Why the lack of B moves used?

[onlinenow25]

Ive watched just about every meta knight video there is on you tube.

Very few people use meta knights b moves. With such dramatic diminishing attacks why would you not use them?

From what i can see the moves are not that bad. And i have yet to see anyone utilize his down b.

Anyone have a reason for this?

 

[NotEz]

His down B has lag before he teleports which gives the enemy time to get ready for it

his neutral B is pretty good but from what I've seen is easily dodged

his Up-B is good for recovery but not much else

his over-B is somewhat good offensively but not good enough for people to use it a lot



this is just what I've heard about and noticed in the videos ive seen. But his B moves aren't that great overall.

 

[beige]

Well then.. We'll find out tommorow, won't we?

 

[malakyoma666]

yes well find out tomorow... then ill own you all! lmao. i hope to fight u all at one point

 

[Rockin]

I'll explain, since I've been playing Meta Knight several times.

The thing is, all of his B moves are situational. Each one got some kind of lag, or the move is easy to DI. If you miss with one of their moves, you'll get punished for it. So it's best to use his A mioves to get him into position with a B move.

In other words, make them count.

 

[Wildfire393]

Here's what I've gathered:

Neutral B - This is Ok at racking up some damage on the approach, but not really great. Maybe use it to get past projectile spammers like Dedede, but that's about it
Down B - Really, this about amounts to a roll + Forward tilt, only a little laggier on the start-up. It's a little less predictable than a roll I guess, but all in all not too good.
Forward B - Seems really situational. can get an OK amount of damage, but a fair bit of lag when it finishes. Comparable to something like the Falcon Kick or Lugi Tornado: you might use it to vary up your approach, but for the most part it's not so hot.
Up B - Actually has high knockback, can be used as a finisher. However, there's really only one good situation to set this up. When creating a vertical wall with Upairs (you can repeatedly do this and jump for a fairly long string), you can end with an Up B to knock them off the top.

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

Personally I like all of them.

Up B is definitely useful in a lot of situations. You can use it under platforms to pressure people and they can't do anything about it. It cancels into glide and then you get glide attack which is great. You can hit people that are out of reach above you with it. It KOs. It's pretty safe because of the glide. If you glide attack just before you land you pretty much get instant recovery. Why not use it?

Down B I don't think is that good of an attack but every now and then but it's great for mobility. I use it to get back on the stage sometimes or to avoid certain situations. I imagine you can do some pretty tricky stuff with it to mess with people once you get good with it.

Neutral B is alright. Nothing crazy but it's pretty safe, has a lot of mobility, a great hit box. It'll eat through some projectiles. It's got it's uses.

Forward B iis good for catching a group of people and getting across the screen with a huge hit box when you need to. It's great recovery and you can use it to get back on the stage. Use it selectively and surprise people with it, it'll get you free hits. It's metaknights only REALLY long range move. It's not exactly safe but it's easy to hit with and you can do unblockables with it on the ground if they try to shield it.

 

[ChRed2AKrisp]

neutral B, one you've gotten someone in it, you can follow them by rising, and deal a pretty good amount of damage. You go into the stunned falling after it, which is a problem.

side b.- This move i think is very good. Most of the time if you catch someone it'll deal a decent amount, and even if you miss, it's not very punishable. Also, you can sweetspot with it, making at a less predicatble and more precise recovery than the UP b.

up B-as already stated, a good finisher. good recovery, and you can glide cancel the glide attack, so you get something extra out of it.

down B-i think this can be usable. especially when going down at an angle. If someone came of the the edge to get you, this would be usable, since it has little enough lag that you could get away with it. I feel this is a recovery move.

 

[Lgndknight]

You can start/end a combo with all of them. They're useful, they're just not used.

 

[Cepheus]

I was planning on using the b-moves quite a bit...

 

[Lgndknight]

yes well find out tomorow... then ill own you all! lmao. i hope to fight u all at one point

..... Ok, thats relevant

 

[Psydon]

Right now people are still learning Meta Knight. As time passes I'm sure more advanced players will find better applications for his B moves.

People do use his Up+B, and not just for recovery. It's fast, powerful enough to kill and high-priority, and it doesn't leave Meta Knight vulnerable like other Up+Bs, so if you mess up it's not the end of the world.

The Down+B, IMO, should be used the way people used Mewtwo's and Zelda's teleports; not just for dodging attacks and creating distance but also messing with your opponent (what if your opponent moves back thinking you'll hit him from behind, only to find you've gone nowhere at all?).

The Side+B is tough to use since it, like all of Meta Knight's B moves except the Up+B, leaves you vulnerable, and also because of the distance you travel. I think you could use it going down as a nice way to mix up your combos. If you and your opponent are trading hits often at close range you could suddenly unleash the Side+B and disrupt the whole exchange, scoring more damage in the process.

