the case so far, and we actually get a new playable character may they be from 9 or 10 or even the much older games.

Expect a lot of pulled-out-of-their-*** movesets. I can't argue though, the limited playability and animations in FE games as the series is a RPS(Role-playing strategy...I think that's it)would cause any character appearances in other games to have movesets that were not seen in their game(s).

 

[Rakath]

Well, these are the caracters that can easily have movesets made for them:

Athos (Anima Mage - Using the 3 types of Anima)
Soren (Wind Mage - Just limiting to the Wind Magic animations and the one from the End of Part 2 cutscene)
Micaiah (Light Mage - Using various Light Animations, there were enough Corona used as well. And Yune as an FS)
Mia (Swordmaster - Dancing Blade and Dolphin Slash would both be suited for putting on a Swordmaster as Astra and Swordmaster Critical respectively. In addition the Swordmaster Critical/Promoted Lyn criticals from GBA era would be a beautiful FS)
Mist (RD Cleric - Proper Balancing of Florete's Ranged properties, Stave use, and probably Shield Breaker. Sol wouldn't be a bad FS choice, but knowing its PoR/RD effect it'd probably lose the healing and be Shield Breaker's new name.)
Nephenee/Sheeda (Soldier/Lance weilding Knight sans Pegasus - Lanceset using spinning the Lance and possibly a Javelin move. Defeat would fit split between a regular Special and a recovery special.)

Sadly our only Bow weilding unit of possible use was Lyn post-promote. An Axe unit would probably play like Brawl Ike.

You can definitly give them all unique movesets so long as we don't do 4 swordsman of the repetitiveness.

 

[True Fool]

Newer FE characters? Marth is still a current FE character, he's in FE11, this makes him current.

Smash isn't about what's current anyway. Retro characters aren't put in because they're in games that people might want to buy. We haven't gotten any news about a new StarFox, or Pikmin game(at least I don't think we have), and they're in. This isn't Super Advertisement Brothers Brawl.

Micaiah might make it, but only because she is a main character, she would make a unique character, and technically isn't from the same game as another FE character already in Smash.

If any supporting characters stand a chance in Smash, they won't be from FE9-10. Those characters are not popular or memorable by most FE fans when compared to others. Any secondary FE character will be from FE1/3, or 4, these are the games that original fans remember, and supporting characters are for the fans, and Japan beats us by miles in FE fanbase.

 

[Rakath]

Newer FE characters? Marth is still a current FE character, he's in FE11, this makes him current.

Smash isn't about what's current anyway. Retro characters aren't put in because they're in games that people might want to buy. We haven't gotten any news about a new StarFox, or Pikmin game(at least I don't think we have), and they're in. This isn't Super Advertisement Brothers Brawl.

Micaiah might make it, but only because she is a main character, she would make a unique character, and technically isn't from the same game as another FE character already in Smash.

If any supporting characters stand a chance in Smash, they won't be from FE9-10. Those characters are not popular or memorable by most FE fans when compared to others. Any secondary FE character will be from FE1/3, or 4, these are the games that original fans remember, and supporting characters are for the fans, and Japan beats us by miles in FE fanbase.

1. Nobody has said Marth isn't current, the only reason he's at question is if they decide to (like with Zelda) consolodate the cast to one world (9-10). And even than it might just mean an uneven split of the series (2-3 FE9 characters and Marth).

2. Smash is a mix of both current and remembered. HOWEVER, Smash and popular characters in it either reignites a series, or brings new fanbase to a series. Fire Emblem is the EXAMPLE AND RULE for this. Without Melee Fire Emblem wouldn't be stateside. Without Melee, I think FE6's sales would of been worse too.

3. Micaiah is technically in a game with an existing Brawl character, unless you're trying to argue FE9 and FE10 are in no way related and its coincidence both games have a blue haired swordfighter named Ike with a sister named Mist who is skilled in Staves, dead father named Greil who was originally known as Gawain and was killed by the Black Knight. However this does not exclude or win her instant acceptance.

