Social 7th Heaven - Cloud Social Thread

[Maxoxpower]

Umm... Lucas was revealed in like February and Roy and Ryu were revealed in June.

Lucas was reveald April 1 but release in the same time than Roy and Ruy

 

[RebelXII]

Good lord. No matter who gets in, there are gonna be immature toddlers who will get there buts hurt over there character not getting in the ****ing game.

God I can't stand the incompetence of some members of the smash community.

 

[Tito Maas]

Not wanting someone in because they wouldn't be competitively viable is literally the dumbest reason to not want someone in.

I mean, why do you think that? Sure, you can spew some idealism about how you should play any character because you like them, but surely whatever character you use in a competitive environment is one you feel like you can win with, which is why you and your homeboys don't rush into tournaments with Mewtwo and Samus. A character that I'm not interested in and isn't good would be fun to play with for a week simply because they'd be new, but especially if I'm paying for the character, a priority of mine should be a long-term investment.

I'd actually like to hear your explanation on how it's dumb to want a character in that's competitively viable, seeing as how you'd be able to interact with that character much more often than you would a character who only makes cameo appearances on "For Fun" Smash online?

The most disappointing part about Mewtwo is that we paid money for a character who was unfinished and not good. All DLC fighting game character DLC should be characters who are competitive with the rest of the cast, if not only because of the extra monetary investment.

 

[Tri Knight]

I'm surprised people were actually butthurt about Cloud getting in. Nintendo needs third party support of this kind of level.

 

[Strong-Arm]

So how is the bar scene looking now?

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I mean, why do you think that? Sure, you can spew some idealism about how you should play any character because you like them, but surely whatever character you use in a competitive environment is one you feel like you can win with, which is why you and your homeboys don't rush into tournaments with Mewtwo and Samus. A character that I'm not interested in and isn't good would be fun to play with for a week simply because they'd be new, but especially if I'm paying for the character, a priority of mine should be a long-term investment.

I mean, people do play those not-so great characters you mentioned. And I play Dedede, whose viability is dubious at best. I can respect the fact that you wanna invest wisely, but you keep going on like this

I'd actually like to hear your explanation on how it's dumb to want a character in that's competitively viable, seeing as how you'd be able to interact with that character much more often than you would a character who only makes cameo appearances on "For Fun" Smash online?

and this

The most disappointing part about Mewtwo is that we paid money for a character who was unfinished and not good. All DLC fighting game character DLC should be characters who are competitive with the rest of the cast, if not only because of the extra monetary investment.

but if you're really serious about competing, here's what I'm wondering: Why wouldn't you get the DLC? I mean, sure, you could vicariously learn through playing the MU over and over again. You could bum off of your friend who mains the character, or even your local rival. You could play it online. But why can't you make the effort to pick up the character for yourself? Like, physically play them, lab them out, and all that jazz? Top players (unless they're complete NEETs) usually don't skimp out on that kinda stuff. They have that **** readily available so they can figure things out on their own.

'Cause, honestly, it sounds like you're parroting a buncha pessimism and anti-meta bull**** emanating from the Character Viability thread. I'm probably wrong, and that's ok. You probably felt like you wasted your five dollars on Mewtwo. I can respect the investment part, but idk if I can get behind your claim of competitiveness motivating your decision. I'm plenty competitive, and I don't regret buying Mewtwo in the slightest, because I have access to that character whenever I need him (to figure out the MU, how he works, etc.). I can overlook how bad he supposedly is in the grand scheme of things because he's instrumental in my developing as a player.

(Not to mention the grassroots logistical aspect of it. You're doing your TO a HUGE favor bringing a complete setup to tourneys.)

Smooth Criminal

 

[TTTTTsd]

I mean, why do you think that? Sure, you can spew some idealism about how you should play any character because you like them, but surely whatever character you use in a competitive environment is one you feel like you can win with, which is why you and your homeboys don't rush into tournaments with Mewtwo and Samus. A character that I'm not interested in and isn't good would be fun to play with for a week simply because they'd be new, but especially if I'm paying for the character, a priority of mine should be a long-term investment.

I'd actually like to hear your explanation on how it's dumb to want a character in that's competitively viable, seeing as how you'd be able to interact with that character much more often than you would a character who only makes cameo appearances on "For Fun" Smash online?

