ShichibukaiJimbe
Smash Apprentice
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edit: sorry double post
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The Quick-Capturing Commando - Sami for SSB4! (Celebrating V-G Day! Hope marches on!)
- Thread starter TheTuninator
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ChronoBound
Smash Hero
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I wrote this on the Project M board in support of an Advance/Famicom Wars character:
Smash Bros. has always been a gathering of all of Nintendo’s various franchises and history. With each subsequent installment of Smash Bros. new franchises are granted content in Smash Bros., whether it be playable characters, stages, items, Assist Trophies, music, or trophies. There has been a greater call for Sakurai to give more Nintendo series a playable character in Smash Bros., and so far it looks like this will be the case (of the two Nintendo newcomers shown so far, both of them were representing series lacking a playable character in Brawl). Both “rumored” (from the same source that leaked Wii Fit Trainer, Villager, and Mega Man) Nintendo newcomers for Smash 4 (Little Mac and Mii) are also characters from series lacking playable in Brawl.
However, although this a positive sign, there are still quite a few series that very likely won’t receive a playable character in Smash 4, despite clearly deserving one. Golden Sun is a possible example of this. Despite Isaac being very highly requested for Smash 4 (among the Top 10 most wanted characters for Smash 4 among Western Smash Bros. fans), the very dismal performance of the third installment in Japan, as well as the lack of requests among Japanese fans, may mean the series will yet again only receive an Assist Trophy as opposed to a playable character (probably of Matthew).
However, in terms of long-running Nintendo franchises, perhaps the one example that is most striking, and much more likely than Golden Sun to be ignored in Smash 4, is that that of the Wars franchise (Famicom/Advance Wars). This series only received an Assist Trophy (which basically consisted of three sprite rips from GBA games), a trophy of that Assist Trophy, and six stickers (Andy, Sami, Max, Jake, Rachel, and Hawke).
The dismal popularity to the franchise in Japan, as well as the very low amount of requests in the West, basically ensures that the series won’t be receiving a playable character in Smash 4 at the very least (it may even lose its Assist Trophy representation).
However, the Wars franchise is a series that is very much deserving of playable representation in Smash Bros. Aside from Punch-Out, it’s the longest running Nintendo franchise with at least five installments under its belt, that has not been given a playable character yet in Smash Bros.
A little history and background about the Wars franchise.
The Wars franchise is often either referred to as the Famicom Wars or Advance Wars franchise. Depending on who you ask, the series have a minimum of seven installments to a maximum of twelve installments. There are seven games in the series developed by Intelligent Systems (Famicom Wars, Game Boy Wars, Super Famicom Wars, Advance Wars, Advance Wars 2: Black Hole Rising, Advance Wars: Dual Strike, Advance Wars: Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict). For the remaining five games, three of the games were developed and published by Hudson (a third-party), which were Game Boy Wars Turbo, Game Boy Wars 2, and Game Boy Wars 3. The remaining two games were real time strategy games developed by Kuju Entertainment (Battalion Wars and Battalion Wars 2).
Still, even strictly looking at the games developed in the series by Intelligent Systems (seven in all), the series is clearly deserving of a playable character.
Famicom Wars was the predecessor to Fire Emblem, being released by Intelligent Systems about two years before the first game in that series was released. While the Famicom Wars games (Famicom Wars, Game Boy Wars, and Super Famicom Wars) never reached the highs that the Fire Emblem series did in Japan in terms of popularity and sales, it did see a large fan following upon its first international release.
The first international release for the franchise was Advance Wars, released in September 10, 2001. The first international release was met with enormous praise and accolades. The game consequentially sold very well. In addition to the popularity of Marth and Roy in Melee, another huge factor for Fire Emblem going international was the sales success and praise of Advance Wars, according to one of the designers of the game.
As with the original Advance Wars, the sequel was also met with sales success and accolades in the West. This case was repeated with Dual Strike and Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict.
The case though with Japan was different. Although Advance Wars was originally planned for an October 2001 release, it was delayed in Japan due to the September 11th terrorist attacks, and the second installment as well was never released. It was not until November 25th 2004 that those games were released in Japan as part of a duo pack cartridge, however, it ended up selling poorly due to how close it was released to the Nintendo DS’s launch in Japan. Dual Strike also ended up selling poorly in Japan. The poor sales of the previous three titles developed by Intelligent Systems, may have been the primary reason why Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict was never released in Japan despite being made by a Japanese developer and already having a Japanese translation available for the game.
With three games released in the interim between Melee and Brawl (just going by Intelligent System’s mainline series), and Advance Wars released only two months prior to Melee, many people felt it was unfair that the series was basically ignored in terms of content in Brawl.
Being a very long running (starting from 1988), popular, and having many installments under its belt, why shouldn’t this notable Nintendo franchise have a playable character for Project M (especially since it likely will never happen for Smash Bros.)?
