Would you guys be up for a NA power rankings list for console?

[Han Solo]

I think it'd be fun to see what everyone's top 10 or top 25 are.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

I believe we did make one of them before but informally with just opinions..

The list could be made though, pretty easily. I think 10-15 people would be good, maybe 20 but I find that people from the later numbers are a bit harder to judge.

 

[Han Solo]

Based on who I've played, and on videos/streams I have watched.

1. Isai
2. Boom
3. JaimeHR
4. Sensei
5. Kefit
6. Mariguas
7. firo
8. SheerMadness
9. YBOMBB
10. ballin4life
11. Nintendude
12. Battlecow
13. KeroKeroppi
14. Megavolt
15. b-rex

 

[clubbadubba]

eh what the hell. Not going to include myself (not that I necessarily make the list, but I'm not even going to consider myself). Also not going to include A$, even though I'm pretty sure he'd make the list, just because I'm the only person he's played in a while so its tough to compare. Not to mention he never plays FOR SERIOUS so I can't even tell just how filthy he is. The last real competitive thing he did was a 12 char battle with keyboard star king, which came down to the final 7 stocks just so people have an idea how good he is. I am going to include kb players because that seems to be the way of the future. **** integration, separate but equal am I right?

1. Isai
2. Boom
________
3. JaimeHR
4. Star King
5. Sensei
6. Bane
7. Frogles
________
8. Kefit
9. Killer
10. SheerMadness
11. tacos
_______

12. Dexter
13. Mariguas
14. YBOMBB
15. MATTS!
16. WOTG
17. Parallax (never played, but based on tourney results...)
__________
18. Ballin4life
19. Firo
20. b-rex
21. thegreginator
22. Battlecow
23. KeroKeroppi
24. Nintendude
25. Kimimaru

Separated into tiers within which order doesn't mean as much. A few more players that could go in that last section, but I'll cap it at 25 so it doesn't go crazy.

 

[SheerMadness]

Pretty sure this is a console list clubba, so half your list doesn't apply as they've never been to a console tourney.

 

[Sangoku]

I don't get it. You're talking about console player tier list? Because it's more accurate than online right? Then you mention your opinion based on videos, so watching videos is more accurate than playing someone online to determine skill?

 

[clubbadubba]

Well if we are expanding this to people we've only seen from videos as Han Solo did, then I feel okay putting up keyboard players. And if that doesn't count, well, I just don't give a duck. Just consider my list an overall smash player list, with super HAX kb DI considered to be legitimate.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

imo Matts and wotg are too high. I'd put Kero higher also

 

[SheerMadness]

Well since everyone is using their own random criteria to make their list, I'll make a list for people I've played against (online or off). Because why not, it's always fun to see other people's ranking lists. Not including myself:

1. Isai
2. Boom
3. JaimeHR
4. Frogles
5. Bane
5. Star King
7. Killer
7. Sensei

I don't think I wanna go any further than that, gets too murky. That isn't entirely based on how well they do vs me, it's just opinion. For example, Killer and his Kirby possibly do a tad better vs me than Frog. But it's Kirby vs like Ness/Mario lol. So I gotta rank Frogles above him.

Also bs at kb's having a disadvantage. Three of top 8 players against me are kb players.

#funtostirthingsup

disclaimer: may have forgotten 1 or 2 people.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

You are putting Bane this high? Didn't know he was this good o_0

 

[Han Solo]

I don't get it. You're talking about console player tier list? Because it's more accurate than online right? Then you mention your opinion based on videos, so watching videos is more accurate than playing someone online to determine skill?

I don't play online, so I don't know how good any online players are. The only people I haven't played on the list are Kefit, Mariguas, and YBOMBB and based on how I've seen them play (mariguas), and their tourney results, that's how I ranked them.

It wouldn't make much sense for someone who exclusively plays console to include online players.

 

[NovaSmash]

I've never played anyone on console so I can't make a list

 

[Yobolight]

@Clubba.
Kerokeroppi beat thegreginator on console the only time they played fairly soundly. How is Kero not above greg?

