Your improvements as a Luigi main

[Kursed]

Hello fellow Luigi players! This thread somewhat specifies the flaws a lot of players have when using Luigi including my/your own. I'm just trying to get a lot of responses so I can improve my Luigi technique.

Here is what I feel I do not do enough in battle:

- Throw more fireballs!
I beat myself up for this many times, But I never throw enough fireballs. I have seen so many players spam fireballs effectively and it really works. This is probably my priority 1.

- I don't space myself out too much.
When I play as Luigi, I feel as if I'm approaching the other player the entire match. No bluffing or anything like that which I should. A really good tool I need to use is back air if the other player approaches me.

- Become more unpredictable!
As discussed in other threads, Luigi's air speed is pretty slow. I don't mind it because I can combo easier, but to make a successful grab combo I shouldn't just run up and grab the other player the entire game.



I feel as if those are my faults as a Luigi main. If I can improve on this I'll become much better. What do you feel you need to work on?

 

[XCounter]

One thing I need to work on keeping track of my second jump. I need to work on keeping it and knowing the best time to use it in order to recover.

Another thing I need to work on converting a down throw into a combo every time I go for it. Whether I go for an up-B, down-B, an aerial or a normal, I need to be certain that it will hit. That should just come with more practice.

I also need to find new ways to approach a match, because constantly approaching looking for grabs isn't going to work against everyone. Like you said, if the situation calls for it I need to be able to start using fireballs and make the opponent attempt to approach me.

 

[ThunderSt0rm]

All luigi mains should work on consistent powershielding. Being able to do this has immensely helped me out.

 

[louie g]

One think that I can of is that I suffer from being juggled a lot. Popping luigi up in the air repeatedly is the same as playing vollyball with a balloon, the best I can do is nair my way down, down B reverse to fake the opponent out, or just green missile my way to the ledge to take that route, it's awkward!

 

[ThunderSt0rm]

If you're ok with working your way onto the stage from ledge, then go for the ledge to escape juggles. When I think about it that's usually what I unconsciously end up doing.

Make sure to mix things up when trying to escape a juggle. Be ready to react to an attack with an airdodge and know what aerials outprioritize yours so that you don't go challenging an aerial you have no way to beat out.

 

[Sleek Media]

Accomplished:

• better movement with foxtrot
• better input with pivot grabs
• dThrow->cyclone

Need:

• cyclone recovery without the jump
• sweet spotting dAir
• jab cancel mixups
• dThrow->upB, dThrow->nAir
• pivot uSmash

 

[Lexiconz]

for what i have read here already, im fine with my playstyle with luigi, but as thunder said, i noticed that one of the most important things in Smash4 is to know how to defend properly, as luigi needs to grab a lot, and power shielding is the most effective way to get near without losing the spacing, i will train this a lot.

For the spacing and approach i will give some advice : make use of the good aerial speed of luigi , short hop fair, dair than a retreating fireball or nair ( make the mix up) and sometimes when i'm landing, my opponent thinks "ok i got him, after landing i will punish him", i just use the cyclone sometimes without mashing , hit them for some % and gaining an upper hand.

And of course, a empty short hop ff to grab works wonder sometimes , cause your opponent will most of the time be using shield when you short hop because of your spacing with the aerials and fireball, this way, ff and grabbing works a lot.

And theres some techniques that i would like to train 2, like reverse neutral b... for changing the direction im falling instantly, to not get juggled...down-t down-b for the early kills,
And something that J miller used a lot.. and i found this out to be huge... its the down-t b-air combo... near the edge this is mortal

-> : /watch?v=qlLmyVVtFkU in this replay, winners finals he used it at
: 1:53 ( kill ) and 3:11 (nokill)

-> : /watch?v=g2EFIzijDfg in this one , grand final he used it at
: 6:11( kill ) , 8:26 ( nokill) , 12:56(kill) , 23:27 (kill)

so , out of 6 time used , he killed with it 4 times without counting it all the other games.... thats a good number.. and the other ones almost killed 2.... thats something i will try to master ...

cya

 

[Ludiloco]

Hey guys, new Luigi main checking in

I feel like I have a very solid grip on Luigi's overall game. I can get combos regardless of DI, know whether to recover high or low based on matchup, and I feel I use cyclone very effectively.

