2B Automatizes!

Altais

Smash Lord
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Starbase, where no turtle has gone before.
Now that we know a second wave of fighters is coming, mine hopes have increased for 2B. Given PlatinumGames's building relationship with Nintendo (Astral Chain being a Switch exclusive), I can honestly see her happening. Both Yoko Taro and PlatinumGames want to port Nier: Automata to Switch. All they need is the funds from Square Enix.
 

NineS

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
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I know you're reading this. Vote 2B.
The Stars have aligned in our favor.

At this point, I'm fully confident in 2B. Why? Expect a lengthy explanation/summary! Endure it! Endure it!

Let us start off with the obvious. We're getting more DLC fighters! (You already knew that though, didn't you?)
And, as a result, we can make the assumption that in this next batch of DLC Fighters, Square Enix will toss in yet another rep.

In the current moment of time, the characters people consider most seem to be Sora, Geno, and I believe 2B. Now with these two in the way, why would 2B get in? Fairly simple. This is going off of how things have been done thus far for such things.

Sora is fairly likely to get in, I'd say, though I believe 2B is more probable. The top four Square Enix franchises thus far in terms of sales in order are: Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts, and the DrakeNier franchise. Of course, going off of this pattern, it'd be natural to assume that Kingdom Hearts is the next in line to get the rep, right? Well, I'm not entirely sure about that to tell the truth. Potential Disney drama aside (because it's been repeated to death at this point, and personally I now feel as if Disney won't hurt nor boost Sora's chances. At least not significantly.), there are some things 2B does happen to have going for her that Sora does not, which I will go into further below.

As for Geno, I believe the odds are against Geno's favor, more so than Sora. Admittedly, outside of the Smash community, he's rather niche on a global scale (I'm sorry for anyone who is a big fan of him, I intend no offense,) and not only that, Fighters Pass DLC thus far seems to have been consistent in one "rule" if you will as stated by Reggie: All new DLC reps are those of franchises that have yet to be in Smash in any shape or form. This is likely to be the case with the next wave, as stated by Sakurai (choose to interpret it literally or not if you will, I choose to do so; Reggie stated something similar before and it ended up being literal)...
Adding more characters into the game means that more game worlds will be added to the series, and that means there will be an even greater opportunity to delight the fans.
The implication here is that the next wave will continue to "add game worlds to the series", or continue to add characters who're not from franchises in smash in any shape or form thus far, as it has with the first Fighters Pass. This doesn't prevent him from being a Mii Costume, however, but I feel as though that'd really be the best case scenario for Geno.

Now, as for the things that point towards 2B? There's many things in her favor.

❖ Sometime in May this year, Yoko Taro stated that 2B's voice actress would soon reprise her role again. This isn't just to suggest that it is for smash, however, but exciting nonetheless isn't it? There's a very good chance that it is for Yoko Taro's next game, which is supposed to be unveiled to the public "next chance he gets", likely Tokyo Game Show 2019. This indicates that Square Enix indeed sees NieR as a valuable franchise to promote to ensure its growth.

Yoko Taro stated he would gladly lend 2B out to put her into as many games as possible, Smash included. Square/Yoko Taro have put 2B/Nier in multiple games already. Some more popular ones are SoulCalibur 6, Gravity Rush/Daze, Monster Hunter Frontier Z, Phantasy Star Online 2, Lords of Vermillion, FFXIV, and countless others (sadly, many are also Japan exclusive). This indicates that she'd be one of the characters Square Enix is far more eager to lend out, especially if Yoko Taro or Yosuke Saito have a say in it.

Sakurai favors NieR: Automata, and has played every game in the franchise. Sakurai has stated before that he loved NieR: Automata, and enjoyed Yoko Taro's works. He's also written a famitsu column on the game as well (link here). Interesting thing to note, many of the more 'recent' games Sakurai has written famitsu columns on thus far have been put into smash one way or another. Sakurai wrote 2 columns on Persona 5 (Joker), even wrote one on indies talking about how he's enjoyed Undertale (Sans Mii Costume), etc. I suppose you could say there's a bit of Sakurai bias on this, as most DLC characters thus far are those of franchises or games Sakurai has enjoyed.

