What AT are you looking forward to the most for competitive play?

[RanserSSF4]

Out of all the AT we discovered so far in the demos, which one are you looking forward to the most for competitive play? If these AT end up being good, we can see more depth in Smash 4's competitive atmosphere, resulting in interesting matches and match-ups.

P.S. Let me know if I missed anything else!

NOTE: All this might have already been changed by now, so we are not sure until the game comes out!

 

[ferioku]

To be honest Id say it's even between Turnaround Cancel and Other AT that haven't been show.

 

[victinivcreate1]

None.

Waiting in new AT that can be used in VARIOUS situations. The two discovered ones won't do so well in certain situations, and tech is supposed to give you more options.

Like Pivot Walking in Brawl. Its good on paper but not worthwhile in practice.

 

[Renji64]

None because they aren't many known atm or that many to choose from.

 

[Senario]

Meh come back when we have the game and know what is possible. I do think dash dancing will be my favorite if it comes back. Always loved dash dancing. Easy and yet so useful.

 

[ferioku]

None.

Waiting in new AT that can be used in VARIOUS situations. The two discovered ones won't do so well in certain situations, and tech is supposed to give you more options.

Like Pivot Walking in Brawl. Its good on paper but not worthwhile in practice.

It's funny because you haven't played the game enough to understand how these AT's will work out, no on knows that yet.

 

[Renji64]

Meh come back when we have the game and know what is possible. I do think dash dancing will be my favorite if it comes back. Always loved dash dancing. Easy and yet so useful.

I would love for that to return i like being able to control my character and not feel restricted.

 

[Hokori]

Dash Dancing is so simple, but it's utility makes such a difference.

Discussion here will likely end up being a 'wish list'.

 

[shapular]

I picked turnaround cancel. It seems like a nice versatile option that will make the ground game solid.

I never liked dash dancing so I'm glad it's gone. I don't see why people want more defensive options like that when at the same time they don't like Brawl's defensive gameplay. RAR is my favorite returning AT and I'd take it over dash dancing as a movement option any day.

 

[BridgesWithTurtles]

I just want dash-dancing and something close to wavelanding, even if it only works on platforms. Hell, especially if it only works on platforms.

 

[shapular]

I just want dash-dancing and something close to wavelanding, even if it only works on platforms. Hell, especially if it only works on platforms.

Speaking of which, has anybody been able to determine if platform cancelling is back?

 

[ferioku]

Dash Dancing> Everything, Dash Dancing no doubt is the best movement option in Smash and if it isn't back I will seriously be pissed because even Casuals can easily do it!

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Dash Dancing> Everything, Dash Dancing no doubt is the best movement option in Smash and if it isn't back I will seriously be pissed because even Casuals can easily do it!

I used to use it a ton like on Marth for approach (lol universe crossing grab), but to be honest I'm not too heart stricken by its removal.

I just don't think it contributes that much in either direction it's competitive potential and that's the most important thing, that the game fosters a competitive environment.

 

[ferioku]

I used to use it a ton like on Marth for approach (lol universe crossing grab), but to be honest I'm not too heart stricken by its removal.

I just don't think it contributes that much in either direction it's competitive potential and that's the most important thing, that the game fosters a competitive environment.

I honestly think it helps for spacing and approaching but yeah, maybe having new AT's that ascend over the past ones will be nice =D.

 

[LancerStaff]

I'd rather see zero "advanced techniques" as to not unhinge the balance. I've never seen this so-called "depth" like this make any game more enjoyable.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

I'd rather see zero "advanced techniques" as to not unhinge the balance. I've never seen this so-called "depth" like this make any game more enjoyable.

Well judging by how vocal they are...I'm pretty sure it's easy to see there is at least one group of people who would enjoy the game more with ATs.

 

[Big-Cat]

Pivot/Turnaround Canceling is something I'm very excited about.

 

[PCHU]

I'd rather see zero "advanced techniques" as to not unhinge the balance. I've never seen this so-called "depth" like this make any game more enjoyable.

Well, enjoyability is solely determined by you, what you like and dislike.
You've made it increasingly apparent that you dislike advanced techniques (yet I believe in the past, you've said you'd be willing to use them to compete at a higher level, am I correct?), so it's safe to say that it wouldn't be enjoyable to you, but I'm not sure that it can apply to everyone else as well.

In Brawl, I enjoyed glide tossing because it was fun, not too hard to perform, and gave me another option of approach/mixup.
It was an advanced technique and it's certainly not mentioned in the manual, but it didn't really unbalance the game or anything drastic, it just made things a little bit more interesting.
I guess another example would be DACUS -- not everyone had it and not everyone's was useful, but it did makes things more interesting without tampering with the game's overall balance.
Snake can be hit/grabbed out of his, Wario's helps his ground game (where he's most lacking, in my opinion), and Wolf's is just downright awesome (maybe not always useful, but always awesome).

The only advanced techniques that I think actually did mess with the balance were character-specific things like extended grapple, wobbling (to an extent), and ICG.

 

[LancerStaff]

Well judging by how vocal they are...I'm pretty sure it's easy to see there is at least one group of people who would enjoy the game more with ATs.

