Welcome to the Maze! A Beginners Pac-Man Guide - (In-depth Apple + Melon Guide Added)

[AGES]

Yo, I have a ****ing accomplishment to share that's thanks to the knowledge from this thread. I just went 5-0 with a Japanese Greninja player. Didn't drop a god damn game. Bet that guys got the Pac-Fear in him now.

Damn, not bad, Ninja(and falcon I guess) has to be my most hated matchup. Any hints to drop?

 

[Skymin50]

Damn, not bad, Ninja(and falcon I guess) has to be my most hated matchup. Any hints to drop?

I've never had too much troubles with them but just try to keep your distance from them sometimes. They want to be fast and rush in, keeping your space and making sure they can't stomp you with fast moves is good.

Watch out for Greninja's counter and side-B, they can be obnoxious. Falcon's not something to worry about but watch for his moves too.

 

[CornFlakes]

That U-turn SideB into Hydrant is such a good technique lol.

 

[AGES]

I've never had too much troubles with them but just try to keep your distance from them sometimes. They want to be fast and rush in, keeping your space and making sure they can't stomp you with fast moves is good.

Watch out for Greninja's counter and side-B, they can be obnoxious. Falcon's not something to worry about but watch for his moves too.

Alright, maybe I just need to play a bit more defensive then and not get too anxious to run in on them. I can be a bit too much of an aggressive player at times with pac :x

 

[Gam3rALO]

I feel like a decent pac man player now!!! 90% of matches I lose is due to lag.
I can't practice when there's lag all the time!!! :/ It messes my timing which is key (no pun intended) to time my back air to kick hydrant ASAP

Anyone have solution for the annoying lag? My wifi is really good so I don't know....

 

[Skymin50]

Alright, maybe I just need to play a bit more defensive then and not get too anxious to run in on them. I can be a bit too much of an aggressive player at times with pac :x

I understand, I tend to mix between offensive and defensive. Depends on who I'm playing against, really.

2 stocked a Duck Hunt last night because I out-defended him

 

[Skymin50]

I feel like a decent pac man player now!!! 90% of matches I lose is due to lag.
I can't practice when there's lag all the time!!! :/ It messes my timing which is key (no pun intended) to time my back air to kick hydrant ASAP

Anyone have solution for the annoying lag? My wifi is really good so I don't know....

I've heard that turning spectating matches off in Internet Options in..well, Options, reduces lag.

Not totally sure.

 

[ChickenBandit]

I like that, actually. (Fixed the link for you) It might be able to lead into bread and butter dash attack > fair > fair >nair for some good percentage. Let me go into the Lab really quick and see how much that'd do.

EDIT: It's...kind of tricky to land. I can't really land it well, but you said yourself it's rare so I guess it's that. Seems like you could lead up though.

In my experience it's easiest to land the 2 hit combo when they're at a medium percentage (between 25 and 125) too low and they won't be knocked far enough to hit the hydrant, too high and they'll go too far away for the second hit to land

 

[GeZ]

I actually have had a lot of trouble with greninja in general. Not just when using Pac-Man. From playing some really intense games with Pac v Frog, I've found a few handy things though.

A lot of Greninja's "WHAT DO I DO" inducing game is just throwing water shurikens and following them up with grab/ Dash Attack mixup. This in and of itself is kind of a ***** because of how many things in this game are relatively low commitment, and our grab is on the slow side. What I found worked really well was the hydrant. When he throws water shurikens you can set it in between you two while grabbing a projectile, start wailing on it to fling it at them, or stand on top of it and mess with em with your water shenanigans.

Hydrant in general seemed to do work in this matchup. When they start to use counter too often you can just drop a hydrant and do the Side B thing (it needs a name). They try (read: fail) to counter the hydrant, it's a freaking hydrant so you know how well that works out, then they got bopped by you and or the hydrant.

Greninja also tends to combo very vertically, and we all know how well Uair does against ****ing HYDRANT

Hydrant in this MU works for me, but it could just be personal experience against people who don't know how to deal, so keep that in mind.

Edit: I also just figured out a filthy edgeguard. Like, seriously amazing how much **** is going on.