❖ Japan favors NieR: Automata. In Japan, Famitsu published results based off of a large survey on what the best games of the Heisei Era were. On this list, NieR: Automata ranked third. It has also grown worldwide appeal thus far, and continues to grow in popularity today at a stunning pace considering its circumstances.

❖ Yoko Taro and Sakurai are good friends. They've become fairly friendly with one another in recent times. Not only will this make it easier for him to obtain 2B, but Sakurai has also put characters belonging to friends in the game. (Snake.)

The other consistent "rule" for DLC thus far, being characters from a game after 2016 being unable to make the cut due to when the first Fighters Pass choices were finalized, is thrown out the window. This is because this fighters pass is new and recent, undeniably getting rid of the biggest roadblock for 2B.

These are merely a few of the main things that are in 2B's favor. These are also the things 2B holds over Sora being in Smash, save for potentially the friendship Sakurai and Yoko Taro hold merely because Nomura is also friends with Sakurai. Admittedly, the only things standing in 2B's way now is the possibility of Sora making it in over her (though I strongly believe her to be more likely than Sora in this case), and the other "rule" of characters needing to have appeared on a Nintendo Console. Though, you could say she already qualifies for that "rule", being in Phantasy Star Online 2, which is also on the Switch. Even then, if that doesn't qualify her, Yosuke Saito, Yoko Taro, and Takahisa Taura have all agreed to wanting to put NieR: Automata on the switch. Therefore, if she doesn't qualify for that rule now, she most likely will very soon.

I'm sorry for making you read so much of this long post. Unless you didn't read it all, which is understandable. And rude. But hopefully this all makes sense to you all.

Let us hope this is all correct. Unless you're rooting for Sora or Geno instead of 2B, I guess.


Glory to Mankind! and whatnot.
 
Last edited:

Altais

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 14, 2007
Messages
1,967
Location
Starbase, where no turtle has gone before.
The Stars have aligned in our favor.

At this point, I'm fully confident in 2B. Why? Expect a lengthy explanation/summary! Endure it! Endure it!

Let us start off with the obvious. We're getting more DLC fighters! (You already knew that though, didn't you?)
And, as a result, we can make the assumption that in this next batch of DLC Fighters, Square Enix will toss in yet another rep.

In the current moment of time, the characters people consider most seem to be Sora, Geno, and I believe 2B. Now with these two in the way, why would 2B get in? Fairly simple. This is going off of how things have been done thus far for such things.

Sora is fairly likely to get in, I'd say, though I believe 2B is more probable. The top four Square Enix franchises thus far in terms of sales in order are: Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts, and the DrakeNier franchise. Of course, going off of this pattern, it'd be natural to assume that Kingdom Hearts is the next in line to get the rep, right? Well, I'm not entirely sure about that to tell the truth. Potential Disney drama aside (because it's been repeated to death at this point, and personally I now feel as if Disney won't hurt nor boost Sora's chances. At least not significantly.), there are some things 2B does happen to have going for her that Sora does not, which I will go into further below.

As for Geno, I believe the odds are against Geno's favor, more so than Sora. Admittedly, outside of the Smash community, he's rather niche on a global scale (I'm sorry for anyone he's a big fan of him, I intend no offense,) and not only that, Fighters Pass DLC thus far seems to have been consistent in one "rule" if you will as stated by Reggie: All new DLC reps are those of franchises that have yet to be in Smash in any shape or form. This is likely to be the case with the next wave, as stated by Sakurai (choose to interpret it literally or not if you will, I choose to do so; Reggie stated something similar before and it ended up being literal)...

The implication here is that the next wave will continue to "add game worlds to the series", or continue to add characters who're not from franchises in smash in any shape or form thus far, as it has with the first Fighters Pass. This doesn't prevent him from being a Mii Costume, however, but I feel as though that'd really be the best case scenario for Geno.

Now, as for the things that point towards 2B? There's many things in her favor.