Well, for one, only four of the games developed by Intelligent Systems (the four combined games on the GBA and DS), were actually story driven (expanding it to the Battalion Wars games, only half of the entire series 6/12 actually had a plot).
Secondly, the Project M team has said that only characters that appeared in Brawl could be under consideration for playable inclusion as possible newcomers in Project M. This leaves only seven possible characters from this series to be under possible consideration for Project M: Andy, Sami, Max, Jake, Rachel, Hawke, and a generic soldier.
Regardless of the character chosen, it would probably be for the best to make the character someone that is a clone of Snake, who possesses a lot of military hardware and weapons.
Let’s get into each possible candidate.
Max:
Max is one of the most important CO’s in the entire series. He was a major supporting protagonist in Advance Wars, Black Hole Rising, and Dual Strike. While he did not have as much importance as Andy in the first one, he shared prominence with Sami and Andy in the sequel, and had the most important role of the “Big 3” in Dual Strike.
While Max is a part of the original CO trifecta, he often comes up less than both Andy and Sami as a prospective character. Due to his huge muscles, its pretty easy to imagine him as a “power” character, who have very strong physical power and a very high weight, but comes at the cost of speed and usually recovery. Considering that Snake is already a heavy, slow, and powerful character, putting in Max may not be as contrasting as other possible Advance Wars characters.
Jake:
Jake was basically the main character of Dual Strike. Nothing else can be said here. Despite being the main character of his game he rarely comes up. He could theoretically be quick, light, and weaker than Snake, though he could also fit in as an “well rounded” Snake clone. Nothing else to say here.
Rachel:
She is among the most important CO’s of Dual Strike. She is probably the most well known female CO after Sami. Nothing else to say about her
Hawke:
He was a major antagonist in Black Hole Rising. He returned in Dual Strike as a supporting protagonist. There is nothing else to say about him.
Generic soldier:
These characters have appeared in every game to this series, and were the Assist Trophy representing the franchise in Brawl (as sprite rips). While they come up every now and then, they are basically faceless characters.
There is really only two good choices for a possible character to represent the Wars franchise: Andy and Sami.
Both of these characters have various things going for them over the other one, so it may be down to personal preference as to which character would be the better one to represent the franchise.
Andy:
Andy was the most important character in the first international title to the Wars franchise, Advance Wars. He returned again in the sequel Black Hole Rising as one of the three most important protagonists. In Dual Strike, he is an unlockable character.
Due to Andy’s prominence in the first two international titles, he is one of the two most popularly requested character for an Advance Wars character. He could be a light quick weaker version of Snake.
Although he is not even seen using military weapons (he is usually depicted in artwork holding a wrench instead), there have been other child or child-like fighters in Smash Bros. before (Ness, Young Link, Toon Link, Lucas, Pit).
Andy may be the most well-known character in the series due to his prominence in the first two international games in the series.
Sami:
Sami was an important character in the first international Wars title, Advance Wars. She returned again in Black Hole rising, as one of three most important protagonists. She also made an appearance in Dual Strike.
Although not as important as Andy is, she rivals him in requests. Her prominence in the first two international titles, as well as her sporting military hardware in nearly every official piece of artwork for her,has made her the only other character from the series to receive a notable amount of requests. Additional artwork where she has be seen using realistic weapons are below:
Her usage of military weapons in nearly all of her official artwork, has made people more easily see her as a possible clone of Snake.
Andy vs. Sami:
Its really down to these two characters as to which one should represent the Wars franchise. Both have various advantages and disadvantages.
Andy:
+ Most well known Advance Wars character.
+ One of the two most requested Advance Wars characters.
+ Has more importance overall to the series than Sami.
- Is not as “hand to hand combat orientated” as Sami in both artwork and personality.
- May end up being criticized for “stealing a spot” from a more requested character due being both less popular and well known that more requested possible Project M newcomers.
Sami:
+ Probably the most well known character after Andy.
+ One of the two most requested Advance Wars characters.
+ Has high importance to the series
+ Is shown using military weapons in all of her artwork, making the transition to being a Snake clone much more believable.
+ Being female could shield her from more criticism if people are unaware of who she is (Zero Suit Samus/Wii Fit Trainer principle)
- Less important to the series than Andy, as well as less known.
- May seem like a “random” addition due to not having a singular “most important protagonist” role.
As such it may be down to which factors the person reading this values more.
However, there is another factor to look into which is, “how will people who are absolutely unfamiliar with this character, view him/her.”
For those who were around for the “Melee era” (basically, those who bought Melee back when Melee was first released or bought it prior to Brawl’s release). Think about your reaction to Marth and Roy. Nearly everyone who first unlocked those two characters in Melee did not know who they were or even what series they were from.
However, a lot of those people unfamiliar with those two characters, still felt a desire to play with them, and upon playing them, thought they were great additions to the roster. Many, many people (including myself) ending up enjoying Marth and/or Roy so much, that they sought out to play the source material games for their series (the Fire Emblem series).