However, there are some things I feel I need to work on.
1. As mentioned in this thread, saving my jump. As a Dedede secondary I've been able to get away with jumping after being knocked far away from the stage because it slows your momentum and may prevent a death or two. Luigi absolutely cannot afford to waste his jump, especially in matchups against gimpy characters like Sheik, Rosalina, and Pikachu. I also feel I recover from below with cyclone a bit too often, but I'm getting better at not doing that. It's a nice mixup but not the answer to everything (especially nice when the opponent gets baited down to gimp you).

2. D-throw reverse bair. Super clutch kill option, I need to work on that.

3. Pivot fireballs, pivot grab (note I am talking about perfect pivots)

4. This is just an overall thing with me that will fade with experience, but so often I'm so excited that I got downthrow fair fair that I finish the following jab combo instead of jab grab or jab jab grab. I also need to start pummeling when I grab, overall I think I just need to calm down and realize I can hang with/take games off of most players if I just relax and don't over commit.

Any other criticism is welcome, I just ordered an el gato yesterday so videos should be coming soon!

 

[sims796]

Stop hitting the damn Green Missile when I meant to go for Cyclone.

 

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

Things I'm currently working on:

• Quick reaction to do aerials OoS instead of rolling away or dropping shield first
• Quick reaction to Utilt when opponent is behind me
• More Bairs in neutral
• Dthrow->Bair
• Cyclone gimp
• Perfect ledge trumping

 

[King_Peachee]

There are times when you can create meteor smash opportunities with dair. If your opponent is on the ledge and you give them some space, maybe throw a few fire balls out and then they get up from the ledge to shield because they expect your pressure, you can grab them, dthrow short hop dair. This works on a lot of characters, but not all. You've got to practice the timing of it all. You also cannot expect the opponent to get up the same way from the ledge. This is an opportunity you just have to look out for and take it when you get it.

 

[The_World]

My biggest problem with Luigi is that I don't read when using him, which makes me unaware of any patterns that are happening, in turn causing me to approach in very predictable Luigi ways. I've started to learn how to read people and in the last couple of days it's proven very useful!

Other things I want to work on:
-Pivot Fireball: it's another tool that I don't utilize often, and is probably great to turn around and get a Bair KO.
-Cyclone Recovery w/o 2nd Jump: it's extra hard to do on the DS but I'm working on it
-Getting Dair/Super Jump Punch Sweet-Spot more

These are more general things I need to work on:
-playing off stage more confidently
-shorthopping more consistently
-better reading
-better Edge-Guarding

 

[MarioFireRed]

Currently working on:
-Successfully performing Down Throw to Up B (I believe it's a Full Hop then Shoryuken)
-Cyclone Recovery w/o Double Jump
-Dair sweet-spotting
-More consistent ground/air pivoted fireballs instead of Green Missile cause 3DS
-OoS options, specifically timing the (dash) grab correctly or Nair
-Down Throw RAR Bair (Seen this but never tried it myself)

 

[TriTails]

Still working on:
- Dash cancel more
- Jumpless Cyclone
- Spacings
- Remember F-air has the same landing lag as an airdodge
- Stop hitting the Missile when I meant to do a aerial Fireball
- Shieldgrabs more
- D-air chaingrab
- D-air spike to FF N-air at low percentages

 

[USPY.3620]

Played Luigi in my second official tournament yesterday. HUGE improvement out than my first tournament - here's where I think I improved:

• Better opponent reads with f-smash. Was able to successfully bait the approach with fireballs - opponent rolled right into my f-smash.
• N-air combo break was clutch against the heavy combo fighters.
• WAY better pacing with fireballs. It's so wise to really wait and let the opponent come to you...spam those fireballs until they come. They will come, and leave themselves open for an attack.

Things I saw I needed to improve:

• It's hard to balance "patience" and "defense" with d-throw combos at early percents. I was not getting enough d-throw combos.
• I went for the kills too early. Back throws are one of my go-to moves and I was attempting this out of habit at 110-120%...this is too early for some characters (I played against a Shulk who seemed to survive WAY too long with successful DI).