The B...I dunno. Perhaps it could be useful for stopping combos.

 

[Phydeaux742]

His regular B is really nice for absorbing projectiles
his up b is a kill move, not much more other then recovery
down b is good for edgeguarding
over b is.....odd...

 

[metaknightrules]

I think his B Moves will be very useful:
Up B: I think this is a good move. Like people have already said, it is a great finisher. It has high knockback and can be really good for edgeguarding. It is also a really good recovery move, since it can cancel into a glide.

Neutral B: This one isn't the best, but also not the worst. It can be really good for comboing and getting rid of projectiles. It can, like all of Metaknight's other special moves, be used in recovery. It can also stop an opponent's combos.

Side B: I think this one is great. It can go really long range, and can curve up or down. It gets multiple hits and does decent damage, and can aid in recovery. This one could be very useful in combos for racking up the damage followed by an Up B to finish. This move also helps in getting the Smash Balls, since it has long range and can curve.

Down B: This moves would mostly be used to annoy your opponents. Like someone already said. you could use it, and then your opponent turns around thinking you're gonna attack from behind, only to realise that you haven't gone anywhere. This move may also be useful in recovery, particularily getting to thge ledge. For example, let's say you were sent flying, used all five of your jumps, only to realise you're not quite at the ledge. You could use Dimensional Cape and go towards the ledge, allowing you to grab it and survive. Another way you could use this move effectively is to avoid being spiked. Let's say Samus knocked you off the course, and while you were returning to the stage used her dair to spike you. You then usr Dimensional Cape and avoid the spike.

I really don't see why people wouldn't use Metaknight's special moves. They are all useful in different ways (Oh yeah, and all of Metaknight's moves can aid in recovery!)

 

[Admiral Pit]

I use all of metaknight's B Moves most of time. It helps me in combat and im sure others will use it when needed.

 

[GreenKirby]

His only semi-useful B attack is his Up+B. It has high knockback, but that's only if you connect it like initially after you start is.

 

[Drack]

B is a good damager and a way to get around some projectiles.

Up+B is a fantastic move, as is the glide attack afterward. Both killers, and the glide attack is a good damager too.

Side B is bad damage and leaves you vulnerable. I don't like it.

Down B also leavesyou vulnerable. Bleh.

 

[kin3tic-c4jun-3]

I've found his upB and downB>smash are good for KOs.

 

[WingedKnight]

I main MK, and I think he has good specials! I find myself using them often, mising up combat and racking up damage! Different strokes for different folks I guess, but I think they are mostly really good and useful in his overall strategy. Well, here I am to give my "expert" XD opinion on Meta Knight's specials:

B, my favorite, Mach Tornado! Great for damage. I wouldn't spam it, but I would use it alot and throw it at people when they don't expect it. Keep tapping that B button, extend the duration and lift opponents off the ground! As mentioned, will block some small projectiles. Works great on a lone enemy, also good fro crowd control in free-for-alls. I use this one a lot, it works well!

Up B, Shuttle Loop! A viable kill move, just be careful. If you use it near the edge or you are not used to gliding, you may SD. Can hit enemies on platforms above you, sometrimes hits twice. Try to sweetspot it (initial trajectory is like Marth's Dolphin Slash). Use when unexpected, pretty good for getting Smash Balls above you. Try to use the Glide Attack to for more damage.

As for Side B, I don't fin myself using Drill Rush too often. I usually use it on accident. Good for catching opponents offguard or recovery, but thats about it. No high damage, can be punished if you miss. Careful, use in moderation, but don't neglect it! Good in Free-for-alls. Use a Dimensional Cape to get out of a huge mass of fighters, and plow through em with Drill Rush (also works well, if not better IMO, with Mach Tornado).

His Dimensional Cape, Down B, is interesting. The after-attack is strong and a good KOer, but if you miss with that sword slash there is an eternity of lag by MK standards. I use it for mindgaming and getting out of sticky situations fast. Adds significantly to Meta Knight's nimbleness and maneuvarability, he can pop up anywhere, keeping foes on their toes. A good move nonetheless.

Dount anything I've said hasn't been siad before, but I'm an Meta Knight main, and I'm pretty good, so I thought I'd share my views on his specials!

 

[ropep0202]

I used his B moves often, especially his up an down B just to mess with people.
Notably, neutral B is excellent for edge guarding.

 

[Oceanborn]

Not sure what others have said but for me, with MK being a potential main, here's what I've learned from practicing with him:

Neutral B: Good for racking up damage especially if the enemy can't get stuck in it. Unfortunate if he does though since you most likely will propel up and fall to a smash. But time it correctly and it can be very helpful for racking up damage, mainly in the lower percentages (for both you and your opponent.)