4. Japan does outweigh in the character selection process (note: Sakurai List has more cast from 1 and 9 than it does from 4), however Sakurai does know the US exists, and does pick a cast to please both. Picking a character from FE4 does NOTHING for the series as much as picking cast from Tellius or Akaneia. Akaneia for FE11 sales bolstering, Tellius as the latest released series. Heck, Sigurd was the only character from FE4 that had a moveset Sakurai noted on his list. The rest of the suggestions were FE1 and FE9. Discounting FE9 because its new is rightly unwise. Since apparently the Japanese fans that wrote in wrote in for FE1 and 9 (and Sigurd).

5. Mia and Mist are cuter than Marth, and that's the only real reason I want them in over him. And they both have better hair than him (Roy has better hair than Marth too), and Mist has a direct connection to a character in Brawl. However my picks are pretty much pure fanboyism.

 

[Torchik]

Wow, I completely agree with Rakath with that last post. Mist and Mia would be awesome! Mia would be like Zamus with a sword and Mist, with Florete, would be awesome. I wouldn't mind seeing Nephenee either, she's cool.

 

[FieryRebirth]

5. Mia and Mist are cuter than Marth, and that's the only real reason I want them in over him. And they both have better hair than him (Roy has better hair than Marth too), and Mist has a direct connection to a character in Brawl. However my picks are pretty much pure fanboyism.

Saying that two female characters is 'cuter' than a male character is definite fanboy-ism, I may suggest you start dating in RL before you get on anyone's nerves, that's my advice. But you're just being honest I guess.

I figured Marth was endangered on appearing in this title because if Sakurai wanted to advertise a FE title again(see, "Roy"), he may do so for the newer FEs. Marth is popular in tourneys and tourneys alone, he was a semi-broken 1v1 character in Melee(Don't get me wrong, I would still love to see him in Smash again). Those characters I listed were popular picks and an analysis of their chances on appearing in the title.

Which reminds me, was there any sort of poll in Japan that Sakurai may have looked over and listed any FE characters that have yet to be announced, besides Sigurd? Knowing the poll choices were, we may have our first speculation/rumor.

 

[Rakath]

By the by, no business of yours, I have a girlfriend, its a tad complicated a relationship. In addition, I played as Roy instead of Marth because Roy had better hair and a cooler outfit, so my vanity in gaming does affect my judgement a lot of the time. ^_^

Sakurai did make mention of ideas that interested him for characters to be in Brawl:

Sheeda (FE 1/3)
Jeigan (FE 1/3)
Oguma (FE 1/3, he was mentioned twice)
The identical Axe Twins (FE 1/3, I always forget the names of these two)
Nabaru (FE 1/3?)
Sigurd (FE4)
Mia (FE9)
Soren (FE9)
The Black Knight (FE9)
Ike (FE9 - FOUR TIMES)

My Fanboyness aside, both Mia and Mist have something backing them up as characters. Mist (in 9/10) is a pretty important character without being a lord, having a unique class, unique weapon, and lots of dialog. Mia has the fact that people like her, and her class (no unique weapon for her, unique class, or lots of dialog).

Marth returning would give him Roy's position as 'advertisement for the next Fire Emblem game'. As the next game to release is 11 (which is a DS remake of Fire Emblem 1). However discounting this view of the games, it'd be very easy to fill up the roster for Fire Emblem (to 3-4 characters) out off just FE9 and 10. I kinda hope for the main FE to be shown as the GCN/Wii era crew, as I do really like the plot and cast. However so long as we get 3-4 FE characters, without all being Swordarms, I'm cool with it.

 

[FieryRebirth]

I sincerely doubt Mist is coming in, I forgot to mention that she was also one of the most annoying characters to most FE players especially because of her VA in both PoR and RD. Either way, no matter how much you like her she isn't gonna appear, just have to put thought into it, she just isn't popular enough.

Wait wait, Ike and other characters were mentioned multiple times you say, huh? There were no official polls?

 

[Dark Sonic]

First. Read this http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=123714

WARNING! WALL OF TEXT APPROACHING!! PREPARE FOR A WALL OF PAIN!!!

Indeed, Marth and Roy's movesets were pulled out of their butts but they did have a nice FE feel to it so Sakurai knows what he's doing if he intended to put about 3 FE playable characters and so far only one is a newcomer and one is looking to see the light of Brawl, that leaves one vacant FE playable spot open.