❖ Sometime in May this year, Yoko Taro stated that 2B's voice actress would soon reprise her role again. This isn't just to suggest that it is for smash, however, but exciting nonetheless isn't it? There's a very good chance that it is for Yoko Taro's next game, which is supposed to be unveiled to the public "next chance he gets", likely Tokyo Game Show 2019. This indicates that Square Enix indeed sees NieR as a valuable franchise to promote to ensure its growth.

Yoko Taro stated he would gladly lend 2B out to put her into as many games as possible, Smash included. Square/Yoko Taro have put 2B/Nier in multiple games already. Some more popular ones are SoulCalibur 6, Gravity Rush/Daze, Monster Hunter Frontier Z, Phantasy Star Online 2, Lords of Vermillion, FFXIV, and countless others (sadly, many are also Japan exclusive). This indicates that she'd be one of the characters Square Enix is far more eager to lend out, especially if Yoko Taro or Yosuke Saito have a say in it.

Sakurai favors NieR: Automata, and has played every game in the franchise. Sakurai has stated before that he loved NieR: Automata, and enjoyed Yoko Taro's works. He's also written a famitsu column on the game as well (link here). Interesting thing to note, many of the more 'recent' games Sakurai has written famitsu columns on thus far have been put into smash one way or another. Sakurai wrote 2 columns on Persona 5 (Joker), even wrote one on indies talking about how he's enjoyed Undertale (Sans Mii Costume), etc. I suppose you could say there's a bit of Sakurai bias on this, as most DLC characters thus far are those of franchises or games Sakurai has enjoyed.

❖ Japan favors NieR: Automata. In Japan, Famitsu published results based off of a large survey on what the best games of the Heisei Era were. On this list, NieR: Automata ranked third. It has also grown worldwide appeal thus far, and continues to grow in popularity today at a stunning pace considering its circumstances.

❖ Yoko Taro and Sakurai are good friends. They've become fairly friendly with one another in recent times. Not only will this make it easier for him to obtain 2B, but Sakurai has also put characters belonging to friends in the game. (Snake.)

The other consistent "rule" for DLC thus far, being characters from a game after 2016 being unable to make the cut due to when the first Fighters Pass choices were finalized, is thrown out the window. This is because this fighters pass is new and reason, undeniably getting rid of the biggest roadblock for 2B.

These are merely a few of the main things that are in 2B's favor. These are also the things 2B holds over Sora being in Smash, save for potentially the friendship Sakurai and Yoko Taro hold merely because Nomura is also friends with Sakurai. Admittedly, the only things standing in 2B's way now is the possibility of Sora making it in over her (though I strongly believe her to be more likely than Sora in this case), and the other "rule" of characters needing to have appeared on a Nintendo Console. Though, you could say she already qualifies for that "rule", being in Phantasy Star Online 2, which is also on the Switch. Even then, if that doesn't qualify her, Yosuke Saito, Yoko Taro, and Takahisa Taura have all agreed to wanting to put NieR: Automata on the switch. Therefore, if she doesn't qualify for that rule now, she most likely will very soon.

I'm sorry for making you read so much of this long post. Unless you didn't read it all, which is understandable. And rude. But hopefully this all makes sense to you all.

Let us hope this is all correct. Unless you're rooting for Sora or Geno instead of 2B, I guess.


Glory to Mankind! and whatnot.
This argument is compelling and well-defended. Added this to the OP.
 

Senatiator

Smash Cadet
Joined
Nov 2, 2014
Messages
73
The Stars have aligned in our favor.

At this point, I'm fully confident in 2B. Why? Expect a lengthy explanation/summary! Endure it! Endure it!

Let us start off with the obvious. We're getting more DLC fighters! (You already knew that though, didn't you?)
And, as a result, we can make the assumption that in this next batch of DLC Fighters, Square Enix will toss in yet another rep.

In the current moment of time, the characters people consider most seem to be Sora, Geno, and I believe 2B. Now with these two in the way, why would 2B get in? Fairly simple. This is going off of how things have been done thus far for such things.