 

[killa k]

A lot of people are way too low on Clubba's list imo.

You are putting Bane this high? Didn't know he was this good o_0

Yeah, Bane is pretty solid from the few times I faced him in teams.

 

[clubbadubba]

didn't put too much thought into the order within sections, so don't put too much weight on the order. Kero prolly > greg.

That being said, its never as simple as X beat Y, therefore X is better than Y, so don't get in that mindset. Cobr beat greg, but I wouldn't say cobr > greg.

 

[cmu6eh]

1: Kikoushi ($730.00)
2: Isai ($292.00)
3: SuPeRbOoMfAn ($175.20)
4: Ruoka Danchon ($102.20)
5: JaimeHR ($69.35)
6: Sensei ($43.80)
7: Kefit ($29.20)
8: Nangoku ($18.25)
9: Firo
9. Kero
9. The greginater
9.5: Nintendude
9.5: YBOMBB
9.5: SheerMadness

 

[Cobrevolution]

Kerokeroppi beat thegreginator on console the only time they played fairly soundly. How is Kero not above greg?

Cobr beat greg, but I wouldn't say cobr > greg

this

homie's falcon was scary

but to back greg up, he's probably played quadruple the amount of people kero has, so his track record is probably better, therefore putting his ranking higher (sorta like in basketball, i could shoot 100% from the free throw if i go 30/30, but someone could shoot 92 and go 920/1000...who's a better shooter?)
to back kero up, however, he has placed very well at the last couple tournaments he's been at, and judging by that competition, i don't think it'd be a completely unfair stretch to say kero is a shade better.

just my two cents.

i'm itching like a ************ to get better right now. but my net is spottier than a twelve year old girl's underwear drawer and i can't play properly til post-graduation.

also curious to see the difference between online/console lists. do both, people! entertain me!

 

[thegreginator]

Ranking people based merely on videos seems highly suspect. Tournament results have a little more validity, but probably the best way to get a sense of someone's overall skill is by playing them many times.

My list:
Isai
Boom
JamieHR
Star King
Sensei
Frogles
Sheer's Yoshi

After that it gets too hard. Leaving out people like Dexter and tacos who I've only played with like 6 frames and thus can't judge their skill too accurately. Have never played Bane.

Tons of online people who are good and hard to rank - probably a very small difference between person #15 and person #30.

I think it'd be interesting to see how many people from North America would be in the top 25 if we made a global list. Guessing not that many.

 

[The Star King]

Kimimaru > greg

sorry greg

yes Bane is that good

 

[clubbadubba]

I think it'd be interesting to see how many people from North America would be in the top 25 if we made a global list. Guessing not that many.

Guessing 2.

greg > kimi

 

[Combo Blaze]

I think we'd have a fair amount. Unless Japan has many more unheard s/a tier players I think we'd be fine, especially if some of our online players actually went to tournys. Doubting Peru's power with the exception of Gerson, Alvin, and Tavo. Come on we gotta support our top players!

 

[Sensei]

Bane, Star King and Frogles need to stop being n00bs and go to Nationals / Internationals. I know where I stand against the people I've played on console. I'm at like <50% full power online so not a good gauge of skill plus I'm sure most play better on console, unless you're used to a fake controller and have no adapter lol.

Anyway, most power rankings work based on tournament results. It's the most objective and fair way to rank players. We are lucky we are seeing more SSB tournies being hosted recently so we have more data points for a more accurate analysis. We shouldn't rely on subjectivity anymore for these "hypothetical" rankings where people are judging off of videos, online play or personal experience (friendlies).

 

[Doomolish]

Idk what does mean "NA", but mariguas uploaded some interesting vids against JaimeHR. I recommend to watch them before making your final veredict.

Here: http://www.youtube.com/user/tirolargo8

 

[prisonchild]

Idk what does mean "NA", but mariguas uploaded some interesting vids against JaimeHR. I recommend to watch them before making your final veredict.

