Kill@Will
Smash Cadet
so i picked up lucario (currently a DDD main) and i love the lil blue dogg. but i need some ideas against certain characters like olimar and the 'Chu. any fighter in that range i need some tips on.
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yo i need some tips (plz i mean like puurdy plz)
- Thread starter Kill@Will
- Start date
Nodrak
Smash Ace
Pikachu isn't too bad, fair or dair will pretty much put a stop to any aerial attack Pikachu has, and bair will kill relatively easily since Pikachu can't survive at high damages. Thunder is easy to see coming, airdodge or roll away. If he's using it extremely predictably, use Double Team (downB) for free hits and possibly a kill at the right %. On the ground... yeah the ground can be painful for Lucario. Tilt's are your best bet, spam Aura Sphere (neutralB) to help counter Spamachu's jolts.
Olimar is one of the tougher opponents. He has longer range then Lucario so defensive play isn't the best option. If he latches pikmin onto you, Double Team (downB) it, it's a free counter and it'll kill the pikmin. Like I said about Pikachu, it can be painful for Lucario to be there against Olimar, so try to make it an aerial battle. If you're forced to the ground, try your best to dodge his attacks, and get in there, don't give him time to attack. If you're more of a defensive player, Aura spheres will help you a lot.
Olimar is one of the tougher opponents. He has longer range then Lucario so defensive play isn't the best option. If he latches pikmin onto you, Double Team (downB) it, it's a free counter and it'll kill the pikmin. Like I said about Pikachu, it can be painful for Lucario to be there against Olimar, so try to make it an aerial battle. If you're forced to the ground, try your best to dodge his attacks, and get in there, don't give him time to attack. If you're more of a defensive player, Aura spheres will help you a lot.
Tip 1: Grammar and punctuation. Employ them every now and then <<
I assume you're talking about small faster chars with a ton of priority and a little spaminess to boot? Like those two, metaknight, toon link, and such? They're really hard to approach and usually just as good if not better at camping and spamming than lucario, so it's a pretty touchy fight. Learn to perfect shield projectiles if you haven't already. Most of them have a unique approach that you kinda just have to figure out.
For pikachu, you can try to goad him into down-smashing and missing, then forward smashing him from just out of range. Try to stay in the air but don't land near him. Perfect shield the lightning bolts and don't ever roll through him or otherwise put yourself in a position to get down smashed.
Besides that, you really just need to space yourself well and take advantage of your superior range. And also remember that most small characters have powerful but short range aerials - use your back air to outrange them or just jump higher than them and down or forward air. Use your jab combo and forward tilt a lot vs. them because their attacks are faster than any of your others. Plan it out so that you don't land next to them, or you can expect to be punished.
Olimar is just a ridiculously unique character in general. Know that you can counter any time you have a pikmin on you. You can use that to approach by holding the control stick backwards - it'll make you charge forward with double team. There is a spot at a 45 degree angle that you can hit him with an aerial without being hit by a smash, but you need to be careful, because oli's upsmash is death. Use your forward tilt to kill the pikmin when he throws them and just try and avoid his smashes because they're his only kill moves. Pursue him mercilessly in the air because you're better than him up there. Remember that his up b can sometimes kill and has a really long range. Remember that he's incredibly bad at recovering and edge hog him well. Try to use sidestepping more than shielding around him because his grabs are incredible. As with all the other fast characters use your tilts and jabs and grabs a lot because they're the fastest moves.
I assume you're talking about small faster chars with a ton of priority and a little spaminess to boot? Like those two, metaknight, toon link, and such? They're really hard to approach and usually just as good if not better at camping and spamming than lucario, so it's a pretty touchy fight. Learn to perfect shield projectiles if you haven't already. Most of them have a unique approach that you kinda just have to figure out.
For pikachu, you can try to goad him into down-smashing and missing, then forward smashing him from just out of range. Try to stay in the air but don't land near him. Perfect shield the lightning bolts and don't ever roll through him or otherwise put yourself in a position to get down smashed.
Besides that, you really just need to space yourself well and take advantage of your superior range. And also remember that most small characters have powerful but short range aerials - use your back air to outrange them or just jump higher than them and down or forward air. Use your jab combo and forward tilt a lot vs. them because their attacks are faster than any of your others. Plan it out so that you don't land next to them, or you can expect to be punished.