Although Marth was a popularly requested character for Melee by the Japanese fanbase (he was by far more supported than the more recent lords Sigurd, Celice/Seliph, and Leaf despite his game having been released over seven years ago by the time Sakurai was taking fan requests for Melee), Roy was a character that Sakurai took a gamble on. Contrary to popular belief, it was Sakurai’s idea, not Intelligent System’s, to include Roy in Melee. When Sakurai had decided to expand Melee’s roster with six additional clones, one of the clone spots he decided on was one for Fire Emblem.
(Its important to note that Sakurai himself is a big fan of the Fire Emblem series. He took Iwata’s place in the Iwata Asks interview for Shadow Dragon, has a copy of FE3 downloaded onto his Wii, and has even gone on the record as to his favorite FE character, Nabarl, a mercenary from the games that Marth has been in).
Sakurai went to Intelligent Systems for permission to use a second Fire Emblem character for Melee, and while he was there got a sneak peak at FE6, which was in development at the time. Seeing Roy, Sakurai took a liking to the character, and became convinced that he would be a better choice than the three Jugdral lords (all of which received barely any requests from Sakurai’s pre-Melee poll). Sakurai felt that Roy’s fire sword helped contrast him more than other possible choices for a second Fire Emblem character. He also thought could help promote the series as a whole. Sakurai further explained on Roy’s update on the Japanese Melee Dojo that although players had yet to play Roy’s source material game, that he felt many people would love Roy for his “charm”.
It ended up that Roy became one of the most popular newcomers from Melee, and that he brought in a lot of new fans to the Fire Emblem series, proving Sakurai’s intuition correct.
From this history lesson, perhaps further clarity could be given to the Project M team about which Advance Wars character to choose to represent this long neglected (but important) Nintendo franchise, should they deem whether a character from this series would be something they would like to do or would be received well..
The thing is that both Andy and Sami are both relatively unknown characters today’s generation of Nintendo fans. The last Advance Wars game was released nearly six years ago (Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict). The last game to which both Andy and Sami had their most important role was in 2003 (although both characters also appearing in Dual Strike in 2005, they definitely did note have the prominence in it that they did in the previous two Advance Wars titles).
It might be more helpful to look at these two characters through the perspective of how people will like/enjoy them without knowing anything about them, and how likely they are to draw people in, much like Marth and Roy did back in Melee.
The fact is that Advance Wars characters have less requests than several other possible Project M newcomers, despite how feasible they would be (it would be very appropriate to make them Snake clones). As such, they need to look at this through the lens of how people they did not know about them or ask for them, will view the character.
As Sakurai would like to say, “Is the character someone that would make people want to try the game?”
While Andy has more importance over Sami, Sami might be more attractive as a character that would get more people to try the “Advance Wars character” simply due to how much she would contrast with the rest of the roster (there are only three-four woman fighters on the roster, and in terms of requests for Project M newcomers, Lyn is the only woman that is popularly requested). However, while she would seem like a much better addition in the eyes of those unfamiliar with the franchise, she may end up seeming “less deserving” to those more familiar with the franchise.
It would be fitting to go with the “Marth/Roy principle” for an Advance Wars characters considering the franchise is the sister series to Fire Emblem. By making the character appealing, they would help bring in possible new fans to the Wars franchise after enjoying the character in Project M, and yet also make them seem more at “home” in Smash Bros.
However, in my view, both characters are deserving of playable inclusion in Project M, and would help bring an important aspect of Nintendo’s history to the roster.
Some obstacles with including an Advance Wars character:
There are definitely a few obstacles to including an Advance Wars character:
- They are not highly requested as over choices.
- They have no 3D models for which the Project M team to base off of for how they would look in 3D.
- Have no voices (would require file rips from other video games for characters that may seem similar enough to them, that they would plausibly work as a voice for Andy or Sami in Project M).
- Likely would be unable to have the Cyper as a recovery move since that is a Metal Gear exclusive machine, so a new recovery move would have to be made for them.
- Copter Final Smash with the reticule may not be the most appropriate (a Landmaster-esque Final Smash where a tank from Advance Wars comes down may be a better choice).
However, despite this, including an Advance Wars fighter would still be an attractive choice. As said, a character from this franchise would represent one of the longest running Nintendo franchise lacking a playable character in Smash Bros. Secondly, depending on how they execute, they would repeat the “Marth/Roy principle” which is a character for which most people are unfamiliar with would end up becoming one of the most popular additions, simply due to how distinctive they are with the rest of the cast.
The Project M team has the opportunity to finally do things that that Sakurai has yet to do in Smash Bros. (the jury is still out on whether Ridley will be playable or Ganondorf will be de-cloned in Smash 4). However, as it stands, its very unlikely that an Advance Wars character will be added in Smash 4 for the reasons outlined in this piece.
