LovinMitts
Smash Journeyman
Title says it all. I'm asking because I'm a fan of kill throws, and would be okay with an up smash or offense up nerf. What do you think? What would you nerf in order to have his up throw from 3.0?
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Would you nerf Lucas further in exchange for his kill throw?
- Thread starter LovinMitts
- Start date
20PK
Smash Apprentice
Throws still kill, just at higher percentages.
I only started playing last month (and so haven't played pre-3.5 PM versions), but from what I've read I'm not sure if anyone was really that bothered by the up-throw nerfs. It seems like the general consensus was that the biggest nerfs were magnet timing and shield pressure which effected combo ability, DJC PKF timing and tethering/magnet cancelling.
These elements made pre-3.5 Lucas fun for a lot of people because of the technical depth, so I'm sure most people wouldn't have minded these elements retained while other things (such as up-throw, etc.) got nerfed in that they kill at higher percentages.
I only started playing last month (and so haven't played pre-3.5 PM versions), but from what I've read I'm not sure if anyone was really that bothered by the up-throw nerfs. It seems like the general consensus was that the biggest nerfs were magnet timing and shield pressure which effected combo ability, DJC PKF timing and tethering/magnet cancelling.
These elements made pre-3.5 Lucas fun for a lot of people because of the technical depth, so I'm sure most people wouldn't have minded these elements retained while other things (such as up-throw, etc.) got nerfed in that they kill at higher percentages.
Last edited:
zFrost
how do i title
no..., neut b is already pretty terrible and upsmash is kinda important, we still have 2 kill throws they just dont kill right away
Jamwa
Smash Champion
Kill throws are very scary though, and Lucas' grab isnt that intimidating as it is right now (the risk/reward isn't that g)
in brawl, lucas' grab was so trash unless you grabbed them at 0% or 120%, because you could either combo or kill. everything else wasnt worth the ~18% you'd get from a few pummels and a throw. but once they're 120%, suddenly its scary.
it's all about mindgames.
that said, don't think i'd want to nerf lucas any further. the nerf were pretty lazy and to re-balance Lucas while keeping his unique feel would be hard
in brawl, lucas' grab was so trash unless you grabbed them at 0% or 120%, because you could either combo or kill. everything else wasnt worth the ~18% you'd get from a few pummels and a throw. but once they're 120%, suddenly its scary.
it's all about mindgames.
that said, don't think i'd want to nerf lucas any further. the nerf were pretty lazy and to re-balance Lucas while keeping his unique feel would be hard
D e l t a
That one guy who does the thing with a camera.
Lucas still retains an amazing grab game. Simply because he cannot kill purely off a throw, does not mean that his throws are bad, nor should they be returned to the level of knockback / kill power they had in 3.02.
Down Throw / Back Throw Mixups
Facing inwards to the stage by a ledge / near the side blast zones can mess up the opponent's DI.
Nerfing the OU upsmash is something many have said, but the only uses for the move are out of no DI on downthrow, after Dair pops an opponent up, or to catch the landing of an enemy.
tl;dr Throws that kill below 130% are overall dumb and Lucas' uthrow nerf was highly justified. His OU attacks are mostly balanced as they currently are.
Down Throw / Back Throw Mixups
Facing inwards to the stage by a ledge / near the side blast zones can mess up the opponent's DI.
- You can Dthrow and use an aerial / Upsmash to kill if they're DI'ing inwards / no DI. If they DI behind, they get set up for a ledge guard.
- If you Bthrow and they DI behind, they will most likely die around 120% give or take 15%.
Nerfing the OU upsmash is something many have said, but the only uses for the move are out of no DI on downthrow, after Dair pops an opponent up, or to catch the landing of an enemy.
tl;dr Throws that kill below 130% are overall dumb and Lucas' uthrow nerf was highly justified. His OU attacks are mostly balanced as they currently are.
Eisen
Smash Ace
Lol no. Lucas is fun as hell as he is, and nearly perfect. better kill throws with his options A) doesn't make sense and B) is kinda dumb
The only change I really want to the character right now is to remove the crappier flub hitbox on fair (the middle hitbox). The normal flub is good enough at punishing poor spacing by not killing but doesn't lead into combos like the crappier flub.
The only change I really want to the character right now is to remove the crappier flub hitbox on fair (the middle hitbox). The normal flub is good enough at punishing poor spacing by not killing but doesn't lead into combos like the crappier flub.
Kipcom
Smash Journeyman
But the new flub on fair is probably the best flub they gave him.
I like it. I think it should stay.
MysteryRevengerson
IT'S A MYSTERY TO ALL
Anyone who thinks Lucas should get nerfed more just to get his up throw back is crazy
It's fine
It's fine
D e l t a
That one guy who does the thing with a camera.
A throw that kills at 138-142 on average, as low as 125 on floaties and up to 155 on most stages / characters? I'd say this is really good. Ness' Bthrow doesn't kill some chars until 170%+ and even then his Upthrow doesn't kill. Not to mention Lucas' Dthrow can be mixed up well with Bthrow to almost always have some good option out of his throws.
A Very Nice Dishwasher
Smash Apprentice
If he didn't have a bajillion other kill options, yes.