The most disappointing part about Mewtwo is that we paid money for a character who was unfinished and not good. All DLC fighting game character DLC should be characters who are competitive with the rest of the cast, if not only because of the extra monetary investment.

Mewtwo is perfectly complete, he's just not super viable. It happens all the time in actual fighting games so I don't see why it's a thing here? Smash is an icon-based character fighter and a majority of its target market falls in line with that. It's easy to forget after you play competitively for a while, but I used to be hella mad about Doc. No he's not DLC but they just slapped equipment and move attribute changes on Mario and made him WORSE. Then I labbed him out, he got some minor improvements and now I play him vicariously along with Ryu.

The end note is that DLC in a game like this is meant to extend the content for everyone, and I don't think competitive viability should bar someone's favorite veteran from returning even if they suck. I have a friend who LOVES Mewtwo, even though he's bad he loves playing the character and seeing them in Smash, I'd hate to see that not be a thing.

 

[Strong-Arm]

Mewtwo isnt even that terrible. His major problems are weight, and really bad hitboxes. A single patch could buff him tremendously. Anywho Smash 4 while made with the competitive side kind of in mind, is still a party game meant for ANYONE to pick up. My girlfriend LOVES Palutena and will only play her. So she does, even if she isnt very good in the thoughts of most ppl. Ill be honest this game is better balanced than the past iterations of smash overall and you CAN use just about every character in all honesty. But thats besides the point. What matters is that the game is for a far larger audience than us. For example the amount of Cloud players that are casuals will FFFFFAAAAARRRRR out weigh the number of people who actually main cloud in a competitive enviroment (Im just predicting here but it still stands) some ppl like smash just so they can play as their favorite characters. Some ppl like FFA's. Some ppl like items, and the other silly stuff.


Yeesh, we should just sit back and play smash and enjoy it.



ANYWAYS. the hype train grows for cloud as December rolls in soonish (tuesday in fact!) anyways whats everyones plans for Thanksgiving?

 

[Smooth Criminal]

And there is that aspect of it, yes, the content expansion. Based TTTTTsd ftw.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Strong-Arm]

At some point I feel like drawing that bar scene that was described earlier for this group...

But yeah, who knows, we're probably going to get a balance patch as always. Im pretty excited to see what the patch alters.

Anyways I went ahead and made a Cloud Meta/Community Guide thread so we have somewhere to post our findings and stuff for reference. I made custom banners and stuff for the different parts. Figured I would get it made and ready for the Cloud bomb

 

[praline]

Lucas was reveald April 1 but release in the same time than Roy and Ruy

Yeah I know that but he was still revealed way before the other 2.

 

[Seoxys]

My reactions about his trailer :

-OMG NEW CHARACTER WHO'S GONNA BE HERE ?!
-... Stars ? No it cannot be... Not Wolf... not that boring character they cannot do this to us... no please don't...
-Super Smash Bros X.... ? Wait, if there is the X thing that means, NEW SERIES in Smash ? IS THAT WHAT I HOPED SO FAR ? IS THAT ... ?
-... Final Fantasy VII... Deceived... Thought it would be Golden Sun or Castlevania to have Vlad or Simon Belmont... meh, why not after all, FF deserves it !
-CLOUD ! Wasn't expecting him, totally forgot his existence ! XD
That's my fault tho, should've played FF games...
-Waow battle theme rocks ! He seems soooo overpowered ! Maybe that's the trailer's effect but surely he's not a C Tier !
-This limit system... is clearly here to say "Look at how I'M BROKEN !" without any jokes !
-WHAT THE HELL OF ZA WARUDO ARE THOSE INVOCATIONS ?!
-His Final Smash was just here to taunt me because it looks like Ike's, and because Ike is his target, isn't it !
-Haha Chocobo costumes, why not ! And his victory jingle is all found ! Nice trailer !

 

[Cutie Gwen]

-... Stars ? No it cannot be... Not Wolf... not that ****ty character they cannot do this to us... no please don't...