Marth and Roy sucked in their games. Ike was fast in PoR and medium speed in RD. Ike and Roy also had ranged attacks. Sakurai completely made up their movesets having almost no references to the actual games. Ike gets a whopping 2 moves from his games while Marth and Roy got none. That "Fire Emblem" feel is simply a well thought out moveset that fits the graceful swordsman Japanese steryotype. Marth just happens to fit that stereotype very well, and with his game being so succesful, they stuck with it for the rest of the FE games (except for Ike).

Now, when Ike's specials were announced, I was mighty disappointed on how the glorious eye-candy his Aether skill was in the latest FE titles was his Up B and crappy-by-how-things-look so far. Great Aether, his FS was surely made up but Sakurai certainly knew about the Aether skill in FE 9 and 10 but I guess he wasn't feeling on adding something more unique to Ike and his move sets. This being the case so far, and we actually get a new playable character may they be from 9 or 10 or even the much older games.

Ike's moveset really doesn't affect the chances of anyone you've mentioned. It affects the Black Knight simply because the most logical style for BK was already used, but for eveyone else you listed it really doesn't matter. Sakruai was always "aware" of the game mechanics, because he actually used their individual Legendary weapons. Whether or not he chose to expand on the features of these games is irrelevant.

I figured Marth was endangered on appearing in this title because if Sakurai wanted to advertise a FE title again(see, "Roy"), he may do so for the newer FEs. Marth is popular in tourneys and tourneys alone, he was a semi-broken 1v1 character in Melee(Don't get me wrong, I would still love to see him in Smash again). Those characters I listed were popular picks and an analysis of their chances on appearing in the title.

Guess what the upcomming FE game is that would use that advertising. MARTH's GAME. And do you really think Marth is only popular because of his high tier status. A sequel to his first game, a remake of his game that's over 10 years old, and an anime starring him all be to differ. Sakurai also doesn't seem to pay much attention to tiers anyway, since he actually buffed the 5th best character in the game (Peach). And while those characters are popular in FE9 and 10 (Mist, Ranulf, ect.) their popularity pales in comparison to Marth and Sigurd, who also have a lot more going for them because they're actually the main characters of their games.

I'm a definite Marth user in Melee and discovered his true potential to be worthy as my main alone, not from popular opinion in tourneys. I used to use Jigglypuff beforehand so I too, do not want to even see Marth stepping out of Brawl but wouldn't it be a bit strange that:

Both Ike and Marth are sword users with a set of similar special attacks right now(Actually, his Neutral B and Down B are the only specials that are similar to both Marth and Roy's). Didn't Sakurai say he was cutting out the cloned characters and possibly giving some 'clone' characters their own movesets?

Having two moves in common makes them clones? And eruption isn't like the shield breaker anyway, animation or physics wise. Ike does have his own unique moveset. He's a slow and heavy swordfighter, almost as if he were designed in direct contrast to Marth. The only reason that people even suggest that they're clones is because they just can't get past the fact that they have blue hair. Over half of the FE lords have blue hair, so it's really not that suprising that they have that in common. However, the rest of their outfit (and even the hair style itself) is different Ike has a more raggedy outfit, Spikey hair, a head band, and what looks like half of a chestplate. Marth's guantlets are different from Ike's, Marth actually carries a sheath for his sword (which is much slimmer than Ike's), Marth is dressed in fine silk, he's wearing the Tiara his sister gave him before she died, and his belt and full chestplate each have a jewel embeded in them. Seriously, they don't look alike.

By the by, no business of yours, I have a girlfriend, its a tad complicated a relationship. In addition, I played as Roy instead of Marth because Roy had better hair and a cooler outfit, so my vanity in gaming does affect my judgement a lot of the time. ^_^

Sakurai did make mention of ideas that interested him for characters to be in Brawl:

Sheeda (FE 1/3)
Jeigan (FE 1/3)
Oguma (FE 1/3, he was mentioned twice)
The identical Axe Twins (FE 1/3, I always forget the names of these two)
Nabaru (FE 1/3?)
Sigurd (FE4)
Mia (FE9)
Soren (FE9)
The Black Knight (FE9)
Ike (FE9 - FOUR TIMES)

My Fanboyness aside, both Mia and Mist have something backing them up as characters. Mist (in 9/10) is a pretty important character without being a lord, having a unique class, unique weapon, and lots of dialog. Mia has the fact that people like her, and her class (no unique weapon for her, unique class, or lots of dialog).

