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2011 DDD Matchup Discussion #6: Olimar

ZTD | TECHnology

Developing New TECHnology
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Location
Ferndale, MI
CHARACTER DISCUSSION #6: OLIMAR

BBR MU Chart says: -2
DDD Boards say: Discussion is in progress.
Can we Chaingrab? No








Why work when you have little carrot like creatures that can do it for you? With insane grab range, a lot of power and a very strong camping game, Olimar and his Pikmin has proven to be a big deal for us. How can we overcome this pint sized powerhouse?



Information we need:


-Both Characters Ground/Air Game Against Each Other-
-Moves To Avoid And How To Avoid Them-
-King Dedede's Moves To Utilize In The Matchup-
-Personal Strategies To Help With The Matchup-
-Stage Discussion For Starters, Counterpicks, And Bans-


 

Sush1

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 7, 2011
Messages
112
Location
Candy land.
Since i'm too new i will just say Olimar clearly outcamps us, our spacing tools won't do any good because he'll always be away, and don't expect olimar to go in the airs too often, like snake. I think DDD dominates the air in this MU.

And if you go offensive Olimar will wreck you with his multiple spacing tools (Fsmash, usmash). Quite a bad MU.
 

Supreme Dirt

King of the Railway
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
7,336
This MU is gay. -3 probably.

A campy Olimar is damn near impossible to beat. Basically your goal in this MU is to get Olimar into the air and juggle him.

Olimar's goal is to prevent that by ****** you.
 

Dark 3nergy

Smash Hero
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First tournament, first game was against richbrown

Go figure :troll:

Basically rush down DDD works best in this MU.


What is a rush down DDD?

Rush down DDD means absolutely no turtling or standing still. Always in the opponents face and never giving him any room to breathe. Unless you have a plan with Waddle D toss dont bother using it too much.

There is really no point trying to be full screen or at the other end of a stage camping against Olimar. He out camps DDD very well.

Tricks that help you get in;

*Dash, then Spotdodge next to him
Don't over use this good olimars will punish it with either utilt,nair,a smash or a grab. Its a really good way of getting in on the ground.

*Inhale
Gets olimar off the ground. If you mis space it olimar can very safely grab punish you out of it. I prefer using pivot inhales out of SH or FH while im air camping. But only as a mix up and seldomly do i use it. When i do use i make sure im always in range so he gets sucked in.

*Your aerials, utilt and Bthrow are your friends
Air camp olimar as best you can. With that being said do not go to final d or places like it. Go counter pick him to rainbow or Brinstar where he is forced into more aerial battles. Don't forget places like delfino where if you pressure him into the water hes in serious trouble if he has no blue pikmin. He might be a power house but with proper pressure on certain maps DDD can shut him down. He loses against our aerial moveset and inhale. If you see him whistling trying to use Super Armor to come back to the ground, keep hitting him, inhale or predict where he'll land and grab him. Just always make sure your never under neath him as uair and nair/utilt/usmash are some of his best get off me tools. Bthrow is best for damage, and sets up for walls of pain.

One of the problems of this MU is that DDD has no quick way of getting pikmin off him without exposing himself. Utilt is really DDDs best tool and it requires 2 things, being on the ground[olimar likes being grounded] and staling your best KO move, a KO move you most likely wont be using on olimar since hes always on the floor. Use it to get pikmin off you if you get over loaded with them. As for what color to pay most attention to? Whites, dont bother swatting off anything else besides whites. Whites do alot more damage when attached.

Heres a couple more tips on how to deal with pikmin.

Shielding/Air or Spot dodging - Pikmin that arent purple go past DDD and ignore his hitbox if your shielding. Purples cause DDD to have shield stun. So if you got purples coming at you dont forget to pshield them. Always make sure to avoid whites. Proper shielding is really the best way to avoid any grounded damage that isnt grabs.

*Use ftilt as a punisher
Good olimars will pshield and grab ftilts not used right.

*Dtilt
In some rare cases if you got a situation where olimar is trying to roll behind you, dtilt. Or if for some weird reason they get inside dtilt them out. Or jump back and aerial.


When Olimar is in the air or off the ground. Make sure he stays there. Don't be afraid to use Uthrow if necessary to keep him in the air. When hes off stage, make sure he stays off stage and never let him come back. Watch out for the pikmin chain, his upb. It'll stage spike if your not careful. He can also use this on stage to get you out of the air or through platforms.

Also Pikmin have very strange properties, they have hitboxes and their own health. There are times when they run back to olimar when you can hit them and kill them even during certain animations where a pikmin runs in front of olimar. If they latch onto DDDs nose you can swat them off with fair. Ftilt goes through olimars fsmash[cept purples i think]. So get a friend and experiment with how pikmin work. Keep in mind the more olimar has to pluck them, the better your chances he'll get punished and killed for doing so. Hes abit of a gimmicky character and all olimars will have one consistant habit, plucking, grabbing and whistle. Just make sure your punishing these habits as all olimars will use these moves at some point.
 