Please, don't give us a veteran that's easy to make who's currently one of, if not THE most requested character

 

[Seoxys]

Yeah exactly, you saw right through my opinion.
I mean, darn it ! You have a chance to make enter a WHOLE new character for Smash, YOU can have an impact on who will be added to the roster !
And... you choose an already existing character that was in Brawl ? Wolf ? Seriously ? These months of exponential hype growing and growing with the hypest decision ever taken by Nintendo just for that ?
This is what I call a waste.
And I used to play Wolf in Brawl. But seriously, taking a whole ballot to bring him back is RIDICULOUS. The ballot means : To give a chance to someone that NEVER had the occasion to shine in Smash Bros, to come in ! This is the meaning of the ballot, not to bring déjà-vu characters ! This would be so deceiving ! ><

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Yeah exactly, you saw right through my opinion.
I mean, darn it ! You have a chance to make enter a WHOLE new character for Smash, YOU can have an impact on who will be added to the roster !
And... you choose an already existing character that was in Brawl ? Wolf ? Seriously ? These months of exponential hype growing and growing with the hypest decision ever taken by Nintendo just for that ?
This is what I call a waste.
And I used to play Wolf in Brawl. But seriously, taking a whole ballot to bring him back is RIDICULOUS. The ballot means : To give a chance to someone that NEVER had the occasion to shine in Smash Bros, to come in ! This is the meaning of the ballot, not to bring déjà-vu characters ! This would be so deceiving ! ><

If the ballot was there before Mewtwo or Lucas would be announced, they'd be getting millions of votes each. Wolf was fun to play, whereas we got 3 veterans who have the same, not including Wolf would be a shame, not to mention Sakurai would most likely not only focus on popularity. If the character who has 'a chance to shine' isn't noteworthy enough, then it just seems like you hate Wolf because he's more popular than your request. Not to mention it's unlikely that the pre-ballot DLC has ended, there is no way Cloud was a popular pick, yet here he is

 

[Drakonis]

Hey, I liked DoC...

Hey, more power to you!

Just because I thought the gameplay wasn't anything special and considered the plot more often contrived than interesting doesn't mean that you should think any less of it.
If you liked it, that's great! Just wasn't for me.

I mean, why do you think that? Sure, you can spew some idealism about how you should play any character because you like them, but surely whatever character you use in a competitive environment is one you feel like you can win with, which is why you and your homeboys don't rush into tournaments with Mewtwo and Samus. A character that I'm not interested in and isn't good would be fun to play with for a week simply because they'd be new, but especially if I'm paying for the character, a priority of mine should be a long-term investment.

I'd actually like to hear your explanation on how it's dumb to want a character in that's competitively viable, seeing as how you'd be able to interact with that character much more often than you would a character who only makes cameo appearances on "For Fun" Smash online?

The most disappointing part about Mewtwo is that we paid money for a character who was unfinished and not good. All DLC fighting game character DLC should be characters who are competitive with the rest of the cast, if not only because of the extra monetary investment.

If you don't want to buy a character that isn't top-tier material after it's release, that's fine. I can see why some people would only want characters that are viable. In a perfect world, balance would be perfect, after all. I I don't think nearly as many people who put actual importance in these things are good enough at the game to have the weaker character actually make a significant difference, but that's besides the point.

Mewtwo might not be particularly strong right now. But that doesn't mean that Sakurai and his team intended it to be that way.
And guess what: It doesn't mean it stays that way. The game is still being supported with patches and DLC, and IMO, they have done a good job with it so far, too. Smash 4 is WAY more balanced than any Smash game ever before.
If everyone says "Mewtwo is too weak" the developers will look into it, test stuff out meticulously as to not make the character broken and make matters worse for everyone else, and then put it into the next patch.

And if you have no interest in buying the character until that happened... just don't do it.

Yeah exactly, you saw right through my opinion.
I mean, darn it ! You have a chance to make enter a WHOLE new character for Smash, YOU can have an impact on who will be added to the roster !
And... you choose an already existing character that was in Brawl ? Wolf ? Seriously ? These months of exponential hype growing and growing with the hypest decision ever taken by Nintendo just for that ?
This is what I call a waste.
And I used to play Wolf in Brawl. But seriously, taking a whole ballot to bring him back is RIDICULOUS. The ballot means : To give a chance to someone that NEVER had the occasion to shine in Smash Bros, to come in ! This is the meaning of the ballot, not to bring déjà-vu characters ! This would be so deceiving ! ><

So.... you're angry about Mario, Kirby, Link, Toon-Link, Ganondorf, Roy, Mewtwo and all other veterans too?
Because by your logic, you really should be.