Mist certainly did not have lots of dialogue in FE10. She rarely said anything at all and you never had to take her with you. They even removed the need to use her premotion item in the NA version of RD. She does have a personal class, but so does Volke, and he's certainly not important in RD. Edward, Nolan, and Leonardo also have personal weapons, but you didn't mention them.

Marth returning would give him Roy's position as 'advertisement for the next Fire Emblem game'. As the next game to release is 11 (which is a DS remake of Fire Emblem 1). However discounting this view of the games, it'd be very easy to fill up the roster for Fire Emblem (to 3-4 characters) out off just FE9 and 10. I kinda hope for the main FE to be shown as the GCN/Wii era crew, as I do really like the plot and cast. However so long as we get 3-4 FE characters, without all being Swordarms, I'm cool with it.

Being both the oldest and the newest Lord at the same time is somehow bad? And what do you mean, discounting this view of the games? While you could fill up the roster with only FE9-10 characters, you could also fill it up with FE1&3 characters, so I don't really see your point here. That could also be seen as the NES-SNES era crew, which has a lot more nostalgia to back it up. Japan likes Marth's cast and plot too you know.

1. Nobody has said Marth isn't current, the only reason he's at question is if they decide to (like with Zelda) consolidate the cast to one world (9-10). And even than it might just mean an uneven split of the series (2-3 FE9 characters and Marth)

The problem with only representing one world is that, unlike Zelda, the characters change in every world. FE doesn't have one character (besides Marth) that keeps coming back and can be considered important to the series. In LoZ the words may chage, but the main characters remain the same. For FE every world has a new "main" character. So for FE, you have to take it a step further and see which reps out of these "main characters" from each game should get in. You figure that out based on the game's popularity, recentness, and sales. In that respect, the only FEs that can really compete are FE1 &3, FE4, and FE9 &10. Then we just pick the most important characters (story wise) from those games and compare their roles and popularity. The two most important characters from Marth's games are Marth and Sheeda. I would include Sheeda in the competition, but she's not a lord and doesn't have a personal weapon. If the wind lance turns out to be Sheeda only in the remake then I'll reconsider. The two most important characters from Sigurd's game are Sigurd and Celice. For Ike's games it's arguable, but most people will agree that Ike is the most important in both games, and that Micaiah is second most important in RD. Now that we have our pool of important characters, we pick the top 3 or 4 most popular, recent, unique, important, ect characters from that bunch. Marth wins every category except uniqueness, which obviously goes to our magic user. Ike gets second in everything Marth won, and ties with Marth for uniqueness. Sigurd gets third for popularity, 4th for recentcy, 4th for uniqueness, and 4th for series importance (He's only important for the first half of his game). Micaiah gets 4th for popularity (her game hasn't sold that well either), ties with Ike for recentcy (same game, duh), 1st for uniqueness, and 3th for series importance (is important for a little over half of her game). So the order of deserving candidates pans out like this.

Marth- won 3 out of 4 categories
Ike-2nd in 2 out of 4 categories and tied in another
Micaiah-1st in 1, tied for 2nd in 1, 3rd in 1, 4th in 1
Sigurd-3rd in 1, 4th in 3.

The top 3 are Marth, Ike, and Micaiah, and that's who I think will get in.

2. Smash is a mix of both current and remembered. HOWEVER, Smash and popular characters in it either reignites a series, or brings new fan base to a series. Fire Emblem is the EXAMPLE AND RULE for this. Without Melee Fire Emblem wouldn't be stateside. Without Melee, I think FE6's sales would of been worse too.

It may not have gotten popular as quickly but it’s a brilliantly designed game that would eventually catch on anyway

3. Micaiah is technically in a game with an existing Brawl character, unless you're trying to argue FE9 and FE10 are in no way related and its coincidence both games have a blue haired swordfighter named Ike with a sister named Mist who is skilled in Staves, dead father named Greil who was originally known as Gawain and was killed by the Black Knight. However this does not exclude or win her instant acceptance.

