Wii U Gamepad and Pro Controllers are glorious! Can replace GameCube controller

[NickRiddle]

As someone who has played tournaments for those games, those have inherent issues of their own design.

You can continue to equate a game's value towards arbitrary identifiers, but it really doesn't accomplish anything other than muddle your point.

I've entered tournaments for Melee, Brawl, PM, Pokemon, Blazblu, Divekick, and Naruto GNT4.
The "better" games are the ones I enjoyed more, it has nothing to do with any entry barriers, or how hard it is to get good.
If you really like a game, put some damn time into it. If it's hard, put MORE time into it.

 

[CRASHiC]

How exactly did someone who can't articulate a single thought or make a single statement relevant to a conversation become a back roomer?

 

[ChikoLad]

IMO, the best fighting games have easy to understand, but incredibly hard to master mechanics, that allow for matches that are never the same as another. Mastering all of the mechanics is not what makes you a competitive player though, because that's a very demanding order.

This is why Smash, Tekken, and Dissidia: Final Fantasy (not solely a fighting game, though I count it. Shame it never had online play) are my three favourite fighters (and PS-All Stars being an honourable mention, as I had a hell of a time with the online mode. Thinking about it makes me so excited for Smash 4, as it will be even better, provided the netcode is fine).

Making a fighting game that demands too much time to play at a competitive level is bad game design, because gamers only are willing to spend so much time with one game. If a player feels they can't enjoy a game because they consistently can't win matches in singleplayer or in competitive multiplayer, all because they can't learn quarter-circle clockwise punch kick magic series special at X frame punch-kick 360 degree rotation anti-clockwise x5 in 0.6 seconds and push all 4 face buttons simultaneously at Y frame - they are likely going to drop the game before long.

A lot of tournament nuts tend to throw around the "JUST SPEND MORE TIME TRAINING" card around a lot, but the simple fact of the matter is that nobody should have to spend 50 hours training ALONE in a MULTIPLAYER-FOCUSED game, just so they can get some enjoyment out of it. The game should be simple enough to remember most techniques after a long period of time without playing. Because nobody can stick with a game for years upon years with complete consistency, as we all have lives and responsibilities, as well as other games we may want to play, and other activities to engage in. And of course, a game should be simple enough so that when a friend of mine comes over who has never played this snazzy new fighting game I bought, they should be able to enjoy watching their character perform cool maneuvers even with the basic mechanics and feel they are having a fun time fighting me, even if I know the game inside out.

Though honestly, this tangent is off-topic.

 

[NickRiddle]

How exactly did someone who can't articulate a single thought or make a single statement relevant to a conversation become a back roomer?

You said that technical skill is nothing but an entry barrier.
Divekick and Naruto games do not have much, so they should be the best games to play.
You said they had other issues, so I posted that after having played multiples games in tournaments, with tech-skill requirements ranging from press A to do complicated inputs, and it boiled down to what I enjoyed more... and said we should practice if we want to get good.
I guess that wasn't a logical thought process?

 

[CRASHiC]

Not only does that have nothing to do with the conversation of how arbitrarily high tech ceilings are bad for games, but its just down right illogical jumps and a pure lack of reading comprehension. I will break this down for you and make things easy.

You said that technical skill is nothing but an entry barrier.

Yes, I did. You have yet to respond to this statement in any way whatsoever, meaningful or otherwise.

Divekick and Naruto games do not have much [technical skill], so they should be the best games to play.

No, it does not.
Not only did I say that a game's technical ceiling is irrelevant to its actual competitive value because it is nothing more than a barrier to entry, I did not equate a low tech ceiling to a good competitive game either. It is a desirable design state, but on a game's competitive value it rarely has consequence unless the technical aspects lead to inconsistent play even at the highest levels.

Even if I had stated that a low tech ceiling makes a game a better competitive avenue, proposing the idea that's the only thing to value is argumentum ad logicam. Not only did I clarify this in my response to both Dive Kick AND Naruto, but its just something that flat out should not have to be clarified at all if I had made this claim.

You said they had other issues, so I posted that after having played multiples games in tournaments, with tech-skill requirements ranging from press A to do complicated inputs, and it boiled down to what I enjoyed more... and said we should practice if we want to get good.

I am all for playing the games people chose to play and not what some angry cloud of internet rage tells them to, however understand that the games you or I enjoy have nothing to do with this discussion at all.

 

[Networker1]

Yeah let's all just stop talking because what that guy said...

We all know that the lack of wired controllers is a hurdle right now, but that has absolutely nothing with what the topic is getting at.
I do personally find the Wii U Pro controller to be my favorite controller in years. Fits perfect in my hands, and though the placement of the stick through me off a bit at first, I am definitely used to it now and for Smash it makes all the sense in the world to me. Way easier, quicker Smash attacks, and I'm pretty sure I can set it up to not even need the face buttons if I try.

How are you getting a Wii U Pro controller to work with Brawl???

 

[APC99]

I think I'm going to use the best option: Wiimote and Nunchuk!

(It's so awesome Batman prefers to use it!)

In all seriousness, I think that the Pro Controller will be fine for Smash Bros. for the Wii U. The GamePad maybe.

 

[BlitznBurst]

It baffles me that Nintendo hasn't cashed in on a Gamecube-styled controller yet. I'm seriously starting to think they have some intense phobia of making money

 

[Cap'nChreest]

It baffles me that Nintendo hasn't cashed in on a Gamecube-styled controller yet. I'm seriously starting to think they have some intense phobia of making money

Because 10% of WiiU owners will buy it. I don't think theres a big market for a controller like that.

 

[BlitznBurst]

Because 10% of WiiU owners will buy it. I don't think theres a big market for a controller like that.

10% of a console's userbase is still a pretty big number, at least if the console actually has a decently sized userbase in the first place, and the controller would cost virtually nothing to make.

 

[[TSON]]

10% of a console's userbase is still a pretty big number, at least if the console actually has a decently sized userbase in the first place

Why did you post this if you were going to win an argument against yourself in the same sentence?