Sora is fairly likely to get in, I'd say, though I believe 2B is more probable. The top four Square Enix franchises thus far in terms of sales in order are: Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Kingdom Hearts, and the DrakeNier franchise. Of course, going off of this pattern, it'd be natural to assume that Kingdom Hearts is the next in line to get the rep, right? Well, I'm not entirely sure about that to tell the truth. Potential Disney drama aside (because it's been repeated to death at this point, and personally I now feel as if Disney won't hurt nor boost Sora's chances. At least not significantly.), there are some things 2B does happen to have going for her that Sora does not, which I will go into further below.

As for Geno, I believe the odds are against Geno's favor, more so than Sora. Admittedly, outside of the Smash community, he's rather niche on a global scale (I'm sorry for anyone he's a big fan of him, I intend no offense,) and not only that, Fighters Pass DLC thus far seems to have been consistent in one "rule" if you will as stated by Reggie: All new DLC reps are those of franchises that have yet to be in Smash in any shape or form. This is likely to be the case with the next wave, as stated by Sakurai (choose to interpret it literally or not if you will, I choose to do so; Reggie stated something similar before and it ended up being literal)...

The implication here is that the next wave will continue to "add game worlds to the series", or continue to add characters who're not from franchises in smash in any shape or form thus far, as it has with the first Fighters Pass. This doesn't prevent him from being a Mii Costume, however, but I feel as though that'd really be the best case scenario for Geno.

Now, as for the things that point towards 2B? There's many things in her favor.

❖ Sometime in May this year, Yoko Taro stated that 2B's voice actress would soon reprise her role again. This isn't just to suggest that it is for smash, however, but exciting nonetheless isn't it? There's a very good chance that it is for Yoko Taro's next game, which is supposed to be unveiled to the public "next chance he gets", likely Tokyo Game Show 2019. This indicates that Square Enix indeed sees NieR as a valuable franchise to promote to ensure its growth.

Yoko Taro stated he would gladly lend 2B out to put her into as many games as possible, Smash included. Square/Yoko Taro have put 2B/Nier in multiple games already. Some more popular ones are SoulCalibur 6, Gravity Rush/Daze, Monster Hunter Frontier Z, Phantasy Star Online 2, Lords of Vermillion, FFXIV, and countless others (sadly, many are also Japan exclusive). This indicates that she'd be one of the characters Square Enix is far more eager to lend out, especially if Yoko Taro or Yosuke Saito have a say in it.

Sakurai favors NieR: Automata, and has played every game in the franchise. Sakurai has stated before that he loved NieR: Automata, and enjoyed Yoko Taro's works. He's also written a famitsu column on the game as well (link here). Interesting thing to note, many of the more 'recent' games Sakurai has written famitsu columns on thus far have been put into smash one way or another. Sakurai wrote 2 columns on Persona 5 (Joker), even wrote one on indies talking about how he's enjoyed Undertale (Sans Mii Costume), etc. I suppose you could say there's a bit of Sakurai bias on this, as most DLC characters thus far are those of franchises or games Sakurai has enjoyed.

❖ Japan favors NieR: Automata. In Japan, Famitsu published results based off of a large survey on what the best games of the Heisei Era were. On this list, NieR: Automata ranked third. It has also grown worldwide appeal thus far, and continues to grow in popularity today at a stunning pace considering its circumstances.

❖ Yoko Taro and Sakurai are good friends. They've become fairly friendly with one another in recent times. Not only will this make it easier for him to obtain 2B, but Sakurai has also put characters belonging to friends in the game. (Snake.)

The other consistent "rule" for DLC thus far, being characters from a game after 2016 being unable to make the cut due to when the first Fighters Pass choices were finalized, is thrown out the window. This is because this fighters pass is new and reason, undeniably getting rid of the biggest roadblock for 2B.

These are merely a few of the main things that are in 2B's favor. These are also the things 2B holds over Sora being in Smash, save for potentially the friendship Sakurai and Yoko Taro hold merely because Nomura is also friends with Sakurai. Admittedly, the only things standing in 2B's way now is the possibility of Sora making it in over her (though I strongly believe her to be more likely than Sora in this case), and the other "rule" of characters needing to have appeared on a Nintendo Console. Though, you could say she already qualifies for that "rule", being in Phantasy Star Online 2, which is also on the Switch. Even then, if that doesn't qualify her, Yosuke Saito, Yoko Taro, and Takahisa Taura have all agreed to wanting to put NieR: Automata on the switch. Therefore, if she doesn't qualify for that rule now, she most likely will very soon.