True. It has no impact on any of their inclusions whatsoever

4. Japan does outweigh in the character selection process (note: Sakurai List has more cast from 1 and 9 than it does from 4), however Sakurai does know the US exists, and does pick a cast to please both. Picking a character from FE4 does NOTHING for the series as much as picking cast from Tellius or Akaneia. Akaneia for FE11 sales bolstering, Tellius as the latest released series. Heck, Sigurd was the only character from FE4 that had a moveset Sakurai noted on his list. The rest of the suggestions were FE1 and FE9. Discounting FE9 because its new is rightly unwise. Since apparently the Japanese fans that wrote in wrote in for FE1 and 9 (and Sigurd).

But you do realize that FE9 and 10 are the only internationally accepted FE games, right? Most FE fans are aware of the fact that the majority of the games are Japanese only, and are perfectly fine with including Japanese only FE characters. FE4 is also one of the best selling games of the series. Sigurd has definitely had more of an impact than some of those lesser characters you mentioned. The fact that his game is even remembered right now can testify to that.

5. Mia and Mist are cuter than Marth, and that's the only real reason I want them in over him. And they both have better hair than him (Roy has better hair than Marth too), and Mist has a direct connection to a character in Brawl. However my picks are pretty much pure fanboyism.

That’s personal preference, so there’s really no way to argue about it. I personally like Marth’s hair more than theirs. And Mist is also not that important to the story. She’s Ike’s sister, but she rarely has any dialogue and you’re never required to bring her with you.


Whew. That took a while.

 

[Torchik]

Yeah, I don't think Mist is gonna make the cut, although I would be very happy if she did. Mia definetely has a chance and I think Nephenee would make a good Brawler. Too bad she's such a minor character...

>.> Wow, Sonic, how long did that take to type? I support Erika as a playable character for Brawl! ^_^ *hides behind flame shield*

 

[Rakath]

To Fiery Rebirth:

In the main section there's the "Characters on Sakurai's Poll" sticky, the first post lists all the characters Sakurai mentioned that he had interesting suggestions for. I went there and cut it to just the FE cast. These were character suggestions made by fans via the email set-up on the old Brawl site a few years ago. Sakurai kept the fans up to date when he read interesting things. This was all done in Japan and America had little say in the matter. So these characters had interesting ideas suggested for them (which is why I have some glimmer of hope for Mia).

This list also has most of the confirmed cast on there (excluding the E3 reveals, Pokemon Trainer is the only new character NOT on the Poll). Sonic won the vote drive and Dedede (5), Ike (4), Diddy Kong (4), Captain Olimar (3), and Lucas (2) all appear on it. Now, there are a lot of characters on there, and there is no way all of them will be in Brawl, but as a way to narrow down the FE universe from the HUNDREDS of cast down to 2 game worlds and a handful of characters, its kind of useful.

The cast split is from 1 and 9 mostly, with Sigurd being the errant FE4 character. So I'd put the priority for more FE1 and 9 cast before FE4 and the GBA eras.

To Sonic Wave:

The opening cast of FE9 (read: Greil Mercs)
Swordweilder x2 (Ike and Mia)
Axeweilder (Titania is importantish)
Wind Mage (Soren is important)
Cleric (Mist DOES have dialog and is a character who has a fake death for a good part of FE10)

Opening cast of FE10 (Dawn Brigade)
Light Mage
Rogue
- While not important late game, they are kinda needed early game -
Axeweilder
Swordweilder
Archer

Opening cast of FE1
A large number of Sword + Lance weilders.
The Axe twins (listing everyone that Sakurai listed)

Since every FE game has tons of additional cast that join with limited dialog, restricting it to the 'main cast' shows that FE9/10 has variety (as well as numbers technically).

Mist is plot important for 9 and 10, if she had a real actual death in those games that wasn't just 'unable to fight' the games would end badly. However her chances are slim, as nobody quite likes her as much as me and Torchik.

Also, when I said 'ignoring the games' I mean to look at picking a cast covering the broadest ammount of Fire Emblem classes. The only way two sword units would work is if they represented "Mercenary/Hero" and "Myrmidon/Swordmaster". The original split of the Swordman classes. Which using Lords would best be done with Ike and Lyn.