Side B: Another good attack for racking up damage. Pretty fast and you don't really have to worry about being propelled up like the Neutral B. The fact that you can direct it makes it far more useful. Can't remember if there's KB after but you can't say this attack isn't useful.

Up B: KB definitely. I mostly use it after UpTilt and a chain of UpAirs, chasing the enemy to the top. But it's pretty much good for any situations where you need good KB. Sure it's situational since it can send you to your doom, but you just gotta be smart about it. Again, you can't say this attack isn't useful.

Down B: I LOVE this attack. Especially after you do a good combo on your enemy and you're ready to knock your opponents off. Charge at them and surprise them with this, and they won't see it coming. Ofcourse, assuming you mastered the DownB+DirectionTilt+B/A mash. This is what Mewtwo's teleporting powers should have had, a possible attack at the end. And since MK has this, this can be exploited to your benefit. Very very useful attack, especially for surprise attacks.

 

[onlinenow25]

Thanks but to add to the attack at the end of meta knights down b. Just hold it and he will do the attack.

 

[Kawaii]

Person I played with today was too used to my approach with Meta after a while, so I experimentally used some B moves in our last match. Every now and then, I do use Up B, for a KO, but I tried side and down. I really do hate side B, down B is a little dangerous to use a lot as well, but since I used Meta in majority of our matches I knew he wouldn't be used to it. I personally liked down B after that match, but I am sure once or twice a match will be all the surprise I need.

 

[Covenant]

I actually signed up to post to this thread, having been a longtime reader.

Metaknight's B moves are all fairly weak--and the idea of the B> as a damager is rather laughable. You'll usually be doing between 2-7 with it, but I often hit around 5 damage out of what seems to be a max of 10. For a move with such a relatively small hitbox and slow traversal speed, the meager damage you get out of it isn't worth the trouble. The only way I see to use this move is similar to Bowser's fortress--as an alternate dodge, a way to get from one side of your foe to the other. Honestly, if you do it right and catch him a quarter second after the move starts and keep them on the tip, you do 10 damage. If he gets out, he takes 5-7 tops and has a chance to punish you. If he manages to get you off the floor, MK will bounce backwards into the air helplessly in a noncancelable fall.

The neutral B does vastly more damage even when you don't rise off the floor, and his long-ranged dash kick does 8, more than you can expect on average from B>, with less lag before and after.

His B^ is obviously a useful KO move while you're in the air, but on the ground you might as well use the dsmash, which hits a wide arc and can kill or knockback as well as anything he's got, and comes out amazingly fast.

I can't imagine using B> as an approach--it's just not very good at it due to the poor damage and control combined with the ending lag. If you're really having issues approaching with Metaknight, use throws. Metaknight's dtilt throw can actually be chained. I've never had enough room to do more than three (he crosses FD after 3 throws, basically) but if you do the shieldcancel grabs like Dedede uses you can actually chain more than one throw together pretty quickly, which is useful for punishing someone's overuse of shields.

Metaknight has poor aerial horizontal speed, so don't approach from the air if you're getting pounded for it. His dash kick is long ranged, fast, and as potent as his moves get. A shieldcancelled dash throw chain (even two) is a great way to put some doubt in an opponent, as is cancelling the dash into a dtilt a swipe at their toes, which can trip, and which you can chain together with a d/ftilt triple strike. In training you can actually see it show up as a 4 hit combo for 17 damage, which is suprisingly high for Metaknight. Anything that can get your opponent to start hopping when you charge in is good--it dovetails well into B^ and so on.

I'm obviously not a pro, but Metaknight's real issue with the B moves is their low damage and forced helplessness. If you want to use those moves, you're going to have to stay close to the ground where it'll minimize the helpless phase, so it also behooves you to mix it up with throws and trips, to keep them from turtling you and avoid the approach problem.

 

[Essix]

In terms of damage, MK's neutral b is great. Be it projectile spam, or multiple opponents, I always find a use for it. The side b is not so good, it has its uses, but not many. The up b is great if they are above you and you don't have time for an upward aerial. Another plus to shuttle loop is that you are not punished with fall special afterward. As for down b, its main use in my humble opinion is to psyche out opponents. If you keep teleporting around, and never stay in one place too long, it just might throw them off guard. Thats my two cents on MK's b moves.

 

[Blaazer07]

The worst part about metaknight's b moves is that if you use them, you'd better get to the ground before your opponent, because they all leave you helpless and open to attack (even shuttle loop only gives you one very predictable attack).

Metaknight needs powerful attacks to compliment his moveset, but all his specials are weak mid-range moves. So if he attacks from more than a down-smash range away, hes using one of them, and the opponent can roll backward an wait to counter attack.