I'm sorry for making you read so much of this long post. Unless you didn't read it all, which is understandable. And rude. But hopefully this all makes sense to you all.

Let us hope this is all correct. Unless you're rooting for Sora or Geno instead of 2B, I guess.


Glory to Mankind! and whatnot.
They did not imply that things like only "new series" characters as something like Corrin would be "new to the series." Reggie has said something similar about Waluigi in an interview. Unless you believe that arbitrarily limiting character choices because of "franchise popularity" or made up rules like "NPCs role can never join Smash from day one" and will never change and can't have overlap like Robin's final smash has Chrom fighting himself is a very good idea. Won't come back to bite anyone in the *** at all. Nope. It's the perfect way to build your crossover roster. If you want to take their words literally then they won't include more content beyond the Fighter's Pass because of Sakurai's statements during Hero's showcase.

Sakurai's words: "We're low on budget"
Fan interpretation: "No DLC after Fighter Pass, because limited budget."

The "new worlds" is a translation error
just as how the 4.0 video is not 22 minutes, it was a translation error by Nintendo of America.
If characters after 2016 can't be in the Fighter's Pass then neither can Hero.
 

NineS

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I know you're reading this. Vote 2B.
They did not imply that things like only "new series" characters as something like Corrin would be "new to the series." Reggie has said something similar about Waluigi in an interview. Unless you believe that arbitrarily limiting character choices because of "franchise popularity" or made up rules like "NPCs role can never join Smash from day one" and will never change and can't have overlap like Robin's final smash has Chrom fighting himself is a very good idea. Won't come back to bite anyone in the *** at all. Nope. It's the perfect way to build your crossover roster. If you want to take their words literally then they won't include more content beyond the Fighter's Pass because of Sakurai's statements during Hero's showcase.

Sakurai's words: "We're low on budget"
Fan interpretation: "No DLC after Fighter Pass, because limited budget."

The "new worlds" is a translation error
just as how the 4.0 video is not 22 minutes, it was a translation error by Nintendo of America.
If characters after 2016 can't be in the Fighter's Pass then neither can Hero.
I believe it is the context that was key, at least for what Reggie stated before. It can be seen here: https://youtu.be/g0Vsatt8-o4?t=187 (essentially the video you linked).
In context, he states it would have characters that are new to the series "just like Joker". Assuming this meant their franchise never has been in smash thus far, then it is true to the Fighters Pass thus far as none of the characters and their series in the Fighters Pass have been in smash in any shape or form. I don't entirely understand what you were trying to get at with Corrin and Waluigi, though.

As for these "arbitrary fan rules", I only mention three.

Characters from a franchise in Smash won't be in the Fighters Pass.
Characters from a game after 2016 aren't able to make the cut. (For the first fighter's pass at least.)
Characters not from a franchise that has been on Nintendo consoles can't make the cut.

I believe it is worth noting that I don't necessarily believe these rules are set in stone, nor do I necessarily happen to like smash "rules" in general. These "rules" are especially open to change now. It is also important to acknowledge that though these rules are always inconvenient, they are not all arbitrary; that would be a hasty generalization.

For the first, well, you already know my reasoning for it so I'll only summarize what I've already stated. It is according to Reggie's words (as said above), and every Smash character in the Fighter's Pass thus far. When he had first mentioned it, admittedly I worried I took it too literal, but now it seems as if the interpretation taken was indeed the case. Delving into the translation thing you mentioned before, this is something I certainly wish I had found before. Nonetheless, the important thing to note here is that the translators can't quite pin if Sakurai's phrasing indicates a change in this or not. It can change, and you can make the assumption that it either will or won't. However going off of how it has worked thus far, it seems more probable for the time being that this "rule" will not change.