The thing that most people seem to be blind about with veterans is that their point is that they fill out a playstyle that doesn't exist anymore.
There isn't a character that plays like Snake at all and also no character that plays like Wolf.
THAT's the reason I want them back and also the reason why I would never fault people for wanting Ice Climbers back, or why I don't mind Jigglypuff still being in the game.

Also keep in mind that veterans are easier to create, so they might be a bonus on top of the new characters, not something we get instead.
Also just as much as I don't think Cloud was one of the ballot winners I don't think any character that would be released alongside him would be.

I feel like the Smash presentation in december will give us the following:
More Mii costumes!
Cloud and some explanations about how his moveset works!
Two more characters (likely veterans) ready to be released alongside Cloud!
Who won the ballot? How many of the top pics are coming to the game?
Bacon!
A new mode? Probably something as big as that.
A clear date when the game will not be supported through DLC and patches anymore (if this is indeed the last Smash Broadcast).

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Bacon

OP nerf plz, the watermouthing scent of bacon would make the fighters just drool on the spot

 

[mario123007]

FF7 remake with Cloud amiibo support is totally gonna happen.

Definitely

 

[SonicvMario]

Bacon!

Unless the direct is gonna be 6 hours long I'd say this'll have its own direct

OP nerf plz, the watermouthing scent of bacon would make the fighters just drool on the spot

This doesn't even scratch the surface of what Sakurai could tell us about bacon
Edit: To elaborate on my 6 hour estimate that is only if he decided to talk about one type of bacon. Add rashers to the mix and that's a good 7-8 extra hours depending on whether or not he decided to show us how to cook it himself

 

[Gimmick]

Eh. There's no real evidence that the FF7 remake will be coming to Nintendo consoles. People thought we were going to receive an entire host of new Metal Gear games when Snake was added to Brawl. Look how that turned out. "Plus the whole Nintendo no like Square" BS (IMO). Square has been producing games such as Secret of Mana, Bravely Default, Final Fantasy spin-offs, and Kingdom Hearts (DISNEY???) for Nintendo consoles for sometime now. I guess people just tend to ignore these things, but who knows. They could'be brought FF games to Nintendo consoles whenever they wanted to.

 

[Drakonis]

Eh. There's no real evidence that the FF7 remake will be coming to Nintendo consoles. People thought we were going to receive an entire host of new Metal Gear games when Snake was added to Brawl. Look how that turned out. Plus the whole Nintendo no like Square thing is BS (IMO). Square has been producing games such as Secret of Mana, Bravely Default, Final Fantasy spin-offs, and Kingdom Hearts (DISNEY???) for Nintendo consoles for sometime now. I guess people just tend to ignore these things, but who knows. They could'be brought FF games to Nintendo consoles whenever they wanted to.

Actually, the biggest problem so far was the power gap between Nintendo Consoles and their competitors. Bringing games like FFXIII to the Wii or FFXV to the WiiU just isn't feasable because their engines just plain require more power.
The NX most likely seeks to close that gap, so the chances of newer games coming to the system is suddenly pretty dang good.

 

[JesseMcCloud]

Unless the direct is gonna be 6 hours long I'd say this'll have its own direct

This doesn't even scratch the surface of what Sakurai could tell us about bacon
Edit: To elaborate on my 6 hour estimate that is only if he decided to talk about one type of bacon. Add rashers to the mix and that's a good 7-8 extra hours depending on whether or not he decided to show us how to cook it himself

I would sell my firstborn child to see a Sakurai-hosted cooking show.

 

[SonicvMario]

Actually, the biggest problem so far was the power gap between Nintendo Consoles and their competitors. Bringing games like FFXIII to the Wii or FFXV to the WiiU just isn't feasable because their engines just plain require more power.
The NX most likely seeks to close that gap, so the chances of newer games coming to the system is suddenly pretty dang good.

The fact it's meant to be getting DQ 11 makes it seem promising that it could get the FFVII remake, unless it's a port of the 3DS version.

 

[RebelXII]

The best part about the trailer was idiots thought that it was going to be Wolf.

I don't think we are getting Final Fantasy VII for the NX. That's just what it feels like to me.