I'm just saying I don't understand the appeal at all. Honestly, I've seen more games outright ruined by things like this then helped. MKDS, Brawl (MK's IDC online), oh, and Kid Icarus: Uprising. That last one just hurts.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Pivot Canceling looks good. I would love to see dash dancing and platform canceling.

 

[BBG|Scott-Spain]

It's all about character specific AT's. lol

 

[DakotaBonez]

I thought this was a thread on the viability of Assist Trophies in competitive play XD

I'm not sure if it's an advanced technique, but the new mechanic of characters bouncing off of the stage when meteor smashed seems like it will lead to some amazing combos.

 

[StarshipGroove]

None, because Sakurai is dead set on removing them all.

I thought this was a thread on the viability of Assist Trophies in competitive play XD

I'm not sure if it's an advanced technique, but the new mechanic of characters bouncing off of the stage when meteor smashed seems like it will lead to some amazing combos.

The meteor bounce has no hit stun at all. It's useless for combos.

 

[LancerStaff]

Well, enjoyability is solely determined by you, what you like and dislike.
You've made it increasingly apparent that you dislike advanced techniques (yet I believe in the past, you've said you'd be willing to use them to compete at a higher level, am I correct?), so it's safe to say that it wouldn't be enjoyable to you, but I'm not sure that it can apply to everyone else as well.

In Brawl, I enjoyed glide tossing because it was fun, not too hard to perform, and gave me another option of approach/mixup.
It was an advanced technique and it's certainly not mentioned in the manual, but it didn't really unbalance the game or anything drastic, it just made things a little bit more interesting.
I guess another example would be DACUS -- not everyone had it and not everyone's was useful, but it did makes things more interesting without tampering with the game's overall balance.
Snake can be hit/grabbed out of his, Wario's helps his ground game (where he's most lacking, in my opinion), and Wolf's is just downright awesome (maybe not always useful, but always awesome).

The only advanced techniques that I think actually did mess with the balance were character-specific things like extended grapple, wobbling (to an extent), and ICG.

Yes, I will use an AT without question in order to win. Soft drifting in MK8 comes to mind. (Can't Firehop in a bike lol.) Pit has a ton of techs in Brawl and I can perform most of them and could effectively use about half of them in real matches, before I stopped playing Brawl. I probably would of learned to use all of them if they weren't all removed from SSB4. I honestly don't see a difference with playing with or without "techs," but trying to enforce such a rule would be like herding cats. So I play with "techs" because that's what works. I see exactly why such things are removed, and won't cry fowl when it inevitably happens.

None, because Sakurai is dead set on removing them all.


The meteor bounce has no hit stun at all. It's useless for combos.

I wasn't aware people could react to getting hit in only a few frames. What's the secret?

 

[Phan7om]

Platform Cancel, Dacus, Dacit, Glide Toss, RAR, Lcancel, Edgecancel (of all kind), Pivot Walking, Melee Dash Dancing, Crouch out of Run, Jump Cancelled Shield (something new that I would actually really want), Shield Dropping, DI, SDI, ASDI, Meteor Cancelling, Actual Spikes

QAC, Dragonic Reverse, Float Dash, Hammer Cancel, Quick Rock, Samus Super Wavedash, Land Cancelled Lasers, Land Cancelled Missiles, Ganon Super Jump, Jump out of Shine, Bike Looping, Parry, Bone walking, Freepulling, Turnip Cancel, Parasol Land Cancel, DJC, Banana Footstool Lock, and ever other Brawl and Melee character specific tech that I didnt list here

I know 95% of this stuff isnt getting in, but its still on my wish list.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

The meteor bounce has no hit stun at all. It's useless for combos.

People were actually combing stuff together in the VGbootcamp vids with it.

I've seen some footage of Samus doing similar as well.

~

For the thread, I love the idea of the run stop cancel and pivoting. Looks pretty good on the ground.

 

[StarshipGroove]

People were actually combing stuff together in the VGbootcamp vids with it.
I've seen some footage of Samus doing similar as well.

I'm pretty sure I saw a Bowser/other characters airdodging the instant they hit the floor and bounce, I'll have to check again.
Can I have a link?

 

[HeavyLobster]

Even though it's probably not going to be in the game and is mostly useless it has to be Flight of Ganon for me.

 

[kro_]

I'm pretty upset over all the gameplay elements that are being taken out. I played a little Brawl as my first Smash Bros, loved it, tried Melee, and I have never wanted to play Brawl over Melee since. I don't know a single AT more complex than dash dancing, I can't even wavedash yet, but everything else just feels better as well. I can understand wanting to appeal to everyone, but taking out gameplay mechanics and techniques just to please casual players is wrong. A good player will beat them anyway.

I'll be happy no matter what gets in, I want to at least have a chance to try them before they're completely removed from existence.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'm pretty sure I saw a Bowser/other characters airdodging the instant they hit the floor and bounce, I'll have to check again.
Can I have a link?

This was a CPU but the smoke trail didn't leave during the bounce so that was legit.

There is probably more than this that can be done but it depends on % and etc.

 

[Scicky]

I swear I saw some gameplay footage of Megaman dash dancing so...