For the second, it is also from Sakurai: https://youtu.be/fccgHnBQ0YM?t=1927. According to the translators, "We decided which fighters to include when we started planning, so we couldn't add characters from Xenoblade Chronicles 2, which was announced after planning had started." As for the situation with Hero, it is important to note that while Sakurai approached the dev team of DQ11, the dev team of DQ11 seemed to have had some say in who the DQ rep would be judging from their commentary. The selection for this one wasn't solely Sakurai's decision, but a team effort. As for DQ11's release date, the game was in development as early as 2013, teased in 2014, then announced for 3DS and what was at the time the "NX" in 2015. This means that although the game didn't release in the time frame Sakurai specified, it was in development for quite some time and revealed to the public within the time frame. Not only that, but that DQ11's dev team collaborated with Sakurai to make the decision on who the DQ rep should be to an unknown degree, going as far as suggesting the costumes for the character. However, this "No character in from after 2016" issue shouldn't apply to the next fighters pass, seeing the current time frame.

The third is, truly, the most simple really. Going off of history thus far, no playable characters in Smash are from a franchise that haven't been on Nintendo consoles in some shape or form (unless I'm somehow missing one, which is possible.) Admittedly, there's not much to say about this one, other than this one is up to change as well as the first. If anything, it is only the less likely outcome that it'll change, same as the first.

I do not mention any sort of "franchise popularity" rule, though I did say that Geno is niche compared to the other two likelier options (Sora and 2B) outside of Smash. I suppose I should mention that I never said Geno was an impossibility, but only the least likely outcome of the three mentioned. I brought that up because if Square Enix were to have a say in who gets chosen again, they'd likely wish to take the chance to promote a long-running franchise with multiple entries that is currently their third best (KH) or a fresh, rapidly growing franchise that was deemed a hit on a global scale and is on its way to becoming one of their best franchises among the likes of FF, DQ, and KH. Geno would still be profitable to a degree as a character, but on a long-term, it'd be more beneficial for both companies to choose either KH or DrakeNier.

As for the mii costumes, I do not mention that mii costumes cannot be fighters at the same time. I only mention the "rule" that characters from a franchise already represented in Smash will not (or rather, are unlikely to, as it would be a more accurate way of phrasing it) be DLC characters in the Fighters Pass. Again, I cannot stress enough that these so-called "rules" have the potential to change for the next wave of Fighters. Merely that at the present, these would indicate what is likely and what isn't, not what is impossible and what can happen (at the very least, that is how I use them here).


EDIT: Unrelated, and I didn't want to double post, but I thought this was something else to note.

 
Last edited:

Inoj

Smash Apprentice
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Sep 18, 2018
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154
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SW-1541-1574-0818
I watched a similar video on that leak. Folks in the comments said that there's a discrepancy between the content of the screencap and the post found on /v/. A fake made using inspect element.
 
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Messages
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I believe it is the context that was key, at least for what Reggie stated before. It can be seen here: https://youtu.be/g0Vsatt8-o4?t=187 (essentially the video you linked).
In context, he states it would have characters that are new to the series "just like Joker". Assuming this meant their franchise never has been in smash thus far, then it is true to the Fighters Pass thus far as none of the characters and their series in the Fighters Pass have been in smash in any shape or form. I don't entirely understand what you were trying to get at with Corrin and Waluigi, though.

As for these "arbitrary fan rules", I only mention three.

Characters from a franchise in Smash won't be in the Fighters Pass.
Characters from a game after 2016 aren't able to make the cut. (For the first fighter's pass at least.)
Characters not from a franchise that has been on Nintendo consoles can't make the cut.

I believe it is worth noting that I don't necessarily believe these rules are set in stone, nor do I necessarily happen to like smash "rules" in general. These "rules" are especially open to change now. It is also important to acknowledge that though these rules are always inconvenient, they are not all arbitrary; that would be a hasty generalization.

For the first, well, you already know my reasoning for it so I'll only summarize what I've already stated. It is according to Reggie's words (as said above), and every Smash character in the Fighter's Pass thus far. When he had first mentioned it, admittedly I worried I took it too literal, but now it seems as if the interpretation taken was indeed the case. Delving into the translation thing you mentioned before, this is something I certainly wish I had found before. Nonetheless, the important thing to note here is that the translators can't quite pin if Sakurai's phrasing indicates a change in this or not. It can change, and you can make the assumption that it either will or won't. However going off of how it has worked thus far, it seems more probable for the time being that this "rule" will not change.