Basically, you set the hydrant right on the side most part of the stage, Z drop a green fruit on it, and do literally anything after that. The green thing throws the hydrant stopping them from ledge hopping/ ledge jumping, as they have to deal with avoiding both hydrant and green. They can't Nair to grab the green because hydrant will break their face. They can't attack from ledge because green bounces off hydrant and will bounce off them if they get up attack. Same with just ledge get up. The only thing it doesn't cover is staying on ledge and ledge roll, which you can guess/ read and use a move to cover.

One of my favorite parts is that when the green hits the hydrant and bounces, it will bounce again when it hits the opponent, so if you do a choice DA or Nair you can grab the green and set the whole fun house up again.

 

[jordanm43444]

Not sure if this is anywhere on this thread right now since I don't have much time right now to read through it but thought Id pitch in with something I've noticed while playing Pac.

If you want to set up a specific fruit but don't have a easy way to get the fruit at the very start of the match (since I love the bell I always need to be careful of when I use the B) I have noticed that if you place a Hydrant down on the ground as your very first move the hydrants first shot will shoot you upwards if you stay standing on it, giving you a lot of extra height while you charge the fruit to get a more safe height to get clear of any first attacks your opponent will fling out.

 

[S3R4PH]

I actually have had a lot of trouble with greninja in general. Not just when using Pac-Man. From playing some really intense games with Pac v Frog, I've found a few handy things though.

A lot of Greninja's "WHAT DO I DO" inducing game is just throwing water shurikens and following them up with grab/ Dash Attack mixup. This in and of itself is kind of a ***** because of how many things in this game are relatively low commitment, and our grab is on the slow side. What I found worked really well was the hydrant. When he throws water shurikens you can set it in between you two while grabbing a projectile, start wailing on it to fling it at them, or stand on top of it and mess with em with your water shenanigans.

Hydrant in general seemed to do work in this matchup. When they start to use counter too often you can just drop a hydrant and do the Side B thing (it needs a name). They try (read: fail) to counter the hydrant, it's a freaking hydrant so you know how well that works out, then they got bopped by you and or the hydrant.

Greninja also tends to combo very vertically, and we all know how well Uair does against ****ing HYDRANT

Hydrant in this MU works for me, but it could just be personal experience against people who don't know how to deal, so keep that in mind.

I'd also like to highlight the usefulness of the hydrant in this matchup. Keys go straight through Greninja's fully charged water shurikens, even negating the weaker/faster smaller ones. If you toss a key at your hydrant, Greninja has two heavy hitting projectiles to deal with, because the key always does enough damage to knock a fresh hydrant off the ground. Just be careful about throwing the key while water is spitting out, as it causes the key to change trajectory 45 degrees.

Also- I just call the "Side-B" move power pellet (PP). If you're able to hit the hydrant and opponent at PP max range, you'll do at least 30% damage depending on the number of hits and cause enough knockback to KO at percentages as low as 90-110% for most characters.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I noticed Meteor Trampoline also has a meteor hitbox at the beginning of the move on the underside of the trampoline.

 

[Paper Maribro]

Hey guys,

I'm an SSB4 Pac main and have been severely struggling against campy characters and projectile spam characters such as Toon Link and Mega Man. Have you guys got any recommendations as I love playing as Pac but it's so frustrating when a Toon Link can just sit there spamming arrows at me and I just cannot figure out a way to deal with it. I've tried dropping a hydrant down on top of them, but it's too predictable and I usually end up in a dodgy spot.

Any recommendations?

 

[S3R4PH]

Hey guys,

I'm an SSB4 Pac main and have been severely struggling against campy characters and projectile spam characters such as Toon Link and Mega Man. Have you guys got any recommendations as I love playing as Pac but it's so frustrating when a Toon Link can just sit there spamming arrows at me and I just cannot figure out a way to deal with it. I've tried dropping a hydrant down on top of them, but it's too predictable and I usually end up in a dodgy spot.

Any recommendations?

Toon Link is tough for me too. I would recommend responding to camp with camp by trying to bide as much time as possible in getting the Key which goes through their projectiles. The hydrant still has useful applications in this matchup, but you will want to abuse the heck out of trampolines on the ground to make them cautious about blindly dashing to advance in. Force them into the air and beat them with your superior air normals like bair and uair. Eventually your reads will be good enough that you'll be able to angle your power pellet towards them which will also go through their attacks due to super armor. Hit them at max range for that KO.