The Wars franchise is the sister-series for Fire Emblem and probably the most popular and iconic Nintendo franchise (aside from Golden Sun) that will still be lacking a playable character in Smash Bros. after the release of Smash 4. For this reason, such a character is an extremely attractive choice to the Project M team as well as fans of both Nintendo and Smash Bros.
I hope that this piece offers some more clarity on this topic as well as this often over-looked franchise. It may have been long, but I hope that a few people at least had some enjoyment (or at least interest) in reading it.
I personally as a solitary fan, may not know what is best, so forgive for any possible hubris or “here is what to do and do it now” ethos in this piece.
My main hope was simply to bring more awareness about the Wars franchise to those who may be unfamiliar with it, and why it possibly deserves a spot in Project M.
Thank you for your time and patience.
Smash Bros. has always been a gathering of all of Nintendo’s various franchises and history. With each subsequent installment of Smash Bros. new franchises are granted content in Smash Bros., whether it be playable characters, stages, items, Assist Trophies, music, or trophies. There has been a greater call for Sakurai to give more Nintendo series a playable character in Smash Bros., and so far it looks like this will be the case (of the two Nintendo newcomers shown so far, both of them were representing series lacking a playable character in Brawl). Both “rumored” (from the same source that leaked Wii Fit Trainer, Villager, and Mega Man) Nintendo newcomers for Smash 4 (Little Mac and Mii) are also characters from series lacking playable in Brawl.
However, although this a positive sign, there are still quite a few series that very likely won’t receive a playable character in Smash 4, despite clearly deserving one. Golden Sun is a possible example of this. Despite Isaac being very highly requested for Smash 4 (among the Top 10 most wanted characters for Smash 4 among Western Smash Bros. fans), the very dismal performance of the third installment in Japan, as well as the lack of requests among Japanese fans, may mean the series will yet again only receive an Assist Trophy as opposed to a playable character (probably of Matthew).
However, in terms of long-running Nintendo franchises, perhaps the one example that is most striking, and much more likely than Golden Sun to be ignored in Smash 4, is that that of the Wars franchise (Famicom/Advance Wars). This series only received an Assist Trophy (which basically consisted of three sprite rips from GBA games), a trophy of that Assist Trophy, and six stickers (Andy, Sami, Max, Jake, Rachel, and Hawke).
The dismal popularity to the franchise in Japan, as well as the very low amount of requests in the West, basically ensures that the series won’t be receiving a playable character in Smash 4 at the very least (it may even lose its Assist Trophy representation).
However, the Wars franchise is a series that is very much deserving of playable representation in Smash Bros. Aside from Punch-Out, it’s the longest running Nintendo franchise with at least five installments under its belt, that has not been given a playable character yet in Smash Bros.
A little history and background about the Wars franchise.
The Wars franchise is often either referred to as the Famicom Wars or Advance Wars franchise. Depending on who you ask, the series have a minimum of seven installments to a maximum of twelve installments. There are seven games in the series developed by Intelligent Systems (Famicom Wars, Game Boy Wars, Super Famicom Wars, Advance Wars, Advance Wars 2: Black Hole Rising, Advance Wars: Dual Strike, Advance Wars: Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict). For the remaining five games, three of the games were developed and published by Hudson (a third-party), which were Game Boy Wars Turbo, Game Boy Wars 2, and Game Boy Wars 3. The remaining two games were real time strategy games developed by Kuju Entertainment (Battalion Wars and Battalion Wars 2).
Still, even strictly looking at the games developed in the series by Intelligent Systems (seven in all), the series is clearly deserving of a playable character.
Famicom Wars was the predecessor to Fire Emblem, being released by Intelligent Systems about two years before the first game in that series was released. While the Famicom Wars games (Famicom Wars, Game Boy Wars, and Super Famicom Wars) never reached the highs that the Fire Emblem series did in Japan in terms of popularity and sales, it did see a large fan following upon its first international release.
The first international release for the franchise was Advance Wars, released in September 10, 2001. The first international release was met with enormous praise and accolades. The game consequentially sold very well. In addition to the popularity of Marth and Roy in Melee, another huge factor for Fire Emblem going international was the sales success and praise of Advance Wars, according to one of the designers of the game.
As with the original Advance Wars, the sequel was also met with sales success and accolades in the West. This case was repeated with Dual Strike and Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict.
The case though with Japan was different. Although Advance Wars was originally planned for an October 2001 release, it was delayed in Japan due to the September 11th terrorist attacks, and the second installment as well was never released. It was not until November 25th 2004 that those games were released in Japan as part of a duo pack cartridge, however, it ended up selling poorly due to how close it was released to the Nintendo DS’s launch in Japan. Dual Strike also ended up selling poorly in Japan. The poor sales of the previous three titles developed by Intelligent Systems, may have been the primary reason why Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict was never released in Japan despite being made by a Japanese developer and already having a Japanese translation available for the game.