Edit: Double checked to make sure, there are definitely videos of several chars dash dancing. Dunno why people think it's out.

 

[Big-Cat]

For the thread, I love the idea of the run stop cancel and pivoting. Looks pretty good on the ground.

This is now Super Tekken Bros.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

This is now Super Tekken Bros.

Wouldn't be surprised if this ground pivot, run stop was all intentional from the Namco/Bandai side.

 

[Big-Cat]

These two changes alone change how we're going to play this game. Funny how just two seemingly subtle changes can make a world of a difference.

 

[PCHU]

Yes, I will use an AT without question in order to win. Soft drifting in MK8 comes to mind. (Can't Firehop in a bike lol.) Pit has a ton of techs in Brawl and I can perform most of them and could effectively use about half of them in real matches, before I stopped playing Brawl. I probably would of learned to use all of them if they weren't all removed from SSB4. I honestly don't see a difference with playing with or without "techs," but trying to enforce such a rule would be like herding cats. So I play with "techs" because that's what works. I see exactly why such things are removed, and won't cry fowl when it inevitably happens.

I dunno.
For me, I kinda want some stuff to stay because it doesn't really do any harm to the game and it's fun to do.
I guess I'm all for whatever adds onto the game positively.

As far as my tech usage goes, in Melee, I'd use just about anything that was available (even stickywalking) because I enjoyed the control it all gave me over my character.
I felt like I could do pretty much anything I wanted to (kinda like I feel when playing as Mewtwo in PM, but much less so).
In that aspect, I suppose I sometimes enjoy the "Hey, look at this cool thing" more than its actual use.
In Brawl, the lack of momentum was a huge negative in my eyes (running full force only to get a crappy hop rather than a real dash jump), but DACUS and glide tossing were cool enough for me to not care so much.

As far as this game goes, the turn cancel thing is looking to be pretty fun, and I always liked doing the moving turn (where you rock the control stick back and forth so you turn, but you move forward, so you can spin across the stage), but I'm more excited about what else will be found.

 

[Senario]

I swear I saw some gameplay footage of Megaman dash dancing so...

Edit: Double checked to make sure, there are definitely videos of several chars dash dancing. Dunno why people think it's out.

Because what people are expecting is a dash dance that actually makes a difference. Generally it isn't surprising that you can quickly dash left and right, the problem is that it doesn't go very far and thus has no real use being so short.

Look at Marth's dash dance and compare it to what you probably saw. Megaman likely didn't move very much from where he was and it wasn't very easy to keep up, eventually you will miss the timing and slide and that is totally different than dash dancing as the competitive community knows it. You have a very large window, some larger than others, to initiate the dash in the opposite direction. Marth and falcon have huge windows, Sheik has a relatively small window.

 

[JabbatheHutt]

Definatley bullet bill

 

[Katy Parry]

I'm excited for the new spike features! Zelda's down air can combo them into the ground from above to lead into a launcher for an up air. Several characters can do this. I love it!

 

[LancerStaff]

I'm pretty upset over all the gameplay elements that are being taken out. I played a little Brawl as my first Smash Bros, loved it, tried Melee, and I have never wanted to play Brawl over Melee since. I don't know a single AT more complex than dash dancing, I can't even wavedash yet, but everything else just feels better as well. I can understand wanting to appeal to everyone, but taking out gameplay mechanics and techniques just to please casual players is wrong. A good player will beat them anyway.

I'll be happy no matter what gets in, I want to at least have a chance to try them before they're completely removed from existence.

You just don't understand. What you used weren't actual, intended, gameplay mechanics, but glitches and effects used in unintended ways. They clash with SSB's very design, it's supposed to be easy to play.

I dunno.
For me, I kinda want some stuff to stay because it doesn't really do any harm to the game and it's fun to do.
I guess I'm all for whatever adds onto the game positively.

As far as my tech usage goes, in Melee, I'd use just about anything that was available (even stickywalking) because I enjoyed the control it all gave me over my character.
I felt like I could do pretty much anything I wanted to (kinda like I feel when playing as Mewtwo in PM, but much less so).
In that aspect, I suppose I sometimes enjoy the "Hey, look at this cool thing" more than its actual use.
In Brawl, the lack of momentum was a huge negative in my eyes (running full force only to get a crappy hop rather than a real dash jump), but DACUS and glide tossing were cool enough for me to not care so much.

As far as this game goes, the turn cancel thing is looking to be pretty fun, and I always liked doing the moving turn (where you rock the control stick back and forth so you turn, but you move forward, so you can spin across the stage), but I'm more excited about what else will be found.

I just don't see the point. You're asking for more movement when it ultimately adds up to nothing because the opponent will be using it just as much as you do. At least in Super Metroid it amounts to something significant because it lets you achieve faster clear times and otherwise let you explore more freely, to the point where a romhack that randomizes powerup locations exists. In fighters, the more skilled player will win regardless of such techniques existing.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Maybe with the lack of long-distance dash dancing people will, I dunno, actually walk when they need a spaced approach, and then actually use tilts and jabs from neutral. Besides, standing/walking pivot looks practically instant in SSB4.