You can't fight against projectile happy characters the same way you can other characters, so take advantage of every tool Pac has.

 

[ChickenBandit]

Hey guys,

I'm an SSB4 Pac main and have been severely struggling against campy characters and projectile spam characters such as Toon Link and Mega Man. Have you guys got any recommendations as I love playing as Pac but it's so frustrating when a Toon Link can just sit there spamming arrows at me and I just cannot figure out a way to deal with it. I've tried dropping a hydrant down on top of them, but it's too predictable and I usually end up in a dodgy spot.

Any recommendations?

Drop hydrant a medium distance away from them then immediately sideB away from them, loop the pellet back around through the hydrant, and you'll knock the hydrant towards them while charging with sideB
Look at my video earlier in the thread for an example. Also throw keys a lot

 

[Paper Maribro]

Toon Link is tough for me too. I would recommend responding to camp with camp by trying to bide as much time as possible in getting the Key which goes through their projectiles. The hydrant still has useful applications in this matchup, but you will want to abuse the heck out of trampolines on the ground to make them cautious about blindly dashing to advance in. Force them into the air and beat them with your superior air normals like bair and uair. Eventually your reads will be good enough that you'll be able to angle your power pellet towards them which will also go through their attacks due to super armor. Hit them at max range for that KO.

You can't fight against projectile happy characters the same way you can other characters, so take advantage of every tool Pac has.

Thanks man, just one thing. How can I space the power pellet so as to avoid it being taken out by the arrows? The one thing I've struggled with is actually setting the power pellet so I can abuse the super armour. Like I was playing a Mega today and he just kept spamming metal blades whenever I tried to PP.

 

[ChickenBandit]

Thanks man, just one thing. How can I space the power pellet so as to avoid it being taken out by the arrows? The one thing I've struggled with is actually setting the power pellet so I can abuse the super armour. Like I was playing a Mega today and he just kept spamming metal blades whenever I tried to PP.

Another option for the power pellet by itself is to start the pellet at the peak of a jump so that you've already started moving before they have a chance to hit the pellet. Angle it downwards a bit then level it out horizontally at the end

 

[Paper Maribro]

Drop hydrant a medium distance away from them then immediately sideB away from them, loop the pellet back around through the hydrant, and you'll knock the hydrant towards them while charging with sideB
Look at my video earlier in the thread for an example. Also throw keys a lot

Charging keys while a guy is literally standing by the ledge just shooting arrows doesn't really give much of an opportunity to do anything. I waited for maybe 30 secs to a minute and he didn't even approach during that time. I was just shielding and jumping and not one single attempt to approach.

Another option for the power pellet by itself is to start the pellet at the peak of a jump so that you've already started moving before they have a chance to hit the pellet. Angle it downwards a bit then level it out horizontally at the end

So an aerial power pellet angled down and into the opponent?

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Something I noticed is that the power pellet (the pellet, not the chomping) stops DHD's cans.
Just angle it into the can and it is knocked back.

 

[ChickenBandit]

Charging keys while a guy is literally standing by the ledge just shooting arrows doesn't really give much of an opportunity to do anything. I waited for maybe 30 secs to a minute and he didn't even approach during that time. I was just shielding and jumping and not one single attempt to approach.

When trying to get a key, just watch for when he tries to shoot you and roll left or right. It will remember what fruit you were on when you start again, kind of like Samus's charged shot. If he's literally doing nothing but shooting arrows it should be very easy to dodge with a roll.

So an aerial power pellet angled down and into the opponent?

Correct, but flattening it out at the end is essential to avoid bouncing into the ground.

 

[BridgesWithTurtles]

Not sure if this is anywhere on this thread right now since I don't have much time right now to read through it but thought Id pitch in with something I've noticed while playing Pac.

If you want to set up a specific fruit but don't have a easy way to get the fruit at the very start of the match (since I love the bell I always need to be careful of when I use the B) I have noticed that if you place a Hydrant down on the ground as your very first move the hydrants first shot will shoot you upwards if you stay standing on it, giving you a lot of extra height while you charge the fruit to get a more safe height to get clear of any first attacks your opponent will fling out.