 

[Dark Sonic]

Why would you give Mia and Soren priority over Sigurd? Sigurd is a lord and they are not. Plain and simple. Not only that, but even if we did get 4 slots, Mia's far from our #1 candidate. In case you haven't noticed, popularity is not the only thing to consider when picking who gets in, and that is the only thing Mia has going for her. Did you read my post?

 

[Torchik]

Erika was a lord...She may not have been popular, but she was a lord AND a female representative! She has a chance. Mia, yeah, I doubt she'll make it, but who knows?

 

[Rakath]

Why would you give Mia and Soren priority over Sigurd? Sigurd is a lord and they are not. Plain and simple. Not only that, but even if we did get 4 slots, Mia's far from our #1 candidate. In case you haven't noticed, popularity is not the only thing to consider when picking who gets in, and that is the only thing Mia has going for her. Did you read my post?

I'd certainly give Soren priority of Sigurd. For the same reason I no longer support Black Knight in Brawl. Ike (Brawl Ike, and RD Ike somewhat) and Sigurd are two of a kind. Slow and powerhouse Swordsman are not needed in grand numbers. Certainly, Sigurd could be made weak and agile, but if we do that we might as well have Marth/Celice/Eliwood/Roy/Eirika instead. I'd also give Sheeda priority over Sigurd. And if Marth returns I give EVERYONE priority over Sigurd.

Mia... Mia is a personal preference for me, and I look at it like this. If there were only 3 FE reps, I know she's not making it, if there were four reps, she's still only a 50-50 shot, and if there were five reps, I'm love it if she made it. But no, I don't prioritize her over any Lord except the Lords of 2 and 5-8.

I did read your post, however I was writing mine as you were posting yours. The thing is that I see a few ways for the FE cast to play out in Brawl. Some have room for Mia, others don't. You seem to think that by default, there is no way that Sakurai would make it all FE9/10 cast. When really there is nothing stopping it either.

Ike, Mist, Soren (or Micaiah), Titania (or Greil)
Ike, Mia, Soren, Micaiah
Ike, Micaiah, Marth, Sheeda
Ike, Soren, Greil, Marth (or Sigurd)
Ike, Mist, Micaiah
Ike, Marth, Micaiah

I have no problem with any of these happening, certainly the Mia list I wish for a bit more, but so long as more diversity is given to the series I'm fine with it. The only things I'd dislike are lists like:

Ike, Sigurd, Marth, Roy
Ike, Black Knight, Marth, Sigurd
Ike, Marth, Sigurd, Celice, Eirika, Eliwood, Roy, Mist, Mia, Elincia, Oguma, Sheeda with a Sword moveset, Raven, Harken... *continues listing Sword weilding units in FE games for a while*

Do I support Mia, yes. Do I wish Mia in Brawl, yes. Do I like Mia as a character, yes from her Supports in 9. Am I an idiot, Not especially. Does Mia stand a chance, More than Eirika, Eliwood, Leaf, and the entire cast of FE2.

 

[FieryRebirth]

To Fiery Rebirth:

In the main section there's the "Characters on Sakurai's Poll" sticky, the first post lists all the characters Sakurai mentioned that he had interesting suggestions for. I went there and cut it to just the FE cast. These were character suggestions made by fans via the email set-up on the old Brawl site a few years ago. Sakurai kept the fans up to date when he read interesting things. This was all done in Japan and America had little say in the matter. So these characters had interesting ideas suggested for them (which is why I have some glimmer of hope for Mia).

This list also has most of the confirmed cast on there (excluding the E3 reveals, Pokemon Trainer is the only new character NOT on the Poll). Sonic won the vote drive and Dedede (5), Ike (4), Diddy Kong (4), Captain Olimar (3), and Lucas (2) all appear on it. Now, there are a lot of characters on there, and there is no way all of them will be in Brawl, but as a way to narrow down the FE universe from the HUNDREDS of cast down to 2 game worlds and a handful of characters, its kind of useful.

The cast split is from 1 and 9 mostly, with Sigurd being the errant FE4 character. So I'd put the priority for more FE1 and 9 cast before FE4 and the GBA eras.

Wow, that's interesting, VERY interesting. Thank you very much for this information.