Questions to ask you all:

• What is everybody's smash attack strategy? What smash attacks do you all use and when do you attempt them? I've been studying BOSS' Luigi and he rarely smash attacks - when he does, it's almost exclusively u-smash. I think I'm spamming smash attacks too much and leaving myself open for punish.
• How to better avoid gimps? I would play a stock really well and get a one stock lead, only to kill myself with poor jump awareness off the edge at 80-90%. Sucked to just give opponents that stock.
• Finally - what stages are we after? I'm a big fan of knowing stage strategy and think it's a great way to get one up on your opponent. I found odd success on Castle Siege and Lylat (ship's tilt does not disrupt fireballs). For reference, the tourney I went to had these stages:
• Neutrals:
• -Final Destination*
  -Battlefield
  -Smashville
  
  Counter Picks:
  -Town and City
  -Castle Siege
  -Delfino Plaza
  -Duck Hunt
  -Lylat Cruise
  -Omegas

 

[TriTails]

Use F-smash if they manage to end up right in front of you. Or if you are real, edgeguard with it (Angle it downwards. Just for fun, but... I managed to hit a Samus trying to recover with it angled downwards, and ended her stock right after .). Not actually recommended though.

U-smash as a primary killing tool and landing punisher.

D-smash as a roll punisher or after I just rolled through an opponent.

Don't Cyclone when you don't need it. Green Missile and double jump and SJP to reach the ledge. Use it only when you are very far below or just wanted to recover high, or just execute it far below so when you finish the Cyclone, opponent can't intrrupt you (You end up right below the ledge, unless they want to do a stage-spike), and then Jump Punch to save yourself.

Not sure what stages.

 

[FalKoopa]

I've learnt consistently using cyclone to approach. Almost half of the time, I got a Green missile instead.

Now to learn to use cyclone without double jump. And roll less.

 

[Soupy]

Hello fellow Luigi players! This thread somewhat specifies the flaws a lot of players have when using Luigi including my/your own. I'm just trying to get a lot of responses so I can improve my Luigi technique.

Here is what I feel I do not do enough in battle:

- Throw more fireballs!
I beat myself up for this many times, But I never throw enough fireballs. I have seen so many players spam fireballs effectively and it really works. This is probably my priority 1.

- I don't space myself out too much.
When I play as Luigi, I feel as if I'm approaching the other player the entire match. No bluffing or anything like that which I should. A really good tool I need to use is back air if the other player approaches me.

- Become more unpredictable!
As discussed in other threads, Luigi's air speed is pretty slow. I don't mind it because I can combo easier, but to make a successful grab combo I shouldn't just run up and grab the other player the entire game.



I feel as if those are my faults as a Luigi main. If I can improve on this I'll become much better. What do you feel you need to work on?

I don't know if you're looking for advice on your 3, but...

1) Definitely use more fireballs!! I can't tell you how often I get a fireball into grab combo. Short hop > fireball to grounded fireball is a decent coverage option. I really like it for edge guarding if you're not really into the off stage game.

2) Retreating back airs are sooooooo good.

3) Always switch up your game. I enjoy not utilizing his 'nado, nair, and up tilt (which is a good alternative to dthrow if you want to get them in the air IMO) until I take the first/second stock which sounds silly but I can't tell you how many times I hear "wow I was not expecting you to tornado there."

Personally, I need to go for sweet spotted nairs and dthrow > nado kills more often.

 

[Luigi#1]

Working on:
Roll less
Spot dodge more
cyclone recovery
Quit using green missle for anything but recovery
d throw-> b-air
Can do:
Most d-throw combos including d throw->Up b and d throw-> cyclone
Spacing with fireballs
reaction
cyclone approach

 

[SuperOven]

Played Luigi in my second official tournament yesterday. HUGE improvement out than my first tournament - here's where I think I improved:

• Better opponent reads with f-smash. Was able to successfully bait the approach with fireballs - opponent rolled right into my f-smash.
• N-air combo break was clutch against the heavy combo fighters.
• WAY better pacing with fireballs. It's so wise to really wait and let the opponent come to you...spam those fireballs until they come. They will come, and leave themselves open for an attack.

Things I saw I needed to improve:

• It's hard to balance "patience" and "defense" with d-throw combos at early percents. I was not getting enough d-throw combos.
• I went for the kills too early. Back throws are one of my go-to moves and I was attempting this out of habit at 110-120%...this is too early for some characters (I played against a Shulk who seemed to survive WAY too long with successful DI).