This can be useful in certain situations, but I've found it to be highly predictable. Aggressive characters with good jumps, like Greninja, can and will try to intercept this action if you rely on it too much. You can also set up a hydrant, run to the side facing away from the opponent (as if using the hydrant as a barrier), and start charging a fruit. The horizontal water stream will push you away from the opponent while leaving a nice shield in between both of you. This gives you ample time to charge a fruit, and keeps you relatively safe. However, you still have to watch out for strong projectiles or speedy attackers sending the hydrant flying at you. But even this just means the opponent is wasting more time while you quickly shield and then get back to charging.

I think a lot of Pac-Man players, when first starting out, seem to be afraid of the water pushing them around too much. If you're on your toes, you'll almost always be safe playing around near the hydrant. Pac-Man's recovery is too good for him to be gimped, unless you're in helpless for some reason. The hydrant is your friend, and it helps Pac-Man so much more than it hurts him. Let it push you around in all kinds of ways, as it can really help with your mobility options. You just have to make sure you're not too predictable or too reliant on certain hydrant maneuvers, as you can be punished pretty hard in such cases. And of course, we should all remember to use the hydrant smartly. Don't let it push you around carelessly, careening into enemy attacks and whatnot. Use the hydrant. Don't let it use you. Treat it with respect, but let it know you're the boss in the relationship. A happy hydrant means a happy Pac-Man.

 

[Paper Maribro]

Guys, I just beat my first Toon Link so he changed to a Pac mirror and I wrecked him at that.

Thanks for the advice, here's to future Waka-wakaing!

Also, in my experience, Ganondorf is one of our easier matchups, as is anyone with a sword strangely enough. My previous main and current secondary, G&W, always struggled against swords so this is so refreshing.

 

[jordanm43444]

This can be useful in certain situations, but I've found it to be highly predictable. Aggressive characters with good jumps, like Greninja, can and will try to intercept this action if you rely on it too much. You can also set up a hydrant, run to the side facing away from the opponent (as if using the hydrant as a barrier), and start charging a fruit. The horizontal water stream will push you away from the opponent while leaving a nice shield in between both of you. This gives you ample time to charge a fruit, and keeps you relatively safe. However, you still have to watch out for strong projectiles or speedy attackers sending the hydrant flying at you. But even this just means the opponent is wasting more time while you quickly shield and then get back to charging.

I think a lot of Pac-Man players, when first starting out, seem to be afraid of the water pushing them around too much. If you're on your toes, you'll almost always be safe playing around near the hydrant. Pac-Man's recovery is too good for him to be gimped, unless you're in helpless for some reason. The hydrant is your friend, and it helps Pac-Man so much more than it hurts him. Let it push you around in all kinds of ways, as it can really help with your mobility options. You just have to make sure you're not too predictable or too reliant on certain hydrant maneuvers, as you can be punished pretty hard in such cases. And of course, we should all remember to use the hydrant smartly. Don't let it push you around carelessly, careening into enemy attacks and whatnot. Use the hydrant. Don't let it use you. Treat it with respect, but let it know you're the boss in the relationship. A happy hydrant means a happy Pac-Man.

Yea the hydrant is amazing, without the little thing I think I might be lost with Pac lol

 

[S3R4PH]

Guys, I just beat my first Toon Link so he changed to a Pac mirror and I wrecked him at that.

Thanks for the advice, here's to future Waka-wakaing!

Also, in my experience, Ganondorf is one of our easier matchups, as is anyone with a sword strangely enough. My previous main and current secondary, G&W, always struggled against swords so this is so refreshing.

Good to see that you're having success after applying what you've learned here!

 

[AGES]

I actually have had a lot of trouble with greninja in general. Not just when using Pac-Man. From playing some really intense games with Pac v Frog, I've found a few handy things though.

