Who's Canonically the Strongest Character in Smash?

[RelaxAlax]

It seems like there would be matchups that would render characters useless. For example, Link vs. Ganondorf brings Link above Ganondorf, but he could never defeat Sonic or Mewtwo. If it were some sort of story, Link would be the top of the chain as he's the only one able (apparently) to stop Ganondorf. But every other fight he would be obliterated.

 

[PadWarrior]

Mega Man, Mario, Pit, Dedede, Bowser and DK need more love in this thread. Oh and Peach. Wasn't she powerful in Super Princess Peach?

 

[josh bones]

Luigi too, but some people think he's gonna be killed before he can use a starman somehow

Who should decide the matchups? I'm thinking moi, but if anyone wants to they can.

 

[pitthekit]

Well AA proved that gaymanwatch is most likely the strongest character in smash...

Would you rather be 2D 3D or 4D?

 

[APC99]

Here, I'll make a tournament. Follow these protocols.

http://challonge.com/canonicallystrongsmashbros

First round:

Toon Link vs. Wii Fit Trainer

GO!

 

[Chiroz]

Toon Link, hands down. Wii Fit Trainer is just a regular human being .


This is how I see the fight going down.

The fight starts, Toon Link starts throwing arrows and bombs from ranged. When Wii Fit trainer starts to run towards him he quickly changes the wind in order to throw her off her feet and then delivers one final arrow to the heart.

 

[Eight Melodies]

Yeah I think Wii Fit Trainer is in for a bad time

 

[josh bones]

Here, I'll make a tournament. Follow these protocols.

http://challonge.com/canonicallystrongsmashbros

First round:

Toon Link vs. Wii Fit Trainer

GO!

Dude, it can't be a tournament, everybody has to fight eachother.
Also toon link wins

 

[RelaxAlax]

Josh has a point, but the tournament will reveal your top contender, although I'm pretty certain we can determine that too.

Instead of working from the top, as we already have our top tiered Gods, we should start from the bottom. Who would get their ass handed to them by everyone on the roster?

 

[josh bones]

Josh has a point, but the tournament will reveal your top contender, although I'm pretty certain we can determine that too.

Instead of working from the top, as we already have our top tiered Gods, we should start from the bottom. Who would get their *** handed to them by everyone on the roster?

villager

 

[Chiroz]

Ok so with these rules let's present the fighters:

In order to shorten this discussion we will cut characters that are obviously inferior to other similar characters

Full Roster:

Mario (includes Dr. Mario)
Bowser
Peach
Luigi
Rosalina
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
Wario
Yoshi
Samus (incles ZSS)
Link (includes Toon Link)
Zelda (includes Sheik but not Hylia)
Ganondorf (includes Ganon)
Marth
Roy
Ike
Ness
Lucas
Pikachu
Pichu
Mewtwo
Lucario
Jigglypuff
Red (includes National Dex)
Pit
Palutena
Ice Climbers
Captain Falcon
Kirby
Meta Knight
King Dedede
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Olimar
R.O.B
Snake
Sonic
Megaman
Villager
Wii Fit Trainer



Plus these added popular choice fighters:

Ridley
King K. Rool
Dixie Kong
Little Mac
Takamaru
Chrom + Lucina
Pac Man
Mii



Now let's cut some obvious choices out and let's try to trim down each respective franchise to the "strongest" of each franchise as proven by cannon inside the franchise
Note: Franchises that don't have an obvious "strongest" will not be cut down


Full Roster:

Mario
Luigi
Bowser
Rosalina
Donkey Kong
Wario
Link
Zelda
Ganondorf
Samus
Pit
Palutena
Kirby
Meta Knight
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Captain Falcon
Mewtwo
Red
Marth
Ike
Ness
Mr. Game and Watch
Snake
Sonic
Megaman
Pac Man
Ridley
King K. Rool
Little Mac
Takamaru
Chrom + Lucina






Now let's further cut down those who are obviously outclassed (to the point where there is no debate possible) and have no way of actually being able to stand up a fight

Mario
Bowser
Rosalina
Link
Zelda
Ganondorf
Samus
Pit
Palutena
Kirby
Meta Knight
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Captain Falcon
Mewtwo
Red
Marth
Ike
Ness
Mr. Game and Watch
Sonic
Megaman
Pac Man
Ridley



And so this is our final roster. The way to declare the "strongest" is who can win the most fights. Obviously there are some fights a character will win and some a character will lose and as such some rock, paper, scissors scenarios will be brought up (I.E.: Ganondorf vs Link, Link vs Sonic, Sonic vs Ganondorf)

As such, the winning condition is who can beat the most characters out of this list.









This is how I think it should be done.