 

[Wing-Zero]

i want mia

 

[pyroroth]

I think a polearm user like nephenee would be cool and unique

 

[Dark Sonic]

I'd certainly give Soren priority of Sigurd. For the same reason I no longer support Black Knight in Brawl. Ike (Brawl Ike, and RD Ike somewhat) and Sigurd are two of a kind. Slow and powerhouse Swordsman are not needed in grand numbers. Certainly, Sigurd could be made weak and agile, but if we do that we might as well have Marth/Celice/Eliwood/Roy/Eirika instead. I'd also give Sheeda priority over Sigurd. And if Marth returns I give EVERYONE priority over Sigurd.

What I'm saying is that character importance should be considered first and foremost. Followed by character popularity, and then lastly diversity. By those conditions, any non-lord character is taken out in the first step (there are very few exceptions here). The second step cuts any characters from disliked games (all the GBA lords and FE2). The third step is kinda tricky, because it depends on who's left from the first two steps (which have already cut any non-lord/non popular characters)

I did read your post, however I was writing mine as you were posting yours. The thing is that I see a few ways for the FE cast to play out in Brawl. Some have room for Mia, others don't. You seem to think that by default, there is no way that Sakurai would make it all FE9/10 cast. When really there is nothing stopping it either.

True. There's also nothing stopping him from putting in 10 Mario characters. I'm going with what is the most likely scenerio and saying that Sakurai will do his best to represent the FE franchise and please as many fasns as possible. For FE, that means representing more than one world. Cutting Marth in favor of Mist/Titania/any other character would be a giant middle finger to almost all Japanese fans, as well as many American ones. By the same token, even though I think Sigurd deserves to be in, I think it's just not going to happen because of Marth and Ike also being in. Putting in three, male, blue haired swordsmen to represent FE would be a bad way to represent the series as a whole. That's why I'm hoping he can find some kind of creative middle ground.

Ike, Mist, Soren (or Micaiah), Titania (or Greil)
Ike, Mia, Soren, Micaiah
Ike, Mist, Micaiah

Once again, I don't think limiting yourself to one world would be a fair way to represent the series. Sure, those choices have a lot of moveset potential, but the characters themselves arent' anything special in the grand scheme of things. They're just your average support characters, no better than Jeigan/Marcus/Seth. Not only that, but even within that world you're leaving out more important characters. What about Tibarn, Sanaki, Elincia, Ranulf, ect.

Ike, Micaiah, Marth, Sheeda
Ike, Soren, Greil, Marth (or Sigurd)
Ike, Marth, Micaiah

Why Greil? Sure, he's got a decent impact on the story, but... he died.

I have no problem with any of these happening, certainly the Mia list I wish for a bit more, but so long as more diversity is given to the series I'm fine with it. The only things I'd dislike are lists like:

Ike, Sigurd, Marth, Roy
Ike, Black Knight, Marth, Sigurd
Ike, Marth, Sigurd, Celice, Eirika, Eliwood, Roy, Mist, Mia, Elincia, Oguma, Sheeda with a Sword moveset, Raven, Harken... *continues listing Sword weilding units in FE games for a while*

I can see why you wouldn't want so many sword users, but the uniqueness of the character should play second seat to the actual importance of the character to the FE series. I want to represent the Fire Emblem series, not the land of Tellius.

Do I support Mia, yes. Do I wish Mia in Brawl, yes. Do I like Mia as a character, yes from her Supports in 9. Am I an idiot, Not especially. Does Mia stand a chance, More than Eirika, Eliwood, Leaf, and the entire cast of FE2.

That isn't really saying much. A lot of characters beat out those guys.

 

[Rakath]

Here's the cool thing about importance:
Marth (3 Games)
Ike and Leaf (2 Games)
Micaiah, and every Lord other than Sigurd (1 game)
Sigurd (Not even the whole game)

Sigurd isn't the main Lord for his game, his standing is PURELY popularity (because before Ike he was the best stat'd FE Lord, his statset was AMAZING, but besides that he dies). If we follow Importance, Popularity, Diversity Sigurd fails in the first and third, then only the second one remains. Soren (for FE9 and 10) has amazing importance, enough popularity to get by, and certainly holds the Diverse aspect.