A lot of Greninja's "WHAT DO I DO" inducing game is just throwing water shurikens and following them up with grab/ Dash Attack mixup. This in and of itself is kind of a ***** because of how many things in this game are relatively low commitment, and our grab is on the slow side. What I found worked really well was the hydrant. When he throws water shurikens you can set it in between you two while grabbing a projectile, start wailing on it to fling it at them, or stand on top of it and mess with em with your water shenanigans.

Hydrant in general seemed to do work in this matchup. When they start to use counter too often you can just drop a hydrant and do the Side B thing (it needs a name). They try (read: fail) to counter the hydrant, it's a freaking hydrant so you know how well that works out, then they got bopped by you and or the hydrant.

Greninja also tends to combo very vertically, and we all know how well Uair does against ****ing HYDRANT

Hydrant in this MU works for me, but it could just be personal experience against people who don't know how to deal, so keep that in mind.

Edit: I also just figured out a filthy edgeguard. Like, seriously amazing how much **** is going on.

Basically, you set the hydrant right on the side most part of the stage, Z drop a green fruit on it, and do literally anything after that. The green thing throws the hydrant stopping them from ledge hopping/ ledge jumping, as they have to deal with avoiding both hydrant and green. They can't Nair to grab the green because hydrant will break their face. They can't attack from ledge because green bounces off hydrant and will bounce off them if they get up attack. Same with just ledge get up. The only thing it doesn't cover is staying on ledge and ledge roll, which you can guess/ read and use a move to cover.

One of my favorite parts is that when the green hits the hydrant and bounces, it will bounce again when it hits the opponent, so if you do a choice DA or Nair you can grab the green and set the whole fun house up again.

The green fruit is called a melon lmao

Useful info overall, and yes the z drop on hydrant is ****ing devious if you get the chance to pull it off. Would also like to add to this with saying z dropping the galaxian works too for shooting the hydrant as long as you're high enough when you drop it.

Oh ye forgot to mention earlier but nice avatar, Ibuki>>>>sheik any day

 

[Paper Maribro]

Had a very nice 0 to death sequence against this Bowser. Orange-dash attack-Fsmash-Fsmash-Power Pellet dead.

What I've found against Little Mac and Bowser, is that the orange is an excellent keep away tool as at the start of the match they just want to get in your face, an orange into dash attack can lead into a lot of opportunities.

 

[CCCM89]

I see a lot of talk with power pellet, so let me add to that. if you hit a wall or the bottom of the stage with your side B after eating the pellet, i.e. finishing the move, you will fall prone. this is a good thing, because it reduces the tail frames on that move. also, I have found that angling the pellet into the stage to prone myself tends to confuse the hell out of people. they think I made a mistake and try to punish, only to get face mashed by pac-man instead.
This, combined with the suggestion about dropping hydrant into a u-turn pellet means you can hydrant, launch it, and not have to worry about them grabbing you since you're prone. you also don't fly as far, and typically, if they dodge the hydrant, you can use a get-up attack to knock them away.

The mind games pac-man is capable of is truly astonishing...

 

[S3R4PH]

I see a lot of talk with power pellet, so let me add to that. if you hit a wall or the bottom of the stage with your side B after eating the pellet, i.e. finishing the move, you will fall prone. this is a good thing, because it reduces the tail frames on that move. also, I have found that angling the pellet into the stage to prone myself tends to confuse the hell out of people. they think I made a mistake and try to punish, only to get face mashed by pac-man instead.
This, combined with the suggestion about dropping hydrant into a u-turn pellet means you can hydrant, launch it, and not have to worry about them grabbing you since you're prone. you also don't fly as far, and typically, if they dodge the hydrant, you can use a get-up attack to knock them away.

The mind games pac-man is capable of is truly astonishing...

I've done this a few times by mistake and it tended to work in my favor. There are a couple of instances where this happens in the videos I posted in the Pac-Man video thread (aside from the messy death I ran into with the bowser Jr match)! Good stuff.

 

[CCCM89]

found something else, not sure how usefull it could be. holding A will make you spam the first hit of your standing combo, right? well press A again for the second hit, hold it down untill the first hit triggers, then repeat. you will punch your way slowly across the stage.

if we can find a way to make this a viable approach, I will laugh.