 

[SonicvMario]

I would sell my firstborn child to see a Sakurai-hosted cooking show.

"This week on the Sakurai Cooking Show we'll show you how to make Octorock Soup with this weeks special guest Link from Hyrule"

 

[Strong-Arm]

Didnt have school or work today so I slept in. Morning bar patrons. I have finally awoken.

 

[BlueX]

After Ridge Racer i am starting Final Fantasy VIII. I have also been thinking about more FF games and just more video games in general.

Didnt have school or work today so I slept in. Morning bar patrons. I have finally awoken.

Good Morning.

 

[Strong-Arm]

Im almost done with disc 1 of FF VII, and VIII. Im also playing Theatrythm curtain call, and Ive start X again. Im just hopping between a bunch of FF games.

 

[Drakonis]

"This week on the Sakurai Cooking Show we'll show you how to make Octorock Soup with this weeks special guest Link from Hyrule"

I wonder what's for dinner...

 

[Strong-Arm]

I wonder what's for dinner...

 

[Tri Knight]

The best part about the trailer was idiots thought that it was going to be Wolf.

I don't think we are getting Final Fantasy VII for the NX. That's just what it feels like to me.

There's no reason why the NX won't get FF7 at this point. I think Nintendo is finally gonna get back in the game and actually care about 3rd party support for this next console. It's one of the biggest reasons the wii u failed expectations. The desire for 3rd party means a powerful console. Powerful console means support from the outside.

They should have done this from the beginning. Could you imagine how great Nintendo could already be if they had access to all their 1st party content (which is arguably the best out of the 3) as well as access to games like Call of Duty, Elder Scrolls/Fallout, main Final Fantasy games, etc.? There'd be no contest.

At this point, it's up to Nintendo to be smart and create a console that can have all that. Something as powerful, if not more powerful than PS4 and Xbone.

 

[Gimmick]

Thanksgiving break. 6 days off, food, family, friends, church, and smash. Dis gonna be good. Only a couple more days until December.

 

[Strong-Arm]

December get here sooner please.

 

[Tito Maas]

I mean, people do play those not-so great characters you mentioned. And I play Dedede, whose viability is dubious at best. I can respect the fact that you wanna invest wisely, but you keep going on like this

and this

but if you're really serious about competing, here's what I'm wondering: Why wouldn't you get the DLC? I mean, sure, you could vicariously learn through playing the MU over and over again. You could bum off of your friend who mains the character, or even your local rival. You could play it online. But why can't you make the effort to pick up the character for yourself? Like, physically play them, lab them out, and all that jazz? Top players (unless they're complete NEETs) usually don't skimp out on that kinda stuff. They have that **** readily available so they can figure things out on their own.

'Cause, honestly, it sounds like you're parroting a buncha pessimism and anti-meta bull**** emanating from the Character Viability thread. I'm probably wrong, and that's ok. You probably felt like you wasted your five dollars on Mewtwo. I can respect the investment part, but idk if I can get behind your claim of competitiveness motivating your decision. I'm plenty competitive, and I don't regret buying Mewtwo in the slightest, because I have access to that character whenever I need him (to figure out the MU, how he works, etc.). I can overlook how bad he supposedly is in the grand scheme of things because he's instrumental in my developing as a player.

(Not to mention the grassroots logistical aspect of it. You're doing your TO a HUGE favor bringing a complete setup to tourneys.)

Smooth Criminal

I would never take a character out of the game. So that's cool that a minority group plays Dedede sometimes. But I still don't see how that affects wanting a character added to the game to be good.

I buy DLC. That's what I do, because I like having a complete game. Every DLC for this game, sans Mii costumes, I've bought Day 1 without hesitation. I don't regret buying Mewtwo, Roy, Ryu, Lucas, Suzaku Castle, Super Mario Maker, Peach's Castle 64, Hyrule Castle 64, or Pirate Ship. So please don't misconstrue my argument (or put words in my mouth to make an argument for me) as me not wanting to buy the character because he or she isn't Sheik. And I can pick up a DLC character, but there are over 50 characters in the game. And I have mains and characters I like. And honestly, not being that good or being a character that I don't win with very often is a great way to fall out of my favoritism in the game, just like the opposite is a great way to get me to pick you up. Mewtwo is one of the few characters in this game that I actually have some sort of experience/attachment to outside of the Smash series, but I'm so disappointed in the character that he doesn't make my rotation. I play him once every now and them--my friends snicker when I do finally pick him--but he's a character that's rarely used and rarely seen competitively, which is disappointing for a DLC character. Mewtwo can't displace my main because my goal isn't to beat the world with a non-good character; my goal is to beat the world with a character I can have fun with. Just like with stages, in my personal preference, I'd rather a DLC stage be a competitively playable stage so I'm not just limited to playing it in melee Smash with my homeboys.