Greil is the only Polearm user (this is only from FE9 cutscenes, as Urvan was made a shorter pole in 10) I could think of with a lick of importance other than Sheeda and Ephraim, he's plot important and directly connected to Ike. It was just that Titania wasn't unique with a weapon or Polearm. In the Unused Greil playable data Urvan looked AMAZING.

See, in FE most characters are not that important (except for certain two Blue Haired sword users with two games to their importance) in the long run. In their game they are important, and certain games brought great mechanics (FE4/9/10 skills, God I love skills). However, in the long run, you can play half the FE games and not be missing much from the other half. So for Fire Emblem itself, I put Diversity as first, then Importance and Popularity to scale out. As while Erk would be diverse, he's from 7 and there's no love on that level.

Mia, somehow, ended up having an interesting idea. She's also from the longstanding tradition of Ayra of Swordmaster Femme fatales. (Ayra, Fir, Karla, Marisa, Mia... I know next to nothing about five) Which for the long run is fairly important. Popularity even she can't sink Sigurd, and Diversity she'd have some uniques for a Swordarm in FE. Not as much as a Lance or Poleax, but more than another Sword Lord. It isn't much but I cling to hope.

 

[FieryRebirth]

Right, I believe that most of the newcomer roster is compromised of popular characters. Popularity is top priority without a doubt. Let's look at the characters with high hopes of being or already in Brawl:

Look at Geno:

Poorly developed character overall in a good RPG for the SNES. He practically doesn't talk!

Apparently says a 'cool' line that got everyone to love him

The glitch he has in battle that's easily exploited making him one of the most strongest, if not, imbalanced characters in that title, most likely attracting more fans. He wasn't that great of a party member without that glitch, I'm sure as I have played the game he is in, used to own it in fact.


Sonic:

Mario's console-wide mascot rival in the 2D days, those were indeed the real console wars only for him brought back to life... to star in horrible, horrible 3D games after the Dreamcast passed on. A majority of reviewers agree that Sonic was at his best in the 2D era.

Renown for his speed and somewhat 'cheesy and old-school' attitude, he attracted a majority of younger gamers

Seriously, this guy had his fame, and it was larger than Mario's but Sega failed to keep that popularity meter up when the 2D era was nearly at it's end. Can we please let this guy Rest in Pixels?


Megaman?


...

*Commence Nerd Rage*

MEEEEEGAMAAAAAAANNNN!!!(I hate him and Sonic too but I've had it with fighting against his fans.)



Ahem, Anyways, I doubt importance or even diversity are being prioritized here after looking through the official character polls and the results we have been getting lately, thus being, I won't be surprised seeing Megaman or Geno appearing as I'm quite certain Sakurai is following popular opinion. Sigurd being in Brawl is likely, because he was popular. Ike is in it and was popular. Think about it, unless they want to advertise their titles again, why WOULDN'T they be there from popular opinion?

 

[Rakath]

First up: You picked 3 examples with only 1 confirmed.

Secondly: Mascot Rival is important, Japan voting made him popular, his classic moves make him unique. Sonic has a 3 areas in the bag. He was not in any way failing in one of the three areas like the cast we look at.

Third: Third party cast in no way is open to the 'fan pleasing non-important cast' like a 3rd-4th FE character or a 5th+ Mario, or a second Kirby. Also Fire Emblem is the only series (besides Pokemon and maybe Zelda) to have such a wide selection of cast. DK caps its main cast 8, Starfox with about 10, Does Daisy count as main Mario cast?, even with her about 8 for Mario, Ado and Waddle Dee are what's left for Kirby cast, Eggplant Wizard?... Anyway, the point is that the other series have less to pick from, thus less arguement.

 

[FieryRebirth]

You pointed out something unnecessary to be criticized over, The confirmed character was just a slight push of explaining my point, the other 2 continue gaining popularity every day, then again, the hype for those two may have not been as strong when the official polls were out. I didn't say they were confirmed, just extremely hyped with the Light of Brawl shining on them, unless you disagree with all these Geno/Megaman fans here?

With this much playable character hype, I'm sure everyone in the forums would turn emo if they don't show up. I agree with your second statement.

Popularity is a much used tool for business than you think...then again, I have yet to know what's on Sakurai's mind.