With three games released in the interim between Melee and Brawl (just going by Intelligent System’s mainline series), and Advance Wars released only two months prior to Melee, many people felt it was unfair that the series was basically ignored in terms of content in Brawl.
Being a very long running (starting from 1988), popular, and having many installments under its belt, why shouldn’t this notable Nintendo franchise have a playable character for Project M (especially since it likely will never happen for Smash Bros.)?
Well, for one, only four of the games developed by Intelligent Systems (the four combined games on the GBA and DS), were actually story driven (expanding it to the Battalion Wars games, only half of the entire series 6/12 actually had a plot).
Secondly, the Project M team has said that only characters that appeared in Brawl could be under consideration for playable inclusion as possible newcomers in Project M. This leaves only seven possible characters from this series to be under possible consideration for Project M: Andy, Sami, Max, Jake, Rachel, Hawke, and a generic soldier.
Regardless of the character chosen, it would probably be for the best to make the character someone that is a clone of Snake, who possesses a lot of military hardware and weapons.
Let’s get into each possible candidate.
Max:
Max is one of the most important CO’s in the entire series. He was a major supporting protagonist in Advance Wars, Black Hole Rising, and Dual Strike. While he did not have as much importance as Andy in the first one, he shared prominence with Sami and Andy in the sequel, and had the most important role of the “Big 3” in Dual Strike.
While Max is a part of the original CO trifecta, he often comes up less than both Andy and Sami as a prospective character. Due to his huge muscles, its pretty easy to imagine him as a “power” character, who have very strong physical power and a very high weight, but comes at the cost of speed and usually recovery. Considering that Snake is already a heavy, slow, and powerful character, putting in Max may not be as contrasting as other possible Advance Wars characters.
Jake:
Jake was basically the main character of Dual Strike. Nothing else can be said here. Despite being the main character of his game he rarely comes up. He could theoretically be quick, light, and weaker than Snake, though he could also fit in as an “well rounded” Snake clone. Nothing else to say here.
Rachel:
She is among the most important CO’s of Dual Strike. She is probably the most well known female CO after Sami. Nothing else to say about her
Hawke:
He was a major antagonist in Black Hole Rising. He returned in Dual Strike as a supporting protagonist. There is nothing else to say about him.
Generic soldier:
These characters have appeared in every game to this series, and were the Assist Trophy representing the franchise in Brawl (as sprite rips). While they come up every now and then, they are basically faceless characters.
There is really only two good choices for a possible character to represent the Wars franchise: Andy and Sami.
Both of these characters have various things going for them over the other one, so it may be down to personal preference as to which character would be the better one to represent the franchise.
Andy:
Andy was the most important character in the first international title to the Wars franchise, Advance Wars. He returned again in the sequel Black Hole Rising as one of the three most important protagonists. In Dual Strike, he is an unlockable character.
Due to Andy’s prominence in the first two international titles, he is one of the two most popularly requested character for an Advance Wars character. He could be a light quick weaker version of Snake.
Although he is not even seen using military weapons (he is usually depicted in artwork holding a wrench instead), there have been other child or child-like fighters in Smash Bros. before (Ness, Young Link, Toon Link, Lucas, Pit).
Andy may be the most well-known character in the series due to his prominence in the first two international games in the series.
Sami:
Sami was an important character in the first international Wars title, Advance Wars. She returned again in Black Hole rising, as one of three most important protagonists. She also made an appearance in Dual Strike.
Although not as important as Andy is, she rivals him in requests. Her prominence in the first two international titles, as well as her sporting military hardware in nearly every official piece of artwork for her,has made her the only other character from the series to receive a notable amount of requests. Additional artwork where she has be seen using realistic weapons are below:
Her usage of military weapons in nearly all of her official artwork, has made people more easily see her as a possible clone of Snake.
Andy vs. Sami:
Its really down to these two characters as to which one should represent the Wars franchise. Both have various advantages and disadvantages.
Andy:
+ Most well known Advance Wars character.
+ One of the two most requested Advance Wars characters.
+ Has more importance overall to the series than Sami.
- Is not as “hand to hand combat orientated” as Sami in both artwork and personality.
- May end up being criticized for “stealing a spot” from a more requested character due being both less popular and well known that more requested possible Project M newcomers.
Sami:
+ Probably the most well known character after Andy.
+ One of the two most requested Advance Wars characters.
+ Has high importance to the series
+ Is shown using military weapons in all of her artwork, making the transition to being a Snake clone much more believable.
+ Being female could shield her from more criticism if people are unaware of who she is (Zero Suit Samus/Wii Fit Trainer principle)
- Less important to the series than Andy, as well as less known.
- May seem like a “random” addition due to not having a singular “most important protagonist” role.
As such it may be down to which factors the person reading this values more.