Olimar is just a ridiculously unique character in general. Know that you can counter any time you have a pikmin on you. You can use that to approach by holding the control stick backwards - it'll make you charge forward with double team. There is a spot at a 45 degree angle that you can hit him with an aerial without being hit by a smash, but you need to be careful, because oli's upsmash is death. Use your forward tilt to kill the pikmin when he throws them and just try and avoid his smashes because they're his only kill moves. Pursue him mercilessly in the air because you're better than him up there. Remember that his up b can sometimes kill and has a really long range. Remember that he's incredibly bad at recovering and edge hog him well. Try to use sidestepping more than shielding around him because his grabs are incredible. As with all the other fast characters use your tilts and jabs and grabs a lot because they're the fastest moves.
Kill@Will
Smash Cadet
(Fine i shall use "correctness") Thanks for the tips. I usually don't edge hog because I've gotten use to my friends saying that edge hogging is cheating, even though I'm quite alright with it. If i did edge hog olimar i would be in better shape so i guess I'll edge hog a little more. Yea lucario's ability is the best thing about him along with his range. One thing i just now noticed about my friend's fighting style is that he shields a lot, so he expects me to hit him for the shield grab. I'll take the sidestepping idea into account because his grabs are **** good. Any particular videos i should watch???
Kill@Will
Smash Cadet
Hey i became a smash child...alright...took me 7-8 months to do it but i did it.
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
Double post bad, perfect shield goood!
That aside, DT actually works well in more situations against these two than most other opponents. Still, use the air to ur advantage, if Pika does Dsmash, DI out (it's hard, but u can do it), and if he spams the jolts, just use ur own aura sphere, as it breaks them more often than not. As for Olimar, he practically gives u a free DT, and be cautious about approaching him on the ground, as his range, especially his grab range, is very scary. Air approach is good for a majority of these attacks, but more predictable attacks can and should be punished by ur own.
That aside, DT actually works well in more situations against these two than most other opponents. Still, use the air to ur advantage, if Pika does Dsmash, DI out (it's hard, but u can do it), and if he spams the jolts, just use ur own aura sphere, as it breaks them more often than not. As for Olimar, he practically gives u a free DT, and be cautious about approaching him on the ground, as his range, especially his grab range, is very scary. Air approach is good for a majority of these attacks, but more predictable attacks can and should be punished by ur own.
Expanding on this real quick: Smash DI is where you DI during the 'freeze frames' that occur as you get hit. It actually jolts you a foot or two in the direction you DI. If you want a really good demonstration of this set off a smart bomb and start mashing your stick in the direction you wanna go. I haven't really tested it against pikachu's down smash but it probably helps
<3
Yeah, shielding is just really good/hard to counter sometimes. Try charging at him and shield grabbing, or forward tilting - it pushes them back and sometimes they drop their shield forgetting that the attack comes out twice. Infi-tan's inner fire videos have some good advice about approaching the shield, too. Try to avoid landing next to him under any circumstances and try using your forward air against him while rising rather than falling, so he can't punish you out of his shield.
Um, I don't know of any specific videos(there's a video out there of me in friendlies against an olimar, but it wasn't his main and he was just playing around) out there, but you might have luck checking one of the stickied threads in this forum.
... Alternatively, you can just play pit against olimar and spam side-b like crazy :embarrass
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=166037 for any extra information.
If your opponent shields a lot you have lots of options. Try to stab through it with Dair or Bair, Empty Hop into Grab, Empty Hop into Force Palm Grab, Charge up an Aura Sphere and run towards them while the Olimar is spamming his Pikmin Throw and stop JUST out of their grab range and they'll whiff a grab. IN which case your Aura Sphere is already heading towards their face.
Against Pikachu you have lots of options, too. Bait Thunder so you can Double Team it. Bait Downsmash so you can Double Team it or Jump real quick and Dair it. Your Aura Spheres don't usually clash with Pika's Thunderjolts, so you're fine for the most part. Watch for Quick Attack Cancels.
And what Nodrak said.
All Lucarios, new and old, are recommended to watch the Inner Fire series of videos found here: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=158132
And also most of the match videos in the stickied Video Topic.
If your opponent shields a lot you have lots of options. Try to stab through it with Dair or Bair, Empty Hop into Grab, Empty Hop into Force Palm Grab, Charge up an Aura Sphere and run towards them while the Olimar is spamming his Pikmin Throw and stop JUST out of their grab range and they'll whiff a grab. IN which case your Aura Sphere is already heading towards their face.
Against Pikachu you have lots of options, too. Bait Thunder so you can Double Team it. Bait Downsmash so you can Double Team it or Jump real quick and Dair it. Your Aura Spheres don't usually clash with Pika's Thunderjolts, so you're fine for the most part. Watch for Quick Attack Cancels.
And what Nodrak said.
All Lucarios, new and old, are recommended to watch the Inner Fire series of videos found here: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=158132
And also most of the match videos in the stickied Video Topic.