For the second, it is also from Sakurai: https://youtu.be/fccgHnBQ0YM?t=1927. According to the translators, "We decided which fighters to include when we started planning, so we couldn't add characters from Xenoblade Chronicles 2, which was announced after planning had started." As for the situation with Hero, it is important to note that while Sakurai approached the dev team of DQ11, the dev team of DQ11 seemed to have had some say in who the DQ rep would be judging from their commentary. The selection for this one wasn't solely Sakurai's decision, but a team effort. As for DQ11's release date, the game was in development as early as 2013, teased in 2014, then announced for 3DS and what was at the time the "NX" in 2015. This means that although the game didn't release in the time frame Sakurai specified, it was in development for quite some time and revealed to the public within the time frame. Not only that, but that DQ11's dev team collaborated with Sakurai to make the decision on who the DQ rep should be to an unknown degree, going as far as suggesting the costumes for the character. However, this "No character in from after 2016" issue shouldn't apply to the next fighters pass, seeing the current time frame.

The third is, truly, the most simple really. Going off of history thus far, no playable characters in Smash are from a franchise that haven't been on Nintendo consoles in some shape or form (unless I'm somehow missing one, which is possible.) Admittedly, there's not much to say about this one, other than this one is up to change as well as the first. If anything, it is only the less likely outcome that it'll change, same as the first.

I do not mention any sort of "franchise popularity" rule, though I did say that Geno is niche compared to the other two likelier options (Sora and 2B) outside of Smash. I suppose I should mention that I never said Geno was an impossibility, but only the least likely outcome of the three mentioned. I brought that up because if Square Enix were to have a say in who gets chosen again, they'd likely wish to take the chance to promote a long-running franchise with multiple entries that is currently their third best (KH) or a fresh, rapidly growing franchise that was deemed a hit on a global scale and is on its way to becoming one of their best franchises among the likes of FF, DQ, and KH. Geno would still be profitable to a degree as a character, but on a long-term, it'd be more beneficial for both companies to choose either KH or DrakeNier.

As for the mii costumes, I do not mention that mii costumes cannot be fighters at the same time. I only mention the "rule" that characters from a franchise already represented in Smash will not (or rather, are unlikely to, as it would be a more accurate way of phrasing it) be DLC characters in the Fighters Pass. Again, I cannot stress enough that these so-called "rules" have the potential to change for the next wave of Fighters. Merely that at the present, these would indicate what is likely and what isn't, not what is impossible and what can happen (at the very least, that is how I use them here).


EDIT: Unrelated, and I didn't want to double post, but I thought this was something else to note.

What Reggie is saying is characters like Joker are “new to the series” because they are not playable in an official Super Smash Bros game prior. That is why he said Waluigi is not “part of the series”, as he is like Joker, not playable in an official Super Smash Bros game prior. Just like Corrin, just like Inklings, just like Ridley, just like R.O.B. like Piranha Plant, just like any character who wasn’t playable before.
 
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What Reggie is saying is characters like Joker are “new to the series” because they are not playable in an official Super Smash Bros game prior. That is why he said Waluigi is not “part of the series”, as he is like Joker, not playable in an official Super Smash Bros game prior. Just like Corrin, just like Inklings, just like Ridley, just like R.O.B. like Piranha Plant, just like any character who wasn’t playable before.
Admittedly, there's not much to go off of for either "interpretation" of this. In terms of what Reggie said really is up to interpretation, and though I can attempt to persuade you and vice versa, there's no objectively incorrect one unless Reggie decides to step forward now and clarify what he meant, but seeing as he's not working at Nintendo anymore...

Though, even on top of all of that, the idea that he meant "Completely new, not even having their franchises represented in smash in any shape or form in the past" has been objectively true thus far. This can change in the future, of course, only at the moment it isn't the likely outcome.
 