If Cloud is a character that I can play with often and play against relatively often, I'll be quite satisfied. I wouldn't take Mewtwo out the game because I wouldn't ever take a character out the game, but Mewtwo isn't a better DLC character than Ryu because he isn't viable. There's no benefits to being a subpar character, so why would I ask for that? Even K. Rool can be competitively viable, despite being a fat, heavy, slow character if they do him the right way. I just don't want him to be a bottom-tier that no one ever sees outside of the character select screen.

Mewtwo is perfectly complete, he's just not super viable. It happens all the time in actual fighting games so I don't see why it's a thing here? Smash is an icon-based character fighter and a majority of its target market falls in line with that. It's easy to forget after you play competitively for a while, but I used to be hella mad about Doc. No he's not DLC but they just slapped equipment and move attribute changes on Mario and made him WORSE. Then I labbed him out, he got some minor improvements and now I play him vicariously along with Ryu.

The end note is that DLC in a game like this is meant to extend the content for everyone, and I don't think competitive viability should bar someone's favorite veteran from returning even if they suck. I have a friend who LOVES Mewtwo, even though he's bad he loves playing the character and seeing them in Smash, I'd hate to see that not be a thing.

Eh, I never agreed with people being upset about a character's inclusion. I still don't understand why everyone was so emotional about my former main, Dark Pit.

And I'm referencing the broken hitboxes on his tilt when I say he's an unfinished character.

 

[SonicvMario]

Didnt have school or work today so I slept in. Morning bar patrons. I have finally awoken.

Would you like some bacon made by Sakurai for breakfast?

 

[Strong-Arm]

Would you like some bacon made by Sakurai for breakfast?

Why h*** yeah! Bacon is always awesome


Anyways in case anyone hasnt seen the thread I made I really want to develop Cloud and his meta along with strategies and stuff. I think we can combine as a community to craft a solid and well made meta for him. When he drops I wonder how many people are actually going to lab him and stick with him tho?

 

[Drakonis]

Why h*** yeah! Bacon is always awesome


Anyways in case anyone hasnt seen the thread I made I really want to develop Cloud and his meta along with strategies and stuff. I think we can combine as a community to craft a solid and well made meta for him. When he drops I wonder how many people are actually going to lab him and stick with him tho?

Unless there's any glaring problem with his gameplay for me I'm sure he'll be a mainstay in my player slot.
But I doubt I'll lab him. Over the course of Smash 4's life span I came to realize that I would have to put in a lot more time to get significantly better, and that's just something I don't have (or rather: Don't want to take from somewhere else).
It was frustrating at first, but when the realization hit and I started playing mostly to have a good time instead of getting better I was having a blast with the game again.

 

[JesseMcCloud]

Why h*** yeah! Bacon is always awesome


Anyways in case anyone hasnt seen the thread I made I really want to develop Cloud and his meta along with strategies and stuff. I think we can combine as a community to craft a solid and well made meta for him. When he drops I wonder how many people are actually going to lab him and stick with him tho?

For Glory is my lab.

when the realization hit and I started playing mostly to have a good time instead of getting better I started having a blast with the game again.

I call this the Viewtiful effect. Once you stop focusing on winning and just start playing to have fun, your brain gets out of its own way, and you'll play better.
Or as @Trifroze put it in one of his videos, "When playing as Falcon, you do not play to win, but to give your foe the most glorious death possible, even if you must die yourself."

 

[Hanku Hirru]

Where's the love for Red XIII?

 

[Strong-Arm]

I would like feedback on the thread I made. What should I add to improve it? I know he hasnt been released yet but that doesnt mean I cant make the format better. I mean I just wanna do the best I can

Also Red XIII is awesome. I didnt like him at first but then I played the game and hes really cool. I keep him in my party at all times.