Here: http://www.youtube.com/user/tirolargo8

NA means North America

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

Idk what does mean "NA", but mariguas uploaded some interesting vids against JaimeHR. I recommend to watch them before making your final veredict.

Here: http://www.youtube.com/user/tirolargo8

North America, so Canada, USA, and Mexico.

Of Mariguas or Jaime, who is usually considered better?

to c6mueh, we really can't judge any of the Japanese players as we have barely played them. Even if we do judge the ones who came here, Jousuke beats them pretty easily it seems that if we did include them, he would be probably be 2nd or 3rd (right before or right after BoomFan, no clue if he is THAT good but it seems like he coul be.) Also, this would make really a world list or a NA/Japan list but adding all of these would add questions such as "who from Peru should be on here," or "is anyone from Europe on this list, etc.
Edit: Also Brazil in that case as well judging by how Oxolane/Bane did and that Cabalero is considered to be possibly beter

So US/Canada/Mexico only. The main distinction for us now is asking console vs online and well until we have a usable KB adapter for the online kb players and the online n64 controller/kb players go to offline tournaments, we cannot really add them.

 

[clubbadubba]

"Jousuke beats them pretty easily" should not be applied to kikoushi just fyi.

If you want a world list just use MATTS! world rankings form those weekly newsletters. They are 100% accurate.

Based on playing them both at around 8 frames, Jaime >> Mariguas.

 

[thegreginator]

Based on playing them both at around 8 frames, Jaime >> Mariguas.

I'm not so sure about this. There are lots of videos of those two playing, and Mariguas has some pretty convincing victories. He also has a playstyle where he forgoes guaranteed kills to try for more flashy combos, which sometimes hurt him in those matches. I think it's fair to say those two are pretty close.

Including Mexico in our list is tough since generally the people on these boards don't know much about the Smash scene south of the border. Who are the other good players in Mexico? There could be several people at Mariguas' level for all we know.

I would break up the Smash regions as follows. Ranking I'm using is "average skill level of top 20 players."
1. Japan
2. South America + Mexico
3. USA + Canada
4. Rest of world

2 and 3 could maybe be switched.

 

[SheerMadness]

NY/NJ is the only region with enough console tourneys to reliably rank people. Potential console ranking based on once a year Apex would be pretty bad. I had to play JaimeHR for 9th place, which I'm guessing was a harder match than any of the other 9th place finishers had. Probably harder than one of the 7th place matches too (the other 7th placer losing to Jaime as well).

Besides threads likes this are really just for fun. It's cool to see how people rank everyone differently. Plus a lot of you console people probably had no idea 3 kb players were top 10 in everybody's online list (or overall list like mine).

South America may very well be ahead of us. They have some really good players. Most people just think of Peru but there's some great Chilean (sp?) players too. I've p2p'ed with both DannySSB and Alpha and they're on par with our top 10 IMO. And I'm positive there's quite a bit of top notch South American players we don't even know about.

 

[thegreginator]

There are probably plenty of players even in the U.S. that are skilled that we don't even know about. SSB64 isn't centralized enough to have any kind of gauge on this kind of thing

Seems like all the regions also have their own boards. It would be cool to integrate these communities and resources, but language barrier will probably keep that from happening.

 

[clubbadubba]

Keep in mind that my jaime/mariguas comparison is based off of my 8 frame interactions with both of them lol. I've played jaime on console a lot, but not mariguas, so I can't compare that. It didn't look like either player was playing super duper serious in those matches so I didn't get much other than entertainment out of them.

I doubt there are any top 10 caliber players that we don't know about. Top 30, very possible. I hadn't heard of b-rex at all until those vids on isai's channel, and he's pretty solid.

Also, next time I get a chance, I'm going to create an ELO ranking based on some recent tournaments.