Questions to ask you all:

• What is everybody's smash attack strategy? What smash attacks do you all use and when do you attempt them? I've been studying BOSS' Luigi and he rarely smash attacks - when he does, it's almost exclusively u-smash. I think I'm spamming smash attacks too much and leaving myself open for punish.
• How to better avoid gimps? I would play a stock really well and get a one stock lead, only to kill myself with poor jump awareness off the edge at 80-90%. Sucked to just give opponents that stock.
• Finally - what stages are we after? I'm a big fan of knowing stage strategy and think it's a great way to get one up on your opponent. I found odd success on Castle Siege and Lylat (ship's tilt does not disrupt fireballs). For reference, the tourney I went to had these stages:
• Neutrals:
• -Final Destination*
  -Battlefield
  -Smashville
  
  Counter Picks:
  -Town and City
  -Castle Siege
  -Delfino Plaza
  -Duck Hunt
  -Lylat Cruise
  -Omegas

I'll weigh in on stages. Delphino, and halberd should be easy counter picks, they have low ceilings and Luigi loves killing off the top. I only don't choose these against chars who also like that.I don't think duck hunt, towncity, or lylat are where you ever really wanna go. The first two because of projectile characters ability to run and zone, and the last because its hard enough to recover safely as Luigi as it is. Battlefield is a great counter pick to projectile characters, they can't get enough space to do it.

 

[Soupy]

I'll weigh in on stages. Delphino, and halberd should be easy counter picks, they have low ceilings and Luigi loves killing off the top. I only don't choose these against chars who also like that.I don't think duck hunt, towncity, or lylat are where you ever really wanna go. The first two because of projectile characters ability to run and zone, and the last because its hard enough to recover safely as Luigi as it is. Battlefield is a great counter pick to projectile characters, they can't get enough space to do it.

I agree with Delphino and Halberd. I only take people there if I have a clear advantage. Otherwise, I stay away from them.

However, I disagree with T&C + Battlefield. I really like T&C for it's unpredictability on platforms, as well as its space. Yes, campies can just lob stuff at you, but that's adaptable. However, I can't even count how many times a higher platform appearing has saved me from having my low recovery gimped.

I really dislike Battlefield for Luigi because it doesn't give you much space to maneuver. Plus, Luigi's up-smash just barely has a hitbox above the first platform so characters that have really good run off + bairs and other things that come out quickly are quite annoying.

Not only do YOU have less space to dodge projectiles, but Shiek/Pika/ZSS players pretty much have free reign. I consider Luigi to be a good mix between projectile and close range based so having enough space to keep your options open instead of getting fair gimped by a shiek is vital.

Thats just my 2 cents on preferences from experience, though.

 

[TriTails]

Odd. I'm on 3DS version, and I'm somehow enjoying Boxing Ring and Living Room, both has very high ceiling. However, I didn't have any problems killing there.

Why?
Step 1: Get your opponent damaged enough
Step 2: Push them to the side with jab, DA or whatever
Step 3: For the ultimate humillitation tactic, DA to them while carrying them to the side
Step 4: Profit

Why yes, DA's high base knockback made it easy to sneak in easy KOs. Though, pretty sure this has zero effect on tourney players.

...Not like 3DS has any big tourneys anyway. If anything, in these years and foward, 3DS tourneys still exist?

 

[Soupy]

Odd. I'm on 3DS version, and I'm somehow enjoying Boxing Ring and Living Room, both has very high ceiling. However, I didn't have any problems killing there.

Why?
Step 1: Get your opponent damaged enough
Step 2: Push them to the side with jab, DA or whatever
Step 3: For the ultimate humillitation tactic, DA to them while carrying them to the side
Step 4: Profit

Why yes, DA's high base knockback made it easy to sneak in easy KOs. Though, pretty sure this has zero effect on tourney players.

...Not like 3DS has any big tourneys anyway. If anything, in these years and foward, 3DS tourneys still exist?

You know what I really doing though is randomly doing side b at 60+%

Because like....no one actually expects you to do it. So they never shield it close up. If you hit, the knockback is good enough to not get punished. And on the random chance you get a misfire, well....free kill haha.

 

[Liwi808]

Usually I'll do side B if I'm somewhat close (but not close enough for a smash), and they're about to land from above. Since I'm far enough away to not do a smash, they usually won't try and shield/air dodge. And the lag from landing gives me an opening to try and get the misfire.

 

[Soupy]

Usually I'll do side B if I'm somewhat close (but not close enough for a smash), and they're about to land from above. Since I'm far enough away to not do a smash, they usually won't try and shield/air dodge. And the lag from lagging gives me an opening to try and get the misfire.

On the off chance that you DO get a misfire, it's so funny haha.
This is why I like Luigi. He's so ridiculous and unpredictable.