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Admittedly, there's not much to go off of for either "interpretation" of this. In terms of what Reggie said really is up to interpretation, and though I can attempt to persuade you and vice versa, there's no objectively incorrect one unless Reggie decides to step forward now and clarify what he meant, but seeing as he's not working at Nintendo anymore...

Though, even on top of all of that, the idea that he meant "Completely new, not even having their franchises represented in smash in any shape or form in the past" has been objectively true thus far. This can change in the future, of course, only at the moment it isn't the likely outcome.
You can try but I will never be convinced to change my mind. Reggie said “Waluigi isn’t part of the series” therefore, he isn’t part of the series until he is playable like Joker. He shouldn’t have said that if Waluigi was part of the series as an NPCs. Piranha Plant is also not part of the series until it became playable. And who knows what characters will become playable after the Plant be it as DLC or future installments. I’m sure some are dead-set that there will be “familiar franchise characters” will join the series like Dixie Kong, or Isaac, or Krystal.
 
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You can try but I will never be convinced to change my mind. Reggie said “Waluigi isn’t part of the series” therefore, he isn’t part of the series until he is playable like Joker. He shouldn’t have said that if Waluigi was part of the series as an NPCs. Piranha Plant is also not part of the series until it became playable. And who knows what characters will become playable after the Plant be it as DLC or future installments. I’m sure some are dead-set that there will be “familiar franchise characters” will join the series like Dixie Kong, or Isaac, or Krystal.
As I've noted before, I was speaking specifically about the notion of Fighters' Passes. Not DLC characters outside of the fighters passes, nor mii costumes.

As for these "arbitrary fan rules", I only mention three.

Characters from a franchise in Smash won't be in the Fighters Pass.
And like I said before,
In terms of what Reggie said really is up to interpretation, and though I can attempt to persuade you and vice versa, there's no objectively incorrect one
It is currently subjective how you interpret what Reggie said. What is objective is the fact that, as stated multiple times already, no character in the Fighters Pass thus far has been in smash in any shape or form, franchises included.

I can say that we do not know who will be playable as DLC (In this specific case, the Fighters Pass), but we can narrow down that list using history so far as an example to guess who's applicable (or rather, who is likely and who isn't).

Even if people think certain "familiar franchise characters" are locks for the Fighters Pass, that doesn't necessarily affect what is likely and what isn't, as it is another part of speculation in it of itself. If there are DLC characters outside of the Fighters Pass (be it "bonus" or individual), then, like Plant, I'd assume anyone is applicable (Including "familiar franchise characters").
 
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As I've noted before, I was speaking specifically about the notion of Fighters' Passes. Not DLC characters outside of the fighters passes, nor mii costumes.



And like I said before,

It is currently subjective how you interpret what Reggie said. What is objective is the fact that, as stated multiple times already, no character in the Fighters Pass thus far has been in smash in any shape or form, franchises included.

I can say that we do not know who will be playable as DLC (In this specific case, the Fighters Pass), but we can narrow down that list using history so far as an example to guess who's applicable (or rather, who is likely and who isn't).

Even if people think certain "familiar franchise characters" are locks for the Fighters Pass, that doesn't necessarily affect what is likely and what isn't, as it is another part of speculation in it of itself. If there are DLC characters outside of the Fighters Pass (be it "bonus" or individual), then, like Plant, I'd assume anyone is applicable (Including "familiar franchise characters").
Sure, sure, if that's what you think. Suit yourself. Reminds me of those guys who thinks K. Rook and Ridley will never be playable since they have a 1 in 5 chance.
 
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Sure, sure, if that's what you think. Suit yourself. Reminds me of those guys who thinks K. Rook and Ridley will never be playable since they have a 1 in 5 chance.
Ironically, I was one of the people pushing and begging for Sakurai to be in Smash during Smash 4's speculation era. The difference between this and then is that instead of "Too big" or "Too irrelevant", it's "Already represented in Smash in some shape or form".

To this day, I still feel like he was teasing Ridley supporters without fully showing him as a stage hazard...

That aside,


I find this especially amusing after getting sans as a mii costume in smash. They've all played each other's games at this point
No connections to 2B in smash, but I just like the thought of these two talking about each other's games.
 
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