(Dimension cape has my vote for worst attack in the game.)

 

[EternalCrusade]

Having just played in a tournament two days ago (3 stock, 7 minutes) my friends who watched my matches say I use a B move every 30 seconds like clockwork, when I don't mean to time it lol.

His tornado is a great attack in my opinion, I usually get critical hits with it and it can be devistating, but you have to be sure to land away from your opponent so you have time to get up. Hit them with the final blow of the tornado and it'll send them straight up. The tornado can also be a darn good recovery move.

I accually learned this while playing a match in the tournament, but Meta Knight's up B has very good knockback.

I never use his side B on purpose but when I do use it by accident it always seems to do a lot of damage lol.

And as for his down B, it seems pretty good to me, just don't miss with it.

 

[KYLEMARTHFALCODANIELSON]

there is a time and place for everything, every b move of metaknights has a very good use if used correctly and at the correct time. why would the designers waste time programming a useless move? the answer: they wouldn't. there is an application for every move, its whether or not you are smart enough to know which move to use at which time.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

To answer the guestion in the very first post, I think that reason why people don´t use MK´s b-moves is because his a-moves are so fast. This is why many think that they are better for comboing and stuff and just ignore b-moves. I personally agree with those who said that b-moves have their moments: D-b as safe return and effective mindgame (pretty much the same as Zelda´s U-b), side-b as surprise recovery/attack and in some situations as combo move, neutral-b in the same usages as side-b but in different situations and as projectile protector and U-b as finisher/surprice attack/combo finisher. I think that in the right hands MK´s b-moves are going to be very useful.

 

[Covenant]

I don't think it's simply that his A-moves are so fast, since they are also incredibly weak, and a good set of B-moves (ie, Toon link's set) would really expand his combat ability a lot.

It's really that Metaknight's B moves don't seem to be all that useful overall. Now, they do have their applications, and I feel that the Mach Tornado meshes well with his playstyle (since it messes up projectiles) as a disruption and approach. However, the dimensional cape and the drill rush are mostly useless compared to his A-game and the shuttle loop is a poor combat move overall. Yes, it has good vertical knockback, but using it to chase someone off the side will SD you and chasing someone up with it will make you fall helplessly afterwards, so you BETTER hit. It's only good because his uair has such a low knock, which is to say, it's only good by comparison to his other weak moves. The tornado is similar, but at least it can be used to get up to someone, mostly, and is a good recovery.

If they did more damage or didn't render you helpless, they'd be way more useful. But light little Metaknight can't afford to be punished for a move that only would have done 6 damage or so anyway. It's possible someone will come up with a strategy to employ the drill rush and cape moves in a dominating way, but I find it extremely unlikely outside of a glitchy AT that we haven't found yet. The shuttle loop is a fun recovery/approach move and so is the tornado, but both of these are easy to see coming at you and easy to punish.

 

[WingedKnight]

Having just played in a tournament two days ago (3 stock, 7 minutes) my friends who watched my matches say I use a B move every 30 seconds like clockwork, when I don't mean to time it lol.

His tornado is a great attack in my opinion, I usually get critical hits with it and it can be devistating, but you have to be sure to land away from your opponent so you have time to get up. Hit them with the final blow of the tornado and it'll send them straight up. The tornado can also be a darn good recovery move.

I accually learned this while playing a match in the tournament, but Meta Knight's up B has very good knockback.

I never use his side B on purpose but when I do use it by accident it always seems to do a lot of damage lol.

And as for his down B, it seems pretty good to me, just don't miss with it.

Wow, that sounds like how I use Meta Knight, almost exactly. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise, Mach Tornado owns! I learned from fighting my buddies online that the finishing blow can be devastating, and the move is genuinely annoying to go up against, Dimensional Cape is good, I'm getting better at it, but you do NOT want to miss. Don't use it to much, or it becomes very predictable. It's my least used of his specials (only because I use Drill Rush on accident a bit) XD

 

[Fishin]

Neutral B is great. It's difficult to interrupt Meta Knight or hit him as he finishes, but if your opponent is hit you can easily rack up 10-20% damage.

Side B seems somewhat like a toned version of neutral B, but it does have higher priority over projectiles, IIRC.

Up B is great for recovery (not that MK needs the help) since it automatically puts you in glide, and has a pretty decent amount of power. On stages with a bottom that you can rise through (like Halberd after the platform has taken off), it can be very good as a surprise attack. It's useful in a variety of other situations, and IIRC it's possible to do it in the air and reverse the direction you glide in, which could be absolutely amazing for chasing offstage.

Down B might have potential for a surprise attack, but I haven't really played with it much yet so I can't say.