The final roster is cut very much so to save time.

Basically people like Luigi have the same abilities as Mario (with a few differences like the Poultergeist) but he has more weaknesses and as such were cut. People that have no chance at all like Olimar, Wii Fit Trainer or Villager were cut immediately. People who are hands down beaten by someone else from their own series in all aspects (strength, endurance, etc) is also taken out (such is the case of King Dedede, whom Kirby/Meta Knight just dominate).


I will make a tournament draft like APC99 did with a round robin where everyone will fight everyone at least once.

 

[RelaxAlax]

I'll put this here to spark discussion.

The tiers here are to seperate the jumps in form. You could argue that Snake could take down Starfox if you wish, but I tried to keep the humans around the same level (Humans with talent I mean.)

G&W gets a tier cause he's a funny case. I feel anyone above him could be able to see him since he's in a second dimension. But that's worth arguing.

I lined Wario, Mario and Luigi because they have the same abilities.

This isn't accurate. I'd like feedback so we know who is better. (Like say Kirby vs. Bowser)


S tier




G&W Tier

A tier.





B Tier






C tier
(Young + Toon)



Megaman




D Tier





Villager
WFT



(Canonically, R.O.B. is an accessory. WFT could trip on him by accident and break him.)

 

[Chiroz]

http://challonge.com/pq96g92p

Ok, here it is, lets start our votes with round 1. For the first round we will give 2 days to vote, so the votings will end on 2/6/2014 around 9-10 AM PT.

Vote for all the match ups in the first round and give a short explanation as to how said character would be able to beat the other.

Other members are able to refute your vote by bringing up an ability (Say I vote for Mario winning vs Megaman and some other person asks how will Mario actually stop Megaman's *copy really overpowered ability*, if I cannot come up with an answer then my vote for that match is nullified.

Let us begin.

 

[Louie G.]

Mewtwo vs Meta Knight?
Oh ho ho.

 

[josh bones]

http://challonge.com/ssbbcanon got the draft,
First match!
Bowser vs Ridley!

 

[pitthekit]

Who is the strongest warrior in the Kirby universe?

Meta knight asked nova to bring the strongest warrior in the galaxy to fight him.

Meta knight defeated galactia knight which made no sense as galactia knight was the strongest warrior in the galaxy. Assuming he took galactia knight from there galaxy.

What is more worrying is that Kirby defeated meta knight.
Why did nova not send Kirby?
Kirby lives in the same galaxy as meta knight?
Kirby is a star warrior also.

 

[Louie G.]

So, do I just list who I think is the strongest in each match-up, or what?

 

[josh bones]

http://challonge.com/pq96g92p

Ok, here it is, lets start our votes with round 1. For the first round we will give 2 days to vote, so the votings will end on 2/6/2014 around 9-10 AM PT.

Vote for all the match ups in the first round and give a short explanation as to how said character would be able to beat the other.

Other members are able to refute your vote by bringing up an ability (Say I vote for Mario winning vs Megaman and some other person asks how will Mario actually stop Megaman's *copy really overpowered ability*, if I cannot come up with an answer then my vote for that match is nullified.

Let us begin.

I think that arguments should beat voting so everyone doesn't vote for Mario.

 

[Louie G.]

I think that arguments should beat voting so everyone doesn't vote for Mario.

Mario's got that Starman tho.

 

[RelaxAlax]

Kirby could absorb the Starman Mario and take the ability permanently xD

 

[josh bones]

Wolf vs Megaman
Megaman has that buster and guns, but wolf has the wolfen. I'm pretty sure wolf's claws are sharper than Sonic's hair, but brawl in the family has no notice here. I have to give the win to Rock

 

[Louie G.]

Mr. Game and Watch vs Bowser.
Hm...
Well G&W has a plethora of weapons at his disposal, but Bowser's got pure strength and fire.
I would go with Bowser, since his weight would ultimately make him very hard to KO.

 

[RelaxAlax]

G&W wouldn't be able to be seen, grabbed or effected by Bowsers moves and he's two dimesional. He has no width. I go with G&W

 

[Louie G.]

G&W wouldn't be able to be seen, grabbed or effected by Bowsers moves and he's two dimesional. He has no width. I go with G&W

That's true.
Canonically G&W can't be touched by anyone!
I change my mind: G&W is the winner.
(Until Paper Mario comes in)

 

[Headcrab Jackalope]

That's true.
Canonically G&W can't be touched by anyone!
I change my mind: G&W is the winner.
(Until Paper Mario comes in)

Paper Mario would still technically be a 3D object, since he's made of paper. And paper is easily destroyed.