 

[Maple42]

Speaking of approaches, I have two proposals:
- Going slightly above the opponent and dropping a hydrant. It will immediately create your field position, and might do damage to an unknowing foe. This is opposed to...
- Neutral Air slow approaching. You know the kind, short hop twirling forward then back. This would probably be better than Hydrant approach, except it sets you up so well on your zoning....

Of course, we could also simply charge Bonus Fruit at the risk of being approached ourselves.

 

[CCCM89]

baiting an approach with fruit is a great gap closer for opponents without any good ranged options.

 

[ptrk83]

Guys. I am going to work on this guide more tomorrow morning. But I am thinking of just keeping it to his general move set and fun information as well... That way someone can make an advance tech and strategy thread. I also am gonna be closing my video thread so someone else can be in charge of it. I can only keep up with one thing. Lol. What do you think?

 

[PainasaurusRex]

So I just started playing SSB4 on the 3DS and have been enjoying Pac-Man. In your guide you mention more testing is required to figure out the side b air breaking the hydrant. What I found is you have the hit the hydrant twice, if you go down at a diagonal then straight down, then forward it will break the hydrant, and you will go across the stage as well. If you do it right and they decide to get hit by it, you can hit them with both the side b and the flying hydrant which is a pretty nice knock back as well as quite a bit of damage. Hopefully this helps!

 

[ChickenBandit]

So I just started playing SSB4 on the 3DS and have been enjoying Pac-Man. In your guide you mention more testing is required to figure out the side b air breaking the hydrant. What I found is you have the hit the hydrant twice, if you go down at a diagonal then straight down, then forward it will break the hydrant, and you will go across the stage as well. If you do it right and they decide to get hit by it, you can hit them with both the side b and the flying hydrant which is a pretty nice knock back as well as quite a bit of damage. Hopefully this helps!

It should only take a single side B u turn back into the hydrant to knock it to the side. I've had it not work sometimes for unclear reasons (stale moves maybe? Or hitting at a sourspot I don't know). But 99% of the time it works perfectly.

 

[CCCM89]

it's move staling. I've checked in training. you just need to throw yourself in a pit and it's back to full strength. well, that, or mix up your moves more and let it recharge. as long as the hydrant/side B isn't coming out every other attack, and you're throwing in grabs and aerials, you'll be fine.

speaking of aerials, his Fair is quite the literal Wall of Pain. it doesn't really knock the opponent back, but it gets them in reletively the same vertical plane, and can be done all the way down you the boundary and STILL manage to recover from it. Really pisses people off, if the disconnect rate in online when I pull this out has anything to say about it.

 

[Paper Maribro]

Dunno if anyone had brought this up, but if you time it right, the Power Pellet (the actual pellet) can absorb pretty much anything. I threw it out in front of a Samus who shot her laser and the PP just absorbed it, no damage to me at all.

 

[Bauske]

Dunno if anyone had brought this up, but if you time it right, the Power Pellet (the actual pellet) can absorb pretty much anything. I threw it out in front of a Samus who shot her laser and the PP just absorbed it, no damage to me at all.

That's a good strategy! Not something I'm gonna rely on, but if I see someone charging up a beam, I'll keep it in mind. Don't think it'd block Robin's Thorin.

 

[Paper Maribro]

That's a good strategy! Not something I'm gonna rely on, but if I see someone charging up a beam, I'll keep it in mind. Don't think it'd block Robin's Thorin.

It also absorbed a lot of damage while just on the ground too, I think the PP could be just as useful if knocked out of our hands as it is finishing opponents off.

Almost definitely would not stop anything transcendent.

 

[Skymin50]

Dunno if anyone had brought this up, but if you time it right, the Power Pellet (the actual pellet) can absorb pretty much anything. I threw it out in front of a Samus who shot her laser and the PP just absorbed it, no damage to me at all.

Do you mean it's super armor or the fact that the trail literally eats through projectiles?

If so, that's interesting for defensive Pac play.

 

[Paper Maribro]

Do you mean it's super armor or the fact that the trail literally eats through projectiles?

If so, that's interesting for defensive Pac play.

The actual pellet, not the super armour (hence damage would have been taken) and no the trail as I dont think that has a hitbox of any kind.

And the pellet also just sat there afterwards and soaked up even more punishment.