However, there is another factor to look into which is, “how will people who are absolutely unfamiliar with this character, view him/her.”
For those who were around for the “Melee era” (basically, those who bought Melee back when Melee was first released or bought it prior to Brawl’s release). Think about your reaction to Marth and Roy. Nearly everyone who first unlocked those two characters in Melee did not know who they were or even what series they were from.
However, a lot of those people unfamiliar with those two characters, still felt a desire to play with them, and upon playing them, thought they were great additions to the roster. Many, many people (including myself) ending up enjoying Marth and/or Roy so much, that they sought out to play the source material games for their series (the Fire Emblem series).
Although Marth was a popularly requested character for Melee by the Japanese fanbase (he was by far more supported than the more recent lords Sigurd, Celice/Seliph, and Leaf despite his game having been released over seven years ago by the time Sakurai was taking fan requests for Melee), Roy was a character that Sakurai took a gamble on. Contrary to popular belief, it was Sakurai’s idea, not Intelligent System’s, to include Roy in Melee. When Sakurai had decided to expand Melee’s roster with six additional clones, one of the clone spots he decided on was one for Fire Emblem.
(Its important to note that Sakurai himself is a big fan of the Fire Emblem series. He took Iwata’s place in the Iwata Asks interview for Shadow Dragon, has a copy of FE3 downloaded onto his Wii, and has even gone on the record as to his favorite FE character, Nabarl, a mercenary from the games that Marth has been in).
Sakurai went to Intelligent Systems for permission to use a second Fire Emblem character for Melee, and while he was there got a sneak peak at FE6, which was in development at the time. Seeing Roy, Sakurai took a liking to the character, and became convinced that he would be a better choice than the three Jugdral lords (all of which received barely any requests from Sakurai’s pre-Melee poll). Sakurai felt that Roy’s fire sword helped contrast him more than other possible choices for a second Fire Emblem character. He also thought could help promote the series as a whole. Sakurai further explained on Roy’s update on the Japanese Melee Dojo that although players had yet to play Roy’s source material game, that he felt many people would love Roy for his “charm”.
It ended up that Roy became one of the most popular newcomers from Melee, and that he brought in a lot of new fans to the Fire Emblem series, proving Sakurai’s intuition correct.
From this history lesson, perhaps further clarity could be given to the Project M team about which Advance Wars character to choose to represent this long neglected (but important) Nintendo franchise, should they deem whether a character from this series would be something they would like to do or would be received well..
The thing is that both Andy and Sami are both relatively unknown characters today’s generation of Nintendo fans. The last Advance Wars game was released nearly six years ago (Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict). The last game to which both Andy and Sami had their most important role was in 2003 (although both characters also appearing in Dual Strike in 2005, they definitely did note have the prominence in it that they did in the previous two Advance Wars titles).
It might be more helpful to look at these two characters through the perspective of how people will like/enjoy them without knowing anything about them, and how likely they are to draw people in, much like Marth and Roy did back in Melee.
The fact is that Advance Wars characters have less requests than several other possible Project M newcomers, despite how feasible they would be (it would be very appropriate to make them Snake clones). As such, they need to look at this through the lens of how people they did not know about them or ask for them, will view the character.
As Sakurai would like to say, “Is the character someone that would make people want to try the game?”
While Andy has more importance over Sami, Sami might be more attractive as a character that would get more people to try the “Advance Wars character” simply due to how much she would contrast with the rest of the roster (there are only three-four woman fighters on the roster, and in terms of requests for Project M newcomers, Lyn is the only woman that is popularly requested). However, while she would seem like a much better addition in the eyes of those unfamiliar with the franchise, she may end up seeming “less deserving” to those more familiar with the franchise.
It would be fitting to go with the “Marth/Roy principle” for an Advance Wars characters considering the franchise is the sister series to Fire Emblem. By making the character appealing, they would help bring in possible new fans to the Wars franchise after enjoying the character in Project M, and yet also make them seem more at “home” in Smash Bros.
However, in my view, both characters are deserving of playable inclusion in Project M, and would help bring an important aspect of Nintendo’s history to the roster.
Some obstacles with including an Advance Wars character:
There are definitely a few obstacles to including an Advance Wars character:
- They are not highly requested as over choices.
- They have no 3D models for which the Project M team to base off of for how they would look in 3D.
- Have no voices (would require file rips from other video games for characters that may seem similar enough to them, that they would plausibly work as a voice for Andy or Sami in Project M).
- Likely would be unable to have the Cyper as a recovery move since that is a Metal Gear exclusive machine, so a new recovery move would have to be made for them.
- Copter Final Smash with the reticule may not be the most appropriate (a Landmaster-esque Final Smash where a tank from Advance Wars comes down may be a better choice).