 

[josh bones]

That's true.
Canonically G&W can't be touched by anyone!
I change my mind: G&W is the winner.
(Until Paper Mario comes in)

Game and watch can't touch anything either, so yeah.

 

[Bowserlick]

Alright. I like the proposed tournament bracket. This is how I am going to make my judgements.

1. Smash is not considered canon because the point of this thread is who can win in a non-Smash battle where not everyone has to be balanced against each other.

2. The battle takes place after all worlds collide. There are elements of each game in this battle.

3. Characters also have their personality traits. Even if someone (like Ness) is strong, do they have the willpower/desire/goal to fight and destroy. That means that some villains such as Ganondorf would have the immediate desire to conquer this newly created world.

4. Characters don't necessarily have every power they have ever had. Sonic could grab a Starman just as Mario can. Mario knows that yellow question marks could have Starmen in them. Mario knows what a Starmen does. Sonic does not have this knowledge, but if he knew what Starmen could do and one was on the field, he would get to it before Mario.

5. I am going to assume that there is a small percentage that any character could theoretically win. So this will be a more probable deduction (say if this scenario played out 100 times; who would win more battles).

 

[josh bones]

vs Samus has more options then ganon, but ganon can't die....Ganon could tier samus out and kill her, so Ganon

 

[PadWarrior]

I'll put this here to spark discussion.

The tiers here are to seperate the jumps in form. You could argue that Snake could take down Starfox if you wish, but I tried to keep the humans around the same level (Humans with talent I mean.)

G&W gets a tier cause he's a funny case. I feel anyone above him could be able to see him since he's in a second dimension. But that's worth arguing.

I lined Wario, Mario and Luigi because they have the same abilities.

This isn't accurate. I'd like feedback so we know who is better. (Like say Kirby vs. Bowser)


S tier




G&W Tier

A tier.





B Tier






C tier
(Young + Toon)



Megaman




D Tier





Villager
WFT



(Canonically, R.O.B. is an accessory. WFT could trip on him by accident and break him.)

You keep leaving Mega Man out.

 

[pitthekit]

You keep leaving Mega Man out.

It has been proven that these characters can beat mega man.... He is a robot giving him huge weaknesses.

Who cares if he can shoot a black hole.... So can Samus
http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Darkburst

http://www.metroidwiki.org/wiki/Darkburst

 

[josh bones]

Rosalina beats Zelda cause she has black holes and Zelda can't survive a black hole.

 

[Louie G.]

Mega Man can technically find a weakness for every character, given that all of the Robot Master's powers are at his disposal.
If it's just Man and Buster, then he's basically helpless.

 

[josh bones]

beats because hgss, you can have a pokemon out with you, red sends out alakazam to psychic him to death.

 

[pitthekit]

Rosalina beats Zelda cause she has black holes and Zelda can't survive a black hole.

It is presumed that Rosalina can make black holes as she can cause the Big Bang, but we need to know if she required the grand star to do that... Even when she had all the grand stars in the beginning she could not stop bowser from stealing the grand stars.. Unless this is plot induced stupidity.

 

[josh bones]

If pacman get's his power berries from ghostly adventures he has this, he can turn into a literal planet, how can pit counter that?

It is presumed that Rosalina can make black holes as she can cause the Big Bang, but we need to know if she required the grand star to do that... Even when she had all the grand stars in the beginning she could not stop bowser from stealing the grand stars.. Unless this is plot induced stupidity.

PIS at it's best. Luma does stuff too, like um, turning into a sling star um I got nothing.

 

[pitthekit]

If pacman get's his power berries from ghostly adventures he has this, he can turn into a literal planet, how can pit counter that?

Pit: dyntos make me a new machine now!
Dyntos: gotta let me have some palutena alone time..
pit: I love you dyntos

 

[josh bones]

outclassesby far, the god tier will put of a valiant fight, but he will fall at the hands of mew2

Pit: dyntos make me a new machine now!
Dyntos: gotta let me have some palutena alone time..
pit: I love you dyntos

What?

I can't see a way for to beat a literal goddess, what did palutena do in her kiu boss fight?

 

[pitthekit]

I can't see a way for to beat a literal goddess, what did palutena do in her kiu boss fight?

Palutena is weak bro... She lost to the chaos kin... What a weakling...

 

[josh bones]

has super Kirby to counter star, and most Mario powers can be countered by Kirby, so being honest, I give this a tie.

 

[RSF-Blue bomber]

It has been proven that these characters can beat mega man.... He is a robot giving him huge weaknesses.

Who cares if he can shoot a black hole.... So can Samus
http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Darkburst

http://www.metroidwiki.org/wiki/Darkburst

he can freaken stop time gosh damnit. and being a robot has nothing to do with strength. if not it makes him better.