 

[Sensei]

The purpose of Power Rankings is to have an accurate representation of players' skill based on empirical evidence and to motivate others to become better. Yes it is true that NJ / NY have the most active tournament scene, but that is because we have made that effort to do so and we are willing to travel to other regions who host tournaments (i.e. Midwest for SWEET, West Coast for Genesis, soon to be Canada for IMPULSE). There is no reason why other regions can not build up a scene and gather players from other regions. We just need others that are willing to put in the effort and host events.

 

[SheerMadness]

Effort is not the main problem. It's location. You can't compare the north east to other parts of the country. The north east is very densely populated in a small geographic area. That's why you guys have it so good.

I remember clubba saying it took him like 4 hours to get to Apex. It takes 3-4 hours MINIMUM just to get out of Florida from Orlando. It takes 7 hours just to get to Atlanta from Orlando. You guys can travel through 4 states in the time it takes me to get to the biggest city in an adjoining state.

The console scene is just like owning a business, it's all about location location location.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

South America may very well be ahead of us. They have some really good players. Most people just think of Peru but there's some great Chilean (sp?) players too. I've p2p'ed with both DannySSB and Alpha and they're on par with our top 10 IMO. And I'm positive there's quite a bit of top notch South American players we don't even know about.

Alpha for 2nd best Kirby after Kikoushi maybe

 

[jimmyjoe]

Sensei is right, even if it is easier for us in the northeast.
This thread is for gauging the interest for a console power rankings list. It's fine to speculate based on tournement results even if it is only a single Apex, but basing anything off of online play isnt. If you've yet to enter a tournament, you're yet to get on this list.
Putting players like Bane/Starking anywhere on the list makes your list invalid, other than Clubba cause he has played starking IRL, but I would hesitate to include him based on friendlies and wouldn't consider his online or KB skills at all when factoring position because they are irrelevant, atleast until CMU unveils this thing, and even then online won't matter-only keyboard console players who attend tournies and compete with a reasonably sized sample of console opponents.

 

[thegreginator]

Also, next time I get a chance, I'm going to create an ELO ranking based on some recent tournaments.

Hats off to Clubba. Between this and the player location map (also another really important initiative IMO - srsly someone should sticky) the Smash 64 scene is getting better every day.

I think we should also keep in mind that the real purpose behind in rankings (at least in my mind) is to foster an atmosphere of friendly competition and encourage more people to play the game. Getting bogged down in the details of Player X being better than Player Y isn't the point of this.

That being said, if you play a bunch of online (low-delay) or offline matches with someone and want to share your opinion of their skill, that should be encouraged. Though your data point might not be weighted as highly as, say, tournament results, having more data can only help form a clearer picture. And there is a serious lack of data right now.

Maybe someone should even make a thread where people can post how they fared against good people they've played. Having that info can help compare two people who haven't played each other (with plenty of disclaimers and taking it all with a grain of salt of course). That can help make a cross-regional ranking system happen.

 

[Olikus]

You can take videos in consideration as well. You dont need to play gerson live to understand he is allmost better Than all players on console.

 

[SheerMadness]

Clubba ruined the path of this thread by including all those online only players. I wanted to be a bad ass like him so I followed suit.

I still don't think one or two Apex's, which were missing a lot of people, is enough data to warrant making a console tier list.

Having one tourney decide my rank (and a ton of other people too) is pretty silly. That's my stance.

People are welcome post their opinion on it though, that's always fun.

 

[¨°PÞ-§°¨ Bane]

1. Isai
2. Boom
3. Jousuke
4. Kikoushi
5. Gerson

my completely subjective opinion based on what i've seen from videos and my understanding of the game

 

[AtotheZ]

I think posting a list at all is a start though. It will always be able to use improvement, but I'd like something like this to start.

Plus, I'm very interested in seeing SK/Bane/Other keyboard warriors step out of the shadows and prove their hype (on console) after Cmu unveils their secret weapon.

 

[Olikus]

1. Isai
2. Boom
3. Jousuke
4. Kikoushi
5. Gerson

my completely subjective opinion based on what i've seen from videos and my understanding of the game

How can you rank gerson that low. He beat isai pika several times. No offense but boom isnt close to that at all.