However, despite this, including an Advance Wars fighter would still be an attractive choice. As said, a character from this franchise would represent one of the longest running Nintendo franchise lacking a playable character in Smash Bros. Secondly, depending on how they execute, they would repeat the “Marth/Roy principle” which is a character for which most people are unfamiliar with would end up becoming one of the most popular additions, simply due to how distinctive they are with the rest of the cast.
The Project M team has the opportunity to finally do things that that Sakurai has yet to do in Smash Bros. (the jury is still out on whether Ridley will be playable or Ganondorf will be de-cloned in Smash 4). However, as it stands, its very unlikely that an Advance Wars character will be added in Smash 4 for the reasons outlined in this piece.
The Wars franchise is the sister-series for Fire Emblem and probably the most popular and iconic Nintendo franchise (aside from Golden Sun) that will still be lacking a playable character in Smash Bros. after the release of Smash 4. For this reason, such a character is an extremely attractive choice to the Project M team as well as fans of both Nintendo and Smash Bros.
I hope that this piece offers some more clarity on this topic as well as this often over-looked franchise. It may have been long, but I hope that a few people at least had some enjoyment (or at least interest) in reading it.
I personally as a solitary fan, may not know what is best, so forgive for any possible hubris or “here is what to do and do it now” ethos in this piece.
My main hope was simply to bring more awareness about the Wars franchise to those who may be unfamiliar with it, and why it possibly deserves a spot in Project M.
Thank you for your time and patience.
ChronoBound
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No thoughts on Sami being a Snake clone for Project M?
Sounds cool.
I agree that it is unlikely that she'll show up in Smash Wii U/3DS (even though I'd freakin' love it if she did). I'm holding out for Sami in SSB5. Unless Nintendo drops a ton of new IP in the next 6 or so years, they'll be in real need of some new franchise newcomers for Smash 5. The Wars series, having appeared on nearly every Nintendo system, seems ripe for the picking...maybe not this time around but definitely next time.
TheTuninator
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That's quite the post! Well done. I'd love to see Sami in Project M, but if I recall correctly aren't they limiting themselves to only characters licensed for use in Brawl? Still, if/when the clone engine is released to the public, who knows?
Sabrewulf238
Smash Hero
Sami has recently snuck into my top ten most wanted newcomers. I've only played (and own) the original Advance Wars on gba. I can't even remember what made me buy the game, it was just one of those spur of the moment purchases.
Sami appeals to me more than Andy, mainly because why would you squeeze Andy into a fighting role (he doesn't seem like a close combat fighter) when Sami is almost equally as important and fits the role so well.
Sami appeals to me more than Andy, mainly because why would you squeeze Andy into a fighting role (he doesn't seem like a close combat fighter) when Sami is almost equally as important and fits the role so well.
Yomi's Biggest Fan
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As mu8ch as I'm a sucker for war games, you can count me as the new Sami supporter. He overall moveset speaks for itself; tanks, copters, military might, close combat, and various explosives. As long as they avoid the machine gun since we all know how Sakurai feels about realistic weapons (ex: bullet shooting guns) other than explosives and swords. Unless, they alter it to look cartoony or bright light the other times like the Super Scope and Ray Gun.
TheTuninator
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Thanks for the support, everybody! Only a few months until the ultimate moment of truth now. Let's hope for an AW rep!
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
A little up to support Sami!
Either as a Snake "heir", with a totally new moveset or a blend of the two. Advance Wars deserves a spot.
Either as a Snake "heir", with a totally new moveset or a blend of the two. Advance Wars deserves a spot.
Zulyar
Smash Cadet
i most certainly support this idea aswell, AW is a great game and a rep would definately be welcomes by me, as a personal preferance i'd also choose sami over max and andy, asking for more then 1 is going to far though for sure. we'd need to wat and see if the AW gets blown in new life, as i too wasn't particilarly happy with days of ruin, though i could remember having issues sleeping with the hype for a new AW game.
You has my support.
You has my support.
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
And, dream scenario, Andy, Sami and Max as a team (like the Pokemon Trainer), switching by using a helicopter ladder.
With an obvious Megatank Final Smash, with the 3 being in it like this:
(I know it's not a Megatank)
With an obvious Megatank Final Smash, with the 3 being in it like this:
(I know it's not a Megatank)
BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
Andy, Max, Sami trio
Ooh now that surely sounds real interesting.
Ooh now that surely sounds real interesting.
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
It would be fun to see, for exemple, Andy spawning a little tank (similar to the AT in Brawl) switching to Sami/Max, and attacking with them while Andy's attack is still here.
Or, if Sami get Snake's moveset, leaving a mine and switching. Could be fun having the three cooperating, even if not on screen.
Or, if Sami get Snake's moveset, leaving a mine and switching. Could be fun having the three cooperating, even if not on screen.
ChronoBound
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I think Sami's only hope is for Project M. However, considering how small the pool is there for highly requested characters, she has a decent chance of making it in, especially considering she is a very feasible clone.