Le vieux lapin

Smash Ace
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Huh. That's weird. I used to use him in friendlies and one match went on for like ten minutes.
Eventually, I lost so many pikmin that I couldn't pull any more up. I thought he ran out. He just
did the pull animation... but no pikmin. I'm gonna go to the Oli boards and check it out... also
gonna see what they have to say on the D3 matchup.
 

Dark 3nergy

Smash Hero
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Pikmin can be pulled up for a maximum of 6 behind olimar at a time. When Olimar uses a move such as; Fair,Uair,Dair,Bair,Usmash,Dsmash,Fsmash,all Grabs the next pikmin in line is used in the attack so the damage/type of element the attack/the range the pikmin runs is applied to the move. The olimars did research on what colors are more commonly plucked from certain maps. So definitely look at.

Dont forget when olimar spawns on the stage with you, he only spawns with 3 pikmin. He must choose at the start of the match between you approaching him and attacking. Or plucking the last 3 pikmin. Spawn in pikmin are random as are the ones he typically plucks. And yes Olimar has a certain AT for plucking pikmin while running so its 0 lag. I've done it myself and its very useful for getting back pikmin that get lost. And pikmin de-synch from olimar often inside of the match so thats something to keep in mind--why? Because to re-synch them he has to whistle. This is kinda what makes Olimar a very gimmicky character is because of the pikmin mechanic. Olimars really have to multi task their pikmin in order to make effective use of them in a fight.

Pikmin also have a timer that they can be away from Olimar. If you go to temple, go to the bottom half and just pikmin toss on the platform down there. Then quickly run to the top of temple, the pikmin will get stuck on polygons on the underside and being unable to return to olimar they die after 20~15 seconds. Whistling will make them 'jump' back to you from ANYWHERE on temple. While this typically doesnt happen on neutrals and counter picks, knocking pikmin away still de-synchs them making olimar unable to use them.
 

Sush1

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 7, 2011
Messages
112
Location
Candy land.
Huh. That's weird. I used to use him in friendlies and one match went on for like ten minutes.
Eventually, I lost so many pikmin that I couldn't pull any more up. I thought he ran out. He just
did the pull animation... but no pikmin. I'm gonna go to the Oli boards and check it out... also
gonna see what they have to say on the D3 matchup.
This means you plucked the maximum pikmin.

You have a limited amount of 6 or 8, not sure. If one dies you can pluck another forever.
 

Sky Pirate

The best defense is a lot of frigging healing
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It's six pikmin.
Huh. That's weird. I used to use him in friendlies and one match went on for like ten minutes.
Eventually, I lost so many pikmin that I couldn't pull any more up. I thought he ran out. He just
did the pull animation... but no pikmin. I'm gonna go to the Oli boards and check it out... also
gonna see what they have to say on the D3 matchup.
Sometimes they can get blown off the top of the screen (they return in a moment or when whistle is used) or ghosted (you have to go to where they were lost and use an attack that uses a pikmin).

Curious, have any Dededes tried an incomplete Uair/Dair for gimping?
 

ZTD | TECHnology

Developing New TECHnology
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Olimar MU in a nutshell:

- Trying to camp is useless. Rush him down and stay on him.

- When you grab him Back Throw. You want him in the air and you want to make each punish count. Tech chasing is risky.

- Up-Tilt kills all Pikmin...but leaves you wide open. I use Nair sometimes in the air.

- Up-Tilt can also allow you to hop over Olimar's grab. Its hilarious.

- You will get comboed like a ***** at low percents.

- If you're paying too much attention to % you will lose. You will always be behind in this MU in terms of percent.

- Go for the gimp anytime you can get it. Sourspotted Back Airs wreck his recovery.

- Swallow is really good in close range if you've got past his grab range.
 

Le vieux lapin

Smash Ace
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I know you have to be on the offensive this whole match, so I have
to make the approach. But dashing at him will only get me grabbed,
and if I go in the air, my air dodge doesn't last long enough to escape
the pikmin throw frames.

Does a nair stop the pikmin from attaching to you?
 

Kaptain

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 30, 2010
Messages
675
Location
Statham, GA
Sometimes you just gotta take a pikmin or two to get in. D3 is heavy, as long as its not a white or a purple, you'll do more to him with your back throw.

:phone:
 

Skel'D3

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 27, 2010
Messages
40
Very difficult MU.

He will camp us with his pikmins and we will have to approach. To kill pikmins, there are two moves who are pretty good imo ; Fair & Utilt.

Try to punish his landing. Grab him near of the ledge to edgeguard him. I like inhale in this MU, he puts Olimar in a pretty bad position.

Be careful to grabs because : We have to approach but approaching, we will be grabbed if Olimar is on the ground so...

I will ban FD or CS in this MU.



60-40.
 
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