Yeah. Outside of Punch-Out, Mii, and Golden Sun, Advance Wars is easily the most deserving series lacking a playable character in Smash Bros.
jaytalks
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At the very least I expect Wars to get some better content representation considering the 3DS is going to focus on portable games. But yeah, as far as series go a spot would be well warranted. Depending on your definition of old, Wars could be the old franchise that Sakurai is talking about in that one quote. Wishful thinking but maybe.
TheTuninator
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I dream of an AW tag character. A tag character makes more sense for AW than most other franchises. Of course, getting one rep will be a miracle, let alone two. Still, we can dream!
Advance Wars isn't really that old, so I'm doubtful. Five years between games is a long time, but scant few years compared to the gaps in other series.But yeah, hopefully the focus on portable games for the 3DS will give Wars some more content. Given the series' legendary reputation and solid popularity as one of Nintendo's handheld franchises, we could certainly hope for a stage at the least.
A Smash rep would do wonders for reviving Advance Wars, which is yet another reason why I have my fingers crossed for a rep this cycle.
jaytalks
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If you look at the quote, its talking about reviving an old franchise, so they oldness can refer to how old the series, while applying the reviving part to advance wars. I really have no idea what Sakurai is talking about, because there arent a lot international NES franchises not in Smash.
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
Considering Pokemon got not one, not two, but five characters, if we consider Lucario, Squirtle, Ivysaur, charizard & the Trainer (but the Trainer isn't really a playable character), having a new 3 in 1 character isn't too farfetched, even if we are talking about Pokemon, a huge franchise.
An "Orange Star" character seems perfect for this.
TheTuninator
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Sadly, Advance Wars just doesn't have the pull to get what amounts to 3 reps. Sakurai likely would adhere to the principle of tags and give us only 2 COs, in any case.
It's a damn shame that AW doesn't have the popularity to rate two characters, because an AW tag character would be fun and nifty.
It's a damn shame that AW doesn't have the popularity to rate two characters, because an AW tag character would be fun and nifty.
TheTuninator
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I love that model to death. Absolutely incredible work. Makes me wish for an AW rep in Smash 4 even more.
I really can't adequately express how awesome it is to see Advance Wars brought to life in 3D.
I really can't adequately express how awesome it is to see Advance Wars brought to life in 3D.
Inawordyes
Smash Lord
I'd would have thought her eyes would be a little more squinted and Oriental-looking based off her artwork, haha. But seriously, if this is a true leak then I will love the Project M for a long while because Sami is one of my favorite Nintendo characters. And even if it's not I share the sentiments of TheTuninator, that model is amazing.
Wii Twerk Trainer
Smash Ace
I wonder how Sami will fight in project m
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
Oh god this looks awesome.
TheTuninator
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Well, the Project M team says the leak is false, and I'm inclined to believe them.
Yeah, the eyes are definitely a little different, but it works. Orange Star is the America of Wars World, after all.
It really does. This model has only fueled my desire to see AW characters in glorious CGI for an intro cutscene. We can dream!
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
So if the Project M team says the leak it false... Maybe it's a SSB4 leak? 
The more I look at it, the more awesome it is. Like you, it only fueled my desire to see AW characters in 3D!
The more I look at it, the more awesome it is. Like you, it only fueled my desire to see AW characters in 3D!
dezeray112
Smash Hero
Where did this whole Sami in Project M rumor started?
TheTuninator
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Somebody on 4chan found the above model on Vaanrose's webpage and started a thread with it. Things escalated rather quickly when somebody claiming to be a member of the Project M team started posting what they claimed were the team's design documents and various assets being worked on, such as alt costumes. Nothing was conclusively proven, and as with all 4chan leaks, it's best to take things with a serious grain of salt.
Superyoshiom
Smash Master
I'm fine with Sami or Andy for an AW rep. Seriously, it's about time that series get a rep.
TheTuninator
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Amen to that. Smash 4 is the optimal time for AW to get a rep, since every major Nintendo series already has at least 2 reps. I do hope Sakurai opts for adding more series rather than bolstering the existing ones this time around.
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
I'm usually not a fan of transposing movesets on a character, but for once, I'll would be totally fine in putting Snake's moveset on Sami. She is in charge of the infantries after all.
TheTuninator
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Snake's normals work pretty well for Sami. However, an AW-inspired set of goofy special moves would definitely fit the series best. Unit call-ins, Powers, building captures, etc.
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
And that's why we need two reps :3
Andy as the commanding character, and Sami as the soldier, with goofier items than Snake's one, for sure.
BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
Incorporating Snake's moveset into Sami is a good idea both in Project M and in SSB4. And if Snake had to be cut for whatever reason, Sami or Andy would be the best replacements.
Erotic&Heretic
Smash Master
Yes, of course, it's considering Snake doesn't return. Something I can imagine happening, and the reason why I don't want his moveset to be gone.